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Author Topic: How to mix SBD and AUD recordings?  (Read 515 times)

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Offline ChadC

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How to mix SBD and AUD recordings?
« on: August 03, 2019, 03:37:33 PM »
I am wondering if there may be an updated and easier to follow guide for mixing SBD and AUD recordings to make a matrix. I tried following the guide linked below but it is beyond my comprehension. Thanks

http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=103031.msg1373822#msg1373822

Offline hoserama

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Re: How to mix SBD and AUD recordings?
« Reply #1 on: August 03, 2019, 09:10:02 PM »
Do they need to be time aligned? Or were they recorded onto the same recorder?
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Offline ChadC

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Re: How to mix SBD and AUD recordings?
« Reply #2 on: August 03, 2019, 11:30:52 PM »
Do they need to be time aligned? Or were they recorded onto the same recorder?

Different recorders so they need to be time aligned. I managed to align them in Audacity but they become more out of sync as time progressed. Is there a quick way to snap them into sync throughout the whole recording?

Offline ycoop

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Re: How to mix SBD and AUD recordings?
« Reply #3 on: August 04, 2019, 12:17:05 AM »
Do they need to be time aligned? Or were they recorded onto the same recorder?

Different recorders so they need to be time aligned. I managed to align them in Audacity but they become more out of sync as time progressed. Is there a quick way to snap them into sync throughout the whole recording?

The different recordings also have different clocks, which differ enough from one another that you can audibly hear the difference. This difference becomes more pronounced over time, as the one clock  gains more and more ground on the other.

The method posted above is the only way I know of to fix this. Essentially you’re taking the two tracks of slightly different length and squishing/stretching  one to make it the same length as the other. This involves determining the % difference in total samples (which correlates with time of the recorders were sampling  at the same rate) and adjusting the length of one track by that difference to keep them aligned through the entire duration of the two recordings. I hope that explanation helps, maybe the process outlined above will make more sense to you.
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Offline hoserama

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Re: How to mix SBD and AUD recordings?
« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2019, 04:09:12 AM »
https://youtu.be/MOz2GUdL_vw

I did a Youtube tutorial on time alignment using Adobe Audition 3.0/CC. If you're doing an AUD/SBD, you may not have to be as precise as I was in the video (multiple IEM sources). But it'll still get you through the process. Most challenging part will be finding the best sync points.
Audio: Countryman B3 + SBD feeds
Wireless Receivers: Lots of those
Antennas: Lots of those
Cables: Lots of those
Recorders: Cymatic Utrack24, Cymatic LR16, RME Multiface, Zoom F8, (3) Tascam 680, (2) Tascam 2D, Zoom H6, Zoom H4n, and a graveyard of irivers/nomads/minidiscs.

Offline rippleish20

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Re: How to mix SBD and AUD recordings?
« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2019, 10:57:23 AM »
Even if they are recorded on the same device they have to be time aligned (if the microphones were on stage the tiime difference may be small but I often see minor time differences in this scenario). If they were recorded on differences devices, you may have to stretch one of them to match the other.

I use Reaper and the process is super easy in it's most basic form. I sometimes split all the tracks and spend more timing panning and setting levels, but at worst you just drag each stereo recoding into Reaper and then time align them by looking at the audio and aligning them by looking for part of the waveform where you can match the two recordings.  There is a nudge tool and you nudge one of them relative to the other. If the microphones were in the audience its roughly a millisecond per foot (from the stage)
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Offline nulldogmas

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Re: How to mix SBD and AUD recordings?
« Reply #6 on: August 04, 2019, 12:03:53 PM »
If that step-by-step instruction above seems too complicated, the basic principle is: Mark the same two points in the show in both recordings, measure the time distance between them, divide one length by the other to get the ratio of the two, then either slow the recording that's shorter or speed up the one that's longer by that ratio to get them to match.

The trickiest part is finding the exact spots to use as markers: a snare hit is usually good since it's a nice sharp peak, but it could be anything that's easy to identify in both recordings. After that it's just simple math and the use of whatever pitch/tempo tool your editing software offers. (If you're not sure whether you should be multiplying or dividing by the ratio of the two, just try one or the other and see if the distance between the two markers ends up the same in both recordings — if not, go back and do it the other way instead.)

Offline morst

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Re: How to mix SBD and AUD recordings?
« Reply #7 on: August 04, 2019, 12:10:52 PM »
I have a public spreadsheet on google docs that does the math for you, once you have located the two sync points, and know either the length of both sections, or the length of one and the difference in lengths. I suggest marking the start of each file after you find Sync 1, then marking them again after you establish Sync 2, to make it easy to find the difference in lengths. (look for stick clicks counting in a song, and magnify the tiny waves!)


https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1pQGfYwPgBFFzcY5m6aRj-Zbu9HsRumLy-tJB1d8Eufg/edit#gid=583050244


Download it so you can save to it.


I have posted detailed instructions on this website but don't have the link handy...
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Offline ChadC

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Re: How to mix SBD and AUD recordings?
« Reply #8 on: August 07, 2019, 05:11:52 PM »
Would anyone be interested in doing the mixes for me? I would be glad to compensate you for your time. I can send dropbox links to the files. The sets are already one big file. I just need them mixed then I can track them out.

Offline beatkilla

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Re: How to mix SBD and AUD recordings?
« Reply #9 on: August 07, 2019, 06:01:54 PM »
Would anyone be interested in doing the mixes for me? I would be glad to compensate you for your time. I can send dropbox links to the files. The sets are already one big file. I just need them mixed then I can track them out.

I might what bands are these?

Offline ChadC

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Re: How to mix SBD and AUD recordings?
« Reply #10 on: August 07, 2019, 06:36:09 PM »
Would anyone be interested in doing the mixes for me? I would be glad to compensate you for your time. I can send dropbox links to the files. The sets are already one big file. I just need them mixed then I can track them out.

I might what bands are these?

There are 3 shows I would like done.

Glass - 2002-08-09
https://archive.org/details/glass2002-08-09.flacf

Phil Lesh and Friends - 2001-04-20
https://archive.org/details/2001-04-20.paf.neumann-bry.buford.4059.sbeok.flacf

Furthur - 2011-07-29
https://archive.org/details/Further2011-07-29.Further2011-07-29

 

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