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Author Topic: Equipment to Mic a Guitar and Bass Amp for a band.  (Read 702 times)

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Offline NewTaper

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Equipment to Mic a Guitar and Bass Amp for a band.
« on: June 23, 2019, 12:59:33 PM »
Hey There,

I am going to shoot some video for a band and need to get some decent captures of their guitar & bass.

Can I run a Shure 57 directly into a Zoom recorder?
I plan on microphones for both cabinets but I am not sure if I need something between the mics & the Zoom?

Thanks for any help!

NT

Offline beegar

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Re: Equipment to Mic a Guitar and Bass Amp for a band.
« Reply #1 on: June 23, 2019, 01:04:04 PM »
Yes, you can run them straight into the recorder with phantom power turned off. The SM57 and SM58 are dynamic mics, which do not require phantom power. However, you will need more gain than if you were running a condenser mic with phantom power.

I wouldn't think that the Zoom preamp noise levels would be a problem with the sound levels you are likely to have.

Offline morst

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Re: Equipment to Mic a Guitar and Bass Amp for a band.
« Reply #2 on: June 23, 2019, 02:10:46 PM »

The zoom preamps should be fine for the mics. Loud sources like speakers don't need a ton of gain on typical dynamic mics like the 57 & 58.


The bass amp may have a direct line out that you can use, or you can use a "direct inject" box, which folks call a D.I. box, and pass the signal through it right before the amp, so you can take a line out. Acoustic guitar is most often run with D.I. rather than a mic on the speaker.


Generally when sound techs mic up a speaker cabinet, the mic is placed pretty close to the speaker cone. Speakers sound different from the edge (dull) to the center (bright and treble-y) so most time, I would split the difference and aim at a midpoint between center and edge. Listen in headphones as you move the mic while the player is playing, and you'll nail it if you have time and access to soundcheck like that.


As for mounting, if you don't have short stands, or if you had a side-address mic, you can drape the mic over the cabinet and secure it in place by wrapping the cable through the carrying handle a few times. Note that it's not ideal to mic at 90 degrees like that but it's still well within the cardioid pickup pattern of your 57 & 58, so it wouldn't be awful. A more elegant solution if you have a "stereo bar" handy is to use one side of that for the mic and clip, and just tuck the other end of the bar into the carrying handle. There are specialized L-shaped mic mounts made for this, many guitarists like the way they prevent technicians from sticking gaff tape on their vintage amps.


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(edited for a smaller image, the first was enormous!)
« Last Edit: June 23, 2019, 02:15:02 PM by morst »
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Offline NewTaper

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Re: Equipment to Mic a Guitar and Bass Amp for a band.
« Reply #3 on: June 23, 2019, 09:18:00 PM »
Many, Many thanks for the information and for the equipment suggestions.
Looks like I will get at least 2 of the Cab Grabbers and one DI Box to supplement the mic'ing of the bass.

Thanks,
NT

Offline heathen

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Re: Equipment to Mic a Guitar and Bass Amp for a band.
« Reply #4 on: June 24, 2019, 08:53:58 AM »
Are you sure the bass player's rig doesn't already have a DI out you could use?  You might not need to buy another piece if gear.
Recordings on LMA: https://archive.org/search.php?query=taper%3A%22Lucas+Lorenz%22
Mics: Core Sound TetraMic | AT4031 | AT AE5100 | AT853 (C/SC) | Line Audio CM3 | Sennheiser e614 | Sennheiser MKE2 | DPA 4061 | CA-14 omni Pre: CA9200 Decks: Zoom F8 | Roland R-05

Offline morst

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Re: Equipment to Mic a Guitar and Bass Amp for a band.
« Reply #5 on: June 25, 2019, 12:00:02 PM »
Are you sure the bass player's rig doesn't already have a DI out you could use?  You might not need to buy another piece if gear.
True, I wasn't very specific, but lots of pro bass amps have an XLR output right on the back.
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Offline heathen

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Re: Equipment to Mic a Guitar and Bass Amp for a band.
« Reply #6 on: June 25, 2019, 12:39:52 PM »
Are you sure the bass player's rig doesn't already have a DI out you could use?  You might not need to buy another piece if gear.
True, I wasn't very specific, but lots of pro bass amps have an XLR output right on the back.
Pedals too.
Recordings on LMA: https://archive.org/search.php?query=taper%3A%22Lucas+Lorenz%22
Mics: Core Sound TetraMic | AT4031 | AT AE5100 | AT853 (C/SC) | Line Audio CM3 | Sennheiser e614 | Sennheiser MKE2 | DPA 4061 | CA-14 omni Pre: CA9200 Decks: Zoom F8 | Roland R-05

Offline morst

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Re: Equipment to Mic a Guitar and Bass Amp for a band.
« Reply #7 on: June 25, 2019, 02:44:28 PM »
Pedals too.
Really? That's a new one on me. I figure most stomp boxes are, 1/4" in and out, so you can chain them together!?



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Offline heathen

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Re: Equipment to Mic a Guitar and Bass Amp for a band.
« Reply #8 on: June 25, 2019, 03:12:11 PM »
Pedals too.
Really? That's a new one on me. I figure most stomp boxes are, 1/4" in and out, so you can chain them together!?

I just meant there are a lot of pedals that have DI outs, not that any pedal can be used to provide a DI.  The Darkglass B7K is one popular example.
Recordings on LMA: https://archive.org/search.php?query=taper%3A%22Lucas+Lorenz%22
Mics: Core Sound TetraMic | AT4031 | AT AE5100 | AT853 (C/SC) | Line Audio CM3 | Sennheiser e614 | Sennheiser MKE2 | DPA 4061 | CA-14 omni Pre: CA9200 Decks: Zoom F8 | Roland R-05

Offline morst

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Re: Equipment to Mic a Guitar and Bass Amp for a band.
« Reply #9 on: June 26, 2019, 04:04:10 AM »


The (xlr or direct) output you take from a particular instrument into the mixing console or recording machine should be at "the end of the line," so it has the complete tone (signal) that the player intends.
The output won't be a very good representation of what you probably want to capture, unless the output is at the end of the signal chain.*
*exception: if you take a clean split from the instrument cable and then process the signal separately for the mix or record apart from the player's stage signal

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Offline goodcooker

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Re: Equipment to Mic a Guitar and Bass Amp for a band.
« Reply #10 on: June 27, 2019, 11:22:42 PM »

My relatively inexpensive bass amp (Mark Bass Black Line) has a balanced XLR DI line out. Don't buy a DI box until you ask the players if they have a DI output on the amps already.

Mine even has separate output controls for the speaker out and the line out so you can send the balanced DI to the PA and run your onstage cabinet completely different.
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Offline NewTaper

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Re: Equipment to Mic a Guitar and Bass Amp for a band.
« Reply #11 on: June 28, 2019, 12:51:20 AM »
Thank you everyone for all the wonderful information, it is extremely useful and appreciated.

Thanks,
NT

Offline morst

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Re: Equipment to Mic a Guitar and Bass Amp for a band.
« Reply #12 on: June 28, 2019, 03:57:05 PM »
I just meant there are a lot of pedals that have DI outs, not that any pedal can be used to provide a DI.  The Darkglass B7K is one popular example.
Just looked at the B7K. It's not just a pedal, it's a complete preamp, so it would make sense that it has all the features of a combo amp except the power stage and the speaker.
https://www.darkglass.com/creations/microtubes-b7k/
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Offline heathen

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Re: Equipment to Mic a Guitar and Bass Amp for a band.
« Reply #13 on: June 28, 2019, 04:11:52 PM »
I just meant there are a lot of pedals that have DI outs, not that any pedal can be used to provide a DI.  The Darkglass B7K is one popular example.
Just looked at the B7K. It's not just a pedal, it's a complete preamp, so it would make sense that it has all the features of a combo amp except the power stage and the speaker.
https://www.darkglass.com/creations/microtubes-b7k/

Yeah it's a sweet little unit.  Ubiquitous in some genres.
Recordings on LMA: https://archive.org/search.php?query=taper%3A%22Lucas+Lorenz%22
Mics: Core Sound TetraMic | AT4031 | AT AE5100 | AT853 (C/SC) | Line Audio CM3 | Sennheiser e614 | Sennheiser MKE2 | DPA 4061 | CA-14 omni Pre: CA9200 Decks: Zoom F8 | Roland R-05

 

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