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Author Topic: Newbie here, wanna start taping but don't know where to start.  (Read 2099 times)

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Offline TheMysticMuse

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Hi everyone!

while downloading some shows from a taper he told me about this place. I want to get into taping but I don't know anything about microphones/portable recorders, basically I don't know anything about the equipment needed for taping. I hear many talking about stealth recording set-ups. Is there any down-side stealth-recording and the equipment needed for this compared to "normal" recording? If stealth recording doesn't affect the sound, why don't everyone stealth record even though taping is allowed? Isn't it convenient to record while not having to think about the mic setup etc?

I would also welcome tips and good things to know about taping (where should I stand, will movement/dancing/digging to the music affect the sound or should I just stand still. ye basically a "good-to-know-guide" would be great to read. I've searched the web but haven't found anything.

So with all the nooby questions asked above I got a couple of more questions. What's a good set-up for a beginner? Or should I go "hard core" at the start and buy the taping equipments to a Rolls Royce? I will need everything (gear) that is required for taping. If anyone would like to share a good set-up to me that would be cool. Sorry for the bad English, I'm Swedish.
Budget: no idea what I'd have to pay for a good set up but nothing more than 500 $ would be good (this is for all the equipment needed).

Looking forward to your replies so I can start taping  :)

Regards,
Christian

PS. Please move this thread to another sub-forum if this isn't the right place to post. Thanks mod!
   

Offline daspyknows

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Re: Newbie here, wanna start taping but don't know where to start.
« Reply #1 on: June 25, 2019, 11:39:04 PM »
Welcome.  Peruse the threads.  You can get a good setup for your budget.  There are a couple of cool tapers from Sweden on here who can provide some mentor-ship too I would expect.

Online ilduclo

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Re: Newbie here, wanna start taping but don't know where to start.
« Reply #2 on: June 26, 2019, 08:25:01 AM »
Stealth thing is pretty easy, I generally tape that way, if only to keep people from asking about it. Equipment is pretty straight forward. A set of Sound pro mics, a sound pro battery box and a Sony a10 should probably get you going at under $500. Used gear buys here are a good way to go, too. There’s a “complete” set up in the yard sale right now, also a Sony m10 which has really excellent battery life and is small. The m10 also has built in mics which might suit your needs for a start. Pretty simple that way. There’s also a set of ca11 mics in the yard sale that are in Europe.

What you tape also makes a difference. It’s hard to get a good recording at a big arena show or at a place where the audience does a lot of talking. But for bar shows with loud amplified music or  quieter music where the audience shuts up, you can get some pretty nice stuff

 Good luck, have fun & share your results freely!

 :cheers:

Offline TheMetalist

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Re: Newbie here, wanna start taping but don't know where to start.
« Reply #3 on: June 26, 2019, 09:27:55 AM »
Welcome!  :cheers:

I'm also from Sweden. In which area do you live?

You will most likely need to purchase your gear online from the US. It's unfortunately difficult to find dealers/sellers from Sweden, or even Europe. Luckily, shipping international is not a hugh deal nowadays. Just remember, when purchasing from a non EU country you'll have to pay approximatily 30% extra for custom charges.

Some beginners starts with only a recorder with decent internal microphones. If you ask me, and most tapers here, you'll get much better results with most external microphones. There are tons of options. It all depends on how much work you want to put into this and how important the end result is for you.

Here in Sweden we don't have an open taping spirit like in the US. At least all tapers I know from here do stealth. Do your thing and no questions asked.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2019, 09:29:57 AM by TheMetalist »
It's not about fancy equipment. It's about the thrill, passion and hard work. Liberate the music!

"The music is your passport - Your magic key - To all the madness that awaits you." B.L. '86

Offline TheMysticMuse

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Re: Newbie here, wanna start taping but don't know where to start.
« Reply #4 on: June 26, 2019, 11:25:24 AM »
Welcome.  Peruse the threads.  You can get a good setup for your budget.  There are a couple of cool tapers from Sweden on here who can provide some mentor-ship too I would expect.

I found some kind of "getting started" thread that I'll carefully read. I'm very committed to this. Sweet with some fellow comrades, I just saw that one has already replied. I recognize your name, think I have stuff that you have taped, thanks for what you're doing! 

Offline TheMysticMuse

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Re: Newbie here, wanna start taping but don't know where to start.
« Reply #5 on: June 26, 2019, 11:29:23 AM »
Stealth thing is pretty easy, I generally tape that way, if only to keep people from asking about it. Equipment is pretty straight forward. A set of Sound pro mics, a sound pro battery box and a Sony a10 should probably get you going at under $500. Used gear buys here are a good way to go, too. There’s a “complete” set up in the yard sale right now, also a Sony m10 which has really excellent battery life and is small. The m10 also has built in mics which might suit your needs for a start. Pretty simple that way. There’s also a set of ca11 mics in the yard sale that are in Europe.

What you tape also makes a difference. It’s hard to get a good recording at a big arena show or at a place where the audience does a lot of talking. But for bar shows with loud amplified music or  quieter music where the audience shuts up, you can get some pretty nice stuff

 Good luck, have fun & share your results freely!

 :cheers:

So recording stealth won't make the audio quality worse than if I recorded the regular way (what now that means)? Thanks for taking your time adressing a lot of my questions. Would you please send me a link to those "complete setups" that  you mentioned. I'll also have a look at that Sony gear. Is Zoom H6 a good recorder? For 350 bucks I can buy it with free delivery from a site called "thomann", got a a lot of good reviews.

Offline TheMysticMuse

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Re: Newbie here, wanna start taping but don't know where to start.
« Reply #6 on: June 26, 2019, 11:36:00 AM »
Welcome!  :cheers:

I'm also from Sweden. In which area do you live?

You will most likely need to purchase your gear online from the US. It's unfortunately difficult to find dealers/sellers from Sweden, or even Europe. Luckily, shipping international is not a hugh deal nowadays. Just remember, when purchasing from a non EU country you'll have to pay approximatily 30% extra for custom charges.

Some beginners starts with only a recorder with decent internal microphones. If you ask me, and most tapers here, you'll get much better results with most external microphones. There are tons of options. It all depends on how much work you want to put into this and how important the end result is for you.

Here in Sweden we don't have an open taping spirit like in the US. At least all tapers I know from here do stealth. Do your thing and no questions asked.

Cool, since I'm new to trading/collecting ROIO I must say that I still haven't met a single Swede talking about bootlegs/live recordings. Is the taping scene "dead" here in Sweden? I live in the southern parts, närmare bestämt Jönköping, du då? Trevligt att råkas. Om du har tid får du gärna "guida/hjälpa" mig, är helt grön.

I've read that some just use the internal mics but I'll go for a good pair of microphones. I think I read somewhere that there's a brand called "Church" that apparently make really really good microphones, is this true? End result is very important for me. I only trade/download/share lossless, I'm a bit of an audiophile. I always verify everything that I download/upload to see if it could be possibly sourced or not. I don't wanna tape just for the matter of taping, I want a good, solid recording. Feel free to send me a PM and we can discuss further discussions. Really appreciate this.

Thanks guys for the help so far. Really looking forward to this, and of course I would never even think about selling recordings. I'm a sharer, everyone deserves to hear good music.


Offline seethreepo

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Re: Newbie here, wanna start taping but don't know where to start.
« Reply #7 on: June 26, 2019, 12:05:18 PM »
Open taping in terms of quality has the advantage of being able to (use bigger and potentially better gear) and also the ability to raise microphones far above head (talking) height. 

The downside is many venues will restrict where you can stet up (which might not be ideal in terms of sound) 

Stealth taping  lets you record  from where ever you want (fob) or front of soundboard is often the best sound quality. you are also typically closer to the Pa  when stealthing.  So the increased sound levels will often compensate for a talkative crowd.
Mics: Sound Professionals - SP-CMC-8 , Studio Projects SPC4, Beyerdynamic ck930 , Marcsounds binaurals
Pre amps: Beyerdynamic MV-1 ,  Naiant IPA
Recorders:  Edirol R-44, Edirol R-09HR, Roland  R-05, Tascam  Dr-2d

Offline flask

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Re: Newbie here, wanna start taping but don't know where to start.
« Reply #8 on: June 26, 2019, 12:13:46 PM »
Stealth taping  lets you record  from where ever you want (fob) or front of soundboard is often the best sound quality. you are also typically closer to the Pa  when stealthing.  So the increased sound levels will often compensate for a talkative crowd.

The downside being that you need to stay relatively still and any talkers next to you may lead to insanity. :angry2:
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Online ilduclo

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Re: Newbie here, wanna start taping but don't know where to start.
« Reply #9 on: June 26, 2019, 03:13:42 PM »
 not necessarily. Stealth can sound really good, here's an example of mine. http://duclism.blogspot.com/2019/04/yob-may-3-2oo9.html

 Also, don't discount the onboard mics. A friend of mine in Mexico uses the m10 internal mics and gets some really good sounding recordings. Would they be better with expensive external mics and a preamp? Maybe. 

A lot of the sound quality of the recordings is the SOUND IN THE ROOM. If it sounds pretty good, most likely you can get a good recording. If not, not much can be done, no matter the cost of the gear.

As a caveat, Church is well thought of as equipment by many here (not me) , but there have been more than a few problems in shipping and repair, and since you're not in USA or Canada, that could be even worse. 



Online opsopcopolis

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Re: Newbie here, wanna start taping but don't know where to start.
« Reply #10 on: June 26, 2019, 05:14:48 PM »
If you're just starting out, an M10, battery box, and small pair of mics will serve you very well. I personally looooove the church gear, but anything similar (AT-853 for example) will get the job done just as well. With a long enough cable you can run them on a stand like you would a larger microphone, and they are very flexible for stealth situations when needed.
Mics: Berliner CM-33, CA-14 card, CA-11 card & omni, AT-853, Sony ECM-907
Recorders: Tascam DR-60D, Tascam DR-05, Sony Hi-MD

Offline nulldogmas

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Re: Newbie here, wanna start taping but don't know where to start.
« Reply #11 on: June 26, 2019, 05:35:38 PM »
If you're just starting out, an M10, battery box, and small pair of mics will serve you very well. I personally looooove the church gear, but anything similar (AT-853 for example) will get the job done just as well. With a long enough cable you can run them on a stand like you would a larger microphone, and they are very flexible for stealth situations when needed.

Seconding everything above. I use the exact same gear (Church or AT-853 mics, battery box, M10) whether "stealthing" or taping open — the only difference is whether the mics are attached to me or to a stand.

You can certainly get better and more expensive gear that works better for open taping. (And, for that matter, other better and more expensive gear that works for stealthing.) But as a good entry-to-mid-level starting point, small recorder + battery box + stealthy mics should work well, and be doable for under $500.

Of course, you still have to decide between cardioid mics and omnis, which is a whole other matter...

Offline mrfender

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Re: Newbie here, wanna start taping but don't know where to start.
« Reply #12 on: June 26, 2019, 05:42:10 PM »
If you're just starting out, an M10, battery box, and small pair of mics will serve you very well. I personally looooove the church gear, but anything similar (AT-853 for example) will get the job done just as well. With a long enough cable you can run them on a stand like you would a larger microphone, and they are very flexible for stealth situations when needed.

I would echo this.  Being relatively new myself, I started with a DR05 (which is excellent for what it is) but changed to the M10 due to size, internal memory and fantastic battery life.  Paired with some Church/AT853s mics and a battery box or small preamp you can get some very good recordings.  Be sure to study up on mic placement and when to use omni or cardio mics as this plays a crucial role in how well you capture the sound.
DR-01, DR-05, DR-22wl, PCM-M10, Roland R-07
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Offline daspyknows

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Re: Newbie here, wanna start taping but don't know where to start.
« Reply #13 on: June 26, 2019, 06:01:24 PM »
One thing to note when stealthing is small and easy to get passed security.  I do not know what security is like in Sweden but in the US and UK (my experience) is many venues are using metal detectors.  Methods for defeating that are discussed privately for obvious reasons.  Also, going the mics, preamp/battery box and recorder option is what I would suggest.  Not a fan of internal mics.

Online opsopcopolis

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Re: Newbie here, wanna start taping but don't know where to start.
« Reply #14 on: June 27, 2019, 11:00:11 AM »
If you're just starting out, an M10, battery box, and small pair of mics will serve you very well. I personally looooove the church gear, but anything similar (AT-853 for example) will get the job done just as well. With a long enough cable you can run them on a stand like you would a larger microphone, and they are very flexible for stealth situations when needed.

I would echo this.  Being relatively new myself, I started with a DR05 (which is excellent for what it is) but changed to the M10 due to size, internal memory and fantastic battery life.  Paired with some Church/AT853s mics and a battery box or small preamp you can get some very good recordings.  Be sure to study up on mic placement and when to use omni or cardio mics as this plays a crucial role in how well you capture the sound.

I made the same switch about 18 months ago. Used the DR05 for years, just liked the profile of the M10 a little more.
Mics: Berliner CM-33, CA-14 card, CA-11 card & omni, AT-853, Sony ECM-907
Recorders: Tascam DR-60D, Tascam DR-05, Sony Hi-MD

 

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