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Author Topic: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts  (Read 2288 times)

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Offline ycoop

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Hey all,

I have a rycote mount and I'm not sure the model. It doesn't seem like there's any indication of the model on the unit itself.

Relatedly, I'm wondering if anyone has any experience using mounts other than the Shure A53m for SRS shapeways mounts.
Mics: Avantone CK-1s, AT853 c+o
Pres: CA9100
Recorders: DR-60d mkII, DR-2d

Offline darby

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #1 on: March 29, 2021, 10:01:34 PM »
Hey all,

I have a rycote mount and I'm not sure the model. It doesn't seem like there's any indication of the model on the unit itself.

Relatedly, I'm wondering if anyone has any experience using mounts other than the Shure A53m for SRS shapeways mounts.

post a picture and voltronic will have no issue helping you

I only use Rycote lyres for my SRS mounts:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Mounting-Base-for-Rycote-Single-and-Duo-Lyres/133298041528?hash=item1f092eb2b8:g:7XMAAOSwy-le44sI

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1054452-REG/rycote_40137_model_duo_lyre_pro_19_34.html?sts=pi-ps&pim=Y

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1083021-REG/rycote_042271_cyclone_pair_of_universal.html?sts=pi&pim=Y

I use these with my shotguns:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/880280-REG/Rycote_041118_INV_8_Microphone_Suspension.html?sts=pi&pim=Y


« Last Edit: March 29, 2021, 10:11:17 PM by darby »

Offline ycoop

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #2 on: March 29, 2021, 11:03:29 PM »
Here’s a picture
Mics: Avantone CK-1s, AT853 c+o
Pres: CA9100
Recorders: DR-60d mkII, DR-2d

Offline audBall

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Offline voltronic

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #4 on: March 30, 2021, 06:17:58 AM »
INV 7HG MKIII perhaps?

https://mymic.rycote.com/products/shock-mounts-suspension/invision-broadcast-film/

Yep; that's it.

Ycoop, Rycotes work perfectly with SRS mounts and they are what I use as well. Yours with the Duo-Lyre 68 will work fine for a pair of heavier pencil mics, but I wonder if it might be a bit too stiff for your Avantones. My CM3s are much lighter than most mics, and I use the individual 72-shore Lyres and the SRS Mounting Base, both of which Darby linked in his post.

SRS tends to use the mount you have in all of their product photos, but it is NOT the correct choice in many applications. It is VERY stiff, and is designed for a shotgun mic with a large windscreen.

I recommend setting up your mics with the SRS mount in your INV-7 HG, and tapping the legs of your stand while listening through headphones to see how much vibration is transferred to your mics. If you feel that too much is coming through, you need less stiffness / more compliance and should buy a pair of the individual 72-shore Lyres. Adorama has them in stock so you wouldn't have to wait for a special order from B&H. You don't need the SRS mounting base, as you would simply replace the Duo-Lyre on your INV-7 HG with these Lyres. You will need a very small Torx wrench (I don't remember the exact size).

Here is a thread where I go through the stiffness / compliance of all the Rycote Lyres. It is not intuitive.
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Offline ycoop

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2021, 07:17:50 PM »
Thanks for the input.

I'm looking to set things up for an AT853 mount, which presumably would need much less stiffness. Now that I think about it, I wonder if the DIY AT853 mount that I made (https://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=193082.0) did not have enough shock absorption. The two shows I taped with this set up didn't come out sounding good. I attributed that to other factors at the time, but now this has got me thinking...

As for the Avantones, I've been playing around with a homebrew mount using a 3" metal tube with 5/8" threading on each side with standard mic clips to hold the mics. Though the 3" 5/8" threaded extender that I bought is a wee bit too narrow for the rycote. Once I get it set up I'll do a mic stand check to see if I also need something less stiff.
Mics: Avantone CK-1s, AT853 c+o
Pres: CA9100
Recorders: DR-60d mkII, DR-2d

Offline voltronic

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #6 on: March 31, 2021, 02:05:37 PM »
Thanks for the input.

I'm looking to set things up for an AT853 mount, which presumably would need much less stiffness. Now that I think about it, I wonder if the DIY AT853 mount that I made (https://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=193082.0) did not have enough shock absorption. The two shows I taped with this set up didn't come out sounding good. I attributed that to other factors at the time, but now this has got me thinking...

As for the Avantones, I've been playing around with a homebrew mount using a 3" metal tube with 5/8" threading on each side with standard mic clips to hold the mics. Though the 3" 5/8" threaded extender that I bought is a wee bit too narrow for the rycote. Once I get it set up I'll do a mic stand check to see if I also need something less stiff.

For either the SRS AT853 mounts or your DIY one, I recommend swapping out the Duo-Lyre 68 for a pair of individual 62-shore Lyres, the softest option. Or if you want to have one setup that will also work for your Avantones, use a pair of 72-shore Lyres. Anything stiffer than that is not going to effectively isolate the super-low mass of your 853s with mount.
DPA 4061 ~ Line Audio CM3 ~ Naiant X-Q ~ AT 853  |  Naiant PFAs ~ Shure FP24  |  Zoom F6 ~ Sony PCM-M10
MOTU M2 ~ KRK Rokit RP5 ~ Sennheiser HD 650 ~ Etymotic ER4XR

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Offline ycoop

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #7 on: March 31, 2021, 02:14:17 PM »
Thanks for the input.

I'm looking to set things up for an AT853 mount, which presumably would need much less stiffness. Now that I think about it, I wonder if the DIY AT853 mount that I made (https://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=193082.0) did not have enough shock absorption. The two shows I taped with this set up didn't come out sounding good. I attributed that to other factors at the time, but now this has got me thinking...

As for the Avantones, I've been playing around with a homebrew mount using a 3" metal tube with 5/8" threading on each side with standard mic clips to hold the mics. Though the 3" 5/8" threaded extender that I bought is a wee bit too narrow for the rycote. Once I get it set up I'll do a mic stand check to see if I also need something less stiff.

For either the SRS AT853 mounts or your DIY one, I recommend swapping out the Duo-Lyre 68 for a pair of individual 62-shore Lyres, the softest option. Or if you want to have one setup that will also work for your Avantones, use a pair of 72-shore Lyres. Anything stiffer than that is not going to effectively isolate the super-low mass of your 853s with mount.

Thank you! Much appreciated.
Mics: Avantone CK-1s, AT853 c+o
Pres: CA9100
Recorders: DR-60d mkII, DR-2d

Offline blee421

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I just recently purchased a DIN mount from Scott @ Shapeway for my DPA 4022 pair. So from what I've read, I will need the softer Rycote 62 Shore lyres along with the mounting base? Hoping you can point me in the right direction team. Thanks for the help in advance.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/809861-REG/Rycote_042255_042255_Pair_of_Softer.html

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Mounting-Base-for-Rycote-Single-and-Duo-Lyres/133298041528?hash=item1f092eb2b8:g:7XMAAOSwy-le44sI

Blee
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Offline DavidPuddy

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I just recently purchased a DIN mount from Scott @ Shapeway for my DPA 4022 pair. So from what I've read, I will need the softer Rycote 62 Shore lyres along with the mounting base? Hoping you can point me in the right direction team. Thanks for the help in advance.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/809861-REG/Rycote_042255_042255_Pair_of_Softer.html

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Mounting-Base-for-Rycote-Single-and-Duo-Lyres/133298041528?hash=item1f092eb2b8:g:7XMAAOSwy-le44sI

Blee

Yes this setup works well. I've used this and the one that Darby posted in his last link.
« Last Edit: May 04, 2021, 12:46:18 PM by DavidPuddy »

Offline voltronic

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #10 on: May 04, 2021, 06:03:18 AM »
I just recently purchased a DIN mount from Scott @ Shapeway for my DPA 4022 pair. So from what I've read, I will need the softer Rycote 62 Shore lyres along with the mounting base? Hoping you can point me in the right direction team. Thanks for the help in advance.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/809861-REG/Rycote_042255_042255_Pair_of_Softer.html

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Mounting-Base-for-Rycote-Single-and-Duo-Lyres/133298041528?hash=item1f092eb2b8:g:7XMAAOSwy-le44sI

Blee

Yes this setup works well. I've used this and the one that Darby posted in his last link.
Yes this

Hold on - The 62-shore lyres are going to be much too soft for a pair of 4022's, even if you were using actives. I only use them for individually mounting my CM3s, and those are super-lightweight (as in, about the weight of an XLR connector).

At minimum, you are going to want a pair of 72-shore lyres. If you are running your DPAs with bodies, you might need a Duo-Lyre 68.
DPA 4061 ~ Line Audio CM3 ~ Naiant X-Q ~ AT 853  |  Naiant PFAs ~ Shure FP24  |  Zoom F6 ~ Sony PCM-M10
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Offline aaronji

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #11 on: May 04, 2021, 09:33:54 AM »
4022s are extremely light, I think around 30 grams (just over an ounce) each, give or take. A pair probably weighs about the same as a single 4011 with the compact body. I don't know if that makes a difference...

Offline blee421

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #12 on: May 04, 2021, 12:45:17 PM »
Each DPA 4022 weighs 7.5 grams (0.26 ounces). This includes the cable and xlr. So I’d call it 5 grams for each mic plus the DIN bar.

That seems pretty light to me.

Bruel & Kjaer 4011's & DPA 4022's (matched sets)

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Offline DavidPuddy

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #13 on: May 04, 2021, 12:58:48 PM »
I just recently purchased a DIN mount from Scott @ Shapeway for my DPA 4022 pair. So from what I've read, I will need the softer Rycote 62 Shore lyres along with the mounting base? Hoping you can point me in the right direction team. Thanks for the help in advance.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/809861-REG/Rycote_042255_042255_Pair_of_Softer.html

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Mounting-Base-for-Rycote-Single-and-Duo-Lyres/133298041528?hash=item1f092eb2b8:g:7XMAAOSwy-le44sI

Blee

Yes this setup works well. I've used this and the one that Darby posted in his last link.
Yes this

Hold on - The 62-shore lyres are going to be much too soft for a pair of 4022's, even if you were using actives. I only use them for individually mounting my CM3s, and those are super-lightweight (as in, about the weight of an XLR connector).

At minimum, you are going to want a pair of 72-shore lyres. If you are running your DPAs with bodies, you might need a Duo-Lyre 68.

You're probably right here. My nbobs with AKG capsule weigh in at 43 grams each (over 10 grams more than the 4022 remote) and I've been using them with the 72 shore mounts with no issue. I was under the impression that the 72 shore were all black but that is not the case.

Offline aaronji

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #14 on: May 04, 2021, 01:54:32 PM »
Each DPA 4022 weighs 7.5 grams (0.26 ounces). This includes the cable and xlr. So I’d call it 5 grams for each mic plus the DIN bar.

I think that is a typo on the B&H site. I have an old DPA brochure on the compact series that differs; unfortunately, the file is too big to upload here (PM me with an e-mail address and I would be happy to send it).

Anyway, a screenshot is attached.

Offline audBall

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #15 on: May 04, 2021, 02:06:51 PM »
For reference, a USD nickel weighs 5 grams. I suspect the DPA is closer to what aaronji posted above.

Is the SRS mount a stereo mount? Why not use the INV 7HG MKIII-style above or this (also mentioned in another of Volt's threads):
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1544187-REG/rycote_41138_invision_on_camera_universal_shotgun.html
« Last Edit: May 04, 2021, 07:37:10 PM by audBall »

Offline blee421

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #16 on: May 04, 2021, 02:47:22 PM »
I just weighed my shapeway din mount for 4022's, plus the 4022's with windscreens on.  5 ounces.







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Offline voltronic

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #17 on: May 04, 2021, 08:34:37 PM »
OK, a few things:

1. Now that we know this is a pair of actives, any sort of Duo-Lyre is totally out of the question. Even the lightest 68-shore version is going to be far too stiff, and that includes that InVision On-Camera mount which is the same exact stiffness in a non-modular format.

2. It seems DPA actives are close in mass to a Line Audio CM3. Line Audio doesn't specify it, but I just put one of mine on my coffee scale and it is 30.5g.

3. Given all of my Lyre trial-and-error with my CM3s, I can say with total confidence that what you want here is a pair of individual 72-shore Lyres with your DPA actives in an SRS stereo mount. That is exactly what I use all the time, and the 72-shore lyres isolate the whole thing perfectly. I also own two pairs of 62-shore Lyres, but trust me when I tell you that they are very compliant - far too much so for a stereo setup of 5 ounces 141 g. Your rig is going to flopping all around on you like some sort of audio Muppet. I use a pair of the 62 lyres each when mounting my CM3s individually, but never as a pair in a stereo bar / clip.
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Offline audBall

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #18 on: May 04, 2021, 09:48:03 PM »
It's a little unclear to me why Option 1 is totally out of the question. I own the On-Camera mount (thanks to your suggestion) as well as the Rycote INV-7 (with 72-shore lyres) and I actually prefer the relatively-increased stiffness of the former for my active stereo setups. I find the INV-7 to be a bit wobbly with wider setups, but totally sufficient for most general stereo setups.

Maybe time will convince me otherwise as you've definitely put more legwork into this, which I, and many others here, appreciate greatly.

Offline blee421

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #19 on: May 05, 2021, 03:04:44 PM »
OK, a few things:

1. Now that we know this is a pair of actives, any sort of Duo-Lyre is totally out of the question. Even the lightest 68-shore version is going to be far too stiff, and that includes that InVision On-Camera mount which is the same exact stiffness in a non-modular format.

2. It seems DPA actives are close in mass to a Line Audio CM3. Line Audio doesn't specify it, but I just put one of mine on my coffee scale and it is 30.5g.

3. Given all of my Lyre trial-and-error with my CM3s, I can say with total confidence that what you want here is a pair of individual 72-shore Lyres with your DPA actives in an SRS stereo mount. That is exactly what I use all the time, and the 72-shore lyres isolate the whole thing perfectly. I also own two pairs of 62-shore Lyres, but trust me when I tell you that they are very compliant - far too much so for a stereo setup of 5 ounces 141 g. Your rig is going to flopping all around on you like some sort of audio Muppet. I use a pair of the 62 lyres each when mounting my CM3s individually, but never as a pair in a stereo bar / clip.

Voltronic, thanks for all the info. Looks like I am going with 72 shore lyres and hopefully your confidence will pay off in the end!
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Offline voltronic

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #20 on: May 05, 2021, 06:12:39 PM »
It's a little unclear to me why Option 1 is totally out of the question. I own the On-Camera mount (thanks to your suggestion) as well as the Rycote INV-7 (with 72-shore lyres) and I actually prefer the relatively-increased stiffness of the former for my active stereo setups. I find the INV-7 to be a bit wobbly with wider setups, but totally sufficient for most general stereo setups.

Maybe time will convince me otherwise as you've definitely put more legwork into this, which I, and many others here, appreciate greatly.

I guess it depends on how vibration-sensitive your DPAs are. Line Audio CM3s are notoriously sensitive to structural vibration. The 68-shore Duo-Lyre completely failed the stand-tap test for me with a pair of CM3s in a SRS mount, as did a single CM3 in a pair of 72-shore Lyres (what comes stock on the INV-7). While I totally understand that you find the INV-7 a bit wobbly, that probably also means it is isolating more, whereas the increased stiffness of the On-Camera (aka Duo-Lyre 68) may be conducting more structural vibrations to your mics. Nothing is for free.

The only way to find out is to test it. Set up your rig, put on a pair of headphones, and tap your stand at various points. Use the On-Camera first, then the INV-7. (Side note: be careful to strain-relief your cable from the mics several inches below the mount. Don't use the clips built into the shockmount.) If the INV-7 is no better, then use the On-Camera.

One situation where you may want to sacrifice mechanical isolation in favor of greater stiffness is outdoors in the wind.
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Offline audBall

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #21 on: May 05, 2021, 07:19:08 PM »
All well understood the points related to vibration sensitivity and the 'cost' that comes with increased stiffness. I did similar tests you describe when I first purchased the INV-7 compared to other mounts I had at the time. I'll try to compare the two directly and see if I can more refine the cost-benefit of which mount for my situations. Thanks as always.

Offline OhioHead

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #22 on: June 18, 2021, 09:10:58 AM »
Hey gang, is the “red” Lyre mount more compliant/stiffer can hold heavy mic’s/cables then a grey Lyre?

Offline voltronic

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #23 on: June 19, 2021, 08:26:21 AM »
Hey gang, is the “red” Lyre mount more compliant/stiffer can hold heavy mic’s/cables then a grey Lyre?

I believe the red lyres are just for the Rode-branded mounts. They should be the same compliance as the standard 72-shore Lyres. EDIT: I actually have no idea if this is true. Those Lyres could be a custom-made compliance for specific Rode mics.

What mount specifically are you looking at?
« Last Edit: June 21, 2021, 03:25:56 PM by voltronic »
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Offline OhioHead

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #24 on: June 21, 2021, 01:21:55 PM »
Hey gang, is the “red” Lyre mount more compliant/stiffer can hold heavy mic’s/cables then a grey Lyre?

I believe the red lyres are just for the Rode-branded mounts. They should be the same compliance as the standard 72-shore Lyres. What mount specifically are you looking at?

Gotcha - check PM’s, please.

I think I need to move to Duo-Lyre set up vs a single pair of Lyre’s.
« Last Edit: June 21, 2021, 01:47:17 PM by OhioHead »

Offline voltronic

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #25 on: June 21, 2021, 03:26:29 PM »
Hey gang, is the “red” Lyre mount more compliant/stiffer can hold heavy mic’s/cables then a grey Lyre?

I believe the red lyres are just for the Rode-branded mounts. They should be the same compliance as the standard 72-shore Lyres. What mount specifically are you looking at?

Gotcha - check PM’s, please.

I think I need to move to Duo-Lyre set up vs a single pair of Lyre’s.

Responded.
DPA 4061 ~ Line Audio CM3 ~ Naiant X-Q ~ AT 853  |  Naiant PFAs ~ Shure FP24  |  Zoom F6 ~ Sony PCM-M10
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Offline OhioHead

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #26 on: June 25, 2021, 09:10:40 AM »
Thank you Volt, I found a stiffer Lyre via Gotham Sound.

The new mount arrived yesterday, took a few moments to remove the old Lyre and install the new one, set everything up & problem solved.

In speaking w/ Gotham, Rycote is having significant production issues so call Gotham, B & H, etc. before ordering Rycote online.

Offline voltronic

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #27 on: June 25, 2021, 04:58:57 PM »
Thank you Volt, I found a stiffer Lyre via Gotham Sound.

The new mount arrived yesterday, took a few moments to remove the old Lyre and install the new one, set everything up & problem solved.

In speaking w/ Gotham, Rycote is having significant production issues so call Gotham, B & H, etc. before ordering Rycote online.

Glad you found something that worked.

Thanks for the heads up on the production delays. I suppose they are hitting everyone at some level.

Just FYI to all: I have always found Adorama to have many more Rycote products in stock than the other big A/V dealers, who often special order from the distributor. This is especially true for the separate Lyres.
https://www.adorama.com/l/Audio/Microphones-and-Accessories/Microphone-Accessories/Rycote~Microphone-Boom-Poles
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Offline OhioHead

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Re: Identifying Rycote model and compatibility with SRS shapeways mounts
« Reply #28 on: June 28, 2021, 10:10:34 AM »
Great to know about the Adroma site, I was not aware until this thread.

 

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