Topic: Mic Trees Affecting Sound?

[runonce]

Most of the mics in that tree have a clear shot.  That one stereo mic in the back is probably effected,

http://bt.etree.org/details.php?id=536292

Listen for yourself....

As predicted upthread....

You guys are confusing "affecting the sound" with "sounds like shit."


just grabbed this, sounds great too me..

[newplanet7]

You guys are confusing "affecting the sound" with "sounds like shit."
just grabbed this, sounds great too me..

This.
The reason I posed the question was to see what would be affected.
As in which frequencies.
It is more evident if something is in front of a mic in say a stealthing situation.
Say if a persons head passed in front of the sound line you can hear it obstructed for a second.

[mterry]

You guys are confusing "affecting the sound" with "sounds like shit."
just grabbed this, sounds great too me..

This.
The reason I posed the question was to see what would be affected.
As in which frequencies.
It is more evident if something is in front of a mic in say a stealthing situation.
Say if a persons head passed in front of the sound line you can hear it obstructed for a second.

Now that you mention that....I taped Los Lobos a few weeks back and where they had us set up, we were directly behind a path and running at about 6 ft. I was actually sitting down and when people walked by there was clearly a noticeable difference in sound. Muffled, dark and less "loudness". Knowing that the mics were only @ 6 feet, I was thinking surely there would be some distortion........not at all. Tapes came out clear and crisp. Even is you are running up front somewhere, as long as you can remain at shoulder to top of head height you will be fine. Of course, anything lower and you will notice some quality loss.

[SmokinJoe]

Most of the mics in that tree have a clear shot.  That one stereo mic in the back is probably effected,

http://bt.etree.org/details.php?id=536292

Listen for yourself....

My apologies, sir, if I caused offense.   I didn't mean to.  That's the hard thing about text on a forum, it doesn't come with body language.

I was speculating that if you could run an A-B test with that tree, versus removing all the other mics on the tree, it's seems probable that there would be SOME difference, measurable in some small way, and that's all I meant.   A spectrum analyzer might show it down 1db at 20khz, but I know I couldn't hear that.   So that might be called "effected", but that doesn't mean it's bad or significant to most people.  As someone else noted, "effected" and "sounds like shit" are two vastly different things.

Since several people have chimed it to say it's an excellent recording, it seems clear that if it was effected, it wasn't by enough to matter, and that is probably the best answer for the original post.

In regards to my statement about the Stone Church beam, I have seen at least one case where it was a noticeable difference.  I don't remember what show it was, or what mics I was using, I just remember that there was an instance where one channel was slightly muffled, to the point where I was displeased and didn't seed it.

[page]

Since several people have chimed it to say it's an excellent recording, it seems clear that if it was effected, it wasn't by enough to matter, and that is probably the best answer for the original post.

Or affected in a positive manner. Effects can be both positive or negative depending on the sonic signature of the sound source and mic.

I wouldn't mind a small hit in the 5khz and up range at Phish... 

[datbrad]

Since several people have chimed it to say it's an excellent recording, it seems clear that if it was effected, it wasn't by enough to matter, and that is probably the best answer for the original post.

Or affected in a positive manner. Effects can be both positive or negative depending on the sonic signature of the sound source and mic.

I think that when you are sitting in a soundfield at a 100db or more, and the source is out front of you, as long as each capsule per mic pair has a line of sight opening in the horizontal plane, having them stacked close together causes no audible change in the result, good or bad. The surfaces are all curved, so any reflections are dispersed.

I do think that if you are going to be clamped on the rear of a stand, you don't want your capsules totally blocked to the opposing sides, so in your case with lowpro mics that can't reach past the stand like full bodies would, you need to use your clamp in a way that will back them away from the stand itself 4-6", so then the other mics are just out in front of you, not acting as a baffle between your caps. Otherwise, I think it's a non-issue.

[Dr.FOB]

My apologies, sir, if I caused offense.   I didn't mean to.  That's the hard thing about text on a forum, it doesn't come with body language.

No offense taken. I just wanted to point out that appearances are deceiving.

Sound capture is part science and part art.  There is no question that a moving body will cause sonic aberrations during playback.
Someone passing between the sound source and mic (especially just one side), a fan, door, or curtain that causes changes in the reflected waves can all be heard in the recording.  A head close to the mic when running low profile is much worse than another mic...

For the most part though, when a tree is constructed, a window to the stage is allowed for each mic pair.  It is not always horizontal though and doesn't have to be with today's elemental arrays.  There is usually one pair of elements that is on axis with a given position on the floor and that should line up with the microphones axis.  Stationary obstructions, though they may attenuate or accentuate some parts of the spectrum, are rarely noticed.

In the referenced photo, it is difficult to tell, but the usm69 was mounted so far back from the rest of the mics on the tree that clear lines were allowed  to the arrays on both sides.  Sounds quite good if I do say so myself;)

[Gutbucket]

You guys are confusing "affecting the sound" with "sounds like shit."
just grabbed this, sounds great too me..

This.
The reason I posed the question was to see what would be affected.
As in which frequencies.
It is more evident if something is in front of a mic in say a stealthing situation.
Say if a persons head passed in front of the sound line you can hear it obstructed for a second.

Now that you mention that....I taped Los Lobos a few weeks back and where they had us set up, we were directly behind a path and running at about 6 ft. I was actually sitting down and when people walked by there was clearly a noticeable difference in sound. Muffled, dark and less "loudness". Knowing that the mics were only @ 6 feet, I was thinking surely there would be some distortion........not at all. Tapes came out clear and crisp. Even is you are running up front somewhere, as long as you can remain at shoulder to top of head height you will be fine. Of course, anything lower and you will notice some quality loss.

Not applicable to many situations, but soncially relevant to the topic- I sometimes record an acoustic jazz trio in a patio type situation with no stage, from a seated seated position directly in front, with people passing between the band and the seating.  Mic'ed at head or body height, passers by muffle the sound terribly, especially if they linger or are of generous proportions. Since a tall stand isn't an option, I've found the best mic position, which nearly eliminates all issues due to the "occasional passing acoustic shadows" is on the floor. Fortunately, ankles tend to be the least occlusive portion of most people's physique in terms of their acoustic silouette.