Topic: good cheap way to matrix on the fly SBD + mics w/R09-HR?

[Brian E.]

Anyone have a solution?  I run CA-14's > 9100 > R09HR, but sometimes if I can get a SBD feed and I think the recording will benefit, I'd like to be able to mix in maybe 25-50% SBD.  I don't want to but an R-44 at $1K, I'd just like something that will let me input 4 channels and output 2 into my R09-HR.

Thanks

[danlynch]

UA-5 is a cheap solution for that scenario.   The problem is that you can't fix any synch issues you might get.

[Brian E.]

true, and that's also pretty bulky and complex.  probably best to just get a zoom or something and run board into it, then sync later.

speaking of which, how do people sync stuff down to the millisecond?  especially on different recorders with different start times?

[su6oxone]

probably best to just get a zoom or something and run board into it, then sync later.

speaking of which, how do people sync stuff down to the millisecond?  especially on different recorders with different start times?

Definitely easier and cheaper to have two recorders for aud and sbd, and sync later.  For syncing, I try to get it as precise as possible using Vegas, typically using discrete sounds like cymbal, snare drum, or best yet, drum stick hits ("1,2,3,4...") to line them up.  It definitely gets down to the sub-second level to align them perfectly. 

[Brian E.]

awesome.  can you do this with Audacity?

[danlynch]

true, and that's also pretty bulky and complex.  probably best to just get a zoom or something and run board into it, then sync later.

speaking of which, how do people sync stuff down to the millisecond?  especially on different recorders with different start times?

the UA-5 is pretty small, its certainly smaller than the R-44.  Its also not complex at all.  The mic inputs are on the front panel (with phantom), and the AUX RCA outputs on the back can be used for four-channel input on the fly.

[F.O.Bean]

true, and that's also pretty bulky and complex.  probably best to just get a zoom or something and run board into it, then sync later.

speaking of which, how do people sync stuff down to the millisecond?  especially on different recorders with different start times?

the UA-5 is pretty small, its certainly smaller than the R-44.  Its also not complex at all.  The mic inputs are on the front panel (with phantom), and the AUX RCA outputs on the back can be used for four-channel input on the fly.

[stantheman1976]

Anyone have a solution?  I run CA-14's > 9100 > R09HR, but sometimes if I can get a SBD feed and I think the recording will benefit, I'd like to be able to mix in maybe 25-50% SBD.  I don't want to but an R-44 at $1K, I'd just like something that will let me input 4 channels and output 2 into my R09-HR.

Thanks

Get a 1/8" male > dual 1/8" female cable and plug both SBD and CA sources into the female end and the male into your recorder.  You won't be able to adjust how much of each source you get but it's quick, easy, and cheap.

[Brian E.]

that would make one channnel mics and the other SBD, right?

[stantheman1976]

It sends the signal to both channels so you'd get an equal mix of SBD and mics on both channels.  Not an ideal way but cheap and easy.

[Walstib62]

Apparently the Russians are coming
Anyway, if you try to combine signals with a y-cable, you wll not like the results unless your mics are REAL close to the PA. You can use a second recorder and do time correction in post, but you have to do that EVERY time, which seems like it would be a pain. Recording 4 tracks is the way to go.

[Walstib62]

You need to toss in some series resistance using the cable approach, otherwise the two sources will load each other with a probable large increase in distortion.

Absolutely! Distorted and out of sync. Sweet!

[Will_S]

Just get a Tascam DR2D.  200 bucks for 4 tracks with no clock drift issues like you'd get with 2 recorders.

[acidjack]

awesome.  can you do this with Audacity?

You can align two sources in Audacity.  Read the long thread in the sticky at the top of the "Computer Related Help" section of TS.com.  I have to caution you that it's not really all that easy, especially if a show is on the longer side.  There's math involved, which I've done before and still had things not sync.  Dan and I were, for instance, trying to sync 6 stereo mic sources, from mics that were almost in the identical spot in the venue, from two of the same decks (Oade R-44s), and even with all the lining up and everything, the drift still seemed to occur... if you line up one point, another would get more "off". 

Those were 2.5 hr shows though.  For your normal rock show of 70 or so min, if you line up a cymbal hit and you start the recorders at the same time, you're 95% of the way there probably.  Heck, I once did a show where I added in DPA 4061>littlebox>m10 to the 4 channels on my -44.  I started both decks at the same time, and I didn't even have to shift the sources at all, as luck would have it.

But anyway, it's not that easy.

Since you have to spend money no matter what you do, I'd second the suggestion of the DR-2D. I haven't used it, but it appears to do what you'd need it to do.  You'll still need SBD cables, of course.  I personally just use some very long RCAs most of the time and have adapter tips for 1/4" and XLR.  Most SBDs I deal with use RCAs, although better ones for bigger venues probably will not. 

[Brian E.]

thanks!