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Author Topic: How much improvement ST-9100 will bring over simple bbox in loud shows?  (Read 5017 times)

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Offline danzz1234

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I run CA cards > CA bbox (no roll-off) > h320.

I'm going to use it mostly for very loud concerts.

Will it improve quality or only give me more options (recording quiet stuff, for example)?

Thanks

Offline DaveG73

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Re: How much improvement ST-9100 will bring over simple bbox in loud shows?
« Reply #1 on: September 11, 2007, 12:04:44 PM »
Simple answer as I understand it (and I am still very much an amateur in this field) is Yes.

Dave.
Always Taping Under The Influence.

I was under the assumption that as a taper, we're all geeks?  I just thought it went with the territory?

Offline danzz1234

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Re: How much improvement ST-9100 will bring over simple bbox in loud shows?
« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2007, 12:08:08 PM »
Simple answer as I understand it (and I am still very much an amateur in this field) is Yes.

Dave.

Yes, it will give me more quality

or

Yes, it will only make my rig more versatile

 ???

Offline DaveG73

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Re: How much improvement ST-9100 will bring over simple bbox in loud shows?
« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2007, 01:00:54 PM »
Simple answer as I understand it (and I am still very much an amateur in this field) is Yes.

Dave.

Yes, it will give me more quality

or

Yes, it will only make my rig more versatile

 ???

Both, as far as I am concerned.

I am running the exact same rig as you if you substitute the Batt Box for the ST9000 and I have been amazed by the results that I have achieved for such a low-pro low budget set up.

The real benefit for me is for the quiet stuff, which I tape quiite a lot, (But unfortunately can't currently share), but the CA pre's are remarkably good and hugely versatile from my limited experience.

Dave.
Always Taping Under The Influence.

I was under the assumption that as a taper, we're all geeks?  I just thought it went with the territory?

Offline Javier Cinakowski

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Re: How much improvement ST-9100 will bring over simple bbox in loud shows?
« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2007, 01:15:42 PM »
For loud stuff, you really don't need the gain of the preamp.  Some camps would say that less is more, and adding the preamp in the chain is a negative.  Others would say that the sonic signature (flavor) of the preamp is an improvement over the sound.

I have found the church preamps to sound really good...
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Offline firebaugh

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Re: How much improvement ST-9100 will bring over simple bbox in loud shows?
« Reply #5 on: September 11, 2007, 01:59:10 PM »
I'm very new to taping as well and I only tape loud rock/metal/punk shows.  I've taped two shows so far, 3 bands each.  The first show I taped with just a batt box (MM-EBM-Custom) and the second show I taped with a preamp (ST-9100).  I like the second show better but there are other factors that could color my opinion as well, different styles of music and different venues as well.  I liked having Chris's 9100 because it was very easy to quickly adjust my levels instead of having to turn off the hold, adjust and then turn hold back on.
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Offline danzz1234

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Re: How much improvement ST-9100 will bring over simple bbox in loud shows?
« Reply #6 on: September 11, 2007, 03:13:37 PM »
Thanks for the answers guys. Anyone else?

So if I got it right... using the 9100 in a loud show wont be bad in any way, and I MIGHT get better results.

And I read somewhere that the 9100 works as a bbox/preamp combo, so I wont need to use the bbox anymore, right?

Offline Javier Cinakowski

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Re: How much improvement ST-9100 will bring over simple bbox in loud shows?
« Reply #7 on: September 11, 2007, 03:35:59 PM »
Thanks for the answers guys. Anyone else?

So if I got it right... using the 9100 in a loud show wont be bad in any way, and I MIGHT get better results.

And I read somewhere that the 9100 works as a bbox/preamp combo, so I wont need to use the bbox anymore, right?

you are correct!
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Offline Belexes

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Re: How much improvement ST-9100 will bring over simple bbox in loud shows?
« Reply #8 on: September 11, 2007, 05:14:57 PM »
I taped "RATT" last night...a loud 80s metal show with the 9100.  I had the 9100 at about "noon" on the dial and then I think the R-09 was at 8 and pulled a good recording.

I see some cranking the 9100 to +20, but that didn't work for me at Tool, which was a very loud concert.  The pre overloaded, but the silly red light should have given me a clue...now I know better.
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Offline 69mako

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Re: How much improvement ST-9100 will bring over simple bbox in loud shows?
« Reply #9 on: September 12, 2007, 03:53:59 AM »
I'm running the 9000 preamp and I noticed a huge difference in my recordings after the first time I used it.  When I was using a battery box, I had to use the gain on my recorder.  Now I'm using the gain on the preamp and my recording seem to have more life!!

Thanks Chris for a quality product!!!

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Offline danzz1234

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Re: How much improvement ST-9100 will bring over simple bbox in loud shows?
« Reply #10 on: September 12, 2007, 11:05:29 AM »
Now I'm using the gain on the preamp and my recording seem to have more life!!

Nice, that's what I wanted to know.

If anyone has any other experience with this, please let me know  ;)

Thanks

dorrcoq

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Re: How much improvement ST-9100 will bring over simple bbox in loud shows?
« Reply #11 on: September 12, 2007, 03:33:48 PM »
Since getting Chris's preamp I've never went back to the battery box.  Personally I found trying to figure out the bass rolloff settings on the (SP) battery box to be a major pain in the ass.

Offline landshark

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Re: How much improvement ST-9100 will bring over simple bbox in loud shows?
« Reply #12 on: September 13, 2007, 12:45:52 PM »
Hey Danz -

My two cents (and that's about all it's worth!) -

Here's my thinking - something has to amplify the signal coming out of the mics (even for loud shows).  You can either have the h320 do the amplification the way you do now, or have something else do the amplification.  I think the question is whether the Church Audio preamp is better (cleaner) than the preamp in the h320.  I've never heard the preamp in the h320, but I expect the CA preamp is MUCH better.  I do know the CA preamp is MUCH better than the preamp in the MicroTrack, and the MicroTrack is specifically designed for recording, whereas the h320 is not.  So, at any given level of amplification, I expect the h320 is going to add more noise than the CA preamp.  In addition to noise, there's the whole issue of "color", or how faithfully the preamp reproduces the exact frequency and dynamic range of the source input.  Again I'll bet that the CA preamp reproduces the inout signal better than the h320.

As long as my assumption about h320 vs. CA preamp quality holds true, I think the rest follows logically.  Of course, sometimes I'm an idiot so use any suggestions with caution...<grin>

Good luck!

Mike

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Offline danzz1234

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Re: How much improvement ST-9100 will bring over simple bbox in loud shows?
« Reply #13 on: September 13, 2007, 05:50:21 PM »
I think the question is whether the Church Audio preamp is better (cleaner) than the preamp in the h320.

As long as my assumption about h320 vs. CA preamp quality holds true, I think the rest follows logically.  Of course, sometimes I'm an idiot so use any suggestions with caution...<grin>

+T
That was REALLY helpful as I'm a noob at this and wasn't thinking about it that way you said (H320 preamp vs. ST-9100 preamp).
Now I guess I got it why it's good to use the Church preamp even at loud shows, and like someone said above, I wouldnt need to use the gain on my H320 and wouldnt have any possible noise by doing that.

Thanks again

Dan

Offline som

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Re: How much improvement ST-9100 will bring over simple bbox in loud shows?
« Reply #14 on: September 13, 2007, 05:59:18 PM »
My two cents....

There is a learning curve with using a preamp. Now you have *two* places where gain is controlled, vs. just one. There is more that can potentially go wrong. My first loud show using the preamp was kind of dissapointing, NOT that there is anything wrong with the preamp.

Here's a thread with a sample and more details if you're interested:

http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,90301.0.html

AT ES943/C's > Church Audio ST-9100 > iRiver H100 (Rockboxed)

 

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