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Author Topic: which record level?  (Read 3714 times)

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Offline tod3sschu3tze

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which record level?
« on: December 27, 2005, 07:54:46 AM »
hi guys?
i have got a sony mz-r70 and the core sound low cost binaurals with low sensivity option.
i am going to tape a heavy metal concert (loud ^^) in some days.
so, as you know the sony md recorder has got a manual record level option from 1-30.
i will plug the mic into the mic-in, what do you think is the correct mic-level when i stand in row #1 and the place to be is a mid-sized music-hall?
Stealth Setup(s):

NEW ONE:
Microphone Madness HLSC-1 > iRiver H120 + Rockbox > USB > WaveLab > Audio-CD / FLAC

OLD ONE:
Core Sound Low Cost Binaurals + Low Sensivity Option > 9V Battery Box > iRiver H120 + Rockbox > USB > WaveLab > Audio-CD / FLAC



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Offline Popmarter

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Re: which record level?
« Reply #1 on: December 27, 2005, 09:20:39 AM »
hi guys?
i have got a sony mz-r70 and the core sound low cost binaurals with low sensivity option.
i am going to tape a heavy metal concert (loud ^^) in some days.
so, as you know the sony md recorder has got a manual record level option from 1-30.
i will plug the mic into the mic-in, what do you think is the correct mic-level when i stand in row #1 and the place to be is a mid-sized music-hall?

get a batterybox and go for line in. mic in just won't do.
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Offline udovdh

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Re: which record level?
« Reply #2 on: December 27, 2005, 10:45:39 AM »
And crank up your stereo a bit, if possible to do some testing.

Offline Fatah Ruark (aka MIKE B)

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Re: which record level?
« Reply #3 on: December 27, 2005, 11:17:53 AM »
If in doubt always set your levels a bit low. You can always increase them in post production. Not too low though. I try to set my levels around -6 db when stealthing. That leaves enough room for times when things get louder, but still loud enough to get a clean recording.

It really will depend on how loud it really is. I don't know much about the sony MD's sorry.

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Offline tod3sschu3tze

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Re: which record level?
« Reply #4 on: December 27, 2005, 11:38:37 AM »
hi guys?
i have got a sony mz-r70 and the core sound low cost binaurals with low sensivity option.
i am going to tape a heavy metal concert (loud ^^) in some days.
so, as you know the sony md recorder has got a manual record level option from 1-30.
i will plug the mic into the mic-in, what do you think is the correct mic-level when i stand in row #1 and the place to be is a mid-sized music-hall?

get a batterybox and go for line in. mic in just won't do.

which battery box (not too expensive) do you recommend?
Stealth Setup(s):

NEW ONE:
Microphone Madness HLSC-1 > iRiver H120 + Rockbox > USB > WaveLab > Audio-CD / FLAC

OLD ONE:
Core Sound Low Cost Binaurals + Low Sensivity Option > 9V Battery Box > iRiver H120 + Rockbox > USB > WaveLab > Audio-CD / FLAC



tod3sschu3tze's Live Show & Bootlegs Trading List: http://trade.tod3sschu3tze.de

Offline Normsreality

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Re: which record level?
« Reply #5 on: December 30, 2005, 06:32:17 PM »
I used to have a similar set up. Never taped any heavy metal, but some pretty loud outdoor shows. I ran the levels on my MD at 22 and used this batt box from sound pros http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/SP-SPSB-6 . Good luck.
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Offline willndmb

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Re: which record level?
« Reply #6 on: December 31, 2005, 09:49:15 AM »
i had a mzr55, which was one step below the 70
and used to set mine around 23 -- i never did rock/metel shows though where it was really loud so you prob want to drop it down to 15 or so
and i recommend the battery box too
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Offline SparkE!

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Re: which record level?
« Reply #7 on: December 31, 2005, 09:56:50 AM »
hi guys?
i have got a sony mz-r70 and the core sound low cost binaurals with low sensivity option.
i am going to tape a heavy metal concert (loud ^^) in some days.
so, as you know the sony md recorder has got a manual record level option from 1-30.
i will plug the mic into the mic-in, what do you think is the correct mic-level when i stand in row #1 and the place to be is a mid-sized music-hall?

Stick the mics in your mouth and hum as loud as you can. (Yes, really.) If you record that and it hits the rails, you are set too hot on your levels and need to back off.  That's about the same sound pressure level that you'll get at a loud metal show.  I'm betting that you need to be about 16 to 18 on the levels.  The MZ-R37 is what I learned on and I think that your model has the same sensitivity settings.
How'm I supposed to read your lips when you're talkin' out your ass? - Lern Tilton

Ignorance in audio is exceeded only by our collective willingness to embrace and foster it. -  Srajan Ebaen

Offline tod3sschu3tze

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Re: which record level?
« Reply #8 on: January 01, 2006, 10:52:42 AM »
hi guys?
i have got a sony mz-r70 and the core sound low cost binaurals with low sensivity option.
i am going to tape a heavy metal concert (loud ^^) in some days.
so, as you know the sony md recorder has got a manual record level option from 1-30.
i will plug the mic into the mic-in, what do you think is the correct mic-level when i stand in row #1 and the place to be is a mid-sized music-hall?

Stick the mics in your mouth and hum as loud as you can. (Yes, really.) If you record that and it hits the rails, you are set too hot on your levels and need to back off.  That's about the same sound pressure level that you'll get at a loud metal show.  I'm betting that you need to be about 16 to 18 on the levels.  The MZ-R37 is what I learned on and I think that your model has the same sensitivity settings.

do you recommend that setting without a battery box?
Stealth Setup(s):

NEW ONE:
Microphone Madness HLSC-1 > iRiver H120 + Rockbox > USB > WaveLab > Audio-CD / FLAC

OLD ONE:
Core Sound Low Cost Binaurals + Low Sensivity Option > 9V Battery Box > iRiver H120 + Rockbox > USB > WaveLab > Audio-CD / FLAC



tod3sschu3tze's Live Show & Bootlegs Trading List: http://trade.tod3sschu3tze.de

Offline SparkE!

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Re: which record level?
« Reply #9 on: January 01, 2006, 11:03:03 AM »
hi guys?
i have got a sony mz-r70 and the core sound low cost binaurals with low sensivity option.
i am going to tape a heavy metal concert (loud ^^) in some days.
so, as you know the sony md recorder has got a manual record level option from 1-30.
i will plug the mic into the mic-in, what do you think is the correct mic-level when i stand in row #1 and the place to be is a mid-sized music-hall?

Stick the mics in your mouth and hum as loud as you can. (Yes, really.) If you record that and it hits the rails, you are set too hot on your levels and need to back off.  That's about the same sound pressure level that you'll get at a loud metal show.  I'm betting that you need to be about 16 to 18 on the levels.  The MZ-R37 is what I learned on and I think that your model has the same sensitivity settings.

do you recommend that setting without a battery box?

Don't do it without a battery box.  It will be wasted time if you do.
How'm I supposed to read your lips when you're talkin' out your ass? - Lern Tilton

Ignorance in audio is exceeded only by our collective willingness to embrace and foster it. -  Srajan Ebaen

Offline tod3sschu3tze

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Re: which record level?
« Reply #10 on: January 01, 2006, 01:29:50 PM »
hi guys?
i have got a sony mz-r70 and the core sound low cost binaurals with low sensivity option.
i am going to tape a heavy metal concert (loud ^^) in some days.
so, as you know the sony md recorder has got a manual record level option from 1-30.
i will plug the mic into the mic-in, what do you think is the correct mic-level when i stand in row #1 and the place to be is a mid-sized music-hall?

Stick the mics in your mouth and hum as loud as you can. (Yes, really.) If you record that and it hits the rails, you are set too hot on your levels and need to back off.  That's about the same sound pressure level that you'll get at a loud metal show.  I'm betting that you need to be about 16 to 18 on the levels.  The MZ-R37 is what I learned on and I think that your model has the same sensitivity settings.

do you recommend that setting without a battery box?

Don't do it without a battery box.  It will be wasted time if you do.

hm ok, i ask explicitly for the need of a battery box, because len moskowit from core sound told me via e-mail that the low cost binuarals with low sensivity function should be plugged directly into the sony's mz-r70 mic-in.
Stealth Setup(s):

NEW ONE:
Microphone Madness HLSC-1 > iRiver H120 + Rockbox > USB > WaveLab > Audio-CD / FLAC

OLD ONE:
Core Sound Low Cost Binaurals + Low Sensivity Option > 9V Battery Box > iRiver H120 + Rockbox > USB > WaveLab > Audio-CD / FLAC



tod3sschu3tze's Live Show & Bootlegs Trading List: http://trade.tod3sschu3tze.de

Offline SparkE!

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Re: which record level?
« Reply #11 on: January 01, 2006, 02:02:23 PM »
hi guys?
i have got a sony mz-r70 and the core sound low cost binaurals with low sensivity option.
i am going to tape a heavy metal concert (loud ^^) in some days.
so, as you know the sony md recorder has got a manual record level option from 1-30.
i will plug the mic into the mic-in, what do you think is the correct mic-level when i stand in row #1 and the place to be is a mid-sized music-hall?

Stick the mics in your mouth and hum as loud as you can. (Yes, really.) If you record that and it hits the rails, you are set too hot on your levels and need to back off.  That's about the same sound pressure level that you'll get at a loud metal show.  I'm betting that you need to be about 16 to 18 on the levels.  The MZ-R37 is what I learned on and I think that your model has the same sensitivity settings.

do you recommend that setting without a battery box?

Don't do it without a battery box.  It will be wasted time if you do.

hm ok, i ask explicitly for the need of a battery box, because len moskowit from core sound told me via e-mail that the low cost binuarals with low sensivity function should be plugged directly into the sony's mz-r70 mic-in.

Well, do the hum test then.  Don't take my word for it.  Stick the mics in your mouth, hum as loud as you can and experiment with the levels.  My bet is that you can't find a level that doesn't sound like it has clipping distortion unless you don't hum as loud.

If that doesn't convince you, then turn your stereo up way loud and do the same thing.  Be sure to get it up as loud as the show you're going to try to record.  That can be hard to do.  I still bet that the recording will sound distorted as compared to what it sounded like in the rooom when you recorded it, no matter what record level you use.  That's because your mics are going to overload.  Len's low sensitivity mod helps a lot, but it does not completely cure the problem of clipping the signal inside the mic capsules when you only have 1 1/2 Volts of bias voltage for the capsules.  His mod is mainly designed to prevent overloading the mic amp in your recorder.  In my opinion, there really is no substitute for a battery box.  The electret mic capsules used in the cheap mics simply need more bias voltage than your minidisc recorder supplies if you're going to record loud shows.

Again, don't take my word for it.  Do the tests.  Learn your equipment.  You'll get better results sooner if you do.
How'm I supposed to read your lips when you're talkin' out your ass? - Lern Tilton

Ignorance in audio is exceeded only by our collective willingness to embrace and foster it. -  Srajan Ebaen

Offline tod3sschu3tze

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Re: which record level?
« Reply #12 on: January 01, 2006, 02:15:17 PM »
okay, thank you for your advice!!! i will do your tests and try without a battery box first, if that does not satisfy me, i will try to get the recommended one! :D
Stealth Setup(s):

NEW ONE:
Microphone Madness HLSC-1 > iRiver H120 + Rockbox > USB > WaveLab > Audio-CD / FLAC

OLD ONE:
Core Sound Low Cost Binaurals + Low Sensivity Option > 9V Battery Box > iRiver H120 + Rockbox > USB > WaveLab > Audio-CD / FLAC



tod3sschu3tze's Live Show & Bootlegs Trading List: http://trade.tod3sschu3tze.de

Offline Ben Turnbull

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Re: which record level?
« Reply #13 on: January 01, 2006, 07:16:20 PM »
And besides, the "preamps" on the MD mic-in are much noisier than the signal going line in.  That was always what I was told and it's what my experience was as well.

... and don't doubt what SparkE! ever says, I find he's never wrong.  ;)
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Offline tod3sschu3tze

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Re: which record level?
« Reply #14 on: January 02, 2006, 06:03:48 AM »
And besides, the "preamps" on the MD mic-in are much noisier than the signal going line in.  That was always what I was told and it's what my experience was as well.

... and don't doubt what SparkE! ever says, I find he's never wrong.  ;)

alright, i will trust you and learn my equipment :)
Stealth Setup(s):

NEW ONE:
Microphone Madness HLSC-1 > iRiver H120 + Rockbox > USB > WaveLab > Audio-CD / FLAC

OLD ONE:
Core Sound Low Cost Binaurals + Low Sensivity Option > 9V Battery Box > iRiver H120 + Rockbox > USB > WaveLab > Audio-CD / FLAC



tod3sschu3tze's Live Show & Bootlegs Trading List: http://trade.tod3sschu3tze.de

 

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