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Author Topic: Edirol R-09 release information  (Read 69363 times)

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Offline poorlyconditioned

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Re: Edirol R-09 release information
« Reply #255 on: July 03, 2006, 10:05:55 AM »
how satisfied are the first edirol R-09 users with the quality of the recordings?
may I ask, how would you compare the quality of edrirol R-09 to HiMD recordings?

Exactly my question.  Compare mic and line inputs with: stock UA5, and HiMD (PCM input), for example.

  Richard
Mics: Sennheiser MKE2002 (dummy head), Studio Projects C4, AT825 (unmodded), AT822 franken mic (x2), AT853(hc,c,sc,o), Senn. MKE2, Senn MKE40, Shure MX183/5, CA Cards, homebrew Panasonic and Transsound capsules.
Pre/ADC: Presonus Firepod & Firebox, DMIC20(x2), UA5(poorly-modded, AD8620+AD8512opamps), VX440
Recorders: Edirol R4, R09, IBM X24 laptop, NJB3(x2), HiMD(x2), MD(1).
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Offline neutrino

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Re: Edirol R-09 release information
« Reply #256 on: July 03, 2006, 04:43:25 PM »
For those interested in seeing what makes the R-09 tick...
dB-


DPA4060 > R-09

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Re: Edirol R-09 release information
« Reply #257 on: July 03, 2006, 05:25:38 PM »
heh, you're the man.  i didn't even have the guts to crack mine all the way open to electrical tape over the LED!   8)

Offline poorlyconditioned

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Re: Edirol R-09 release information
« Reply #258 on: July 03, 2006, 05:59:35 PM »
For those interested in seeing what makes the R-09 tick...
dB-




Now that is sexxy!  I love it!  +T.

Do you have bigger pics?  I want to read the chip numbers.  If you have them, please Email them to me at: mannr@uwaterloo.ca.

If you don't have bigger pics, can you read some chip numbers off for me?  The "LVM" chip, upper right, in the second photo is interesting.  Also, the two eight-pin chips in the second photo on the right hand edge.

Thanks again,
  Richard
Mics: Sennheiser MKE2002 (dummy head), Studio Projects C4, AT825 (unmodded), AT822 franken mic (x2), AT853(hc,c,sc,o), Senn. MKE2, Senn MKE40, Shure MX183/5, CA Cards, homebrew Panasonic and Transsound capsules.
Pre/ADC: Presonus Firepod & Firebox, DMIC20(x2), UA5(poorly-modded, AD8620+AD8512opamps), VX440
Recorders: Edirol R4, R09, IBM X24 laptop, NJB3(x2), HiMD(x2), MD(1).
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Re: Edirol R-09 release information
« Reply #259 on: July 03, 2006, 08:28:53 PM »
what is the 28-pin cirrus logic chip? it looks like  it says CS5465 but the 54 series wouldnt be an audio a/d.  I would expect something in the CS42xx series.

peace, chris
My recordings and transfers at archive.org: http://www.archive.org/search.php?query=berryman%20AND%20mediatype%3Aetree%20AND%20collection%3Aetree

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Re: Edirol R-09 release information
« Reply #260 on: July 03, 2006, 09:24:34 PM »
what is the 28-pin cirrus logic chip? it looks like  it says CS5465 but the 54 series wouldnt be an audio a/d.  I would expect something in the CS42xx series.

peace, chris

CS8406-CZZ

That is a digital audio transimitter... for the digital *output* function.

OK, please get back to me on the other stuff.  I'd like to know what opamps and/or ADC are in there.  Note that some of the AKM series have builtin mic preamps, so everything might be in one chip.  That is how minidisc work anyways...

  Richard
Mics: Sennheiser MKE2002 (dummy head), Studio Projects C4, AT825 (unmodded), AT822 franken mic (x2), AT853(hc,c,sc,o), Senn. MKE2, Senn MKE40, Shure MX183/5, CA Cards, homebrew Panasonic and Transsound capsules.
Pre/ADC: Presonus Firepod & Firebox, DMIC20(x2), UA5(poorly-modded, AD8620+AD8512opamps), VX440
Recorders: Edirol R4, R09, IBM X24 laptop, NJB3(x2), HiMD(x2), MD(1).
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Re: Edirol R-09 release information
« Reply #261 on: July 03, 2006, 09:25:23 PM »
hmmm...that's the SPDIF encoder chip, the TI chip is the DSP, do you see a chip that looks like the codec or A/D?
My recordings and transfers at archive.org: http://www.archive.org/search.php?query=berryman%20AND%20mediatype%3Aetree%20AND%20collection%3Aetree

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Offline neutrino

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Re: Edirol R-09 release information
« Reply #262 on: July 03, 2006, 09:30:27 PM »

It looks like the A/D chip is on the center board B pic. It's a Burr Brown/TI chip labeled AIC32I. The LV chip you guys asked about is labled LVU04A which is a hex inverter.
dB-
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Re: Edirol R-09 release information
« Reply #263 on: July 03, 2006, 10:07:55 PM »
here are the specs on the codec then:
Stereo Audio DAC
100 dB A Signal-to-Noise Ratio
16/20/24/32-Bit Data
Supports Rates From 8 kHz to 96 kHz
3D/Bass/Treble/EQ/De-Emphasis Effects
Stereo Audio ADC
92 dB A Signal-to-Noise Ratio
Supports Rates From 8 kHz to 96 kHz
Six Audio Input Pins
Six Stereo Single-Ended Inputs
Six Audio Output Drivers
Stereo 8 , 500 mw/Channel Speaker Drive Capability
Stereo Fully-Differential or Single-Ended Headphone Drivers
Fully Differential Stereo Line Outputs
Low Power: 14-mW Stereo 48-kHz Playback With 3.3-V Analog Supply
Programmable Input/Output Analog Gains
Automatic Gain Control (AGC) for Record
Programmable Microphone Bias Level
Programmable PLL for Flexible Clock Generation
I2C Control Bus
Audio Serial Data Bus Supports I2S, Left/Right-Justified, DSP, and TDM Modes
Extensive Modular Power Control
Power Supplies:
Analog: 2.7 V - 3.6 V
Digital Core: 1.525 V - 1.95 V
Digital I/O: 1.1 V - 3.6 V
Available Packages: 5 × 5 mm, 32 QFN
My recordings and transfers at archive.org: http://www.archive.org/search.php?query=berryman%20AND%20mediatype%3Aetree%20AND%20collection%3Aetree

“Those who cast the votes decide nothing. Those who count the votes decide everything.”  Joseph Stalin

Offline poorlyconditioned

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Re: Edirol R-09 release information
« Reply #264 on: July 03, 2006, 10:31:29 PM »
here are the specs on the codec then:
Stereo Audio DAC
100 dB A Signal-to-Noise Ratio
16/20/24/32-Bit Data
Supports Rates From 8 kHz to 96 kHz
3D/Bass/Treble/EQ/De-Emphasis Effects
Stereo Audio ADC
92 dB A Signal-to-Noise Ratio
Supports Rates From 8 kHz to 96 kHz
Six Audio Input Pins
Six Stereo Single-Ended Inputs
Six Audio Output Drivers
Stereo 8 , 500 mw/Channel Speaker Drive Capability
Stereo Fully-Differential or Single-Ended Headphone Drivers
Fully Differential Stereo Line Outputs
Low Power: 14-mW Stereo 48-kHz Playback With 3.3-V Analog Supply
Programmable Input/Output Analog Gains
Automatic Gain Control (AGC) for Record
Programmable Microphone Bias Level
Programmable PLL for Flexible Clock Generation
I2C Control Bus
Audio Serial Data Bus Supports I2S, Left/Right-Justified, DSP, and TDM Modes
Extensive Modular Power Control
Power Supplies:
Analog: 2.7 V - 3.6 V
Digital Core: 1.525 V - 1.95 V
Digital I/O: 1.1 V - 3.6 V
Available Packages: 5 × 5 mm, 32 QFN

Nice.  It looks like everything, including the headphone amp!, is in that chip.  Seems pretty good quality too.  Does anyone know how the TI/Burr-Brown stuff compares to the AKM in terms of the converter quality?

Let me just add to that, after skimming the docs, what the preamp is doing.  There is a plot showing that if I put in a signal at -65dB wrt line level, what the SNR is as I add (mic pre) gain.  If I add 0dB gain I get an SNR of ~27dB, which is just down to the noise floor of -92dB.  It I add 20dB of gain, I get an SNR of ~37dB.  So, adding 20dB of gain added about 10dB to the noise floor.  If I were using "hot" mics, maybe 20dB is enough gain, and then my *maximum* SNR would be 92-20 = 72dB.  I'll have to look at MD, but I think it is comparable.

Of course, this is all on paper.   I've got to hear how it sounds.

Thanks again Neutrino for the brave disassembly!  I hope you get it back together safely...

  Richard
Mics: Sennheiser MKE2002 (dummy head), Studio Projects C4, AT825 (unmodded), AT822 franken mic (x2), AT853(hc,c,sc,o), Senn. MKE2, Senn MKE40, Shure MX183/5, CA Cards, homebrew Panasonic and Transsound capsules.
Pre/ADC: Presonus Firepod & Firebox, DMIC20(x2), UA5(poorly-modded, AD8620+AD8512opamps), VX440
Recorders: Edirol R4, R09, IBM X24 laptop, NJB3(x2), HiMD(x2), MD(1).
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Re: Edirol R-09 release information
« Reply #265 on: July 03, 2006, 10:38:51 PM »
Is there anyway to tell if I'm running line-in, at what point I'm adding gain to the signal, or is it all attenuation when recording via the line-in?
dB-
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Offline poorlyconditioned

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Re: Edirol R-09 release information
« Reply #266 on: July 03, 2006, 10:45:00 PM »
Is there anyway to tell if I'm running line-in, at what point I'm adding gain to the signal, or is it all attenuation when recording via the line-in?
dB-

I don't know.  I would never be certain of anything!  My guess is the line input is going to just have zero gain programmed in, but who knows.

If you got time, I'd like to see you put a test pattern, like a 1600Hz sine wave, into line in, adjust the gain to just under 0dB full scale, and record.  You could use something like a NJB3 as a signal source.  Then run a Fourier analysis of the signal to make sure there are no nasty harmonics around.

Some may recall that I did this with a Edirol UA5 and discovered *severe* distortion about -3dB or so.  I'm hoping they got it right with these units.  Probably OK, but worth checking.

Thanks again!
  Richard
Mics: Sennheiser MKE2002 (dummy head), Studio Projects C4, AT825 (unmodded), AT822 franken mic (x2), AT853(hc,c,sc,o), Senn. MKE2, Senn MKE40, Shure MX183/5, CA Cards, homebrew Panasonic and Transsound capsules.
Pre/ADC: Presonus Firepod & Firebox, DMIC20(x2), UA5(poorly-modded, AD8620+AD8512opamps), VX440
Recorders: Edirol R4, R09, IBM X24 laptop, NJB3(x2), HiMD(x2), MD(1).
** This individual has moved to user "illconditioned" **

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Re: Edirol R-09 release information
« Reply #267 on: July 03, 2006, 10:48:11 PM »
anyone know what the codec in the R-1 is?
My recordings and transfers at archive.org: http://www.archive.org/search.php?query=berryman%20AND%20mediatype%3Aetree%20AND%20collection%3Aetree

“Those who cast the votes decide nothing. Those who count the votes decide everything.”  Joseph Stalin

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Re: Edirol R-09 release information
« Reply #268 on: July 03, 2006, 11:00:38 PM »
Is there anyway to tell if I'm running line-in, at what point I'm adding gain to the signal, or is it all attenuation when recording via the line-in?
dB-

Hey, can you please answer one more question?  Is there gain/attenuation available on line in?  If so, how much?  I'm wondering if one could run "hot" mics directly into line in like I do on my Minidisc.  Both line and mic seem to go through the same preamp, though, so maybe it would just be better to use mic on low sensitivity.  But you might need line in control if you're plugging in a preamp or board feed though.

Thanks
  Richard
Mics: Sennheiser MKE2002 (dummy head), Studio Projects C4, AT825 (unmodded), AT822 franken mic (x2), AT853(hc,c,sc,o), Senn. MKE2, Senn MKE40, Shure MX183/5, CA Cards, homebrew Panasonic and Transsound capsules.
Pre/ADC: Presonus Firepod & Firebox, DMIC20(x2), UA5(poorly-modded, AD8620+AD8512opamps), VX440
Recorders: Edirol R4, R09, IBM X24 laptop, NJB3(x2), HiMD(x2), MD(1).
** This individual has moved to user "illconditioned" **

Offline neutrino

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Re: Edirol R-09 release information
« Reply #269 on: July 03, 2006, 11:21:21 PM »
Is there anyway to tell if I'm running line-in, at what point I'm adding gain to the signal, or is it all attenuation when recording via the line-in?
dB-

Hey, can you please answer one more question?  Is there gain/attenuation available on line in?  If so, how much?  I'm wondering if one could run "hot" mics directly into line in like I do on my Minidisc.  Both line and mic seem to go through the same preamp, though, so maybe it would just be better to use mic on low sensitivity.  But you might need line in control if you're plugging in a preamp or board feed though.

Thanks
  Richard

The low/high gain effects the pre-amp inputs only. There are seperate inputs for Line and Mic - it's not just a signal input with a switch.
dB-
DPA4060 > R-09

 

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