Topic: Newbie advice - what's the difference between CA-14 and CA-11?

[GreatGig]

Hi guys, brand new to the forum but I did pop in here a few years back, then lost you! Glad to have found it again....

Anyway, I'm new to taping as well as the forum, but have been passionate about live music for the past 35+ years, so thought it time to preserve some of those shows, as I ain't getting any younger  I have a gig tomorrow night and in my haste last week I bought a Zoom H1. I must admit the recording quality after playing around is not bad at all and I did intend to buy some external mics, but I am rather concerned about the very plasticky build quality and the fact I looks like it won't last long. So it's going back to Amazon and after reading here over the last couple of days, I have decided on a SONY PCM-M10. Next up for me are mics and my choices at the moment are between Church Audio and AudioReality, although it seems that CA would be the better buy?

I have looked at the CA website and eBay store and only see mention of CA-11's in my price range, but there are many posts here about CA-14's so can anyone point out what the difference is, or has the 14 been superseded? I'm looking to buy a battery box as well from CA or Studio Professionals. My intention is for recording mostly by stealth at live rock concerts, so predominately loud, but I do love female vocal, Americana and acoustic folk music too, so would need to do both - am I on the right track with the gear mentioned?.

About me, well I live in the UK and started going to gigs at 14 and have never stopped. I listen to music everyday at home and have just reached the situation where I am very happy with my home system (no more upgrades . . . phew), so recording is the next step as I go to lot's of gigs.

And finally, thanks for all the fantastic information here, this is a wonderful resource for taping and I was directed here a year or two ago from a Pink Floyd forum, but have only just managed to get my arse in gear!

[acidjack]

Audio Reality is garb.  In the Church mics, I think the CA-14 sound much better, but they have a built-in windscreen that makes them a bit larger.  Mounted on a hat or something they are not THAT noticeable but the CA-11 definitely have a lower profile.

If you can get up close and are considering omni mics, the Church CA-1, which is less common here, sounds outstanding.   A friend of mine got some and has been making great recordings with them.  The CA-1s are also tiny.

[GreatGig]

That makes sense, thanks Jack (if that's your name  ), most of my taping will be indoors in fact probably around 90%, so maybe the windscreens are not that important, I need to have something small in preference. I take it these will be a good match for the M10? I have a lot to learn too it seems, a bit daunting at this stage but onwards and upwards.

Just had a look at 'nyctaper'... I love The Felice Brothers 

[Church-Audio]

That makes sense, thanks Jack (if that's your name  ), most of my taping will be indoors in fact probably around 90%, so maybe the windscreens are not that important, I need to have something small in preference. I take it these will be a good match for the M10? I have a lot to learn too it seems, a bit daunting at this stage but onwards and upwards.

Just had a look at 'nyctaper'... I love The Felice Brothers 

The ca-14 is a larger mic with a better overall quality of sound deeper bass the high end is about the same now that I have improved the ca-11 the ca-14 uses a larger 14 mm capsule the ca-11 uses a smaller 8 mm capsule. Both mics are good The ca-14 is more forgiving of placement where as the ca-11 needs to be up high and pointed more directly at the sound source.

So its really all about size the difference in low end is not that huge.

The ca-11 is more flexible because you can get omni capsules for it that simply screw on the ca-14 does not have that option. The ca-14 comes in an omni or cardioid version.


I would recommend the ca-11 and a ugly battery box if you are always taping loud shows if you tape all kinds of things I recommend my ca-9200 or ugly preamp if size is an issue.

Chris

[GreatGig]

Thanks Chris, I have just emailed you but you can probably ignore that now, as this has pretty much answered my question.... faster than a speeding bullet 
Now I just have to work out if I need Omni or Cardioid 

[Church-Audio]

Thanks Chris, I have just emailed you but you can probably ignore that now, as this has pretty much answered my question.... faster than a speeding bullet 
Now I just have to work out if I need Omni or Cardioid 

Cards are good when you are far away from the sound source and or in a bad sounding room. Omni is good for good sounding rooms and or close to the sound source. If you had to have just one mic I would recommend a cardioid. If you can get two I recommend both because its good to have the flexibility.

[Hypnocracy]

I'm loving my omni's right now (but they are AT853a's) you just have to ask yourself ...are you in the impact zone (close) and can live with all the talking going on around you...if so they sound more realistic...

[adrianf74]

Thanks Chris, I have just emailed you but you can probably ignore that now, as this has pretty much answered my question.... faster than a speeding bullet 
Now I just have to work out if I need Omni or Cardioid 

Cards are good when you are far away from the sound source and or in a bad sounding room. Omni is good for good sounding rooms and or close to the sound source. If you had to have just one mic I would recommend a cardioid. If you can get two I recommend both because its good to have the flexibility.

+1.

I prefer the sound of omnis, however, they're not very forgiving to the drunken wooks and/or chatty cathys who may be standing (or sitting) around you.   If you can get close, run omnis, otherwise get the cards.  I run both types of mics and would suggest you spend the little bit extra and get both from Chris.   Normally I try and get close so I can run omnis but in bigger stadiums/arenas (and even clubs), you might not have that luxuty so the cards are your friend.

[GreatGig]

Thanks guys, I have bit the bullet and just ordered an M10 and some cardioid's/battery box to get me started. When I have sussed out what I am doing and if it's for me, I will order omni's and cards from Chris, with a preamp. Right now I needed something quick, so have gone with SP-CMC-2 > SP-SPSB-8 > Sony PCM-M10

I have no clue what I'm doing yet, but you gotta start somewhere I guess.

( by the way, a big thanks to all who have chipped in and helped me in the threads and via PM - it's very much appreciated and this is a very friendly board for sure  )

[zupanic]

on 10/16/11 I used the CA-11 cards 35' from stage for Widespread Panic. I was nervous about using cards this close, but the results were fantastic. I also used them on 10/15 in a theater just behind the soundboard which I estimate was about 85-100 feet from the stage. Again, the results were awesome. Chris' mics are the bomb!
I use CA-11's > Sound Professionals SPSB-8 battery box > Tascam DR-2d
The 10/15 recording can be heard here if you want to sample...
http://panicstream.com/streams/wsp/2011_10_15/player.html

[newplanet7]

35' isn't at all close. That's great for cards.

[Fried Chicken Boy]

Right now I needed something quick, so have gone with SP-CMC-2 > SP-SPSB-8 > Sony PCM-M10

That is a solid low-profile rig and, aside from using a different recorder (Edirol R-09), I've used the same mics and battery box to pull quite a few tapes and have gotten some great results.  I also have a set of Chris' CA-11's and have made some great pulls with them as well.  IMO, the SP-CMC-2 have a slight edge in sound quality over the CA-11's and, like the CA-11's, you can also get changeable omni caps for them.  All that said, I think the Church CA-14's have the edge in sound quality over both of those mics.  Regardless, you'll have a good setup to do some recording.