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Author Topic: Really bad, but well-intended, English translation  (Read 439 times)

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Offline DSatz

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Really bad, but well-intended, English translation
« on: June 14, 2018, 01:27:52 PM »
Hi. I'm going through my old paper files to see what I can do without. I came across the attached English-language (sort of) product literature that I think is from the late 1960s or early 70s. I'm posting it because it manages to make almost every mistake that a well-meaning, intelligent person might make when translating technical German into English--especially, picking the first definition in a dictionary when you really need a more specialized term.

It's from the East German "Georg Neumann" company that later became Microtech Gefell, and describes a remote-switchable-pattern stereo microphone containing two M 7 capsules, along the lines of Neumann (Berlin)'s SM 69 or AKG's C 24. But it calls capsules "boxes" while calling microphones "transmitters". Geek that I am, I find that interesting, since a lot of other German electroacoustic literature calls the same things "receivers". (Of course they're both at the same time--transducers are like that.)

It's kind of an interesting puzzle to figure out what they must have meant by certain things--for example, "the slewing piece of the transmitter connection cable" = the swivel mount of the microphone cable. But I'll leave "gliding caskets" as an exercise for the reader ...

--best regards
« Last Edit: June 14, 2018, 01:35:04 PM by DSatz »
music > microphones > a recorder of some sort

Offline noahbickart

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Re: Really bad, but well-intended, English translation
« Reply #1 on: June 14, 2018, 01:34:30 PM »
Hast du den Text auf Deutsch? So können wir die beiden Versionen vergleichen.
Recording:
Capsules: Schoeps mk41v (x2), mk4v (x2), mk22 (x2), mk3 (x2), mk21 & mk8
Cables: 2x nbob KCY, 1 pair nbob actives, Darktrain 2 and 4 channel KCY extensions:
Preamps:    Naiant Littlebox, Naiant IPA, Naiant PFA, Sound Devices Mixpre6
Recorders: Sound Devices Mixpre6, Sony PCM m10
Home Playback: Mytek DSD 192> Adcom SLC 505> Marantz Ma500 (x2)> Eminent Tech LFT-16; Musical Fidelity xCan v2> Hifiman HE-400
Office Playback: Grace m903> AKG k701

Offline noahbickart

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Re: Really bad, but well-intended, English translation
« Reply #2 on: June 14, 2018, 01:35:15 PM »
Hast du den Text auf Deutsch? So können wir die beiden Versionen vergleichen.

או לפחות בעברית כדי לרדת לעומק הפשט.
Recording:
Capsules: Schoeps mk41v (x2), mk4v (x2), mk22 (x2), mk3 (x2), mk21 & mk8
Cables: 2x nbob KCY, 1 pair nbob actives, Darktrain 2 and 4 channel KCY extensions:
Preamps:    Naiant Littlebox, Naiant IPA, Naiant PFA, Sound Devices Mixpre6
Recorders: Sound Devices Mixpre6, Sony PCM m10
Home Playback: Mytek DSD 192> Adcom SLC 505> Marantz Ma500 (x2)> Eminent Tech LFT-16; Musical Fidelity xCan v2> Hifiman HE-400
Office Playback: Grace m903> AKG k701

Offline DSatz

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Re: Really bad, but well-intended, English translation
« Reply #3 on: June 14, 2018, 01:36:03 PM »
Leider nicht; zumindest ist er zur Zeit noch nicht aufgetaucht. Oder/aber doch!

(The attached page was scanned from the 1964 catalog.)
« Last Edit: June 14, 2018, 01:42:53 PM by DSatz »
music > microphones > a recorder of some sort

Offline noahbickart

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Re: Really bad, but well-intended, English translation
« Reply #4 on: June 14, 2018, 01:42:44 PM »
Leider nicht; zumindest ist er zur Zeit noch nicht aufgetaucht.

Das ist bedauerlich. Auch bedauerlich ist dass mein Deutsch Scheiße ist.
Recording:
Capsules: Schoeps mk41v (x2), mk4v (x2), mk22 (x2), mk3 (x2), mk21 & mk8
Cables: 2x nbob KCY, 1 pair nbob actives, Darktrain 2 and 4 channel KCY extensions:
Preamps:    Naiant Littlebox, Naiant IPA, Naiant PFA, Sound Devices Mixpre6
Recorders: Sound Devices Mixpre6, Sony PCM m10
Home Playback: Mytek DSD 192> Adcom SLC 505> Marantz Ma500 (x2)> Eminent Tech LFT-16; Musical Fidelity xCan v2> Hifiman HE-400
Office Playback: Grace m903> AKG k701

Offline Gutbucket

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Re: Really bad, but well-intended, English translation
« Reply #5 on: June 14, 2018, 03:35:22 PM »
An entertaining read, thanks.  All the more so as I'm spending the day putting together a technical installation/operation/service manual, struggling to translate oral shop/engineering speak directly from folks who know all about these things and do them by rote into comprehensible english which non-technical installers and end users can follow.  Sort of need to be inside two very different mindsets at once, observing and writing from a third person point of view.  It's a challenging puzzle.

I'm curious what the Overspeaking Absorption >= 45dB spec is referring to.
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made easy- >>Improved PAS table<< | made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<<

Offline DSatz

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Re: Really bad, but well-intended, English translation
« Reply #6 on: June 14, 2018, 05:05:01 PM »
That is a rote translation of "Űbersprechdämpfung," which is crosstalk suppression--basically, the degree of electrical separation between the two channels of the amplifier, independent of the capsules. This could be measured by using a test head that shunts the amplifier's inputs with capacitances equal to those of the two capsules. You'd apply a 1 kHz tone at nominal level to the amplifier input for either channel alone, then observe the outputs of both channels. The 1 kHz residue in the channel not receiving the test signal should be at least 45 dB below the level of the channel to which the signal was applied.

45 dB may not seem like a lot of separation. But this is a stereo microphone that picks up a sound field at one particular location. For that application (as with stereo phonograph cartridges and stereo FM broadcasts), 20 to 25 dB of separation is the point of diminishing returns. It's comparable to the depth of the nulls in the capsules' directional patterns. And given the difficulty of isolating two very high-impedance inputs from each other when they're in such close proximity, 45 dB is a very good result for the technological era that this microphone comes from.

--best regards
« Last Edit: June 22, 2018, 09:14:08 AM by DSatz »
music > microphones > a recorder of some sort

Offline aaronji

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Re: Really bad, but well-intended, English translation
« Reply #7 on: June 14, 2018, 05:05:26 PM »
I'm spending the day putting together a technical installation/operation/service manual, struggling to translate oral shop/engineering speak directly from folks who know all about these things and do them by rote into comprehensible english which non-technical installers and end users can follow.  Sort of need to be inside two very different mindsets at once, observing and writing from a third person point of view.  It's a challenging puzzle.

I am frequently asked to provide a "laymen's summary" of the work I do.  I also find it very challenging, especially since it deprives me of all of my technical jargon...

Das ist bedauerlich. Auch bedauerlich ist dass mein Deutsch Scheiße ist.

It's a hell of a lot better than mine!  Although I find that as my Dutch (slowly but surely) gets better, I can at least understand some German (for what it's worth, the two languages are much more dissimilar than most English-speakers assume).

Offline ycoop

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Re: Really bad, but well-intended, English translation
« Reply #8 on: June 14, 2018, 05:20:51 PM »
Hast du den Text auf Deutsch? So können wir die beiden Versionen vergleichen.

או לפחות בעברית כדי לרדת לעומק הפשט.

?נראה לי שלהבין את זה צריך גם רמז, דרש, וסוד. ובאמת לכנס לפרדס זה משהו עיקרי במוזיקה, לא
Avantone CK-1s > DR-60d mkII, DR-22wl

Offline noahbickart

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Re: Really bad, but well-intended, English translation
« Reply #9 on: June 14, 2018, 08:09:09 PM »
Hast du den Text auf Deutsch? So können wir die beiden Versionen vergleichen.

או לפחות בעברית כדי לרדת לעומק הפשט.

?נראה לי שלהבין את זה צריך גם רמז, דרש, וסוד. ובאמת לכנס לפרדס זה משהו עיקרי במוזיקה, לא
לחלוטין.

לא ידעתי שיש עוד יודעי ספר באתר הזה.
Recording:
Capsules: Schoeps mk41v (x2), mk4v (x2), mk22 (x2), mk3 (x2), mk21 & mk8
Cables: 2x nbob KCY, 1 pair nbob actives, Darktrain 2 and 4 channel KCY extensions:
Preamps:    Naiant Littlebox, Naiant IPA, Naiant PFA, Sound Devices Mixpre6
Recorders: Sound Devices Mixpre6, Sony PCM m10
Home Playback: Mytek DSD 192> Adcom SLC 505> Marantz Ma500 (x2)> Eminent Tech LFT-16; Musical Fidelity xCan v2> Hifiman HE-400
Office Playback: Grace m903> AKG k701

Offline ycoop

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Re: Really bad, but well-intended, English translation
« Reply #10 on: June 14, 2018, 08:29:44 PM »
Hast du den Text auf Deutsch? So können wir die beiden Versionen vergleichen.

או לפחות בעברית כדי לרדת לעומק הפשט.

?נראה לי שלהבין את זה צריך גם רמז, דרש, וסוד. ובאמת לכנס לפרדס זה משהו עיקרי במוזיקה, לא
לחלוטין.

לא ידעתי שיש עוד יודעי ספר באתר הזה.

  :bigsmile:
Avantone CK-1s > DR-60d mkII, DR-22wl

 

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