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Author Topic: Portable Computer-less Archive/Transfer/Backup of Flash Recordings  (Read 29829 times)

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Offline guysonic

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Re: Portable Computer-less Archive/Transfer/Backup of Flash Recordings
« Reply #30 on: June 26, 2006, 03:34:23 PM »
I think you are still getting your bits and bytes confused.  A 16Mb (bit)/sec drive will take about 40 minutes to transfer a 4GB (bytes) card, I know since I do it with my Flashtrax which is spec about the same for speed as the best OTG drives.
The HyperDrive HD80 promises 16MB/s, link. Like Leonard said, we need someone to actually use one of these things and report back on actual performance.


16MB/s is the BURST rating on this device, not the sustained transfer rate.  Likely burst speed is more useful for smaller flash capacity transfers, but not a useful indicator for large capacity flash like we tend to use here. 

Many devices seem to put the burst spec up front, and not also give sustained rates most useful for audio. 

This of course is why trying out stuff is so important, you often can't tell enough from the marketing/technical literature to know actual performance.
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Offline flintstone

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Re: Portable Computer-less Archive/Transfer/Backup of Flash Recordings
« Reply #31 on: June 27, 2006, 05:30:05 PM »
The Hyperdrive (also called Compactdrive in markets outside the USA) has
been on the market for about a year, and it is widely adopted by photographers.
A quick scan of www.dpreview.com, a respected photo forum, produced
the following test results, posted by readers.

Sandisk Ultra II  -- transfer 4GB in 6.75 minutes (9.8MB/sec)

Sandisk Ultra II --  transfer 2GB in 3.5 minutes (9.5MB/sec)

Sandisk Extreme III -- transfer 2GB  approx. 3min  (11MB/sec)

A post to the forum described how long the batteries will last:
copied 80GB of files from a SanDisk Ultra II CF on one fully charged set of 2500mAh.

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Re: Portable Computer-less Archive/Transfer/Backup of Flash Recordings
« Reply #32 on: June 29, 2006, 03:54:29 PM »
I have been using the Hyperdrive for about 6 months.  Absolutley love the thing.  The above transfer times seem accurate.  About 3-4 minutes/75 minunte set @24/48.  It has transferred every file perfectly.  It is easy to use and transfers onto PC through USB at about the same rate (3-4 min/75 set @24/48)

I use Lithium rechargables.  Since I recharge them before every show I cannot speak to the battery life, but would say 80 GB/charge seems a little high.

Highly recommended unit.

Jesse

Offline aberg

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Re: Portable Computer-less Archive/Transfer/Backup of Flash Recordings
« Reply #33 on: June 29, 2006, 09:04:44 PM »
I have been using the Hyperdrive for about 6 months.  Absolutley love the thing.  The above transfer times seem accurate.  About 3-4 minutes/75 minunte set @24/48.  It has transferred every file perfectly.  It is easy to use and transfers onto PC through USB at about the same rate (3-4 min/75 set @24/48)

I use Lithium rechargables.  Since I recharge them before every show I cannot speak to the battery life, but would say 80 GB/charge seems a little high.

Highly recommended unit.

Jesse

I also use the HD80 and love it... people that complain about the storage capacity of CF-based recorders need to stop worrying... this thing is all you need. Throw your hard-disk based recorders away, or if it's a 722, keep it, cuz that box owns regardless... needless to say, the HD80 is great.

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Re: Portable Computer-less Archive/Transfer/Backup of Flash Recordings
« Reply #34 on: July 02, 2006, 11:29:30 PM »

The HyperDrive HD80 promises 16MB/s, link. Like Leonard said, we need someone to actually use one of these things and report back on actual performance.


Thank you for posting your experiences with transfers.  And following my own advice, here is an update on the burner I purchased for easy flash transfer to DVD.

While my EZDigiMagic burner worked flawlessly for transfers of 2 ~2GIG size flash files or < 4 gigs fitting on 1 DVD blank, recent need to transfer 3 files totalling just over 5 GIGs to DVD caused the spanning feature to fail. 

Burner initiated stating spanning was needed to transfer the flash files, and first try made it to beginning of file #2 before burner ground to a standstill only acting like it was still burning files (drive activity light still flashing), but NO transfered bytes file status change after ~44 mininutes to over 60 minutes when I had to pull the plug (power off switch) as ESC button didn't work, starting over.  Second and third try initiated identically, but failed to transfer even the 1st file after two more tries before again locking up with identical symtoms.

Looked at the first burned disc and found a readable and intact (first) file, and second 0 bit failed file.  So I had the first file transfered OK and deleted that file from the flash using the MT deck.  Then again used the EXDigiMagic to successfully transfer the remaining <4 GIG two files to single DVD disk. 

While CD-R/RW capacity disk spanning might work OK (not yet tested) there seems a likely problem with DVD spanning over 4 GIGs and I won't know for sure until next time I have again have similar >4GIG flash capacity to transfer.

I guess it's time (after the 4th holiday) to call their customer/technical assist numbers to see if there's a problem with a solution.

Keep sharing those transfer device experiences.
 
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Re: Portable Computer-less Archive/Transfer/Backup of Flash Recordings
« Reply #35 on: July 03, 2006, 12:09:45 AM »
i saw jon merins hd80 compactdrive and its the tits, if i was using cf cards, thats what id buy, he transferred his AND jds's cf cards in NO time at setbreak/after last nites moe show
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Offline flintstone

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Re: Portable Computer-less Archive/Transfer/Backup of Flash Recordings
« Reply #36 on: July 04, 2006, 07:38:40 PM »
The 40GB SmartDisk Flashtrax XT personal media player is on sale at CompUSA.  Normally $299, there's a $100 mail in rebate if you order before the end of the month.  Take a look here http://tinyurl.com/pzb7c

The Flashtrax XT copies data from your Compactflash card a lot more slowly than competitors like Hyperdrive.  But it does have the ability to play MP3 and WMA audio, plus a bunch of video formats on a 3.5" color LCD screen.  $199 is pretty cheap for these features.  Of course, it's on sale for a reason.  No doubt there is an improved version in the works.

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Re: Portable Computer-less Archive/Transfer/Backup of Flash Recordings
« Reply #37 on: July 04, 2006, 11:06:29 PM »
The 40GB SmartDisk Flashtrax XT personal media player is on sale at CompUSA.  Normally $299, there's a $100 mail in rebate if you order before the end of the month.  Take a look here http://tinyurl.com/pzb7c

The Flashtrax XT copies data from your Compactflash card a lot more slowly than competitors like Hyperdrive.  But it does have the ability to play MP3 and WMA audio, plus a bunch of video formats on a 3.5" color LCD screen.  $199 is pretty cheap for these features.  Of course, it's on sale for a reason.  No doubt there is an improved version in the works.

Flintstone

Looks to be a good buy, but noticed website says 'sold out for delivery, in store purchase only.' 
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Re: Portable Computer-less Archive/Transfer/Backup of Flash Recordings
« Reply #38 on: August 11, 2006, 03:33:24 PM »

The HyperDrive HD80 promises 16MB/s, link. Like Leonard said, we need someone to actually use one of these things and report back on actual performance.


Thank you for posting your experiences with transfers.  And following my own advice, here is an update on the burner I purchased for easy flash transfer to DVD.

While my EZDigiMagic burner worked flawlessly for transfers of 2 ~2GIG size flash files or < 4 gigs fitting on 1 DVD blank, recent need to transfer 3 files totalling just over 5 GIGs to DVD caused the spanning feature to fail. 

Burner initiated stating spanning was needed to transfer the flash files, and first try made it to beginning of file #2 before burner ground to a standstill only acting like it was still burning files (drive activity light still flashing), but NO transfered bytes file status change after ~44 mininutes to over 60 minutes when I had to pull the plug (power off switch) as ESC button didn't work, starting over.  Second and third try initiated identically, but failed to transfer even the 1st file after two more tries before again locking up with identical symtoms.

Looked at the first burned disc and found a readable and intact (first) file, and second 0 bit failed file.  So I had the first file transfered OK and deleted that file from the flash using the MT deck.  Then again used the EXDigiMagic to successfully transfer the remaining <4 GIG two files to single DVD disk. 

While CD-R/RW capacity disk spanning might work OK (not yet tested) there seems a likely problem with DVD spanning over 4 GIGs and I won't know for sure until next time I have again have similar >4GIG flash capacity to transfer.

I guess it's time (after the 4th holiday) to call their customer/technical assist numbers to see if there's a problem with a solution.

Keep sharing those transfer device experiences.
 

Finally got around to calling EzDigiMagic product Customer service (during business hours) and was quickly talking to a tech who related NO ONE has tested the device spanning with anything like the large 2 GIG audio files I was attempting when transfer problems occured. 

As with flash memory cards, these devices are mostly used for digital camera photo files and later for MP3 audio, NOT specifically tested to handle continuous audio files of two or more GIGS each in size, so I was the first to report this shortcoming with transfer that required DVD (~4 GIG capacity) disk spanning.

After confirming my unit had the latest firmware and everything, the tech is giving this a 'high priority' engineering support status to find out what can be done. 

Keep progress on this posted as the EzDigiMagic seems the ONLY field portable device that allows true ARCHIVE quality backup and verification of flash card files without a laptop.   And powering from (a planned product) 5 volt switching supply run on a 4 D cells seems far easier than field powering a laptop to burn archive quality discs.

"mics? I no got no mics!  Besides, I no have to show you no stink'n mics!" stxxlth taper's disclaimer

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Re: Portable Computer-less Archive/Transfer/Backup of Flash Recordings
« Reply #39 on: August 13, 2006, 07:07:04 AM »

The HyperDrive HD80 promises 16MB/s, link. Like Leonard said, we need someone to actually use one of these things and report back on actual performance.


Thank you for posting your experiences with transfers.  And following my own advice, here is an update on the burner I purchased for easy flash transfer to DVD.

While my EZDigiMagic burner worked flawlessly for transfers of 2 ~2GIG size flash files or < 4 gigs fitting on 1 DVD blank, recent need to transfer 3 files totalling just over 5 GIGs to DVD caused the spanning feature to fail. 

Burner initiated stating spanning was needed to transfer the flash files, and first try made it to beginning of file #2 before burner ground to a standstill only acting like it was still burning files (drive activity light still flashing), but NO transfered bytes file status change after ~44 mininutes to over 60 minutes when I had to pull the plug (power off switch) as ESC button didn't work, starting over.  Second and third try initiated identically, but failed to transfer even the 1st file after two more tries before again locking up with identical symtoms.

Looked at the first burned disc and found a readable and intact (first) file, and second 0 bit failed file.  So I had the first file transfered OK and deleted that file from the flash using the MT deck.  Then again used the EXDigiMagic to successfully transfer the remaining <4 GIG two files to single DVD disk. 

While CD-R/RW capacity disk spanning might work OK (not yet tested) there seems a likely problem with DVD spanning over 4 GIGs and I won't know for sure until next time I have again have similar >4GIG flash capacity to transfer.

I guess it's time (after the 4th holiday) to call their customer/technical assist numbers to see if there's a problem with a solution.

Keep sharing those transfer device experiences.
 

Finally got around to calling EzDigiMagic product Customer service (during business hours) and was quickly talking to a tech who related NO ONE has tested the device spanning with anything like the large 2 GIG audio files I was attempting when transfer problems occured. 

As with flash memory cards, these devices are mostly used for digital camera photo files and later for MP3 audio, NOT specifically tested to handle continuous audio files of two or more GIGS each in size, so I was the first to report this shortcoming with transfer that required DVD (~4 GIG capacity) disk spanning.

After confirming my unit had the latest firmware and everything, the tech is giving this a 'high priority' engineering support status to find out what can be done. 

Keep progress on this posted as the EzDigiMagic seems the ONLY field portable device that allows true ARCHIVE quality backup and verification of flash card files without a laptop.   And powering from (a planned product) 5 volt switching supply run on a 4 D cells seems far easier than field powering a laptop to burn archive quality discs.

Called Thursday and talked to a 'Dave' in customer tech service as reported above, and was out when Dave called back Friday to leave a long 'Dear GuySonic' message relating that their backup device was NOT designed for handling large files that needed spanning, the device was never intended to be able to 'break-span' a large continuous file,  yada, yada, yada.   In other words, so far they seem to NOT want to do the tests with at 2 to 3 large files like I had trouble with. 

The files I had were two 2-gig size files (that should've fit 'unbroken' on a single DVD disc), and a third ~700MEG size file (in that order) that caused the machine to stall after copying the first file on the first try, then failed to copy even the first file on further attempts, and never did get to the second file after 3 tries.   

As reported here previously, by removing the first file from the flash, the unit worked to back up the remaining 2 GIG and .7 GIG (<4 GIG total) files.  I now am wondering if the device will actually copy two 2-GIG size flash files onto a single DVD; something tells me this might also cause the device to stall out. 

EzDigiMagic device is specifically marketed to be able to store 4 gigs on a single DVD, but does that also mean two 2 GIG audio files would be handled?
Appears not so likely with my experience.

Next week I go back to talking to EZpnp company about these issues, stay tuned for more news, or my getting a misrepresented product refund.

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Re: Portable Computer-less Archive/Transfer/Backup of Flash Recordings
« Reply #40 on: August 13, 2006, 08:23:38 AM »
I guess this little box will work with my R-09 and an old 20GB iPod:
http://www.iperris.com/otgbridge.htm

Does anyone have any experience with these?

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Recordings:
Live Music Archive | DaD Torrents | TTD Torrents | Etree Torrents

Offline guysonic

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Re: Portable Computer-less Archive/Transfer/Backup of Flash Recordings
« Reply #41 on: August 14, 2006, 08:18:46 PM »

Thank you for posting your experiences with transfers.  And following my own advice, here is an update on the burner I purchased for easy flash transfer to DVD.

While my EZDigiMagic burner worked flawlessly for transfers of 2 ~2GIG size flash files or < 4 gigs fitting on 1 DVD blank, recent need to transfer 3 files totalling just over 5 GIGs to DVD caused the spanning feature to fail. 

Burner initiated stating spanning was needed to transfer the flash files, and first try made it to beginning of file #2 before burner ground to a standstill only acting like it was still burning files (drive activity light still flashing), but NO transfered bytes file status change after ~44 mininutes to over 60 minutes when I had to pull the plug (power off switch) as ESC button didn't work, starting over.  Second and third try initiated identically, but failed to transfer even the 1st file after two more tries before again locking up with identical symtoms.

Looked at the first burned disc and found a readable and intact (first) file, and second 0 bit failed file.  So I had the first file transfered OK and deleted that file from the flash using the MT deck.  Then again used the EXDigiMagic to successfully transfer the remaining <4 GIG two files to single DVD disk. 

While CD-R/RW capacity disk spanning might work OK (not yet tested) there seems a likely problem with DVD spanning over 4 GIGs and I won't know for sure until next time I have again have similar >4GIG flash capacity to transfer.

I guess it's time (after the 4th holiday) to call their customer/technical assist numbers to see if there's a problem with a solution.

Keep sharing those transfer device experiences.
 

Finally got around to calling EzDigiMagic product Customer service (during business hours) and was quickly talking to a tech who related NO ONE has tested the device spanning with anything like the large 2 GIG audio files I was attempting when transfer problems occured. 

As with flash memory cards, these devices are mostly used for digital camera photo files and later for MP3 audio, NOT specifically tested to handle continuous audio files of two or more GIGS each in size, so I was the first to report this shortcoming with transfer that required DVD (~4 GIG capacity) disk spanning.

After confirming my unit had the latest firmware and everything, the tech is giving this a 'high priority' engineering support status to find out what can be done. 

Keep progress on this posted as the EzDigiMagic seems the ONLY field portable device that allows true ARCHIVE quality backup and verification of flash card files without a laptop.   And powering from (a planned product) 5 volt switching supply run on a 4 D cells seems far easier than field powering a laptop to burn archive quality discs.

Called Thursday and talked to a 'Dave' in customer tech service as reported above, and was out when Dave called back Friday to leave a long 'Dear GuySonic' message relating that their backup device was NOT designed for handling large files that needed spanning, the device was never intended to be able to 'break-span' a large continuous file,  yada, yada, yada.   In other words, so far they seem to NOT want to do the tests with at 2 to 3 large files like I had trouble with. 

The files I had were two 2-gig size files (that should've fit 'unbroken' on a single DVD disc), and a third ~700MEG size file (in that order) that caused the machine to stall after copying the first file on the first try, then failed to copy even the first file on further attempts, and never did get to the second file after 3 tries.   

As reported here previously, by removing the first file from the flash, the unit worked to back up the remaining 2 GIG and .7 GIG (<4 GIG total) files.  I now am wondering if the device will actually copy two 2-GIG size flash files onto a single DVD; something tells me this might also cause the device to stall out. 

EzDigiMagic device is specifically marketed to be able to store 4 gigs on a single DVD, but does that also mean two 2 GIG audio files would be handled?
Appears not so likely with my experience.

Next week I go back to talking to EZpnp company about these issues, stay tuned for more news, or my getting a misrepresented product refund.

Got a 'returned my call' from an engineer responsible for customer support and he was very receptive to understand just what is occuring with large audio file archive to disc backup.

It seems there are many variables, not just file size and type, but also types of flash can cause system transfer problems.  He did acknowledge these products were NOT tested with the types and sizes of files we are making in audio flash decks, and wants to investigate all the variables of flash card types and audio file size issues with the DVD burner product.  I am very encouraged by this recent conversation to say the least.

So the plan is I'm being sent at least one other make/model CF 4GIG or larger card known to work OK with their product to try recording with MT another two 2-GIG size audio files type for backup.  IF this works, I will try just recording another file set with my existing Sandisk Ultra II, to see if there's a problem using this card type. 

Although I have experiences and by all reports here to assume Sandisk Ultra II to be most reliable in my and most other's experience, the engineer related that his personal knowledge and knowing others within the company having problems with exactly this type of flash for at least reliability reasons, and then named most all the other types of less costly flash cards we have all seen deeply discounted and wondered if I've tried any of those as he has no bad experiences the alternatives, but I have to wonder as this has NOT been our experience in this group where most of those makes mentioned reported to caused at least occassional grief for one reason or another. 

My opinion is still the Sandisk Ultra II is one with most reports of reliability AND consistent workability for audiio recording purposes.  His opinion/EXPERIENCES is based on CAMERA photo file recording/transfer, and this may be the reason for differing experience and opinions.

Well, to continue, we talked for about an hour about all issues dealing with this application, and I did mention how SLO....OW this product burns to disc.  News is there is a new hardware version that's twice the speed coming out soon, (he'll send me one TO TEST AT FIRST CHANCE!), AND it will take advantage of the dual layer disc drive already in my version that is currently unsupported for backup function.   So maybe this is the way to go after all.   

In other words, Burn a dual-layer 8+GIG capacity DVD disc IN ONE SHOT, NO SPANNING NEEDED for 8-GIG flash card!?!?

Like I said before, this is the (only type of) product capable of archive quality backup, and ability to handle 8 GIG FLASH IN ONE DISC BURN IN AN HOUR'S TIME WOULD BE AWESOME.

I did have to ask him if other products like this are on the market, and response is ONLY one,the 'other make' taking twice the time to do the same things.

Stay tuned for tests results and (being optimistic now) practical solutions. 
"mics? I no got no mics!  Besides, I no have to show you no stink'n mics!" stxxlth taper's disclaimer

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Offline guysonic

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Re: Portable Computer-less Archive/Transfer/Backup of Flash Recordings
« Reply #42 on: September 03, 2006, 08:25:21 PM »
This is another update on the EzDigiMagic optical backup/archiving burner that refused to span DVD discs on first to third attemps with same seeming OK set of flash files. 

It seems the device WILL SPAN automatically to several DVDs.  I discovered working operation after doing a few more tests, one similar to first set of files that failed.  This time the burner first spanned properly (without incident) (3) 24bit/88.2K files totalling 4.74GIGS. These were two 2 GIG, and one 744meg size files.  The first DVD handled the two 2 gig files, and then the device asked for another blank, refusing a CD-R 700meg capacity blank as NOT enough space; which was correct, then accepted the second blank DVD+r for transferring the last 744meg file, closed the disc, and everything checked out with the two discs being burned correctly without noticeable errors.

Third test in this series is a completely autofilled 8-GIG CF card containing 5 wav files of type like before.  The card held four 2-GIG files, and a fifth ~70meg file recorded until the MT deck found no more memory space on the card, then stopped recording.

The burner accepted the filled up card, and properly spanned all five files to two DVD blanks, again without problems.

I am using the SAME Sandisk Ultra II 8-GIG flash card and MT deck, but upgraded the deck's firmware from 1.4.0 to 1.4.3, and this is the ONLY change in making these tests.  NO changes with the EzDigiMagic burner in any way.

Whatever the problem with making the first series of tests that failed, the problem has not reappeared so far.  Talking to EasyPNP engineers indicated speculation that something was not quite right with format on first files attemped, and that the burner (like some of the audio flash decks) can be sensitive to file/card format issues for proper operation.

So I guess I go to use the burner AS-IS until  problems again surface. 

My next series of tests will be with files LESS THAN 2-GIG size.  Like having 1.5 + .5 +1 + 2 + .75 GIG size files that should challenge the burner to allocate which files fit on a single disc, then span the next series of files to other blanks as needed. 

Uneven file size flash spanning is more likely normal for a field recordist doing a series of project recordings, and the burner is NOT allowed to split-up individual files, but hope it properly allocates whole files for spanning DVD archival requirements without further problems. 

Asked the engineers if there was ANY OTHER disc burner like their product useful for this purpose.  Reply was just one other, but worked much slower than their's, maybe fewer features.  Well it takes nearly an HOUR to burn a 4 GIG DVD disc now, we really should have faster, not slower.  Maybe the Dual Layer burner will get produced as mentioned before, and this is planned to double the burn speed.  Would be nice to burn an entire 8 GIG flash card to ONE DVD in less than an hours time.  Make a nice Christmas present it would.

In any case, I'll post the next test results ASAP.
"mics? I no got no mics!  Besides, I no have to show you no stink'n mics!" stxxlth taper's disclaimer

DSM HRTF STEREO-SURROUND RECORDING SYSTEMS WEBSITE: http://www.sonicstudios.com

Offline flintstone

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Re: Portable Computer-less Archive/Transfer/Backup of Flash Recordings
« Reply #43 on: September 29, 2006, 02:42:50 AM »
Here's another portable, battery powered DVD burner with built-in flash card reader:

Delkin DVD BurnAway, $300
http://www.delkin.com/products/burnaway/dvd/index.html

The web site says you can record in multi-session format, but does not mention
a disc-spanning function.

Flintstone

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Re: Portable Computer-less Archive/Transfer/Backup of Flash Recordings
« Reply #44 on: September 29, 2006, 07:31:33 AM »
Here's another portable, battery powered DVD burner with built-in flash card reader:

Delkin DVD BurnAway, $300
http://www.delkin.com/products/burnaway/dvd/index.html

The web site says you can record in multi-session format, but does not mention
a disc-spanning function.

Flintstone
 

This must be the OTHER disc burner the EasyPNP guys were talking about as being 'slower' than their's.  However, delkin shows this model 'out of stock' and might be out of production(?). 

A search shows Delkin device selling (in stock) at only $219 at: http://www.buydig.com/shop/product.aspx?sku=DLKBA e-tailer and a few others also claiming stock and discounted price far below Delkin's.

The BurnAway DOES claim to do spanning, and about half a dozen more media playback (TV and Headphones) and CD-R/DVD-R USB connected burner functions NOT done by the EZdigiMagic; AND comes with a REMOTE CONTROL for playback functions. 

So for the money and media features, the Delkin burner is worth considering.  But does it work as advertised?

If you do purchase this unit, please post performance experiences, and strongly suggest getting the DC auto adapter cord as this may be the only way to charge/power this unit in remote locations after the charged up NiMH battery is exhausted.

"mics? I no got no mics!  Besides, I no have to show you no stink'n mics!" stxxlth taper's disclaimer

DSM HRTF STEREO-SURROUND RECORDING SYSTEMS WEBSITE: http://www.sonicstudios.com

 

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