Topic: comp: Sonosax SXM2/LS (Lemosax) vs. NBox+

[Craig T]

http://bt.etree.org/details.php?id=506051


Comparison between the Sonosax SX-M2/LS ("Lemosax") and the NBox+

Umphrey's Mcgee
April 18, 2007
Penn's Peak - Jim Thorpe,PA

Source 1: Schoeps MK4(DIN)>kcy>Sonosax SX-M2/LS>Hydra Silver XLR Interconnects >Sound Devices 722(24/96)
Lineage: Wavelab 6(resample,dither)->cd wave->flac
Taped by: Jon Merin
Transferred by: Jon Merin

Source 2: Schoeps mk4 (DIN)> NBox+> SD 722 (24/96); Wave Lab 5 (fades)> CDWave (tracks)> Wave Lab 5 (resample, Apogee uv22hr dither)> FLAC16
Recorded by Craig Taraszki (ctaraszki@hotmail.com)

Both rigs were on the same stand, about 35' from stage, center, 8.5' high.

Set 2
01. Higgins

Tracks:
1-9, odd: source A (1 minute intervals, 5 second cross-fades)
2-10, even: source B (1 minute intervals, 5 second cross-fades)

11: source A
12: source B

[Brian Skalinder]

Thanks for the post, Craig - looking forward to hearing the NBox+.  Couple questions:

• Do you know if the WL6 upgrade includes changes to the resampling algorithm?
• Were the same settings used for resampling and dithering in WL5 v. WL6?
• Is it possible to get the original 24/96 files?

[Craig T]

don't know if they've changed anything in the uv22hr dither algorithm in WL6.

same settings used in the resampling and dither.  we both batch process using the same plugins and settings.

hoping to get the 24/96 files from jon to do a 24bit comp, but it might take a bit.

[Brian Skalinder]

I'm not shy, I'll go first.    My playback:

PC > wireless > Squeezebox > digi-out > Sony STR-DA3000ES > Von Schweikert VR-2s (still in the process of breaking in)

In playing back, I adjusted the 3000ES volume by ~+1.5 dB on the even tracks to account for slightly lower levels.  My playback is in flux, so I should re-evaluate after things settle down, but my initial impressions...

Source A

• greater detail *, but less coherent soundstage (struggling a bit to figure out how I can think both of those things simultaneously)
• LF not as full or extended as Source B
• emphasis in MF, leading to a more up-front sound
• emphasis in HF, leading to a more up-front sound

Source B

• less overall detail *, but more coherent soundstage
• more robust, extended LF
• MF not as up front, somehow more "integrated"
• smoother HF, again not as up front, somehow more "integrated"

All in all, I found things I like in both sources.  In Source A I think the snare and guitars shine and I enjoy the more in-your-face kick drum, while in Source B I prefer the more robust bass, smoother high-hats, and more coherent soundstage.  My initial reaction was to prefer A, given it's more "in your face" sound, but over time I found its "hyped" sound fatiguing and ended up preferring the more laid back, natural sounding Source B.

Edit to add:  * After more listening, I'm not sure A provides more detail than B; may just seem like it due to the MF/HF emphasis I hear.

I'm gonna guess A (odd) = NBox+, B (even) = SX-M2/LS2

[spyder9]

35' from stage is the spot in that place.  Any farther out and the place sounds like it looks:  a barn.  The only time I recorded at Penn's, New Riders 8/18/06, they had the dinner crowd setup on the floor.  I didn't bother setting up close, instead setup by the SBD.  I didn't want to block their view.  Were they serving dinner at tables on the floor for this show?     

[Craig T]

I agree, it can sound very cavernous when you get farther back.  They had the tables set up, but no food service.  Tables actually gave us some protection from the crowd and a place for the gear.  We were told by venue staff that they just installed a new PA system a few days prior to this show.  I didn't think it sounded much different than the last time I was there.  Louder, maybe.

[spyder9]

I agree, it can sound very cavernous when you get farther back.  They had the tables set up, but no food service.  Tables actually gave us some protection from the crowd and a place for the gear.  We were told by venue staff that they just installed a new PA system a few days prior to this show.  I didn't think it sounded much different than the last time I was there.  Louder, maybe.

The staff at Penn's is a taper's best friend.  Great folks.  More than willing to help in any way, shape, or form.

Maybe they finally bought their own PA.  Some places, like Penn's, out-source their sound and they don't even own the equipment. 

[shaggy]

Potential Spoiler Ahead....




I guessed this wrong according to key.  I read the damn comments on the etree.org thread and must have been swayed.  Wklitz was saying, 'Finally listened t0 the comparison. Those who own a Sonosux should sell it now, unless you don't mind having a bass-deficient preamp.', that comment threw me off completely and figured into my guess as I keyed on mainly the bass.

http://bt.etree.org/details.php?id=506051

For a split second, I was thinking of losing the Lemosax.  Made RaZoRbAcK an offer on the NBox+/mk4 setup before I got the key from Craig (I was convinced I got it right and thought that Nick cleaned up the NBox with his new plus mod).  But now, I am keeping the Sonosax.

A vms02ib in the mix would have been nice!  I definitely prefer the sound of it to the Lemosax.  It is just kind of big and klunky compared to the other two in size.  The BNC connectors also add to the overall bulk when getting it into a waistpack and making it look discrete. 

[wklitz]

A vms02ib in the mix would have been nice!  I definitely prefer the sound of it to the Lemosax.  It is just kind of big and klunky compared to the other two in size.  The BNC connectors also add to the overall bulk when getting it into a waistpack and making it look discrete. 

Really?  I find the VMS02IB easier to put into a waistpack over a Sonosax, as it is not as deep., besides, I can even lay the VMS on it's side, couldn't do that with the sax.

[jerryfreak]

bump for unprocessed 2496 files

A vms02ib in the mix would have been nice!  I definitely prefer the sound of it to the Lemosax.  It is just kind of big and klunky compared to the other two in size.  The BNC connectors also add to the overall bulk when getting it into a waistpack and making it look discrete. 

Really?  I find the VMS02IB easier to put into a waistpack over a Sonosax, as it is not as deep., besides, I can even lay the VMS on it's side, couldn't do that with the sax.