Taperssection.com
Gear / Technical Help => Microphones & Setup => Topic started by: OFOTD on February 15, 2006, 01:11:42 PM
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The AKG Actives Project
Okay folks,
Matt (gumbino) and I have decided to take the lead on this project and get it going. Seems like there have been countless starts that always end up sputtering out. Not this time.
We will be taking this project in several phases (in no particular order):
- We are trying to round up all of the current users/owners of JKLabs and r/nboxes and getting a reference schematic drawn up as a basis to work off of.
- We need to find out who would be interested in this project/product
- We need to decide on what exactly we want out of this. Its not as easy as saying"I just want actives"
- Who is willing to pay for this type of project/product. Not everyone is willing to spend $100/$500/$1000 or whatever the final cost would be
- Who can build this for us. Is it Nick of Nbox fame or dp we find an outside engineer.
These are just a few of the questions we need to figure out.
If you would at all like to be involved in this project please send me a PM. Most likely what I will do is to take the alot of this planning and development off of this board as not to clutter it up and confuse people. When we have tangable facts and ideas then we could bring it to the board.
So if you want to help, are just interested in the project/product or whatever please send me a PM with an email addy and what you like to help with. After a few days I'll email everyone who has responded and we'll get this thing rolling to completion.
PLEASE DO NOT POST PDF's DRAWINGS DIAGRAMS TO THIS THREAD. EMAIL THEM TO ME AT OFOTDAKG@GMAIL.COM
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perhaps we could get some feedback or assistance from Jim Williams @ Audio Upgrades as well, he seems to know the insides of the mics rather well ???
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Would anyone be willing to open up their 460/480 bodies and possibly caps and take high-res pictures? Just in case AKG won't release schematics and Jim Williams doesn't want to help? I believe there is a nice picture of the box ToddR bought from Lee somewhere. Nice to see renewed interest in this! ;D
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well, count me in on some actives, I have no schematics to help w/, but the final project i would be willing to throw down 500>1000 for actives for the 480's, i dont want a phantom source tho, i just want to go ck6x>actives>v3(phantom)
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I don't believe Jim will work on the 480's, as everything in it is surface mount.
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i am willing to pop open my moded 460s have a camera with great macro capabilities, but i think there are some photos around here somewhere of the insides, and to be honest I have no clue how to get them open.
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PM sent.
Any schematics or hires pictures may be sent to: mannr@uwaterloo.ca, or better yet, just post for all to see :)
I'll report here if I make any progress. My first step is to build a 62V supply for polarizing the capsule. After this, the rest should be easy :)
Richard
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i am willing to pop open my moded 460s have a camera with great macro capabilities, but i think there are some photos around here somewhere of the insides, and to be honest I have no clue how to get them open.
I've only seen pictures of the stuff he takes out, never the inside. But I believe you just have to loosen the screw at the base and slide the cover off - maybe using an xlr cable that is connected to help?
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FYI, I've already initiated correspondence with AKG Europe regarding schematics on a lot of this stuff. I think it would be best if everyone holds off bombarding them with emails / calls. I think they'd be more likely to help out & supply this info if there aren't a ton of people bugging them all of the sudden.
I too thought about JW, but seeing that he does a TON of work on all kinds of gear, I don't know that he'll have as much time to devote to this project as we'd like.
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Matt has a good point. Let's see what happens with his initial inquiry.
FWIW, I just touched base with AKG and the tech has started looking at my caps but went home sick yesterday (hope that's not an omen!) They told me he's good about returning messages though, so I'm sure I'll hear from him tomorrow of so (at which point I'll ask him about the CK6_ possibilities).
Dirk
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Has anyone thought of reverse engineering a JKLabs box?
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Has anyone thought of reverse engineering a JKLabs box?
Can you elaborate, Chuck?
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i've got photos of each side, but i don't have any software on this computer to reduce the size, i can email the high-res to someone if they want to repost the images here? FWIW they are about 1.5MB each
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i've got photos of each side, but i don't have any software on this computer to reduce the size, i can email the high-res to someone if they want to repost the images here? FWIW they are about 1.5MB each
PM sent.
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i've got photos of each side, but i don't have any software on this computer to reduce the size, i can email the high-res to someone if they want to repost the images here? FWIW they are about 1.5MB each
PM sent.
you've got mail
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So how come we can't put this kind of effort into finding bin Laden?
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Has anyone thought of reverse engineering a JKLabs box?
Can you elaborate, Chuck?
I thought the box was a piece of the puzzle... :-[
I know some good machinists if we have to get parts made...
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Thanks, Tim. As for JK Labs box owners, here's what I've been able to gather off the board. Granted, these are AKG boxes primarily. There are one or two of them that are MG, which we know will work for other caps dependent upon the corresponding cables.
Charlies
ToddR - pics (http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=18564.0).
Raoulduke - Geffell/AKG JK Labs box. pics (http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=56528.0).
Jon Ice
jlizard1969 runs both AKG & MG with her JK Labs box & has cables for both.
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- Who can build this for us. Is it Nick of Nbox fame or dp we find an outside engineer.
you should PM nick aka "schoepsnbox".
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- Who can build this for us. Is it Nick of Nbox fame or dp we find an outside engineer.
you should PM nick aka "schoepsnbox".
Thanks, Craig. I know he's mentioned working on something for the AKG's in 2006. I pm'd him about them 3 weeks ago and haven't heard back from him yet.
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OK, I've put some stuff on my webpage:
These are the bodies of the C460: PDF document from AKG, page 2 has schematic. Images from Gumbino...
www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/C460_img1.jpg
www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/C460_img2.jpg
www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/C460.pdf
Just for fun, here are two pictures of my lastest project, a phantom power adapter for *CK91* caps. It takes phantom power in and provides 3-wire DC for *electret* mics, AT853, CK91, etc.
www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/ph_box.jpg
www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/ph_box_open.jpg
As for making the CK6_ actives, we need:
- 62V power supply, from either 48V or 9V
- FET *at the capsule*. Some kind of housing (or more likely, just glue + shrinkwrap + copper shielding) that contains a FET.
- some kind of phantom or battery box like I've shown above.
Note that there is no need for bodies. They are just fun to look at...
Richard
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OK, I've put some stuff on my webpage:
These are the bodies of the C460: PDF document from AKG, page 2 has schematic. Images from Gumbino...
www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/C460_img1.jpg
www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/C460_img2.jpg
www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/C460.pdf
Just for fun, here are two pictures of my lastest project, a phantom power adapter for *CK91* caps. It takes phantom power in and provides 3-wire DC for *electret* mics, AT853, CK91, etc.
www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/ph_box.jpg
www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/ph_box_open.jpg
As for making the CK6_ actives, we need:
- 62V power supply, from either 48V or 9V
- FET *at the capsule*. Some kind of housing (or more likely, just glue + shrinkwrap + copper shielding) that contains a FET.
- some kind of phantom or battery box like I've shown above.
Note that there is no need for bodies. They are just fun to look at...
Richard
the photos of the C460 bodies are the JW modded 460s
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Posting because I want to follow this thread. +T to everyone.
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- We need to decide on what exactly we want out of this. Its not as easy as saying"I just want actives"
In fear of opening the floodgates, this is something we all need to give some thought. Let's all try to be realistic, though.
Here's what I'm interested in:
1) A box that has the option of a) providing phantom 48v and variable gain from 0 to ? AND b) not providing anything other than acting as the bodies. Ideally, it could operate either way so it could be used as actives only for running infront of other gear that provide the phantom power & gain (i.e. M148 / V3), or it would operate as an all in one in front of an ADC/capture device for stealthing.
2) An extension cable for the AKG 460/480 mics that allow for running the caps remotely from the bodies. This would allow the caps to be run remotely from the JW Mod AKG bodies, similar to the MBHO actives.. Ideally, an it would allow for the option to run the bodies in the chain with the box. This would possibly require more work than it's work, or not be feasable at all.
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- We need to decide on what exactly we want out of this. Its not as easy as saying"I just want actives"
In fear of opening the floodgates, this is something we all need to give some thought. Let's all try to be realistic, though.
Here's what I'm interested in:
1) A box that has the option of a) providing phantom 48v and variable gain from 0 to ? AND b) not providing anything other than acting as the bodies. Ideally, it could operate either way so it could be used as actives only for running infront of other gear that provide the phantom power & gain (i.e. M148 / V3), or it would operate as an all in one in front of an ADC/capture device for stealthing.
2) An extension cable for the AKG 460/480 mics that allow for running the caps remotely from the bodies. This would allow the caps to be run remotely from the JW Mod AKG bodies, similar to the MBHO actives.. Ideally, an it would allow for the option to run the bodies in the chain with the box. This would possibly require more work than it's work, or not be feasable at all.
#1 is a possibility and has in fact already been done (JK Labs).
I thought the whole purpose of this "project" was to make #2 a reality?
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- We need to decide on what exactly we want out of this. Its not as easy as saying"I just want actives"
In fear of opening the floodgates, this is something we all need to give some thought. Let's all try to be realistic, though.
Here's what I'm interested in:
1) A box that has the option of a) providing phantom 48v and variable gain from 0 to ? AND b) not providing anything other than acting as the bodies. Ideally, it could operate either way so it could be used as actives only for running infront of other gear that provide the phantom power & gain (i.e. M148 / V3), or it would operate as an all in one in front of an ADC/capture device for stealthing.
2) An extension cable for the AKG 460/480 mics that allow for running the caps remotely from the bodies. This would allow the caps to be run remotely from the JW Mod AKG bodies, similar to the MBHO actives.. Ideally, an it would allow for the option to run the bodies in the chain with the box. This would possibly require more work than it's work, or not be feasable at all.
You're asking the right questions. But I would aim for #1 since it means you could buy the caps only. The bodies are much more expensive than the caps, so why buy them if you don't need them.
Richard
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lixard1969 is a male.
here's a link to "team jk labs"
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=51923.0;all
Are you sure, Tim? Their profile says female, and a couple people refer them as "her" in the team board.
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the secret is not the box.
Tim is right...when I was corresponding with Jon before he disappeared he told me the value in what he did was in the cabling as the housing was difficult to create and had to be done to pretty specific standards otherwise all kinds of noise was introduced.
I remember asking him can I just take the PCB board out of the bodies and put them in a box behind cables with the caps on them and he said it wasnt anywhere near that easy...he explained to me, though I still dont understand completely the cables had to have electronics built into them, at the cap mount, since the bodies were seperated.
Not trying to dissuade anyone, I hope it works...just relaying a conversation
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I remember asking him can I just take the PCB board out of the bodies and put them in a box behind cables with the caps on them and he said it wasnt anywhere near that easy...he explained to me, though I still dont understand completely the cables had to have electronics built into them, at the cap mount, since the bodies were seperated.
That's funny; I'm planning on doing the exact same thing with mine once they come back from service. I probably won't take the PCBs out of the bodies though - just find a DIY project box that will keep everything together and easily connectable. XLR punch outs on both sides maybe.
The AKG bodies with active ends and XLR cables connected to them are HUGE. Much larger and bulkier than my KM140s were.
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- We need to decide on what exactly we want out of this. Its not as easy as saying"I just want actives"
In fear of opening the floodgates, this is something we all need to give some thought. Let's all try to be realistic, though.
Here's what I'm interested in:
1) A box that has the option of a) providing phantom 48v and variable gain from 0 to ? AND b) not providing anything other than acting as the bodies. Ideally, it could operate either way so it could be used as actives only for running infront of other gear that provide the phantom power & gain (i.e. M148 / V3), or it would operate as an all in one in front of an ADC/capture device for stealthing.
2) An extension cable for the AKG 460/480 mics that allow for running the caps remotely from the bodies. This would allow the caps to be run remotely from the JW Mod AKG bodies, similar to the MBHO actives.. Ideally, an it would allow for the option to run the bodies in the chain with the box. This would possibly require more work than it's work, or not be feasable at all.
You're asking the right questions. But I would aim for #1 since it means you could buy the caps only. The bodies are much more expensive than the caps, so why buy them if you don't need them.
Richard
I agree that my item #1 would be the best approach for a new taper looking to get an affordable stealth/open AKG rig. Realistically, more people are going to use the all in one box vs. the extension cables, IMO. Therefore, I see the extension cables being on the back burner until the AKG actives/box is finished.
However, my wants/needs are different than this person. I love the JW Mod 460 sound, as do many others here. If there is no way to make the actives/box work with the bodies, I'll grab one for stealth/lowpro and hold onto my JW Mod bodies for open situations.
Additionally, I look at it as an opportunity to run 4 mic on-the-fly mixes since I own ck61/ck62/ck63 caps. If the actives/box worked per my item #1, I could run
ck62 > AKG box > UA-5 PLUS ck61 or ck63 > JW Mod 460's > M148 > V3 > UA-5
and output a 24 bit signal from the UA-5 to my capture device.
For all I know, the extension cables aren't even an option, but it seems to me if you can create an active/extension cable that works with the box, then creating an extension cable to run between the caps & body is a possibililty.
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- We need to decide on what exactly we want out of this. Its not as easy as saying"I just want actives"
In fear of opening the floodgates, this is something we all need to give some thought. Let's all try to be realistic, though.
Here's what I'm interested in:
1) A box that has the option of a) providing phantom 48v and variable gain from 0 to ? AND b) not providing anything other than acting as the bodies. Ideally, it could operate either way so it could be used as actives only for running infront of other gear that provide the phantom power & gain (i.e. M148 / V3), or it would operate as an all in one in front of an ADC/capture device for stealthing.
2) An extension cable for the AKG 460/480 mics that allow for running the caps remotely from the bodies. This would allow the caps to be run remotely from the JW Mod AKG bodies, similar to the MBHO actives.. Ideally, an it would allow for the option to run the bodies in the chain with the box. This would possibly require more work than it's work, or not be feasable at all.
option 2 is kinda what i thought was getting spit balled here and i am interested in seeing this happen.
option 1 is an acceptable alternative and would be easier to pull off, but i dont see the real need in my world. sure, it would be great to stealth my akg sound, but even then the caps are still bigger than i would like to be stealthing with... also, it seems the box solution would possibly cost more than the cable solution.
+ t to the thread, but in all honesty, i really dont need actives... never really understood what the hype was about.
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OK, I've put some stuff on my webpage:
These are the bodies of the C460: PDF document from AKG, page 2 has schematic. Images from Gumbino...
Gotta give credit where credit is due: Terrapinj, not me.
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lixard1969 is a male.
here's a link to "team jk labs"
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=51923.0;all
Are you sure, Tim? Their profile says female, and a couple people refer them as "her" in the team board.
yup contact has been made with him by the n box crew. :)
Cool. Thanks for the clarification, Tim.
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+ t to the thread, but in all honesty, i really dont need actives... never really understood what the hype was about.
i didn't either until i ran Ian Stones Ho's, so easy to set up, so low profile, plus i would like the option of being able to stealth with my mod 460s even if they aren't as small as some of the micro mics
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Either option would be better than what we have now...
I'm willing to help this come about in any way I can.
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i didn't either until i ran Ian Stones Ho's, so easy to set up, so low profile, plus i would like the option of being able to stealth with my mod 460s even if they aren't as small as some of the micro mics
This would appear to be a second "vote" for keeping the bodies in the chain and pursuing option #2. As it happens, I also have Audio Upgrades modded bodies and would prefer to keep them as well. So really the "box" isn't the focus of this push, IMO.
Dirk
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If the box sounded good, I would take it first. But active cables > bodies would be great as well.
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This is growing too fast.
Let me please be a little more specific before the floodgates totally open on this one because we want to do this right.
Currently we are looking for 6-7 people with some really good experience taping. This is not for new tapers. With these people we will discuss the objectives of this project of which there are tons of possibilities. When we decide on what we want this to be then we'll come back to the thread with those goals. Be it caps/cables/box or caps/cables/bodies, etc. We are not yet at that point yet in the project.
If you are all sharing PDF's, drawings, pictures and whatever please don't put them in this thread yet. Email them to me or to gumbino. My email is ofotdakg@gmail.com I promise we will be open and honest the whole way through.
Flooding this thread with stuff is just what we want to avoid as going this route has NOT worked in the past. It's going to take some patience from everybody.
So save your ideas, write them down but please wait before sharing them so that we can get and stay organized. If you would like to help with this project email me or PM me with your email addy and we'll get a group together that can help see this to completion.
Creating a plan is the absolute first step. Taking shit apart and buying gear to take apart is many steps ahead of us. Let's cross that bridge when we come to it.
Cool everybody?
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The Burger King is such a wise man ;D
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Well one good step would be to get in touch with those who are already working on this project, but have run into time issues etc. There is one member on here who has already machined the connectors for the bodies and the caps and completed connecting the cable. He was working on the circuitry in the end that connects to the capsules but had a full plate and didnt have time to spend on it right now. He posted pics on here and it looked sweet. I think it was jholdren or something to that effect. He is so far along that all it might take is one of the other electronic whizzes on this board to help him out a little and the cable option might be a reality.
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- We need to decide on what exactly we want out of this. Its not as easy as saying"I just want actives"
In fear of opening the floodgates, this is something we all need to give some thought. Let's all try to be realistic, though.
Here's what I'm interested in:
1) A box that has the option of a) providing phantom 48v and variable gain from 0 to ? AND b) not providing anything other than acting as the bodies. Ideally, it could operate either way so it could be used as actives only for running infront of other gear that provide the phantom power & gain (i.e. M148 / V3), or it would operate as an all in one in front of an ADC/capture device for stealthing.
2) An extension cable for the AKG 460/480 mics that allow for running the caps remotely from the bodies. This would allow the caps to be run remotely from the JW Mod AKG bodies, similar to the MBHO actives.. Ideally, an it would allow for the option to run the bodies in the chain with the box. This would possibly require more work than it's work, or not be feasable at all.
#1 is a possibility and has in fact already been done (JK Labs).
I thought the whole purpose of this "project" was to make #2 a reality?
#1 has almost been done...that's what I have, but there is a minimum amount of gain that is always on. There is a post from Jon somewhere on this site where he clarifies that. When I ordered from him, I thought I was getting exactly what is described in #1, but in fact there is a minimum amount of gain at the lowest setting.
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Well one good step would be to get in touch with those who are already working on this project, but have run into time issues etc. There is one member on here who has already machined the connectors for the bodies and the caps and completed connecting the cable. He was working on the circuitry in the end that connects to the capsules but had a full plate and didnt have time to spend on it right now. He posted pics on here and it looked sweet. I think it was jholdren or something to that effect. He is so far along that all it might take is one of the other electronic whizzes on this board to help him out a little and the cable option might be a reality.
I agree with everything you just said.
But I can't say this enough though. ONLY ONE PERSON HAS SUCCEEDED AT THIS SO FAR. JKLabs. Many have tried and failed. Many have tried and run out of time. Many have tried and just given up. Thats why we are trying this a new and different way. All of the info Brad just provided is awesome and its something we want to get to but we are at day one of this project. I fully expect (maybe hope is a better word) to have this completed in 6-9 months. So this is not some quick deal. We want to do it right the first time.
Half of the people that have PM's me want caps > actives > bodies and the other half want caps > actives > phantom box. Well we need to figure out what makes the most sense for the most amount of people. Where should we devote our time and energy maybe both or maybe one or maybe something not mentioned yet.
If you have strong opinion and have information join the team putting this together.
Sorry if I sound bitchy I am just really trying to avoid tons of people chirping in because that just gets us in endless conversation circles and not any closer to our end goal.
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My first step is to build a 62V supply for polarizing the capsule. After this, the rest should be easy :)
I believe the m148, nbox and RMod all use internal batteries to do that? The batteries do seem to last a long time. That seems like a really simple approach and nothing is cleaner than DC off of a battery. My RMod seems to throw about 55-58 volts to the caps even when no 9volt batteries are present and regardless of on/off switch position.
Regarding the JKL MG cap shells.. It would be interesting to know whether and how they can be disassembled for cable replacement, etc.
I like the idea that you intend to do this as a public/open project.
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I like the idea that you intend to do this as a public/open project.
I think one of the goals I had in mind is to make sure that we have available parts afterwards for repair or replacement.
I like the idea that you intend to do this as a public/open project.
This is really going to be back and forth between semi-private and open/public. I feel like the actual down and dirty work will be semi-private so that we can stay focused but the concept and final product will be open/public. One of the problems I have seen with the idea of AKG actives is that few people want to share credit. An ego thing i'm guessing. Or you have a situation where it kinda almost becomes like a "I made it and only I can fix it" type of situation. All sorts of people may end up working on this (ts.com members or not) and in the end I at least hope for the information to be available in the public domain. But then again thats one of the reason we're putting this group together so we can make decisions on these types of things to (hopefully) avoid some of the pitfalls that have attached themselves to all sorts of other projects in the taping world.
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I like the idea that you intend to do this as a public/open project.
I think one of the goals I had in mind is to make sure that we have available parts afterwards for repair or replacement.
I like the idea that you intend to do this as a public/open project.
This is really going to be back and forth between semi-private and open/public. I feel like the actual down and dirty work will be semi-private so that we can stay focused but the concept and final product will be open/public. One of the problems I have seen with the idea of AKG actives is that few people want to share credit. An ego thing i'm guessing. Or you have a situation where it kinda almost becomes like a "I made it and only I can fix it" type of situation. All sorts of people may end up working on this (ts.com members or not) and in the end I at least hope for the information to be available in the public domain. But then again thats one of the reason we're putting this group together so we can make decisions on these types of things to (hopefully) avoid some of the pitfalls that have attached themselves to all sorts of other projects in the taping world.
I agree these can all be problems. But my approach so far has been to post anything I do and give links to schematics/photos so others can build it. I'm doing this with my battery boxes, AKG CK9_ actives, preamps, etc. I figure that the more people that see this, the more DIYers will attempt it, either for themselves or for others. In fact, I suggested (by PM) a few people to build these, but noone has done so (yet). In the meantime I'm going to build a few battery boxes for people that have asked :)
OK, less talk and more solder!!! If anyone builds, dissassembles, or otherwise messes with anything AKG CK6_ related, please post here or mail to someone in this thread. Otherwise just wait on this thread until something happens...
Thanks,
Richard
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Eventually, I think it would be good if we handled this like the headphone amp builders. Create approved circuit boards (after thorough testing) and create a stuffing guide with suggest places to get the parts. I'm impressed with the way the headphone amp guys work together and are able to help DIY'ers get a quailty project (in their case headphone amps) out to the masses.
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I will try to take some pics of the JK Labs box I have its made for the AKG's (AKG CK91's> JK labs ECMS-2)..Its pretty shotty looking inside,from what I hear this is one of his first boxes :)..
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Man, look what I started. Well I guess I will put my hat in the ring. I have access to 100's of thousands of dollars worth of testing gear. You name I can probably use it or find somebody in the lab to help me use it. A few of the guy's I work with are designing a software defines ham radio. I have been helping them write the software. One of these guys is one that was going to help me design the humbucker curcuit to kill the noise from the body to the cap. Basically a tit for tat type of deal. So let me know what you may need and I may be able to help. He had some other Ideas also. So I will keep a select few of you in the know.
~Clint
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there may be hope in actives for my 480s yet! +T for the continuation of the project!
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option #2
i want still want to run my 480 bodies.
~justin
nice upgrade clint!
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Chuck, I was also very impressed with the headphone amp projects. I think a general 'open hardware' approach is the way to go. Avoiding egos would be good. As a community effort, the project can attract some serious talent.
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option #2
i want still want to run my 480 bodies.
~justin
nice upgrade clint!
ck6x>active/extension>480 bodies would be slick too
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I'm new to the AKG team... Have some 480s and would be interested in making an active mod.... unfortunetly I don't have the skills to help design the solution. I would be very much interested in looking at the resutls though :-}
Stay Kind,
Dana
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OK folks, just got off the phone with Richard at AKG. His take on the VR tube thing is that it *could* be possible, but the tube provides ground to the circuit.
So find an alternate grounding source and maybe it could work? (these are my conclusions, not his).
His take on it was that the demand wasn't there, so there wasn't any reason to do it. He definitely did not come out and say "it can be done", but once I explained the thought process to him he did concede that it might be possible.
So there you go.
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OK folks, just got off the phone with Richard at AKG. His take on the VR tube thing is that it *could* be possible, but the tube provides ground to the circuit.
So find an alternate grounding source and maybe it could work? (these are my conclusions, not his).
His take on it was that the demand wasn't there, so there wasn't any reason to do it. He definitely did not come out and say "it can be done", but once I explained the thought process to him he did concede that it might be possible.
So there you go.
Thanks for the info. I don't understand how they don't see the demand. I can't believe that studios aren't interested in the remote capsules?
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Thanks for the info. I don't understand how they don't see the demand. I can't believe that studios aren't interested in the remote capsules?
that is because if they need a world class cardioid, they get the 4022s :P
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Thanks for the info. I don't understand how they don't see the demand. I can't believe that studios aren't interested in the remote capsules?
that is because if they need a world class cardioid, they get the 4022s :P
Yes, Nick. We know you love your mics.
Now, the first step to recovery is admitting that you have a problem ;)
+T
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Thanks for the info. I don't understand how they don't see the demand. I can't believe that studios aren't interested in the remote capsules?
that is because if they need a world class cardioid, they get the 4022s :P
Yes, Nick. We know you love your mics.
Now, the first step to recovery is admitting that you have a problem ;)
+T
was just trying to start a holy war :P
and my wife would support anyone who says I have a problem
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and my wife would support anyone who says I have a problem
;D
fwiw, I like to think I run the poor man's 4022's, and get to add quality hypers (ck63's) and omni's (ck62's) for still less than the cost of the 4022's:
JW also compares the mod 460's to the DPA 4011, 402x series of mics. Moke & Goose ran a comparision of the JW mod 460's > V3 and the DPA 4022's > V3. The results showed the highs of the mod 460's to a tad harsher and the 4022's to be more enjoyable overall, but the differences of the two were so little that most people didn't think the marginal increase of sound quality for the 4022's justified the big cost differential. Moke's post and the responses can be read here:
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=48168.0 (http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=48168.0)
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understand, hypers are irrelevant to me...if I my seats arent good enough for cards, I need better seats!
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OK folks, just got off the phone with Richard at AKG. His take on the VR tube thing is that it *could* be possible, but the tube provides ground to the circuit.
So find an alternate grounding source and maybe it could work? (these are my conclusions, not his).
His take on it was that the demand wasn't there, so there wasn't any reason to do it. He definitely did not come out and say "it can be done", but once I explained the thought process to him he did concede that it might be possible.
So there you go.
Thanks for the info. I don't understand how they don't see the demand. I can't believe that studios aren't interested in the remote capsules?
Most studios don't use the 460's and 480's. They use 451's. If they need to get the cap into a tight spot they'll use the A51 or A61 angler.
Can't comment on the DPA thing. Most studios I've been in don't have DPAs at all.
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understand, hypers are irrelevant to me...if I my seats arent good enough for cards, I need better seats!
Snob! :alert:
Wish we could all be so lucky. I hate to say it, but my taping days are going to become numbered once the wife and I have kids. Money will be tighter, and choice seats cost $$. I'm going to be volunteering at the big amphitheater here in return for free lawn seats for every show. Now, I know that "God couldn't pull a good tape from the lawn", but at least it will give me something to feed my addiction.
I need to download Tony's ck69 P&F show and see how it sounds. Might work from the lawn?
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* sigh *
So I just heard from AKG and they can't repair the 3 non-working capsules because their facilities aren't set up to do it properly...so I got cards and hypers but no omnis. They did check out the other 4 and fixed the other active cable for me. After talking with some other folks it does seem the omnis could be fixed though, but I don't know if I want to bother with this anymore.
Anyone interested in a set of actives with cards and hypers? Sale? Trade? ::)
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understand, hypers are irrelevant to me...if I my seats arent good enough for cards, I need better seats!
Snob! :alert:
Wish we could all be so lucky. I hate to say it, but my taping days are going to become numbered once the wife and I have kids. Money will be tighter, and choice seats cost $$. I'm going to be volunteering at the big amphitheater here in return for free lawn seats for every show. Now, I know that "God couldn't pull a good tape from the lawn", but at least it will give me something to feed my addiction.
I need to download Tony's ck69 P&F show and see how it sounds. Might work from the lawn?
I am sure my priorities will change when I have kids ;D
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understand, hypers are irrelevant to me...if I my seats arent good enough for cards, I need better seats!
Snob! :alert:
Wish we could all be so lucky. I hate to say it, but my taping days are going to become numbered once the wife and I have kids. Money will be tighter, and choice seats cost $$. I'm going to be volunteering at the big amphitheater here in return for free lawn seats for every show. Now, I know that "God couldn't pull a good tape from the lawn", but at least it will give me something to feed my addiction.
I need to download Tony's ck69 P&F show and see how it sounds. Might work from the lawn?
I am sure my priorities will change when I have kids ;D
and i'll be there to buy your 4022s when that happens >:D
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and i'll be there to buy your 4022s when that happens >:D
change with regards to concerts I attend...the gear is a sunk cost, that is the story I gave my wife and I am sticking to it!
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and i'll be there to buy your 4022s when that happens >:D
change with regards to concerts I attend...the gear is a sunk cost, that is the story I gave my wife and I am sticking to it!
Wise approach. Same one I took. Since I also work weekends doing live recording I am still able to continually justify the cost of new gear to my better half (within reason of course!)
She wants new kitchen cabinets and I want a V3 to play around with. Must be a compromise in there somewhere, right?
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and i'll be there to buy your 4022s when that happens >:D
change with regards to concerts I attend...the gear is a sunk cost, that is the story I gave my wife and I am sticking to it!
we'll see ;) baby cribs are getting expensive these days!
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and i'll be there to buy your 4022s when that happens >:D
change with regards to concerts I attend...the gear is a sunk cost, that is the story I gave my wife and I am sticking to it!
we'll see ;) baby cribs are getting expensive these days!
i'll trade him a crib for the 722 ;D
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OK folks, just got off the phone with Richard at AKG. His take on the VR tube thing is that it *could* be possible, but the tube provides ground to the circuit.
So find an alternate grounding source and maybe it could work? (these are my conclusions, not his).
His take on it was that the demand wasn't there, so there wasn't any reason to do it. He definitely did not come out and say "it can be done", but once I explained the thought process to him he did concede that it might be possible.
So there you go.
This is EXACTLY what I thought might be going on. Would certainly explain the hum Marc Nutter heard and I believe freeluch had to overcome this problem by running an additional wire - I will have to look at that thread again. Anyway, to me it totally makes sense that the metal tube just acts as a ground, and this should be able to be circumvented by soldering a wire to each of the connections. If it is only a grounding issue, what I envision is cutting and removing the tube 1/2" off the threaded connections, leaving a bit of the tube attached to each end and exposing all the wiring. Then solder a wire to connect the two remaining pieces of tube and enclose all the wiring with a sleeve or tech-flex. Only question is why did the one guy say it's a matter of capicitance? Anyway, strong work and THANKS! +T
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OK folks, just got off the phone with Richard at AKG. His take on the VR tube thing is that it *could* be possible, but the tube provides ground to the circuit.
So find an alternate grounding source and maybe it could work? (these are my conclusions, not his).
His take on it was that the demand wasn't there, so there wasn't any reason to do it. He definitely did not come out and say "it can be done", but once I explained the thought process to him he did concede that it might be possible.
So there you go.
This is EXACTLY what I thought might be going on. Would certainly explain the hum Marc Nutter heard and I believe freeluch had to overcome this problem by running an additional wire - I will have to look at that thread again. Anyway, to me it totally makes sense that the metal tube just acts as a ground, and this should be able to be circumvented by soldering a wire to each of the connections. If it is only a grounding issue, what I envision is cutting and removing the tube 1/2" off the threaded connections, leaving a bit of the tube attached to each end and exposing all the wiring. Then solder a wire to connect the two remaining pieces of tube and enclose all the wiring with a sleeve or tech-flex. Only question is why did the one guy say it's a matter of capicitance? Anyway, strong work and THANKS! +T
Just want to step in here and say he was very hesitant to give me any words of encouragement on this. I asked him specifically could you keep the two ends and remove the length of the tube and replace with flexible cabling. He did hem and haw about it but eventually acknowledged that it *might* be possible. He actually followed that up by saying he'd never thought about it before!
So caveat emptor (or something like that). Proceed with caution. Do not pass go. Do not collect $200. yadda yadda yadda
Off to AKG to pick the stuff up. I will reiterate the question in person if I have the opportunity. I shall report back directly.
Dirk
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Anyone interested in a set of actives with cards and hypers? Sale? Trade? ::)
pm sent
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I don't know if it has already been mentionned but the "AKG service documentation" for 480s is available here (http://www.akg.com/mediadatabase/psfile/datei/25/c4804055d22b41250.pdf)
Partial schematics are given.
This is a nice project !
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I don't know if it has already been mentionned but the "AKG service documentation" for 480s is available here (http://www.akg.com/mediadatabase/psfile/datei/25/c4804055d22b41250.pdf)
Partial schematics are given.
This is a nice project !
Thanks for the link! +T This is just the sort of thing we're looking fdr!
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i've been following this thread since it began. i'm one of those tapers that falls into the "beginner" category and probably wouldn't really be helpful w/ the technical nature of this project. but i do want to commend everyone involved thus far for their motivation and involvment. Good Luck and if I can contribute in some small way LMK. +T gents.
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Count me in on a set of actives. I would be willing to help the project in any other way possible as well.
-dvn
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here's an extension tube, BIN $50
http://cgi.ebay.com/AKG-VR1-for-C451-C460-C480-extension-condenser-ULS_W0QQitemZ7390284252QQcategoryZ41460QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
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That tube won't fit a 480, will it?
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i am taking one of chris k.'s 460's to the machinist this week to have the colletts made for nick, for his akg nbox project.
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i am taking one of chris k.'s 460's to the machinist this week to have the colletts made for nick, for his akg nbox project.
:) :D ;D :coolguy: :yahoo: :yack:
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+T to you, Nick, and Chris! Thanks.
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SWEET!
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i am taking one of chris k.'s 460's to the machinist this week to have the colletts made for nick, for his akg nbox project.
oh hell yeah
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i assume the 460 and 480 have a different sound even though they both use the ck6x cap correct?
now if a active set up was made then anyone using a 461 and a 481 now would have the exact sound because you would eliminate the body and just use the cap with whatever kind of box was made
is that fair to say?
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i assume the 460 and 480 have a different sound even though they both use the ck6x cap correct?
now if a active set up was made then anyone using a 461 and a 481 now would have the exact sound because you would eliminate the body and just use the cap with whatever kind of box was made
is that fair to say?
yep, the 480's are TRANSFORMERLESS, the 460s are not, 480's are a bit faster/more detailed IMO
the ck6x are the exact caps tho!
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i assume the 460 and 480 have a different sound even though they both use the ck6x cap correct?
now if a active set up was made then anyone using a 461 and a 481 now would have the exact sound because you would eliminate the body and just use the cap with whatever kind of box was made
is that fair to say?
depends on what the resulting product is. if its a nBox type design then yes, they will sound the same because the bodies are no longer invloved. if its an active cable that goes between bodies and ck6* caps then ideally they should sound like what the bodies would sound like without the cables involved.
yep, the 480's are TRANSFORMERLESS, the 460s are not, 480's are a bit faster/more detailed IMO
the ck6x are the exact caps tho!
unless you get the 460's modded ;D
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i assume the 460 and 480 have a different sound even though they both use the ck6x cap correct?
now if a active set up was made then anyone using a 461 and a 481 now would have the exact sound because you would eliminate the body and just use the cap with whatever kind of box was made
is that fair to say?
depends on what the resulting product is. if its a nBox type design then yes, they will sound the same because the bodies are no longer invloved. if its an active cable that goes between bodies and ck6* caps then ideally they should sound like what the bodies would sound like without the cables involved.
yep, the 480's are TRANSFORMERLESS, the 460s are not, 480's are a bit faster/more detailed IMO
the ck6x are the exact caps tho!
unless you get the 460's modded ;D
very true, once modded, they may even be a bit faster/more detailed than the 480's
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now if a active set up was made then anyone using a 461 and a 481 now would have the exact sound because you would eliminate the body and just use the cap with whatever kind of box was made
is that fair to say?
There are a few different types of active setups.
1. Cap > Active > Body
2. Cap > Active > Phantom Box (Nbox, JKLabs, etc.)
3. Cap > Active > Pre-Amp (v3, m148, etc.)
If you are using #1 then the sound would definately be different because of the different bodies.
If you are using #2 then the sound would be different because you are using some sort of external power to the caps
If you are using #3 then the sound would be different just because it would be the sound of the cap and not the body or external power box
Good question! +T
Oh and while the JW460's sound nice I still prefer the 480 sound YMMV
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very true, once modded, they may even be a bit faster/more detailed than the 480's
Bean put the crack pipe down and please step away. You mind will clear up! ;D
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very true, once modded, they may even be a bit faster/more detailed than the 480's
Bean put the crack pipe down and please step away. You mind will clear up! ;D
i still like the 480 sound a tad better myself, but the mod460s are pretty 'fast' mics ;)now if a active set up was made then anyone using a 461 and a 481 now would have the exact sound because you would eliminate the body and just use the cap with whatever kind of box was made
is that fair to say?
There are a few different types of active setups.
1. Cap > Active > Body
2. Cap > Active > Phantom Box (Nbox, JKLabs, etc.)
3. Cap > Active > Pre-Amp (v3, m148, etc.)
If you are using #1 then the sound would definately be different because of the different bodies.
If you are using #2 then the sound would be different because you are using some sort of external power to the caps
If you are using #3 then the sound would be different just because it would be the sound of the cap and not the body or external power box
Good question! +T
Oh and while the JW460's sound nice I still prefer the 480 sound YMMV
number 3 would not be possible w/ 99% of mics, they still have to have some kind of mic preamp/body, only ccm4's come to mind, unless youre running schoeps mk4/41/whatever>schoeps vms preamps, which takes the place of the bodies ala the jklabs/nbox
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If you are using #3 then the sound would be different just because it would be the sound of the cap and not the body or external power box
number 3 would not be possible w/ 99% of mics, they still have to have some kind of mic preamp/body, only ccm4's come to mind, unless youre running schoeps mk4/41/whatever>schoeps vms preamps, which takes the place of the bodies ala the jklabs/nbox
You can run schoeps/neumann/akg bluelines/franken naks/any other mic with a FET attached with the sonosax sx-m2/ls2 via a lemo connector
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If you are using #3 then the sound would be different just because it would be the sound of the cap and not the body or external power box
number 3 would not be possible w/ 99% of mics, they still have to have some kind of mic preamp/body, only ccm4's come to mind, unless youre running schoeps mk4/41/whatever>schoeps vms preamps, which takes the place of the bodies ala the jklabs/nbox
You can run schoeps/neumann/akg bluelines/franken naks/any other mic with a FET attached with the sonosax sx-m2/ls2 via a lemo connector
damn, 480's arent bluelines tho, are they?
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If you are using #3 then the sound would be different just because it would be the sound of the cap and not the body or external power box
number 3 would not be possible w/ 99% of mics, they still have to have some kind of mic preamp/body, only ccm4's come to mind, unless youre running schoeps mk4/41/whatever>schoeps vms preamps, which takes the place of the bodies ala the jklabs/nbox
You can run schoeps/neumann/akg bluelines/franken naks/any other mic with a FET attached with the sonosax sx-m2/ls2 via a lemo connector
damn, 480's arent bluelines tho, are they?
nope, however I would think that if you too one end of the extension tube, and ran it to a lemo connection via a cable, and added a ground, making it three wires. That would work I think.
The buzzing you are getting from all the attempts are from poor grounding. Thats pretty obvious, to know for sure if i'd work i'd need to know how many connections are there plus ground.
For example, with KM140's all you need to do is cut off one end of the active cable and solder on a lemo with the correct pin outs and you can run it straight into a lemosax. Similarily i bet you could run it into a AT or Samson power module just fine.
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If you are using #3 then the sound would be different just because it would be the sound of the cap and not the body or external power box
number 3 would not be possible w/ 99% of mics, they still have to have some kind of mic preamp/body, only ccm4's come to mind, unless youre running schoeps mk4/41/whatever>schoeps vms preamps, which takes the place of the bodies ala the jklabs/nbox
You can run schoeps/neumann/akg bluelines/franken naks/any other mic with a FET attached with the sonosax sx-m2/ls2 via a lemo connector
you always have the best avatars 8)
I can't help technically with any of this but am willing to loan out my caps and be a beta tester ;D
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If you are using #3 then the sound would be different just because it would be the sound of the cap and not the body or external power box
number 3 would not be possible w/ 99% of mics, they still have to have some kind of mic preamp/body, only ccm4's come to mind, unless youre running schoeps mk4/41/whatever>schoeps vms preamps, which takes the place of the bodies ala the jklabs/nbox
You can run schoeps/neumann/akg bluelines/franken naks/any other mic with a FET attached with the sonosax sx-m2/ls2 via a lemo connector
damn, 480's arent bluelines tho, are they?
nope, however I would think that if you too one end of the extension tube, and ran it to a lemo connection via a cable, and added a ground, making it three wires. That would work I think.
The question is, is there an active element (FET) in the extension tube or not. I'm guessing no, in which case it may not drive more than the length of the tube (due to capacitance of the wire between the mic element and the body that contains the FET). I don't know for sure though, 'cause I haven't seen the tube.
The buzzing you are getting from all the attempts are from poor grounding. Thats pretty obvious, to know for sure if i'd work i'd need to know how many connections are there plus ground.
For example, with KM140's all you need to do is cut off one end of the active cable and solder on a lemo with the correct pin outs and you can run it straight into a lemosax. Similarily i bet you could run it into a AT or Samson power module just fine.
Have anyone measured the output voltage of the Sax? It should output 60-62V polarization voltage on one of the wires. Or did we (TS.com) go through this discussion already with the "spitty" Nbox?
Thanks,
Richard
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The question is, is there an active element (FET) in the extension tube or not. I'm guessing no, in which case it may not drive more than the length of the tube (due to capacitance of the wire between the mic element and the body that contains the FET). I don't know for sure though, 'cause I haven't seen the tube.
I think that thegreatgumbo was working on getting the VR schematics from AKG, which should answer this question. Any word on that yet?
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Schoeps definitely puts a buffer in their gooseneck. I'd expect (hope!) AKG does the same..
The 'sax polarization voltage is supposedly only 48v.
I tried to measure the voltage from my MG bodies but couldn't get anything using my DVM. Any thoughts on that?
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thanks guys
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i'll measure the sax when i get it later this week. It says 48v but thats before it hits the internal part of the pre which acts as the bodies.
I was basing my assumption on the vr tube off of the schoeps tube which does indeed have a FET
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I contacted Sonosax customer support to inquire about adding a 5-pin Binder connector to my older SX-M2/LS. They gave me the following pin-out which confirms that the Sonosax provides 48V as the polarization voltage to the capsules:
The pin-out of the 5-pin binder is:
1: Ground
2: Audio In Left
3: Audio In Right
4: +6Vdc
5: +48Vdc
- Jason
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any reason that the active cables (mk46) for the 460 series cannot be used as a basic prototype for these 480 series active cables? although these cables are rare they are out there in tapers' hands, including mine
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Jason, I think you posted some specifics on the 5 pin binder connector somewhere recently. Can you re-post? I am having trouble finding it. I am thinking of adding connectors to my schoeps active cables and am trying to identify the best connectors for reliability/least impact.
I have two sets of schoeps actives. One is KC5 like and the other is for the RMod. I'd like to be able to use my kc5's on the rmod. The rmod cables are mini star quad and are very old and stiff (from sweat, I guess).
In the kc5 case, I'd like a robust connector to use near the mic body end of the cable. In another case (my RMod cables), I'd like to find some very compact connectors to install near the capsule end.
The RMod colletes appear to have been glued together rather than held with the proper snap rings. That is dumb, dumb, dumb.. Because not only can I probably not completely replace the old stiff cable, one of the snap rings provides support to the delicate capsule threads. So in that case I may snip the existing cable near the capsule and install a small connector.
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I have two sets of schoeps actives. One is KC5 like and the other is for the RMod. I'd like to be able to use my kc5's on the rmod. The rmod cables are mini star quad and are very old and stiff (from sweat, I guess).
Use caution here! I thought I'd pick up an NBox and make an adapter cable from my current KC5 cables (which are modified with 3-pin Lemo connectors) to whatever connector Nick puts on his box. He said that he can modify my cables, but that he changes the circuit inside the active head (the "colette" capsule connector). So it seems that you can't use a single set of cables for an NBox and any other standard setup like CMCs, VST62, VMS05, VMS02iB, SX-M2/LS(2), etc. That's one nice thing about the Sonosax setup - the cables are no different from the Schoeps standard, either literally using their cable with the 5-pin connector, or just cut and wired with 3-pin Lemos. Presumably this is the same issue with the RMod box but I'm just guessing based on the NBox's history.
I don't have much info on the 5-pin binder connector save for the recent info I got from Sonosax. Did you mean the schematic I posted that shows the wiring of the Lemo connectors along with some of the basic part info of an active cable? I also posted a schematic of the CMC3/5 amplifiers which shows a bit of active info as well.
- Jason
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The question is, is there an active element (FET) in the extension tube or not. I'm guessing no, in which case it may not drive more than the length of the tube (due to capacitance of the wire between the mic element and the body that contains the FET). I don't know for sure though, 'cause I haven't seen the tube.
I think that thegreatgumbo was working on getting the VR schematics from AKG, which should answer this question. Any word on that yet?
No schematic exists for the VR61 or VR62. Here's the response I got from Karl:
"For the VR61 and 62 there are no schematics available as these extension tubes are strictly passive and contain a direct connection between the two terminals."
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any reason that the active cables (mk46) for the 460 series cannot be used as a basic prototype for these 480 series active cables? although these cables are rare they are out there in tapers' hands, including mine
Here's Karl's response to that question, Chris:
"By the way, the C480 cannot be used with the MK46 cable as there is no bias output on the preamp. So you need to use the C460 in connection with the cable."
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any reason that the active cables (mk46) for the 460 series cannot be used as a basic prototype for these 480 series active cables? although these cables are rare they are out there in tapers' hands, including mine
Here's Karl's response to that question, Chris:
"By the way, the C480 cannot be used with the MK46 cable as there is no bias output on the preamp. So you need to use the C460 in connection with the cable."
That relates to that extra ring in the mic amplifier that's on the 460 but not the 480. There's a contact on the cable that apparently hits this ring to provide the bias output.
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The question is, is there an active element (FET) in the extension tube or not. I'm guessing no, in which case it may not drive more than the length of the tube (due to capacitance of the wire between the mic element and the body that contains the FET). I don't know for sure though, 'cause I haven't seen the tube.
I think that thegreatgumbo was working on getting the VR schematics from AKG, which should answer this question. Any word on that yet?
No schematic exists for the VR61 or VR62. Here's the response I got from Karl:
"For the VR61 and 62 there are no schematics available as these extension tubes are strictly passive and contain a direct connection between the two terminals."
That is interesting! So nothing is needed to separate a capsule from the body by up to 3ft (the length of the VR62 tube) except the correctly machined terminations? Sounds like there is no reason one couldn't canabilize a pair of tubes and make some short cables. I wonder what the maximum distance would be?
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The question is, is there an active element (FET) in the extension tube or not. I'm guessing no, in which case it may not drive more than the length of the tube (due to capacitance of the wire between the mic element and the body that contains the FET). I don't know for sure though, 'cause I haven't seen the tube.
I think that thegreatgumbo was working on getting the VR schematics from AKG, which should answer this question. Any word on that yet?
No schematic exists for the VR61 or VR62. Here's the response I got from Karl:
"For the VR61 and 62 there are no schematics available as these extension tubes are strictly passive and contain a direct connection between the two terminals."
That is interesting! So nothing is needed to separate a capsule from the body by up to 3ft (the length of the VR62 tube) except the correctly machined terminations? Sounds like there is no reason one couldn't canabilize a pair of tubes and make some short cables. I wonder what the maximum distance would be?
Or make the appropriate connectors in a machine shop.
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;) ;D
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That is interesting! So nothing is needed to separate a capsule from the body by up to 3ft (the length of the VR62 tube) except the correctly machined terminations? Sounds like there is no reason one couldn't canabilize a pair of tubes and make some short cables. I wonder what the maximum distance would be?
Anyone know how long a cable Marc Nutter tried? He apparently had some serious hum using a good shielded cable. Would assume he wasn't trying a cable longer than what most of us would want - ?
-Heikki
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I PM'd him, but never heard back. Might be worth giving him a call. My guess is that he didn't provide a ground (apparently this is the only function of the metal tube he cut) which caused the hum. But who knows?
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my akg 460's are at the machine shop right now getting the heads for the active cables made. the ones that were made for the gefells are sweeeeet. i'm sure these will be nice too.
nick, mike and myself are really looking forward to getting this project complete, but we need some help.
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How can we help?
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How can we help?
as someone wrote earlier on this thread, the secret is in the cables & heads, not the box.
we need someone from here:
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=59577.msg787072#msg787072
to let us inspect the cables and heads of thier setup. a couple on the list live within road trip distance of nick, mike and myself. we could arrange for pre-paid shipping too, and supply a backup set of mics (akg, geffell, mk4>nbox)
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How can we help?
as someone wrote earlier on this thread, the secret is in the cables & heads, not the box.
we need someone from here:
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=59577.msg787072#msg787072
to let us inspect the cables and heads of thier setup. a couple on the list live within road trip distance of nick, mike and myself. we could arrange for pre-paid shipping too, and supply a backup set of mics (akg, geffell, mk4>nbox)
aight, where do you all live??? Chris I know you via Lotus, albeit just by computer, so as an AKG 480 owner and a very lucky AKG460>mk46>ck1x owner, I will loan you all my 460 set up for use in the design, this shit is in mint condition and I want it back in that condition too, that is all I ask
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you da man grider :)
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aight, where do you all live??? Chris I know you via Lotus, albeit just by computer, so as an AKG 480 owner and a very lucky AKG460>mk46>ck1x owner, I will loan you all my 460 set up for use in the design, this shit is in mint condition and I want it back in that condition too, that is all I ask
I belive Chris is referring to those folks that have the JKLabs AKG setup.
Nice offer though! +T
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well, no actually, I thought people were planning to manufacture a cable that will run from the cap to the body, as is the case with the mk46 active cable, no?
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well, no actually, I thought people were planning to manufacture a cable that will run from the cap to the body, as is the case with the mk46 active cable, no?
yes and no. The majority of the work by several different people seems to be of the cap > cable > box variety. The cap > cable > body is decidedly a longer term goal and/or project. Also bear in mind that the basis for (dare I say) all of the AKG active projects and attempts are based first and foremost on the ck6x line of caps.
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well don't most people who have ck1x caps already have the mk46 cable, I mean one is useless without the other after all; but regardless, it would seem there would be huge interest in an active cable machined at one end to fit onto the ck61/62/63 cap and also onto the 480 body, but only limited interest in an actual battery box/preamp type set up, look at how few of the JK Labs boxes are in use today; I guess it just seems logical for this project to produce a cable that can be put into instant and wide use, such as a cable that connects the ck63 cap to the 480 body, who wouldn't want that cable? and its exactly what connects my ck1x cap to my 460 body, I guess I thought that is what people wanted and why this thread started, my bad
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well don't most people who have ck1x caps already have the mk46 cable, I mean one is useless without the other after all; but regardless, it would seem there would be huge interest in an active cable machined at one end to fit onto the ck61/62/63 cap and also onto the 480 body, but only limited interest in an actual battery box/preamp type set up, look at how few of the JK Labs boxes are in use today; I guess it just seems logical for this project to produce a cable that can be put into instant and wide use, such as a cable that connects the ck63 cap to the 480 body, who wouldn't want that cable? and its exactly what connects my ck1x cap to my 460 body, I guess I thought that is what people wanted and why this thread started, my bad
i'd still check with Chris K
i would think that they could get some valueable info from your set-up. perhaps they can compare the mk46 to the cable design that jk labs uses perhaps there similarities in the basic structure? if they end up not wanting your cable I still appreciate your offering it up! +T
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I'm down with the Active Cable scenario..I just wanna run the caps low-profile...
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I'm down with the Active Cable scenario..I just wanna run the caps low-profile...
I hear you brother, after years of happily running my 480's, last month I instead ran my ck1x>mk46>460>interconnect cables>preamp, and CLAMPED onto another taper's stand, whew what a relief that whole evening was, no stand, no mic bodies, just a tiny set up on someone else's stand and I pulled a fat tape, I just think if this could be done with 480s(like its been done with the 460s) most people would line up to buy such cables
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I hear you brother, after years of happily running my 480's, last month I instead ran my ck1x>mk46>460>interconnect cables>preamp, and CLAMPED onto another taper's stand, whew what a relief that whole evening was, no stand, no mic bodies, just a tiny set up on someone else's stand and I pulled a fat tape, I just think if this could be done with 480s(like its been done with the 460s) most people would line up to buy such cables
I agree with you. Let me try and ask though.
If you had the choice of having a cap > cable > box available in 1 month or a fully active set of cap > cable > body in 12 months which would you prefer?
The way I see it I'll take option #1 and then when development reaches a point to allow for option #2 to become a reality i'm sure i'll upgrade at that time. So either way for me is a win-win situation. Obviously the fact that there are only a handful of active type systems out there goes to show that this is not an easy or quick development. While I think its cool that there are options currently for the 460's it is not a deal breaker for me to give up my 480's for 460's.
+T's around as we're all on the same team on this one!
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How can we help?
as someone wrote earlier on this thread, the secret is in the cables & heads, not the box.
we need someone from here:
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=59577.msg787072#msg787072
to let us inspect the cables and heads of thier setup. a couple on the list live within road trip distance of nick, mike and myself. we could arrange for pre-paid shipping too, and supply a backup set of mics (akg, geffell, mk4>nbox)
I am here...I just had one question, which was ... is this a for profit enterprise? -Charlie
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some of you may know Bob Wiely of Santa Cruz, I know he runs the ck61 stock cap into JKLabs cable into JKLabs DVC battery box, might be impossible to get at his gear but you never know, he's a long time bay area taper who has some interesting torrents going right now on etree that shows his equipment in the torrent itself
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I'm sending Nick my MG active cables > JK Labs ECMS-23 tomorrow.
awesome +t.
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I am here...I just had one question, which was ... is this a for profit enterprise? -Charlie
There has been some discussion that this project would pool the resources of the community to create an open solution.
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I am here...I just had one question, which was ... is this a for profit enterprise? -Charlie
There has been some discussion that this project would pool the resources of the community to create an open solution.
Can anyone working on this confirm the above? Should we expect to see photos and schematics of the gear that people are loaning for reverse engineering?
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OK folks, just got off the phone with Richard at AKG. His take on the VR tube thing is that it *could* be possible, but the tube provides ground to the circuit.
So find an alternate grounding source and maybe it could work? (these are my conclusions, not his).
His take on it was that the demand wasn't there, so there wasn't any reason to do it. He definitely did not come out and say "it can be done", but once I explained the thought process to him he did concede that it might be possible.
So there you go.
Thanks for the info. I don't understand how they don't see the demand. I can't believe that studios aren't interested in the remote capsules?
In the past, the discussion always centered around there not being the appropriate connection on the head of the mic body to support the connection necessary to run the caps separate from the body. If I remember correctly, the discussion was separating the two would require soldering the connection to a point INSIDE the c480 or completely re-creating the head of the body w/ a connection to that same internal point in the c480. So it wasn't at all a demand type of issue w/ AKG...the bodies simply weren't engineered in a manner that lends itself to build a Schoeps style active cable w/out major work to the bodies themselves. That previous discussion is somewhere on the net...perhaps in the archives of the Oade forums. At any rate, just adding to the history of this discussion. I'd love to see it become a reality...I eventually sold my 480s and moved to the Schoeps just b/c of the active setup. Personally I think the bodies are critical to the 480 sound...to me, the JK Labs box doesn't sound true to the c480b/ck6x combination.
Mitch
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The MG bodies also lack any connectors or provision for supplying a buffer circuit with power.
Can you guys post some pics of the gear you've been reverse engineering? Curious about how others have done custom MG and akg collette connectors, etc.
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bump...
are we getting anywhere? ::)
~justin
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are we getting anywhere? ::)
Seems things have slowed down a bit. But thanks for volunteering to complete the remainder of the project! When do you anticipate you'll finish?
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Just a note to grider's mention of the ck1x and mk46 cable being useful for the cable to connect the capsule to the 480's. In fact niether of these items would be useful, the mk46 cable will not work with the 480, it has different connections and a different anchor (which the 480 is missing) so if one were to model the new one after the mk46 it would not work.
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Seems things have slowed down a bit. But thanks for volunteering to complete the remainder of the project! When do you anticipate you'll finish?
Not surprising with warmer weather coming..
But so far, it does not seem like an open hardware project in the same way that many other open hardware and software projects are run. Maybe we're not seeing pics and schematics of the reverse engineered JK Labs stuff (collettes for example) because this is just a period of intensive work?
Also, if the current focus is in extending the capability of the nbox, how does that eventually become open? Or am I mistaken that this was all about building an open actives platform?
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are we getting anywhere? ::)
Seems things have slowed down a bit. But thanks for volunteering to complete the remainder of the project! When do you anticipate you'll finish?
dont remember volunteering, just wondering how things were coming along, sorry for asking. it wont happen again.
~justin
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dont remember volunteering, just wondering how things were coming along, sorry for asking. it wont happen again.
Nothing personal, Justin - that's just my standard response for anyone not directly involved inquiring about the status of a project. The ::) made it seem as though you were impatient with the delay, hence my snide remark. Apologies if you didn't mean it that way.
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Well let me update some of you.
First let me tell everyone that the MAIN objective of this project is to get an active setup for the AKG ck6x capsules first and foremost (box or no box) by any means necessary.
There are several people who are working on these goals "for profit" and there are several that are working on it because they like to do this kind of thing. Let me elaborate on both of these types of people:
1. FOR PROFIT - There are several people on this board and several who have nothing to do with ts.com working on various solutions like a nbox, jklabs box, etc. These people as far as I can tell as of 3.27.06 seem to be the closest to completion. They are doing the majority of the work themselves. If they choose to do their thing for profit more power to them.
2. OPEN HARDWARE PROJECT - The majority of people that support this type of project for the most part do not seem to have the education or ability to take on this type of project. Those that do have the education and ability seem to be working on what i'll call "duct tape" solutions. Many people have offered different degrees of support but none on the technical side. Alot of "i'll test them for you" or "i'll kick in $20". In reality I do not see this as happening right now. Welcome to a free market economy.
My personal opinion is that I want to see two things, one would be a Nbox/JKLabs box that would allow the capsules to be used with active cables. I would like to still use my own flavor of 48v power (V2,V3,148,248,etc.) Secondly (and preferably) I would like to have a set of active cables that go from the cap to the body with no box whatsoever.
So where does that leave us? Well part of what I am trying to do is get the right people together on this. Some people (who seem to be closest) don't want or need others and prefer to tackle this themselves. Nothing we can do about this. Well maybe just get in line for a finished product to purchase. Now I have also put several people together who are at various stages of making this work and they all seem to have different opinions and theories of how to do it.
At the very least hopefully all of the talk and interest will help nudge along those folks who are closest to completion a little bit faster. As for those who I have put together to do a pseudo-open hardware project things are at their earliest stages.
Remember folks that the time frame when I helped to start this project was at the least 6-9 months out. If any of you are waiting on this to become reality sooner than that it may be a tad bit unrealistic in your thinking.
If any of you feel like you have the knowledge, resources and time and want to make this an open hardware project then please contact me and we'll get you all in the loop. But if you are just an end user and want to know whats up please don't as I will try and post more ofter as to what I know.
Some people who have current setups (again nbox and jklabs boxes) do not want their gear looked at to be copied and sold. The only assurance I give on that one is if someone who has a box and it can be reversed engineered then it would be posted publically, PERIOD! If you are giving your gear to someone who makes these things for profit then thats a different story.
Questions? Comments?
Please everyone understand that there is a reason why an AKG active setup hasn't come out yet really. I believe its alot of people wanting to do it but nobody wanting to share the info in it or again people working on a duct tape solution. Heck the thought of a $1000 box seems pretty enticing because I know there would be a line around the corner for one. That damn free market economy again.
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Well let me update some of you.
First let me tell everyone that the MAIN objective of this project is to get an active setup for the AKG ck6x capsules first and foremost (box or no box) by any means necessary.
There are several people who are working on these goals "for profit" and there are several that are working on it because they like to do this kind of thing. Let me elaborate on both of these types of people:
1. FOR PROFIT - There are several people on this board and several who have nothing to do with ts.com working on various solutions like a nbox, jklabs box, etc. These people as far as I can tell as of 3.27.06 seem to be the closest to completion. They are doing the majority of the work themselves. If they choose to do their thing for profit more power to them.
2. OPEN HARDWARE PROJECT - The majority of people that support this type of project for the most part do not seem to have the education or ability to take on this type of project. Those that do have the education and ability seem to be working on what i'll call "duct tape" solutions. Many people have offered different degrees of support but none on the technical side. Alot of "i'll test them for you" or "i'll kick in $20". In reality I do not see this as happening right now. Welcome to a free market economy.
My personal opinion is that I want to see two things, one would be a Nbox/JKLabs box that would allow the capsules to be used with active cables. I would like to still use my own flavor of 48v power (V2,V3,148,248,etc.) Secondly (and preferably) I would like to have a set of active cables that go from the cap to the body with no box whatsoever.
So where does that leave us? Well part of what I am trying to do is get the right people together on this. Some people (who seem to be closest) don't want or need others and prefer to tackle this themselves. Nothing we can do about this. Well maybe just get in line for a finished product to purchase. Now I have also put several people together who are at various stages of making this work and they all seem to have different opinions and theories of how to do it.
At the very least hopefully all of the talk and interest will help nudge along those folks who are closest to completion a little bit faster. As for those who I have put together to do a pseudo-open hardware project things are at their earliest stages.
Remember folks that the time frame when I helped to start this project was at the least 6-9 months out. If any of you are waiting on this to become reality sooner than that it may be a tad bit unrealistic in your thinking.
If any of you feel like you have the knowledge, resources and time and want to make this an open hardware project then please contact me and we'll get you all in the loop. But if you are just an end user and want to know whats up please don't as I will try and post more ofter as to what I know.
Some people who have current setups (again nbox and jklabs boxes) do not want their gear looked at to be copied and sold. The only assurance I give on that one is if someone who has a box and it can be reversed engineered then it would be posted publically, PERIOD! If you are giving your gear to someone who makes these things for profit then thats a different story.
Questions? Comments?
Please everyone understand that there is a reason why an AKG active setup hasn't come out yet really. I believe its alot of people wanting to do it but nobody wanting to share the info in it or again people working on a duct tape solution. Heck the thought of a $1000 box seems pretty enticing because I know there would be a line around the corner for one. That damn free market economy again.
Let me just add that if any DIY types (like myself...) get anything, it will be open and it will be posted here. No need to keep reviving this post though. If/when something happens, open or otherwise, you'll hear about it here first!
Richard
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Let me just add that if any DIY types (like myself...) get anything, it will be open and it will be posted here. No need to keep reviving this post though. If/when something happens, open or otherwise, you'll hear about it here first!
Richard
Thanks Richard. +T
I want people to know that if you have anything to add to this please let me know. If someone has a box they'd like to be looked at, know that it will be shared. I know Tim didn't send his Gefell Box out due to some concerns. I don't blame him but if you're still willing Tim let's get it looked at (to your comfort) and have the info up here for all to see.
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I'm pretty good with a soldering iron, but don't have much electrical design experience/knowledge. I have some 480's that I'd like to make active. I would like to help this project along in any way possible. I understand both the for profit and open design camps and personally think either group can come up with a workable solution. But I personally feel that working together in the beginning would be more beneficial. There are going to be plenty of recordists that will want either option I think. Some will be willing to pay for a "branded" a-la Oade product from the profit camp and there will be do-it-yourselfers that will want to try it themselves. This is what happened when the Edirol UA-5 digi-mod details were made public. Plenty of UA-5's were moded or mangled by do-it-yourselfers... Some don't feel comfortable doing it and continue to pay others, like Bussman2 to do it for them.
I happen to really like the model the headphone amp guys like Tangentsoft http://tangentsoft.net/audio/new-diyer.html have...
Come up with a design... Test it and get it just right. Then make the details available publically, including approved circuit boards etc...
This way, the for profit group can sell the parts and and or assemble the thing for people that do not feel comfortable doing it and the DIY group can put it togther themselves. In this model, the most important part, coming up with the best workable design, is out there for everybody to contribute to.
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i just gave nick (n-box) the colletts for the akg 460/480 n box project. i think he is going to post pictures here very soon.
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i just gave nick (n-box) the colletts for the akg 460/480 n box project. i think he is going to post pictures here very soon.
the collettes are very nice. they look heavier than they actually are. the threads are even and accept the capsules perfectly, and have a very positive stop. the gefells collettes are equally nice.
i havent read this thread in a while. not sure what all this profit vs open stuff is. like i posted earlier, the "secret" is what is in the head of the cables. if you want us to release this information (what is in the cable heads), i dont think we would be opposed to that, but as we were going to use a modified nbox for the pre you cannot expect nick to release that information on the nbox-preamp.
i understand tim's (raoulduke's) and other jk-labs owners' positions. if i had a unique device i would be leary to let people inspect it as well. that is thier perogative. i am certain nick, mike, our ee buddy (not on this board) and myself can come up with the correct formula for the heads thru trial and error. nick works on schoeps capsules, cables and collette heads on a daily basis and he has the understanding and know how.
if these jk-labs owners would reconsider, i am sure nick and myself would make it worth your while. for instance, supply two new sets of cables and active heads...say one 20foot for open taping, and a 6foot set for stealth/low-pro...a nice deal for a day or two of down time for us to inspect the head.
here are the photos of the akg colletes we had made.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v310/justgup/projects/akg1.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v310/justgup/projects/akg2.jpg)
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Wow! Nice Work! When these AKG N-Boxs are ready to be sold, sign me up! I was talking to JK about ordering one of his when he disappered from the earth.
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i havent read this thread in a while. not sure what all this profit vs open stuff is. like i posted earlier, the "secret" is what is in the head of the cables. if you want us to release this information (what is in the cable heads), i dont think we would be opposed to that, but as we were going to use a modified nbox for the pre you cannot expect nick to release that information on the nbox-preamp.
i understand tim's (raoulduke's) and other jk-labs owners' positions. if i had a unique device i would be leary to let people inspect it as well. that is thier perogative. i am certain nick, mike, our ee buddy (not on this board) and myself can come up with the correct formula for the heads thru trial and error. nick works on schoeps capsules, cables and collette heads on a daily basis and he has the understanding and know how.
if these jk-labs owners would reconsider, i am sure nick and myself would make it worth your while. for instance, supply two new sets of cables and active heads...say one 20foot for open taping, and a 6foot set for stealth/low-pro...a nice deal for a day or two of down time for us to inspect the head.
Very nice indeed. I think the offer for existing JK Labs owners is a hell of a deal too.
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+T
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Very nice indeed. I think the offer for existing JK Labs owners is a hell of a deal too.
[/quote]
I maybe down for that I have a JK labs box for the 391s etc !!!
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those look nice
but i agree with tim too
on the other hand,(if i understand this stuff right) i personally think it would be better to have a box that acts as bodies, like the jk box vs a box thats a pre too
that way you could use any pre you wanted
edit, actually i think the best would be just cables where you used the "real" 480 bodies and so it went like this
cap > active cable > body > cable > pre
i think that would be smaller overall compaired to a box but maybe i am wrong
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those look nice
but i agree with tim too
on the other hand,(if i understand this stuff right) i personally think it would be better to have a box that acts as bodies, like the jk box vs a box thats a pre too
that way you could use any pre you wanted
edit, actually i think the best would be just cables where you used the "real" 480 bodies and so it went like this
cap > active cable > body > cable > pre
i think that would be smaller overall compaired to a box but maybe i am wrong
I would have to agree here, just think if a battery box/pre were painstakingly engineered and manufactured, but nobody liked the way it sounded, that would be a disaster, and since hardly anyone agrees on which flavor of preamp they like best its likely to happen
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Great work on those collettes!
I just came across this thread a week or so ago and tried to catch up with the discussions. Just popped in again today. As a JKLabs owner myself, I'll chime in and say sorry, but I'm not interested in allowing my setup to be used as the guinnea pig. :-\ Sorry if this upsets the folks that I'm sure are interested in an active solution for the AKGs. Totally understand your desire to get this project going -- I love my AKG actives!
But at least for my JKLabs active heads, everything is completely epoxied in. There doesn't seem to be any way to disassemble them to look inside. The only option would be to destroy them to get at the innards, and then hope that whoever tore them apart could completely rebuild them. So if this project fails, I'd no longer have a viable/working AKG active setup for myself. Just not a risk I'm willing to take, and if all the JKLabs owners have similar, epoxied-together active heads, I doubt you'll find anyone who will be willing to sacrifice their JKLabs setup to help the cause.
Anyway, just a little insight into what is really being asked of the JKLabs owners. Hopefully the AKG capsules work in much the same way as the schoeps capsules and designers can use the schoeps active design as a starting point. That together with experimentation and trial and error should eventually lead to a working AKG active design.
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those look nice
but i agree with tim too
on the other hand,(if i understand this stuff right) i personally think it would be better to have a box that acts as bodies, like the jk box vs a box thats a pre too
that way you could use any pre you wanted
edit, actually i think the best would be just cables where you used the "real" 480 bodies and so it went like this
cap > active cable > body > cable > pre
i think that would be smaller overall compaired to a box but maybe i am wrong
I would have to agree here, just think if a battery box/pre were painstakingly engineered and manufactured, but nobody liked the way it sounded, that would be a disaster, and since hardly anyone agrees on which flavor of preamp they like best its likely to happen
thats what i was trying to say, just not so well :)
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those look nice
but i agree with tim too
on the other hand,(if i understand this stuff right) i personally think it would be better to have a box that acts as bodies, like the jk box vs a box thats a pre too
that way you could use any pre you wanted
edit, actually i think the best would be just cables where you used the "real" 480 bodies and so it went like this
cap > active cable > body > cable > pre
i think that would be smaller overall compaired to a box but maybe i am wrong
I would have to agree here, just think if a battery box/pre were painstakingly engineered and manufactured, but nobody liked the way it sounded, that would be a disaster, and since hardly anyone agrees on which flavor of preamp they like best its likely to happen
thats what i was trying to say, just not so well :)
in the end, there is probably no better match for the ck line of caps than the 480 body, just add an active cable to pair them remotely, what could be simpler and more natural
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those look nice
but i agree with tim too
on the other hand,(if i understand this stuff right) i personally think it would be better to have a box that acts as bodies, like the jk box vs a box thats a pre too
that way you could use any pre you wanted
edit, actually i think the best would be just cables where you used the "real" 480 bodies and so it went like this
cap > active cable > body > cable > pre
i think that would be smaller overall compaired to a box but maybe i am wrong
I would have to agree here, just think if a battery box/pre were painstakingly engineered and manufactured, but nobody liked the way it sounded, that would be a disaster, and since hardly anyone agrees on which flavor of preamp they like best its likely to happen
Don't hold your breath. That isn't likely to happen.
It is done with Schoeps because the schoeps bodies are *designed* for it. They have extra connectors. Those connectors are fed extra power for the buffer circuit.
The MG bodies are not designed for this. They do not have extra connectors. They do not supply power for a buffer circuit. Someone would need to design a cable with a battery to feed the buffer circuit, etc. I don't have AKGs so I can't look to see if they are the same way but I'm guessing they are.
I would like to see a solution that consists of a tiny box that supplies the capsules with 48v (via pass-thru) and contains a buffer circuit ala sonsosax. It could be much smaller than an nbox because it would not contain the batteries to supply 60v, nor the 9volt batteries. It would not generate 48v (though maybe a special version would). The 48v would come from the upstream pre-amp. This should be a very simple circuit and very cheap.
I've done a little work on this but haven't had much time (and spring is coming..).
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those look nice
but i agree with tim too
on the other hand,(if i understand this stuff right) i personally think it would be better to have a box that acts as bodies, like the jk box vs a box thats a pre too
that way you could use any pre you wanted
edit, actually i think the best would be just cables where you used the "real" 480 bodies and so it went like this
cap > active cable > body > cable > pre
i think that would be smaller overall compaired to a box but maybe i am wrong
I would have to agree here, just think if a battery box/pre were painstakingly engineered and manufactured, but nobody liked the way it sounded, that would be a disaster, and since hardly anyone agrees on which flavor of preamp they like best its likely to happen
Don't hold your breath. That isn't likely to happen.
It is done with Schoeps because the schoeps bodies are *designed* for it. They have extra connectors. Those connectors are fed extra power for the buffer circuit.
The MG bodies are not designed for this. They do not have extra connectors. They do not supply power for a buffer circuit. Someone would need to design a cable with a battery to feed the buffer circuit, etc. I don't have AKGs so I can't look to see if they are the same way but I'm guessing they are.
I would like to see a solution that consists of a tiny box that supplies the capsules with 48v (via pass-thru) and contains a buffer circuit ala sonsosax. It could be much smaller than an nbox because it would not contain the batteries to supply 60v, nor the 9volt batteries. It would not generate 48v (though maybe a special version would). The 48v would come from the upstream pre-amp. This should be a very simple circuit and very cheap.
I've done a little work on this but haven't had much time (and spring is coming..).
Yep, a good starting point. 48V should work (and appears to be used on the Sonosax), but to run *properly* you will need 60V. Anyway, I'm all for starting out simple with a "pass through" circuit.
I'm going to buy a set of caps (soon!) and experiment. But, as I said ealier, no need to ask here. If *anything* happens, you'll hear it hear first...
Richard
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in the end, there is probably no better match for the ck line of caps than the 480 body, just add an active cable to pair them remotely, what could be simpler and more natural
JW Mod 460 bodies 8)
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So I'm assuming that inside these collette heads Nick or someone else is going to build a FET to match up with the cap. If thats the case then i'd probably want a pair with lemo connectors on the other end and try to run it with the sonosax sx-m2/ls2. The sonosax lemosax can run any pair of mic capsules with a fet at the capsule end, so AT853's, franken naks, schoeps with any actives, KM140's with any actives, AKG ck91,92,93 caps, ect...
If someone put a FET in with this i'd be very very interested. Just a thought too if the box becomes an option some people don't want
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hewllo all, i am new to the thread but have chatted with Matt recently about MK46's etc. i do own three of the CK8X capsules that use the MK46. unfortunately i only have 2 of the MK46 cables. i would love to get a third cable - either AKG oem or something from this project. anyway on page ten i saw this post:
Just a note to grider's mention of the ck1x and mk46 cable being useful for the cable to connect the capsule to the 480's. In fact niether of these items would be useful, the mk46 cable will not work with the 480, it has different connections and a different anchor (which the 480 is missing) so if one were to model the new one after the mk46 it would not work.
will, i am not so sure about all the discussions about the "bias" ring. the reality is that my schematics show that ring not connected to anything in the 460 electronics. plus when the MK46 is screwed onto the 460 body, the threaded housing contacts the 460 body as well as the "bias" ring. i believe that akg used it for a second shield (note that the MK46 cable is triaxial in construction) to eliminate as much RFI/EMI as possible from the umbilicle cable. if you look at the german schemo for the MK46 cable, they call the two outer wires in the cable SCREENS - an old term for ground. one would have to check to see if the corresponding capsule end is actually connected after the LEMO connector or if they left it floating (as is done in many car and home RCA cables) to provide extra shielding...
anyway, i dunno if this has been covered previously. if so, my apologies. just trying to assist. has anyone tried to order the plastic insert at the end of the 460 body?? unfortunately my experience with AKG have been universally hideous (paid for 2 new diaphrams for the ck8's - was told i must send my MK46's and 460's cause they don't have any in repair, then come to find out the work was never done, yet they billed me and refused to take them back and fix them). i have a wonderful relation with sennheiser usa, dwight and uber, so as much as i like the akg's i am biased toward sennheiser.
btw, sennheiser MKE-2, as well as the ME20/40/60/88's all use a FET in the capsule and they work with only two wires - of course they are electret capsules.....
if i can contribute in any way to this project, please let me know. i do have as couple of excellent machinist friends... maybe get them to do this as a CNC project to make it affordable. i need both ends of an MK46. seems to me you guys are all pretty much after the capsule end only.
neil in san diego
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Wow! Nice Work! When these AKG N-Boxs are ready to be sold, sign me up!
i agree! +T!
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I wonder how it would sound to put say a Scheops capsule on an AKG body or visa/versa. Anybody follow me here?
Like find a cheap active sytem that works and put another manufacturers capsules on it. MBHO has an active system, but I don't care for the sound of the capsules... I wonder how hard it would be to make an adaptor to fit the various different microphone manufacturers caps on the already existing active set-ups.
Just a thought...
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i would think that would be extremely hard if not impossible.
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i would think that would be extremely hard if not impossible.
Have you ever engineered anything that numerous people in the field said was impossible?
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no, have you?
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not for nothing, but didnt freelunch make scheops actives from goosenecks? thats an achievement in my book ;D
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no, have you?
Yes.. My point with the comment was to forward the notion that you cannot accomplish the impossible unless you are willing to risk failure by attempting the impossible. People telling you that your plans/project are impossible is great motivation. Though the best ideas are often derided as impossible when proposed and then dismissed as obvious upon success.
The schoeps gooseneck actives project was a nice hack but not near the level of 'impossible'. Though I added some additional pressure because I went public with what I was doing way before the outcome was assured.
An adaptor that allowed the schoeps active cables to take MG caps would be pretty slick..
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There is an adaptor available to use the older Neumann caps (including the LD ones) on the AKG 451 series mics. There is a guy in England who machines them. Im sure there are other possibilities for different mics/caps combinations if people checked into it and wanted to do the R & D.
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There is an adaptor available to use the older Neumann caps (including the LD ones) on the AKG 451 series mics. There is a guy in England who machines them. Im sure there are other possibilities for different mics/caps combinations if people checked into it and wanted to do the R & D.
As someone who tried this (451's and 460's with the above referenced machined adapters and vintage Gefell bayonet capsules) I can testify that it worked. So an adapter to use different caps on different bodies is not so far-fetched. I'm sure neither AKG nor Gefell expected anyone would ever make a hybrid from their mic components.
Dirk
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There is an adaptor available to use the older Neumann caps (including the LD ones) on the AKG 451 series mics. There is a guy in England who machines them. Im sure there are other possibilities for different mics/caps combinations if people checked into it and wanted to do the R & D.
As someone who tried this (451's and 460's with the above referenced machined adapters and vintage Gefell bayonet capsules) I can testify that it worked. So an adapter to use different caps on different bodies is not so far-fetched. I'm sure neither AKG nor Gefell expected anyone would ever make a hybrid from their mic components.
Dirk
How did that sound? I wonder how much the microphone body contrubutes to the overall sound. With a neutral microphone body, it would be cool to be able to have the option of using different manufacturers capsules.
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How did that sound? I wonder how much the microphone body contrubutes to the overall sound.
Well I think the answer to that is do you like the 460 or 480. I can tell a major difference between the two with the exact same caps. I can also tell the difference in a more subtle way with the JW460 <> 480 comps.
Alot of the thinking towards all of this is do you just want actives or do you want actives with that distinct AKG sound that you love before an active system has been developed?
As much as I want AKG actives for my 480's I don't (fingers crossed) want to sacrifice the sound that my ears love. Ahhh problems of the world....
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I actually hadn't thought of it that way. I know the 460 bodies are transformer coupled, so they do sound different than the 480 bodies. I've never heard a direct comparison.
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any change in the status on this?
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Let me know if I can be of any help I have no interest in selling these things but I could help with the design I have alot of contacts in the mic building world and with AKG.
Chris Church
How did that sound? I wonder how much the microphone body contrubutes to the overall sound.
Well I think the answer to that is do you like the 460 or 480. I can tell a major difference between the two with the exact same caps. I can also tell the difference in a more subtle way with the JW460 <> 480 comps.
Alot of the thinking towards all of this is do you just want actives or do you want actives with that distinct AKG sound that you love before an active system has been developed?
As much as I want AKG actives for my 480's I don't (fingers crossed) want to sacrifice the sound that my ears love. Ahhh problems of the world....
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There is an adaptor available to use the older Neumann caps (including the LD ones) on the AKG 451 series mics. There is a guy in England who machines them. Im sure there are other possibilities for different mics/caps combinations if people checked into it and wanted to do the R & D.
As someone who tried this (451's and 460's with the above referenced machined adapters and vintage Gefell bayonet capsules) I can testify that it worked. So an adapter to use different caps on different bodies is not so far-fetched. I'm sure neither AKG nor Gefell expected anyone would ever make a hybrid from their mic components.
Dirk
How did that sound? I wonder how much the microphone body contrubutes to the overall sound. With a neutral microphone body, it would be cool to be able to have the option of using different manufacturers capsules.
How did it sound? Not like an AKG, and certainly not like a vintage Gefell capsule. The point mentioned in the posts above are pretty important. A box will very likely change the sound characteristics. You'll have AKG "actives", but they won't necessarily sound like your typical AKGs.
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Does anybody have the flac files from that JWmod460 vs. 480 vs. 460 comparison done by gumbino a while back? I'm trying to decide if I should send my 460s into to JW for the mod, or sell 'em and get 480s... will be running into an mp-2 for now, and then likely an ACM 671 later this summer... shoot me a PM if you can help me with the comparison...
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Does anybody have the flac files from that JWmod460 vs. 480 vs. 460 comparison done by gumbino a while back? I'm trying to decide if I should send my 460s into to JW for the mod, or sell 'em and get 480s... will be running into an mp-2 for now, and then likely an ACM 671 later this summer... shoot me a PM if you can help me with the comparison...
Dude, you're a slut to look up (down?) to...
You haven't even got the 463's yet and you're planning to get the next upgrade.
++++++++++++++++++T for that one!
Richard
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Does anybody have the flac files from that JWmod460 vs. 480 vs. 460 comparison done by gumbino a while back? I'm trying to decide if I should send my 460s into to JW for the mod, or sell 'em and get 480s... will be running into an mp-2 for now, and then likely an ACM 671 later this summer... shoot me a PM if you can help me with the comparison...
Dude, you're a slut to look up (down?) to...
You haven't even got the 463's yet and you're planning to get the next upgrade.
++++++++++++++++++T for that one!
Richard
Haha, well I've ran 463s before.... had 'em last summer. I bought them cuz they were super cheap, I got a great deal and I was planning to mod them when I got 'em... but yes, I am a slut lately, but a smart slut... I got a great deal selling the neumanns and now a great deal on 463s... couldn't resist re-joining team AKG.
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I've never heard the direct comparison recordings either. I have an idea in my head what the differences are, but it would be nice to hear a valid comparison.
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I've never heard the direct comparison recordings either. I have an idea in my head what the differences are, but it would be nice to hear a valid comparison.
For that matter it would be interesting to hear the differences between ToddR's 480 active set-up and my full bodied 480's.
Has a comp like that ever been done?
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I've never heard the direct comparison recordings either. I have an idea in my head what the differences are, but it would be nice to hear a valid comparison.
For that matter it would be interesting to hear the differences between ToddR's 480 active set-up and my full bodied 480's.
Has a comp like that ever been done?
ToodR does NOT have an active 480 setup. He has an active ck6x setup. Big difference. FWIW, I believe the JW mods bring the speed of the 460's up close to the 480's. I am biased and still prefer the 480 bodies but different ears hear diferent things.
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I've never heard the direct comparison recordings either. I have an idea in my head what the differences are, but it would be nice to hear a valid comparison.
For that matter it would be interesting to hear the differences between ToddR's 480 active set-up and my full bodied 480's.
Has a comp like that ever been done?
ToodR does NOT have an active 480 setup. He has an active ck6x setup. Big difference. FWIW, I believe the JW mods bring the speed of the 460's up close to the 480's. I am biased and still prefer the 480 bodies but different ears hear diferent things.
Oopss...
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Bumpidity Bump :)
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I've never heard the direct comparison recordings either. I have an idea in my head what the differences are, but it would be nice to hear a valid comparison.
For that matter it would be interesting to hear the differences between ToddR's 480 active set-up and my full bodied 480's.
Has a comp like that ever been done?
ToodR does NOT have an active 480 setup. He has an active ck6x setup. Big difference. FWIW, I believe the JW mods bring the speed of the 460's up close to the 480's. I am biased and still prefer the 480 bodies but different ears hear diferent things.
Does anyone have a 480 active setup? I always thought they were CK6x active setups.
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I've never heard the direct comparison recordings either. I have an idea in my head what the differences are, but it would be nice to hear a valid comparison.
For that matter it would be interesting to hear the differences between ToddR's 480 active set-up and my full bodied 480's.
Has a comp like that ever been done?
ToodR does NOT have an active 480 setup. He has an active ck6x setup. Big difference. FWIW, I believe the JW mods bring the speed of the 460's up close to the 480's. I am biased and still prefer the 480 bodies but different ears hear diferent things.
Does anyone have a 480 active setup? I always thought they were CK6x active setups.
No AKG 480 active setup exists. The JK Labs DVC box that ToddR & a few others have uses the ck6_ caps, but the box replaces the bodies.
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Too bad leegeddy is gone. I remember at one time he was thinking about using the A61 swivels in an attempt to have a true 480 active setup.
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I actually hadn't thought of it that way. I know the 460 bodies are transformer coupled, so they do sound different than the 480 bodies. I've never heard a direct comparison.
hmm, this has gotten me thinking, I think I will run my ck1xcap into my mk46 active cables into my stock 460 bodies for one set and into my 480 bodies for the second set, sometime soon, and then torrent the recording, I see no reason why I could not do so, might be illuminating, could do so next week for that Toad the Wet Sprocket show
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I actually hadn't thought of it that way. I know the 460 bodies are transformer coupled, so they do sound different than the 480 bodies. I've never heard a direct comparison.
hmm, this has gotten me thinking, I think I will run my ck1xcap into my mk46 active cables into my stock 460 bodies for one set and into my 480 bodies for the second set, sometime soon, and then torrent the recording, I see no reason why I could not do so, might be illuminating, could do so next week for that Toad the Wet Sprocket show
I don't think the MK46 cables work on 480's.
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I actually hadn't thought of it that way. I know the 460 bodies are transformer coupled, so they do sound different than the 480 bodies. I've never heard a direct comparison.
hmm, this has gotten me thinking, I think I will run my ck1xcap into my mk46 active cables into my stock 460 bodies for one set and into my 480 bodies for the second set, sometime soon, and then torrent the recording, I see no reason why I could not do so, might be illuminating, could do so next week for that Toad the Wet Sprocket show
I don't think the MK46 cables work on 480's.
you are right... only the 460s due to an extra contact that is not existant in the 480 body
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I actually hadn't thought of it that way. I know the 460 bodies are transformer coupled, so they do sound different than the 480 bodies. I've never heard a direct comparison.
hmm, this has gotten me thinking, I think I will run my ck1xcap into my mk46 active cables into my stock 460 bodies for one set and into my 480 bodies for the second set, sometime soon, and then torrent the recording, I see no reason why I could not do so, might be illuminating, could do so next week for that Toad the Wet Sprocket show
I don't think the MK46 cables work on 480's.
you are right... only the 460s due to an extra contact that is not existant in the 480 body
the fact that I did not know this means that I need to tape more >:D, speaking of which I will be taping Del McCoury Band tomorrow and on Saturday too for the Bean Blossom Bluegrass Festival, and perhaps TTWS next week, that will jump start things a bit
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I actually hadn't thought of it that way. I know the 460 bodies are transformer coupled, so they do sound different than the 480 bodies. I've never heard a direct comparison.
hmm, this has gotten me thinking, I think I will run my ck1xcap into my mk46 active cables into my stock 460 bodies for one set and into my 480 bodies for the second set, sometime soon, and then torrent the recording, I see no reason why I could not do so, might be illuminating, could do so next week for that Toad the Wet Sprocket show
I don't think the MK46 cables work on 480's.
you are right... only the 460s due to an extra contact that is not existant in the 480 body
the fact that I did not know this means that I need to tape more >:D, speaking of which I will be taping Del McCoury Band tomorrow and on Saturday too for the Bean Blossom Bluegrass Festival, and perhaps TTWS next week, that will jump start things a bit
Since the 1x caps won't work with the 480s, maybe do a ck1x vs ck61 comparison on the 460s?
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yes, that would be simple enough to do
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Does anybody have the flac files from that JWmod460 vs. 480 vs. 460 comparison done by gumbino a while back? I'm trying to decide if I should send my 460s into to JW for the mod, or sell 'em and get 480s... will be running into an mp-2 for now, and then likely an ACM 671 later this summer... shoot me a PM if you can help me with the comparison...
I'm a little behind in this thread, but I have this on the hard drive if you still need it. Let me know.
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Does anybody have the flac files from that JWmod460 vs. 480 vs. 460 comparison done by gumbino a while back? I'm trying to decide if I should send my 460s into to JW for the mod, or sell 'em and get 480s... will be running into an mp-2 for now, and then likely an ACM 671 later this summer... shoot me a PM if you can help me with the comparison...
I'm a little behind in this thread, but I have this on the hard drive if you still need it. Let me know.
Shoot Terrapinj a PM. He's going to upload it to Tapers.org. Maybe you can get it to him via ftp. I've been trying to get it to him, but been slacking off. I have a cd ready to mail to him, but haven't made it to the post office yet. Thanks for the offer. +T
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OK, nothing much happening I guess.
So, I just ordered a pair of CK63's to play with.
I expect one week or so delivery then I'll start messing with them.
Time to break out the hot melt glue and duct tape. And a few FETs and 1GOhm resistors for good measure...
Richard
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OK, nothing much happening I guess.
So, I just ordered a pair of CK63's to play with.
I expect one week or so delivery then I'll start messing with them.
Time to break out the hot melt glue and duct tape. And a few FETs and 1GOhm resistors for good measure...
Richard
Richard - you are the man. +T
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OK, nothing much happening I guess.
So, I just ordered a pair of CK63's to play with.
I expect one week or so delivery then I'll start messing with them.
Time to break out the hot melt glue and duct tape. And a few FETs and 1GOhm resistors for good measure...
Richard
Richard - you are the man. +T
Oh yeah, if anyone has "collettes" for these, please send me a PM. Someone had machined a set. I sent an Email, but I'm not sure if these are still available. Or, if they take a standard thread I might find in a hardware store (unlikely, but possible), please let me know.
Mechanical problems are the biggest issues for me. I can deal with the electronics stuff.
Richard
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Hi there. I finally ordered a set of CK63 caps and built a crude prototype.
Shown below: six (!) 9V batteries in series for the polarization voltage, two FETs, two 1Gohm (!) resistors, and other various parts. I have not done extensive testing, but it "appears" to work, that is, I can speak into the mic and hear myself clearly.
So, if anyone has the collettes, I'd like to get a pair. Otherwise I'll have to do something messy with copper screen, foil tape, etc.
Thanks,
Richard
(http://www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/ck63_prototype.jpg)
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crap, nice work my friend
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Very cool, indeed! Any chance of your playing with some Schoeps caps, Richard?
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Wow that is alot of wires and alligator clips. Good to see the clips used for their intended purposes. ::)
Knowing nothing about electronics all those 9v seems like alot... But wondering what the ! on the two 1Gohm (!) resistors indicated. I take it this is different than what you would expect to use?
Dana
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Very cool, indeed! Any chance of your playing with some Schoeps caps, Richard?
No way I'm going to play with other stuff, unless someone gives me them :). I'm out enough money already buying the AKGs.
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Good job, Richard! +T
Any chance of getting a crude schematic?
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Have you set a price once these get cleaned up?
~Clint
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Have you set a price once these get cleaned up?
~Clint
+t
Thanks for the laugh on a sweltering Monday morning!
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Very cool, indeed! Any chance of your playing with some Schoeps caps, Richard?
no need for him to either. they already make actives. :P
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Shown below: six (!) 9V batteries in series for the polarization voltage, two FETs, two 1Gohm (!) resistors, and other various parts. I have not done extensive testing, but it "appears" to work, that is, I can speak into the mic and hear myself clearly.
(http://www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/ck63_prototype.jpg)
Sans the 9v's, would the two FETs, the two 1Gohm (!) resistors, and the various other parts be all that's needed to create an extension cable to run from the 460 bodies to the ck6_ caps? Seems like the mk46 cables could be modified to work with this setup? :hmmm:
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No they would not, because the AKG bodies have a FET in them already, what you see when you unscrew the cap is the connection between the FET and the capsule.
You need a bare polarization voltage to transmit over a long enough distance to the FET at the capsule, there is no way to get that polarization voltage from the connector on the bodies. This is what i've gathered from my ideas and experiments.
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I am assuming a mic body is off to the right where the +(yellow cable) goes. Or is this solution to just place everything @ the capsule a la the CCM or 402x mics?
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Good job, Richard! +T
Any chance of getting a crude schematic?
Yeah, I'll post a "blackboard drawing" in a bit.
Richard
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RIchard how is that you accomplished this in a matter of days, where others have been struggling for much much longer? will adding length to the cables cause any issues at all? i am really impressed and can't wait to hear some samples.
of course you accomplish this right after I finally acquire some active cables :P
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No they would not, because the AKG bodies have a FET in them already, what you see when you unscrew the cap is the connection between the FET and the capsule.
You need a bare polarization voltage to transmit over a long enough distance to the FET at the capsule, there is no way to get that polarization voltage from the connector on the bodies. This is what i've gathered from my ideas and experiments.
Actually, you *could* make an extension cable to run the capsules from the 460/480 bodies. Well, basically you would just get the polarization voltage from the 460/480 body and run it to the cap with the FETs *at the capsule*, then take the signal off the FETs. So the body would do nothing but provide the polarization voltage.
But I am not interested in doing this. I don't want to buy/carry the mic body! The whole point for me is to have mics for a cheap price, for just the price of the capsules. Others are welcome to experiment with using the existing bodies, adding preamps to bring output to line level, etc.
OK, the next step is to build this into a collette at the mic capsule. (So, does anyone have collettes for these capsules?) Next I'll try to field test.
Thanks for your interest!
Richard
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No they would not, because the AKG bodies have a FET in them already, what you see when you unscrew the cap is the connection between the FET and the capsule.
You need a bare polarization voltage to transmit over a long enough distance to the FET at the capsule, there is no way to get that polarization voltage from the connector on the bodies. This is what i've gathered from my ideas and experiments.
Actually, you *could* make an extension cable to run the capsules from the 460/480 bodies. Well, basically you would just get the polarization voltage from the 460/480 body and run it to the cap with the FETs *at the capsule*, then take the signal off the FETs. So the body would do nothing but provide the polarization voltage.
But I am not interested in doing this. I don't want to buy/carry the mic body! The whole point for me is to have mics for a cheap price, for just the price of the capsules. Others are welcome to experiment with using the existing bodies, adding preamps to bring output to line level, etc.
OK, the next step is to build this into a collette at the mic capsule. (So, does anyone have collettes for these capsules?) Next I'll try to field test.
Thanks for your interest!
Richard
someone tried this I believe, the polarization voltage provided by the bodies won't carry over a long enough distance. there's a thread about it somewhere.
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OK, the next step is to build this into a collette at the mic capsule. (So, does anyone have collettes for these capsules?) Next I'll try to field test.
Thanks for your interest!
Richard
you prob saw this...
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=59577.msg830670#msg830670
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RIchard how is that you accomplished this in a matter of days, where others have been struggling for much much longer? will adding length to the cables cause any issues at all? i am really impressed and can't wait to hear some samples.
of course you accomplish this right after I finally acquire some active cables :P
Unfortunately, this is the point in the process where problems can creep in, such as RF interference, noise etc...
It looks like Richard has the quick and dirty part done. I'll bet that the refining takes a bit longer.
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RIchard how is that you accomplished this in a matter of days, where others have been struggling for much much longer? will adding length to the cables cause any issues at all? i am really impressed and can't wait to hear some samples.
of course you accomplish this right after I finally acquire some active cables :P
Unfortunately, this is the point in the process where problems can creep in, such as RF interference, noise etc...
It looks like Richard has the quick and dirty part done. I'll bet that the refining takes a bit longer.
Someone help me with the collettes and we'll see how long it takes :).
Richard
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Good job, Richard! +T
Any chance of getting a crude schematic?
Yeah, I'll post a "blackboard drawing" in a bit.
Richard
looking forward to the blackboard...
you are a frickin haxor animal :P
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RIchard how is that you accomplished this in a matter of days, where others have been struggling for much much longer? will adding length to the cables cause any issues at all? i am really impressed and can't wait to hear some samples.
of course you accomplish this right after I finally acquire some active cables :P
Unfortunately, this is the point in the process where problems can creep in, such as RF interference, noise etc...
It looks like Richard has the quick and dirty part done. I'll bet that the refining takes a bit longer.
Someone help me with the collettes and we'll see how long it takes :).
Richard
Assuming it is a metric thread pattern, somone w/ access to a digital caliper could figure this out for us.
how far, in millimeters it advances in one turn of the cap will give you the thread pattern. While you are at it accurate internal and external diameters of boddies/caps will also be needed.
hopefully this is a standard pitch so a tap could be purchased. Soft brass would be pretty easy to work through and engineering a mount for the center pin would be pretty easy.
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RIchard how is that you accomplished this in a matter of days, where others have been struggling for much much longer? will adding length to the cables cause any issues at all? i am really impressed and can't wait to hear some samples.
of course you accomplish this right after I finally acquire some active cables :P
Unfortunately, this is the point in the process where problems can creep in, such as RF interference, noise etc...
It looks like Richard has the quick and dirty part done. I'll bet that the refining takes a bit longer.
Someone help me with the collettes and we'll see how long it takes :).
Richard
Assuming it is a metric thread pattern, somone w/ access to a digital caliper could figure this out for us.
how far, in millimeters it advances in one turn of the cap will give you the thread pattern. While you are at it accurate internal and external diameters of boddies/caps will also be needed.
hopefully this is a standard pitch so a tap could be purchased. Soft brass would be pretty easy to work through and engineering a mount for the center pin would be pretty easy.
Isn't the thread info shown on the product data sheets as an m19 x 0.75?
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No they would not, because the AKG bodies have a FET in them already, what you see when you unscrew the cap is the connection between the FET and the capsule.
You need a bare polarization voltage to transmit over a long enough distance to the FET at the capsule, there is no way to get that polarization voltage from the connector on the bodies. This is what i've gathered from my ideas and experiments.
I don't know about that. The ck_x caps have a FET in them if I remember correctly & they operate over the mk46. Seems like the ck6_ could be operated in a similar fashion if a FET and ? was added in the collette.
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No they would not, because the AKG bodies have a FET in them already, what you see when you unscrew the cap is the connection between the FET and the capsule.
You need a bare polarization voltage to transmit over a long enough distance to the FET at the capsule, there is no way to get that polarization voltage from the connector on the bodies. This is what i've gathered from my ideas and experiments.
I don't know about that. The ck_x caps have a FET in them if I remember correctly & they operate over the mk46. Seems like the ck6_ could be operated in a similar fashion if a FET and ? was added in the collette.
Exactly. You need to add *at least* one FET in the collette. I've added two, one to acts an buffer/amplifier and one to act as a constant current source for the amp. So, in the collette I will put: two FETs, two 1Gohm resistors and a few other parts. For now I'm going to just seal it with copper foil/tape and see if that works.
I'll post results when I do this. But in the meantime, if the person with the Collettes wants to get back to me, that would be much appreciated.
Richard
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No guarantees, but here is the circuit I used:
(http://www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/ck63_schematic.jpg)
I will post again if I build in/near the mic capsule.
Richard
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Isn't the thread info shown on the product data sheets as an m19 x 0.75?
well that was easy.
Depending on how much realestate is needed in the collete it should be easy to work w/ a short run machine shop to get some made up. The 1Gohm resistors are the bigest part in there(as pictured). Depending on the wattage required/recomended they can be had as small as 1/4" by 1/4".
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No guarantees, but here is the circuit I used:
(http://www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/ck63_schematic.jpg)
I will post again if I build in/near the mic capsule.
Richard
Incredible Richard, +T!
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OK, I've got contacts at the machine shop here to build Collettes. That will begin 1 August. I've also got a query out to someone on TS.com who has collettes already made. Either way, this *is* going to move forward...
See you in August...
Richard
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thanks for your hard work gentlemen, i cnat wait for this to take off ;D
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Yeah, great work there Richard!
I live in the same town, so I'm hoping to see the progress on this first hand!
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please let me (or us) know if you need anything to fund this research and development. i'm interested if it comes to fruition, but in the meantime, i'm willing to help fund this project (as i'm sure alot of us would) with money or parts or whatever.
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OK, I've got contacts at the machine shop here to build Collettes. That will begin 1 August. I've also got a query out to someone on TS.com who has collettes already made. Either way, this *is* going to move forward...
See you in August...
Richard
+t
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You just gotta love Richards use of a good old blackboard!
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thanks for your hard work gentlemen, i cant wait for this to take off
ditto!
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Just posting so this shows up in my "Show new replies to your posts.".
Word!
-Kevin
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Collettes machined, thanks to some generous folks over in Engineering...
Now I will attempt to get these freakin' things working...
Richard
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Sweet!
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Collettes machined, thanks to some generous folks over in Engineering...
Now I will attempt to get these freakin' things working...
Richard
Did you make a blueprint? I have some machinist friends... ;)
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Right on Richard, can't wait to hear how it goes...
-
Collettes machined, thanks to some generous folks over in Engineering...
Now I will attempt to get these freakin' things working...
Richard
Did you make a blueprint? I have some machinist friends... ;)
Just another "blackboard" drawing. Someone already offered me some collettes, but I decided to do it here rather than wait.
They are simple anyways. Just an aluminum tube with an m19 thread on one end.
Richard
-
Collettes machined, thanks to some generous folks over in Engineering...
Now I will attempt to get these freakin' things working...
Richard
Did you make a blueprint? I have some machinist friends... ;)
Just another "blackboard" drawing. Someone already offered me some collettes, but I decided to do it here rather than wait.
They are simple anyways. Just an aluminum tube with an m19 thread on one end.
Richard
That's all you'd need.... got any pics?
-
Collettes machined, thanks to some generous folks over in Engineering...
Now I will attempt to get these freakin' things working...
Richard
Did you make a blueprint? I have some machinist friends... ;)
Just another "blackboard" drawing. Someone already offered me some collettes, but I decided to do it here rather than wait.
They are simple anyways. Just an aluminum tube with an m19 thread on one end.
Richard
That's all you'd need.... got any pics?
I'll post pics once I get a prototype working.
Richard
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Big Plus T Richard! Can't Wait!! ;D
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+t richard
glad to see this has not died, and since i now own 481 i am even happier
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I'm a little confused. I thought AKG already made active cables for the blue line. Its the MK 90/3 + H 98. I apoligize, if we are talking about something else.
http://www.akg.com/products/powerslave,mynodeid,15,id,92,pid,92,_language,EN.html
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I'm a little confused. I thought AKG already made active cables for the blue line. Its the MK 90/3 + H 98. I apoligize, if we are talking about something else.
http://www.akg.com/products/powerslave,mynodeid,15,id,92,pid,92,_language,EN.html
we are talking about something else....actives for 460/480's.
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What are Actives? I have a pair of 480b/ck63 and if you have time would like to know more.
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What are Actives? I have a pair of 480b/ck63 and if you have time would like to know more.
Basically a cable that allows you to run the capsules away from or in some cases without the mic bodies. You may want to do a search. Lots of information on this topic.
Joe
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Thanks Joe.
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Sorry for the delay.
I'm still pissing around with these parts. Trying to fit everything into the collette is difficult! I've also got to find a way to connect to the center pin of the mic. Right now I'm using some round "crimp pins", but I'm not sure how they will work mechanically.
Argh! 90% of the job (to me at least) is solving mechanical problems.
Richard
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Sorry for the delay.
I'm still pissing around with these parts. Trying to fit everything into the collette is difficult! I've also got to find a way to connect to the center pin of the mic. Right now I'm using some round "crimp pins", but I'm not sure how they will work mechanically.
Argh! 90% of the job (to me at least) is solving mechanical problems.
Richard
richard
just a question, once you figure it out, would the cap be built into the collette or will you still be able to change caps by unscrewing it?
or at this point is it unsure :)
thanks +t again for your effort and work
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Keep up the good work... I can't wait to see how this turns out.
From someone that is electronicalliy challenged.... what is a FET?
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Keep up the good work... I can't wait to see how this turns out.
From someone that is electronicalliy challenged.... what is a FET?
This may fail to answer the question, depending on how we define "electronically challenged"... ;)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_effect_transistor
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Sorry for the delay.
I'm still pissing around with these parts. Trying to fit everything into the collette is difficult! I've also got to find a way to connect to the center pin of the mic. Right now I'm using some round "crimp pins", but I'm not sure how they will work mechanically.
Argh! 90% of the job (to me at least) is solving mechanical problems.
Richard
richard
just a question, once you figure it out, would the cap be built into the collette or will you still be able to change caps by unscrewing it?
or at this point is it unsure :)
thanks +t again for your effort and work
As far as I know, Richard had threads cut on the collettes so the caps would be switchable. I can't wait to see the finished prototype.
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It's a fancy transistor:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_effect_transistor
EDIT: (beat me to it! ;D )
I was wondering (maybe it was answered earlier) ...
Richard does your design rely on the 480 bodies? If not, have you been able to tell if the sound is close to that of the 48x sound? Thanks for all your work on this! Another +T for ya! Peace,
-dan
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It's a fancy transistor:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_effect_transistor
I was wondering (maybe it was answered earlier) ...
Richard does your design rely on the 480 bodies? If not, have you been able to tell if the sound is close to that of the 48x sound? Thanks for all your work on this! Another +T for ya! Peace,
-dan
I can field this question too for now until Richard signs on.
His design doesn't require 460 or 480 bodies. He is looking to build everything into the collette head and a battery box. Thus, you wouldn't need bodies at all, just the caps. As far as the sound goes, I don't think extensive testing and comparison has been done yet.
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Thanks Berg :)
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Thanks Berg :)
No problem... +t
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His design doesn't require 460 or 480 bodies. He is looking to build everything into the collette head and a battery box. Thus, you wouldn't need bodies at all, just the caps. As far as the sound goes, I don't think extensive testing and comparison has been done yet.
Berg...question...
battery box only or would phantom power from a preamp work also? I saw that he had 9v's..but didn't look at the box to see what the power was...
thanx
btw...very nice richard...its amazing to me that people can have this much knowledge... if you need anything programmed (ala website/db or comp software) i can offer my services there...
bj
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Hmmm, that part I'm not sure of off the top of my head, but I think it would be a battery box, and not phantom. If you consult his schematic from a few pages back in the thread it might be more clear there.
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Hmmm, that part I'm not sure of off the top of my head, but I think it would be a battery box, and not phantom. If you consult his schematic from a few pages back in the thread it might be more clear there.
ha....thats like saying I can ride in a lead balloon...I can't read anything on that....Ill pm him, or see if he happens to catch up with this thread...its not that big of a deal...just wondering as I was reading. Thanx.
bj
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No guarantees, but here is the circuit I used:
(http://www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/ck63_schematic.jpg)
I will post again if I build in/near the mic capsule.
Richard
Ok, looks like it's using a 9V battery box, thus you would not provide phantom 48V from your pre, but you could still use it to apply gain...
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No guarantees, but here is the circuit I used:
(http://www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/ck63_schematic.jpg)
I will post again if I build in/near the mic capsule.
Richard
Ok, looks like it's using a 9V battery box, thus you would not provide phantom 48V from your pre, but you could still use it to apply gain...
thanx...the only part i fully undestood from that was the extreme lower right corner of the board ;D :nightfevah:
so...it looks like 9v on one line and 50-60v on the other any electo's care to explain (in very simple terms) how that works? and it looks like the 9v goes to one side of the cap(on sheild) and the 60v goes to the other? am I even close or does all that stuff in the middle change the lines? (omg i suck at this)
So...Im guessing this would be unbalanced?
Unbalanced Audio (3 pole XLR):
Pin 1: Ground / Screen
Pin 2: Signal
Pin 3: Ground / Screen (connect to pin 1)
COULD ( i dont' know enough to even know if this is valid theoretically) the power be on the Sheild(i guess this is pin 1/3 below) to use phantom power instead? would that change everything in between like the 1m's j201's, 22n etc.....?
Sorry, im just trying to grasp the concepts here...like i said...i don't know shit
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No guarantees, but here is the circuit I used:
(http://www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/ck63_schematic.jpg)
I will post again if I build in/near the mic capsule.
Richard
Ok, looks like it's using a 9V battery box, thus you would not provide phantom 48V from your pre, but you could still use it to apply gain...
thanx...the only part i fully undestood from that was the extreme lower right corner of the board ;D :nightfevah:
so...it looks like 9v on one line and 50-60v on the other any electo's care to explain (in very simple terms) how that works? and it looks like the 9v goes to one side of the cap(on sheild) and the 60v goes to the other? am I even close or does all that stuff in the middle change the lines? (omg i suck at this)
So...Im guessing this would be unbalanced?
Unbalanced Audio (3 pole XLR):
Pin 1: Ground / Screen
Pin 2: Signal
Pin 3: Ground / Screen (connect to pin 1)
COULD ( i dont' know enough to even know if this is valid theoretically) the power be on the Sheild(i guess this is pin 1/3 below) to use phantom power instead? would that change everything in between like the 1m's j201's, 22n etc.....?
Sorry, im just trying to grasp the concepts here...like i said...i don't know shit
The 9V you say there is the actual power to the capsule... the 50-60V is there to polarize the capsule (this is what Richard told me) and that source doesn't drain at all. I think the 50-60V was made up of a series of 9V batts in his prototype but I'm not sure what he's going to do now. These could easily be placed inside the battery box along with the single 9V for power I think. As for the rest of your questions, I have no clue, sorry...
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The 9V you say there is the actual power to the capsule... the 50-60V is there to polarize the capsule (this is what Richard told me) and that source doesn't drain at all. I think the 50-60V was made up of a series of 9V batts in his prototype but I'm not sure what he's going to do now. These could easily be placed inside the battery box along with the single 9V for power I think. As for the rest of your questions, I have no clue, sorry...
thanx...that is exactly what im trying to get outta this.... just the basics....
+T berg for your help man!
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Is there a TRUE waiting list for these if they work out?
-Kevin
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Is there a TRUE waiting list for these if they work out?
-Kevin
Thanks Andrew for fielding the questions.
There is no "waiting list". I am just building for myself (for now). I'm hoping that if I give plans and building details someone can start selling these. Hopefully Chris Church, Busman2, etc, will step up and help us out.... Unfortunately I don't have time/energy to build for others now.
Richard
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Cool cool...just wanted to make sure I wasn't missing the bandwagon(which appears could be a good number of people if this goes into production).
-kevin
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Cool cool...just wanted to make sure I wasn't missing the bandwagon(which appears could be a good number of people if this goes into production).
-kevin
I would definitely be on this bandwagon. :D
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OK, I stuffed the parts into the collette.
I'm getting a good signal out, no hum, but I'm getting some annoying "rushing" or "wind" type noises. I think those are problems due to small currents, eg., solder flux, etc.
I have to get more serious about cleaning the parts and putting conformal coating on them. I've also redesigned the circuit to reduce the # of parts inside the collette.
So, this is going to take some messing around. I'm sure I can get it working, but it is not so easy as I thought...
Richard
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Is there a TRUE waiting list for these if they work out?
-Kevin
I would think there would be an instant market for these cables, after all the 480 is "probably" the most widely used mid level mic among live music tapers and most of us would instantly lose the bodies if we could
-
Is there a TRUE waiting list for these if they work out?
-Kevin
I would think there would be an instant market for these cables, after all the 480 is "probably" the most widely used mid level mic among live music tapers and most of us would instantly lose the bodies if we could
Mid Level by price Maybe... they're world class performers! ;)
I can't think of anyone running 480's aside from a few Studio engineers that would NOT be interested in this project. Foolproof stereo setup instantly ala Kwon Bar or similar... heck yeah!
{post corrected}
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Is there a TRUE waiting list for these if they work out?
-Kevin
I would think there would be an instant market for these cables, after all the 480 is "probably" the most widely used mid level mic among live music tapers and most of us would instantly lose the bodies if we could
Mid Level by price Maybe... they're world class performers! ;)
I can't think of anyone running 480's aside from Studio engineers that would be interested in this project. Foolproof stereo setup instantly ala Kwon Bar or similar... heck yeah!
perhaps, but among members here, and on datheads, and laptoptapers, and the multitude of other sites, and ebay, there should be hundreds of interested buyers I would think
-
Is there a TRUE waiting list for these if they work out?
-Kevin
I would think there would be an instant market for these cables, after all the 480 is "probably" the most widely used mid level mic among live music tapers and most of us would instantly lose the bodies if we could
Mid Level by price Maybe... they're world class performers! ;)
I can't think of anyone running 480's aside from Studio engineers that wouldn't be interested in this project. Foolproof stereo setup instantly ala Kwon Bar or similar... heck yeah!
perhaps, but among members here, and on datheads, and laptoptapers, and the multitude of other sites, and ebay, there should be hundreds of interested buyers I would think
I think he meant "woundn't" maybe?
-
Is there a TRUE waiting list for these if they work out?
-Kevin
I would think there would be an instant market for these cables, after all the 480 is "probably" the most widely used mid level mic among live music tapers and most of us would instantly lose the bodies if we could
Mid Level by price Maybe... they're world class performers! ;)
I can't think of anyone running 480's aside from Studio engineers that wouldn't be interested in this project. Foolproof stereo setup instantly ala Kwon Bar or similar... heck yeah!
perhaps, but among members here, and on datheads, and laptoptapers, and the multitude of other sites, and ebay, there should be hundreds of interested buyers I would think
I think he meant "woundn't" maybe?
yep, shit, my bad, thanks and +T
-
Is there a TRUE waiting list for these if they work out?
-Kevin
I would think there would be an instant market for these cables, after all the 480 is "probably" the most widely used mid level mic among live music tapers and most of us would instantly lose the bodies if we could
Mid Level by price Maybe... they're world class performers! ;)
I can't think of anyone running 480's aside from Studio engineers that wouldn't be interested in this project. Foolproof stereo setup instantly ala Kwon Bar or similar... heck yeah!
perhaps, but among members here, and on datheads, and laptoptapers, and the multitude of other sites, and ebay, there should be hundreds of interested buyers I would think
I think he meant "woundn't" maybe?
yep, shit, my bad, thanks and +T
Actually that would be MY bad.
Good god what is it about this board that makes me type funny.
-
Is there a TRUE waiting list for these if they work out?
-Kevin
I would think there would be an instant market for these cables, after all the 480 is "probably" the most widely used mid level mic among live music tapers and most of us would instantly lose the bodies if we could
I WANT MY BODIES!!!!! :)
-
Is there a TRUE waiting list for these if they work out?
-Kevin
I would think there would be an instant market for these cables, after all the 480 is "probably" the most widely used mid level mic among live music tapers and most of us would instantly lose the bodies if we could
I WANT MY BODIES!!!!! :)
Me too...
-
Is there a TRUE waiting list for these if they work out?
-Kevin
I would think there would be an instant market for these cables, after all the 480 is "probably" the most widely used mid level mic among live music tapers and most of us would instantly lose the bodies if we could
I would definately want the option of keeping the bodies in the chain. But at this point... whatever can work.
I WANT MY BODIES!!!!! :)
Me too...
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bodies or no bodies for me depends on sound
if a active set up came out but didn't have the same sound i would prob stick to the bodies - thats why i like the idea of having a active cable but still needing the bodies
if you had a active cable that ran into a box the sound might be better/worse/same but with the bodies you know exactly what you are getting
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bodies or no bodies for me depends on sound
if a active set up came out but didn't have the same sound i would prob stick to the bodies - thats why i like the idea of having a active cable but still needing the bodies
if you had a active cable that ran into a box the sound might be better/worse/same but with the bodies you know exactly what you are getting
I am making a setup *without* bodies. I don't have bodies, and I don't want to pay for them!
Richard
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Are the diaphragms/ capsules for microphones, like the C-480's, all made from a few manufacturers, like the electret capsules ???
Does AKG make their own capsules and or microphone diaphragms?
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Are the diaphragms/ capsules for microphones, like the C-480's, all made from a few manufacturers, like the electret capsules ???
Does AKG make their own capsules and or microphone diaphragms?
As far as I know, the big manufacturers (Neumann, Scheops, AKG, etc) all make their own capsules. Some manufacturers, like AT may have things made for them, and only them.
If you look at some cheaper stuff, like Studio Projects, ADK, Rode, etc, those are made in China, for a number of people. The key with these is quality control, and one expects those bigger companies to have it. Not the cheaper ones like Apex, Behringer, etc. Those are probably the same Chinese mics, but a crap shoot.
As for electrets, those are made by many companies, like Primo, Transsound, and many many others.
This is all discussed on the Yahoo group "micbuilders". Both circuits and sources can be found there. I've learnt most of my stuff (3-wire, FET circuits, etc) over there too...
Richard
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Richard, excellent work! Things are looking really close, it'll be nice not to be the only one (?) running ck6x caps with active cables. We need more AKG stealth/fob/low-pro rigs going. ;D
If your design is body-less, are you making some kind of gain available in your battery box? If not, does that mean these are pretty low output, or is the output level/sensitivity pretty typical?
bodies or no bodies for me depends on sound
if a active set up came out but didn't have the same sound i would prob stick to the bodies - thats why i like the idea of having a active cable but still needing the bodies
if you had a active cable that ran into a box the sound might be better/worse/same but with the bodies you know exactly what you are getting
I really think people will find that no matter what -- actives without bodies or using the 480 bodies -- there will be a change in sound, however subtle. Neumann claims to use the same capsules and electronics in the 184s as in the 140s, presumably meaning the same microphone amplifier circuit. But the circuit design changes needed to make the 140s allow active cables leads to subtle, but noticeable differences in the sound between the two.
Even using the 480 bodies, by adding the electronics that are part of the actives, the sound of the new system is likely to change somewhat. The capsules themselves are responsible for a lot of the AKG sound, so that will remain. But I'd imagine a "480" active system, bodies or not, will not sound exactly the same. My JKLabs ECMS system definitely sounds a bit different than the 480 system it replaced (though it doesn't use 480 bodies, so those differences might be more pronounced).
-
I've heard enough of Todds recordings to know that they have that AKG sound. We've never been able to do a proper comparision, but I do know that the active set-up he has sounds very good.
-
Richard, excellent work! Things are looking really close, it'll be nice not to be the only one (?) running ck6x caps with active cables. We need more AKG stealth/fob/low-pro rigs going. ;D
If your design is body-less, are you making some kind of gain available in your battery box? If not, does that mean these are pretty low output, or is the output level/sensitivity pretty typical?
does this mean yours has gain Todd? just intersted as I have never seen one...
from my earlier questions posted, and Berg's reply...I believe he said the battery provides the power, but the gain is still applied through the preamp. From a "I have never stealthed" perspective....is this typical?
thanx for this thread!!! so much learning..so little time ;D
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I really don't know if my ECMS box has any gain or not. It does not have gain in our traditional sense of being a mic pre-amp. And I'll preface that I really don't know anything about mic design, but I thought that mic bodies provided an initial amount of gain for the mic capsules. Some manufacturers refer to their mic bodies as the mic pre-amps.
This is not the same terminology we use when we talk about external mic preamps, which are used to bring mic level signals up to line level for use with A/Ds, etc. I _think_ that mic bodies generally provide some level of gain to bring the signal coming from the capsule up to typical mic output levels.
That said, my ECMS box+active cables+capsules has about the same "mic" output as my 480/ck6x mic set up did. That's why I was asking Richard whether there is any level of gain in his system. I know he isn't planning gain in the traditional mic preamp to line level sense, but I was curious if there was no gain whatsoever whether that means the mic output is unusually low.
-
I really don't know if my ECMS box has any gain or not. It does not have gain in our traditional sense of being a mic pre-amp. And I'll preface that I really don't know anything about mic design, but I thought that mic bodies provided an initial amount of gain for the mic capsules. Some manufacturers refer to their mic bodies as the mic pre-amps.
This is not the same terminology we use when we talk about external mic preamps, which are used to bring mic level signals up to line level for use with A/Ds, etc. I _think_ that mic bodies generally provide some level of gain to bring the signal coming from the capsule up to typical mic output levels.
That said, my ECMS box+active cables+capsules has about the same "mic" output as my 480/ck6x mic set up did. That's why I was asking Richard whether there is any level of gain in his system. I know he isn't planning gain in the traditional mic preamp to line level sense, but I was curious if there was no gain whatsoever whether that means the mic output is unusually low.
Mic bodies don't provide gain in the typical sense. They merely buffer/strengthen the existing signal so it can drive a balanced cable and a low impedance preamp input. There are typically two buffers in the mic body. The first is the FET (field effect transistor) right at the capsule. This strengthens the extremely weak signal from the capsule. The second is the a line driver transistor(s) or a transformer, or both. This drives the balanced cable.
What I am doing is the former only, ie., the FET. There is no line driver and certainly no preamp. The output impedance will be high (eg., 10k), just like the battery boxes we all use for electret mics.
I'll leave it up to others if they want to add stuff, either a line driver or a preamp stage.
Richard
PS: I'll be away for the next week. Then I will return to experimenting. I think I know the (noise) problem now. I just need some time to fix it.
-
I really don't know if my ECMS box has any gain or not. It does not have gain in our traditional sense of being a mic pre-amp.
does your battery box have gain control knobs???
-
I really don't know if my ECMS box has any gain or not. It does not have gain in our traditional sense of being a mic pre-amp.
does your battery box have gain control knobs???
No gain, no filtering. Just a straight box. I always use units (MD, UA5, Presonus, etc) with gain controls on them....
Richard
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I really don't know if my ECMS box has any gain or not. It does not have gain in our traditional sense of being a mic pre-amp.
does your battery box have gain control knobs???
No gain, no filtering. Just a straight box. I always use units (MD, UA5, Presonus, etc) with gain controls on them....
Richard
that inquiry was actually directed at Todd and his JK Labs box, Richard
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Thanks, Richard! That makes sense.
grider -- no, I've got no knobs on my ECMS. As I said, no gain in our traditional sense. It probably has the FET and line drivers Richard mentions (and it sends a balanced signal).
-
thanks for the input todd and tim
i ment to say a large difference in sound would sway me one way or the other
with that said i have heard a decent amount of jklab akg recordings and can't tell much difference between them and ones with full bodies
i never really saw a box live and payed much attn to it, but from the looks of it with the AA Battery next to it, its much smaller then i imagined, which is a good thing
again huge props to richard for his work as well
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Just a bit of caution here with this project as I know several folks working on several different options for the AKG capsules.
If you are looking for an active solution that will sound just like your 480's it is not going to happen. If you want something that has a familiar AKG sound then yes that is attainable but not an exact copy.
-
Mic bodies don't provide gain in the typical sense. They merely buffer/strengthen the existing signal so it can drive a balanced cable and a low impedance preamp input. There are typically two buffers in the mic body. The first is the FET (field effect transistor) right at the capsule. This strengthens the extremely weak signal from the capsule. The second is the a line driver transistor(s) or a transformer, or both. This drives the balanced cable.
What I am doing is the former only, ie., the FET. There is no line driver and certainly no preamp. The output impedance will be high (eg., 10k), just like the battery boxes we all use for electret mics.
I'll leave it up to others if they want to add stuff, either a line driver or a preamp stage.
Richard
Richard...rock on man....unbelievable work.
the bold part above....is that what the box is that tim linked? and then the cap in the pictures is what richard has given the schematics too?
thanx guys
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OK, I got a prototype working!!!
The "wooshing/scratching" noise was due to a poor connection to the mic capsule. Now I can hear everything loud and clear and there is no hum or other noise. Just a bit of self-noise, probably due to my preamp (my Minidisc!).
So, now I have the parts soldered to a (very small) circuit board and inside the collette. Next I have to encase the whole thing in epoxy, and build a battery box on the other end. I'll probably have to do some adjustments to make sure the FET is "centered" on the right voltage for optimal response. But it is looking great so far.
I'll return to this next week...
Richard
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OK, I got a prototype working!!!
The "wooshing/scratching" noise was due to a poor connection to the mic capsule. Now I can hear everything loud and clear and there is no hum or other noise. Just a bit of self-noise, probably due to my preamp (my Minidisc!).
So, now I have the parts soldered to a (very small) circuit board and inside the collette. Next I have to encase the whole thing in epoxy, and build a battery box on the other end. I'll probably have to do some adjustments to make sure the FET is "centered" on the right voltage for optimal response. But it is looking great so far.
I'll return to this next week...
Richard
I wonder about stuff like the way the capsules connect to the collettes. That connection could be difficult to make work correctly and present to be a problem. It seems most every mic manufacturer has their own way to ensure good contact. Also, is the capsule/ collette junction a part of the resonator or, is all that "tuning" done in the capsule?
I for one am psyched about this! Thanks a bunch Richard! +T
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OK, I got a prototype working!!!
The "wooshing/scratching" noise was due to a poor connection to the mic capsule. Now I can hear everything loud and clear and there is no hum or other noise. Just a bit of self-noise, probably due to my preamp (my Minidisc!).
So, now I have the parts soldered to a (very small) circuit board and inside the collette. Next I have to encase the whole thing in epoxy, and build a battery box on the other end. I'll probably have to do some adjustments to make sure the FET is "centered" on the right voltage for optimal response. But it is looking great so far.
I'll return to this next week...
Richard
Were you able to get it onto a single layer of a circuit board (even if you had to use both sides) rather than a couple of layers
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Great work Richard. +T
Joe
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Great work Richard. +T
Joe
agreed, awesome bro!
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OK, I'm still stuck on the mechanical issues.
In particular, I need a good way to connect to the center pin of the capsule. Does anyone know how the JKlabs ones are done? I tried a 1mm crimp, from a DB25 type computer cable, but this is not reliable. I need something that I can embed in epoxy at the end of the collette.
I'm *almost* ready to just hard wire/solder/glue-tape my stuff right next to the cable.
Also, I'll probably be taking a break from this due to classes starting and also some more shows to tape in the fall.
So, any mechanical solutions, post here or PM.
Thanks,
Richard
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I now have a digital camera and can take some pics of my JK box. If that would help, let me know. This is the box with adjustable gain versus fixed/no gain.
Charlie
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As I recall, the active head on my JKLabs setup has a very small metal tube attached upright to a round piece of circuit board material and permanently epoxied inside the head/colette. The ck6x capsule pin inserts into the center of this small tube when the capsule is screwed on.
I'm pretty sure there are pictures of the inside of the active heads that were posted along with pics of the rest of my JKLabs system. I think the links to the thread with these pics is somewhere earlier in this thread.
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I now have a digital camera and can take some pics of my JK box. If that would help, let me know. This is the box with adjustable gain versus fixed/no gain.
Charlie
I can do the same for my 460>ck1x equipment
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I now have a digital camera and can take some pics of my JK box. If that would help, let me know. This is the box with adjustable gain versus fixed/no gain.
Charlie
I can do the same for my 460>ck1x equipment
Thanks for the offers guys. If you get a chance, I'd really like to understand how that center pin is fitted. There seem to be two possibilities. One is to have a socket to fit it, and push just a little bit up. There is some spring in the pin. Another way it to have a crimp of some sort in the socket.
Anyway, I got fed up last night and just hardwired to the capsule. I guess it was the medication (???) I took, made me see things in a new light :). All I did was wedge a thin copper wire between the capsule metal and the plastic insert. That connects to the body. I put another wire under the nut that holds the center pin. In the process I clumsily dissassembled the capsule. There is really not much there at all! Just a gold (?) diaphragm, a backplate with holes, and some kind of opening in the back. This is a single unit mounted on plastic, soldered to a spring, plus a metal sheet/grille in the front of the capsule, and a separator ring.
Anyway, all the parts near the capsule are worth $20 max, so I'm just going to glue-tape it up and cover wth copper foil.
I'll report with gruesome pics in a few weeks.
Richard
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I now have a digital camera and can take some pics of my JK box. If that would help, let me know. This is the box with adjustable gain versus fixed/no gain.
Charlie
I can do the same for my 460>ck1x equipment
Thanks for the offers guys. If you get a chance, I'd really like to understand how that center pin is fitted. There seem to be two possibilities. One is to have a socket to fit it, and push just a little bit up. There is some spring in the pin. Another way it to have a crimp of some sort in the socket.
Anyway, I got fed up last night and just hardwired to the capsule. I guess it was the medication (???) I took, made me see things in a new light :). All I did was wedge a thin copper wire between the capsule metal and the plastic insert. That connects to the body. I put another wire under the nut that holds the center pin. In the process I clumsily dissassembled the capsule. There is really not much there at all! Just a gold (?) diaphragm, a backplate with holes, and some kind of opening in the back. This is a single unit mounted on plastic, soldered to a spring, plus a metal sheet/grille in the front of the capsule, and a separator ring.
Anyway, all the parts near the capsule are worth $20 max, so I'm just going to glue-tape it up and cover wth copper foil.
I'll report with gruesome pics in a few weeks.
Richard
Wow, you've got balls man... taking apart a brand new cap like that.... good work!
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Richard is a warrior and fears no disassembly! >:D I'm not even a 460/480 owner and I'm real excited about this.
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Why not use a metal tap soldered to your circuit board then encased in epoxy with just the tab sticking out like they do on many mics. Would that work? Also a spring could be used you could coat the top of the sping in silver solder for good contact. or use a conductive lube on the tip of the spring. Let me know if you need a source for the conductive paste. I use it in recording consoles that have bad insert jacks.
I now have a digital camera and can take some pics of my JK box. If that would help, let me know. This is the box with adjustable gain versus fixed/no gain.
Charlie
I can do the same for my 460>ck1x equipment
Thanks for the offers guys. If you get a chance, I'd really like to understand how that center pin is fitted. There seem to be two possibilities. One is to have a socket to fit it, and push just a little bit up. There is some spring in the pin. Another way it to have a crimp of some sort in the socket.
Anyway, I got fed up last night and just hardwired to the capsule. I guess it was the medication (???) I took, made me see things in a new light :). All I did was wedge a thin copper wire between the capsule metal and the plastic insert. That connects to the body. I put another wire under the nut that holds the center pin. In the process I clumsily dissassembled the capsule. There is really not much there at all! Just a gold (?) diaphragm, a backplate with holes, and some kind of opening in the back. This is a single unit mounted on plastic, soldered to a spring, plus a metal sheet/grille in the front of the capsule, and a separator ring.
Anyway, all the parts near the capsule are worth $20 max, so I'm just going to glue-tape it up and cover wth copper foil.
I'll report with gruesome pics in a few weeks.
Richard
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Why not use a metal tap soldered to your circuit board then encased in epoxy with just the tab sticking out like they do on many mics. Would that work? Also a spring could be used you could coat the top of the sping in silver solder for good contact. or use a conductive lube on the tip of the spring. Let me know if you need a source for the conductive paste. I use it in recording consoles that have bad insert jacks.
I now have a digital camera and can take some pics of my JK box. If that would help, let me know. This is the box with adjustable gain versus fixed/no gain.
Charlie
I can do the same for my 460>ck1x equipment
Thanks for the offers guys. If you get a chance, I'd really like to understand how that center pin is fitted. There seem to be two possibilities. One is to have a socket to fit it, and push just a little bit up. There is some spring in the pin. Another way it to have a crimp of some sort in the socket.
Anyway, I got fed up last night and just hardwired to the capsule. I guess it was the medication (???) I took, made me see things in a new light :). All I did was wedge a thin copper wire between the capsule metal and the plastic insert. That connects to the body. I put another wire under the nut that holds the center pin. In the process I clumsily dissassembled the capsule. There is really not much there at all! Just a gold (?) diaphragm, a backplate with holes, and some kind of opening in the back. This is a single unit mounted on plastic, soldered to a spring, plus a metal sheet/grille in the front of the capsule, and a separator ring.
Anyway, all the parts near the capsule are worth $20 max, so I'm just going to glue-tape it up and cover wth copper foil.
I'll report with gruesome pics in a few weeks.
Richard
Yeah, Chris might have something there.
A strip of (springy) conductive metal, bent, so it can push against the pin on the capsules...
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well I have taken a slew of very detailed shots of my ck1x caps, the mk46 active cables' lemo connectors and 460 body connectors, and I can share them here if I can figure out how to reduce their pic size, photos are very detailed and should help move this project along
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here is a good shot of female end of 460 body and male connector from mk46 active cable connector
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another of the mk46 connector into the 460 body
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and lastly, one of the lemo connection on the back of the ck1x capsule and the end of the mk46 active cable, I have many of these pics if anyone would like to see more of them, if so pm me
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Anyone have a broken A61 sitting around? I would love to try and take one apart to see what is inside. I've been trying to find a cheap one or a VR61 extension tube to take apart and screw around with.
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so has anyone been in contact with the maker of the nbox to see about making an akg version of the nbox ???
anyone have his info? isnt his name nick?
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so has anyone been in contact with the maker of the nbox to see about making an akg version of the nbox ???
anyone have his info? isnt his name nick?
I don't know about the other projects, but I'm still dragging my feet on my project. I've been pretty busy this (fall) term and, well, I bought and hacked an R4, and oh yeah, I taped a lot of shows too...
Richard
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so has anyone been in contact with the maker of the nbox to see about making an akg version of the nbox ???
anyone have his info? isnt his name nick?
I don't know about the other projects, but I'm still dragging my feet on my project. I've been pretty busy this (fall) term and, well, I bought and hacked an R4, and oh yeah, I taped a lot of shows too...
Richard
oh i wasnt trying to rush anyone, just didnt know if anyone had contacted the nbox maker to see if he could do a prototype or something of sorts :)
I def appreciate all of the work you are doing too Richard and hope that someday we can see the fruits of everyones efforts :)
why did jon have to go MIA ??? does anything think he got killed? maybe he ripped the wrong person off ???
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I don't know the frist thing about making any thing like this but how hard would it be to make a box that could run any set of caps. Like the mbho, mg, schoeps and so on. That way you would just have to chang the cable and you could use the caps that you like. I would think that all mic are the same on the inside. ???
-Brian
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Well the thing that seems to differ in terms of the schoeps vs. the other caps mentioned is that the Schoeps have a seperate conductor on the capsule for polarization. AKG, MBHO,MG and others have only one contact and ground. Richard where did you source the 1 Gig resistors you used? I asssume you are using those to strip the 50-60 volts to polarize the capsule, correct me if I'm wrong.
Thanks,
Nick
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Well the thing that seems to differ in terms of the schoeps vs. the other caps mentioned is that the Schoeps have a seperate conductor on the capsule for polarization. AKG, MBHO,MG and others have only one contact and ground. Richard where did you source the 1 Gig resistors you used? I asssume you are using those to strip the 50-60 volts to polarize the capsule, correct me if I'm wrong.
Thanks,
Nick
1G resistors are from Digikey.com. Something like $3 to $5 each. I need two per capsule. All in all, the parts are not expensive. And, yes, it should be possible to run any cap on the end. Provided you've got a good physical and electrical connection to the capsule. At this point I'm leaning towards a "hard" connection to the capsule for reliability, but anything is possible.
Richard
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I searched high and low at digi key and could not come up with that value. Any chance you have a part # available?
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Richard, are you using the famous Schoeps circuit or a variant, like one of the Dorsey circuits?
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Richard, are you using the famous Schoeps circuit or a variant, like one of the Dorsey circuits?
I'm using a very simple "battery box" circuit. The Scheops circuit has a balanced output with a pair of transistors. I'm not using that, although it is certainly possible.
My schematic is here:
www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/ck63_schematic.jpg
The "prototype" is here:
www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/ck63_prototype.jpg
(the big black parcel is six 9V batteries in series to generate the polarization voltage!)
I have not made any more progress on this, due to busy times at work and a lot of shows to tape! I experimented with some collettes, but decided I need to make a "hard" attachment to the mic capsule for a reliable connection.
Richard
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I searched high and low at digi key and could not come up with that value. Any chance you have a part # available?
try 1000M
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I searched high and low at digi key and could not come up with that value. Any chance you have a part # available?
try 1000M
Yeah, when I Dorsey moded Oktava MC012's, that's what I used.
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I searched high and low at digi key and could not come up with that value. Any chance you have a part # available?
try 1000M
Yeah, when I Dorsey moded Oktava MC012's, that's what I used.
1 gigaohm is the best value for that resistor :) thats what they all use. Dale makes that part they are about $5.50 each in a 1% metal film
and Digikey does sell them.
Chris Church
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bump... any progress updates from the nbox camp?
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bump... any progress updates from the nbox camp?
would love to hear about positive results as well...Last I spoke with Nick (via PM's) around Thanksgiving time, he was hoping to have a solution by the end of the year.
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bump... any progress updates from the nbox camp?
would love to hear about positive results as well...Last I spoke with Nick (via PM's) around Thanksgiving time, he was hoping to have a solution by the end of the year.
I've been talking to Richard about getting his prototype going (mostly mechanical issues dealing with the cap/collette connection at this point), but if Nick is nearly ready and will be offering these up in the near future, maybe it's not worth the trouble... although it would be fun to get running.
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I'm pretty electronically inept here...but I do have an AKG C 451 that I can pull the insides of the mic out too readily...I'll see if I can post a picture later but it appears that the section where the cap connects with the body is only connected by one or two copper wires to the PCB board...couldn't one extend these copper wires? or do we loose too much juice doing that?
attached is a picture I found on the net...the capsule attaches to the board by just a couple of copper wires...
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I think the 480 is a very different beast ...
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I think the 480 is a very different beast ...
perhaps...but I'm sure the answer lies in the 460's....
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I think the 480 is a very different beast ...
perhaps...but I'm sure the answer lies in the 460's....
The "answer" is just what I (and others) have shown in schematics, innards, parts lists, etc.
There should be one or two FETs (transistors) inside the "collette" that joins the capsule, then a wire to a remote "battery box" that somehow provides 60V to polarize the capsule.
My preliminary schematic is at:
www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/ck63_schematic.jpg
The difficult part (for me) is getting a good mechanical and electrical contact at the capsule. A second issue is getting a 60V power source. I've cheated for now and just used a bunch of 9V batteries in series. The proper thing is an oscillator/transformer pair, which is shown in the AKG service schematics for AKG 460 and 480 mics.
Oh yeah, I checked with MBHO, they sell a collette+cable for $175 each. This should have FETs in it, and fit their (relatively) inexpensive caps. Hmm. I wonder, would it fit the AKGs? Anyone have specs on the MBHO caps?
Richard
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I think the 480 is a very different beast ...
perhaps...but I'm sure the answer lies in the 460's....
The "answer" is just what I (and others) have shown in schematics, innards, parts lists, etc.
There should be one or two FETs (transistors) inside the "collette" that joins the capsule, then a wire to a remote "battery box" that somehow provides 60V to polarize the capsule.
My preliminary schematic is at:
www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/ck63_schematic.jpg
The difficult part (for me) is getting a good mechanical and electrical contact at the capsule. A second issue is getting a 60V power source. I've cheated for now and just used a bunch of 9V batteries in series. The proper thing is an oscillator/transformer pair, which is shown in the AKG service schematics for AKG 460 and 480 mics.
Oh yeah, I checked with MBHO, they sell a collette+cable for $175 each. This should have FETs in it, and fit their (relatively) inexpensive caps. Hmm. I wonder, would it fit the AKGs? Anyone have specs on the MBHO caps?
Richard
i think the MBHO actives connect via lemo connector
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I think the 480 is a very different beast ...
perhaps...but I'm sure the answer lies in the 460's....
The "answer" is just what I (and others) have shown in schematics, innards, parts lists, etc.
There should be one or two FETs (transistors) inside the "collette" that joins the capsule, then a wire to a remote "battery box" that somehow provides 60V to polarize the capsule.
My preliminary schematic is at:
www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~mannr/AKG/ck63_schematic.jpg
The difficult part (for me) is getting a good mechanical and electrical contact at the capsule. A second issue is getting a 60V power source. I've cheated for now and just used a bunch of 9V batteries in series. The proper thing is an oscillator/transformer pair, which is shown in the AKG service schematics for AKG 460 and 480 mics.
Oh yeah, I checked with MBHO, they sell a collette+cable for $175 each. This should have FETs in it, and fit their (relatively) inexpensive caps. Hmm. I wonder, would it fit the AKGs? Anyone have specs on the MBHO caps?
Richard
i think the MBHO actives connect via lemo connector
Yup, they do, but maybe their cables could be hacked.... a lot of money to spend to hack shit apart though.
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i think the MBHO actives connect via lemo connector
4 pin mini xlr to be exact.
and i dont think that akg caps would fit on a mbho collette....
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Ok, if anyone has access to a machine shop and possibly brass tubing to use for collettes, talk to me and I can draw up some mechanical drawings to get rolling on this for Richard. I have an idea for the pin contact involving a BNC jack.
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BNC jack is an interesting idea!
How firmly does the socket grab the pin? Just wondering if it will scratch the pin up while being screwed on (the MGs screw on, not sure about AKG).
FWIW, in the case of MGs the lone pin makes contact just on the tip. The body has a spring loaded pad. So that is another possible option.
Yeah, that's another option I was considering... I'll see what I can figure out with old parts in my place.
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Looks like I won't have time after all over the holidays to figure out the mechanical aspects of this project. If we could get an update from ChrisK or Nick from the schoeps nbox project, that would be great...
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making some headway.
akg prototype is working well. need to test drive it in the field. and the kinks are being worked out on the gefell prototype.
i'll post more in a little while and with pics. stay tuned. :)
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making some headway.
akg prototype is working well. need to test drive it in the field. and the kinks are being worked out on the gefell prototype.
i'll post more in a little while and with pics. stay tuned. :)
Excellent+++++++++!
Keep us posted, schematics and/or pics...
Richard
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making some headway.
akg prototype is working well. need to test drive it in the field. and the kinks are being worked out on the gefell prototype.
i'll post more in a little while and with pics. stay tuned. :)
Is this on an Nbox type of thing or on active cables?
EDIT: I re-read this thread and see that they have been working on a type of NBox
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That's GREAT news John! Looking forward to the pics/info...
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awesome fellas :)
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well, we're going back to the machinist for some tweaks on the colletes. we are trying to make the collettes compatible with the schoeps accessories (clips, vark bar etc).
also we need to make the collettes a little lighter in overall mass. machinist was concerned about durability where we are explaining it is a precision instrument and will be well taken care of. furthermore, we will need a bit more room inside the collette for the electronic components.
i was told that once it is to our satisfaction , that the final collette measurements will be entered into the machinists computer and he will be able to recall the saved specs, hit a button, and make a run of 25-30 collettes at a time. this should eventually save some time and cost.
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well, we're tgoing back to the machinist for some tweaks on the colletes. we are trying to make the collettes compatible with the schoeps accessories (clips, vark bar etc).
also we need to make the collettes a little lighter in overall mass. machinist was concerned about durability where we are explaining it is a precision instrument and will be well taken care of. furthermore, we will need a bit more room inside the collette for the electronic components.
i was that told once it is too our satisfaction , that the final collette measurements will be entered into the machinists computer and he will be able to recall the saved specs, hit a buttn, and make a run of 25-30 collettes at a time. this should eventually save some time and cost.
grea++T work.
so, how are you going to deal with the center pin? Is that part of the collette design? That is the main problem I had.
Richard
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i was told that once it is to our satisfaction , that the final collette measurements will be entered into the machinists computer and he will be able to recall the saved specs, hit a button, and make a run of 25-30 collettes at a time. this should eventually save some time and cost.
I can donate some $$$ if needed for that.
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i was told that once it is to our satisfaction , that the final collette measurements will be entered into the machinists computer and he will be able to recall the saved specs, hit a button, and make a run of 25-30 collettes at a time. this should eventually save some time and cost.
Indeed.. Once the design is settled an auto chucking CNC lathe will bang collettes out like no tomorrow at very low cost.
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i was told that once it is to our satisfaction , that the final collette measurements will be entered into the machinists computer and he will be able to recall the saved specs, hit a button, and make a run of 25-30 collettes at a time. this should eventually save some time and cost.
Indeed.. Once the design is settled an auto chucking CNC lathe will bang collettes out like no tomorrow at very low cost.
awesome news fellas!
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I assume these collettes are brass? Anybody know a good powdercoater?
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I know mark powder coats his markbars himself. How that would translate to this I don't know.
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Are the new collets made to fit into the popular active bars? If they are sized to fit into the Schoeps ortf bar or similair, that would be a bonus.
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Are the new collets made to fit into the popular active bars? If they are sized to fit into the Schoeps ortf bar or similair, that would be a bonus.
well, we're going back to the machinist for some tweaks on the colletes. we are trying to make the collettes compatible with the schoeps accessories (clips, vark bar etc).
;)
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wow, this is all great to hear... eventually it would be great to hear a side by side comparison of this setup vs. standard 480/460/mod460 bodies, etc etc
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I assume these collettes are brass? Anybody know a good powdercoater?
We have a whole line. I can get em done free.
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collettes made for free or powdercoated for free? count me in either way.
+T
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My company has a powdercoat line. And I mean it's huge. We could do a whole Ford Explorer. It's that big. So ya I can get anything powdercoated.
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My company has a powdercoat line. And I mean it's huge. We could do a whole Ford Explorer. It's that big. So ya I can get anything powdercoated.
Sorry for the ignorance here, but what exactly is powdercoating... does it provide a more matte black finish to the brass?
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Powdercoating is a finishing similar to paint but more durable. The aplication process is different than paint and the parts are placed in an oven to cure the powder. The powder comes in all different colors but I'm assuming matt black is what would be used on these.
Joe
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An example of powder coating is your washer and dryer exterior. Prevents rust and oxidation which you would eventually get with brass/any metal exposed.
JNT...spot on about powdercoating! Plus t
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Thanks guys, that sounds awesome. This sounds like a real pro setup shaping up. Sign me up!
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Thanks guys, that sounds awesome. This sounds like a real pro setup shaping up. Sign me up!
ditto ;D
you guys rock!
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Is brass really the best choice? I'm concerned about corrosion and dissimilar cap metals.
The schoeps don't look like brass.. and I don't think the MGs are brass but I don't have them in front of me.
I'm not too worried about paint chipping because I just put heatshrink on everything except the capsules.
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Thanks guys, that sounds awesome. This sounds like a real pro setup shaping up. Sign me up!
it took you this long to sign up ;)
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Is brass really the best choice? I'm concerned about corrosion and dissimilar cap metals.
The schoeps don't look like brass.. and I don't think the MGs are brass but I don't have them in front of me.
I'm not too worried about paint chipping because I just put heatshrink on everything except the capsules.
Looks like the 480 bodies are brass:
(http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b82/tramsden/c480bmanualpage.jpg)
I know the jklabs active heads for the ck6x caps were brass, and I'm pretty sure my new milabs are brass as well. Doesn't seem like it should be a problem.
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Brass has been a common metal for microphone bodies for many moons.
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so, how are you going to deal with the center pin? Is that part of the collette design? That is the main problem I had.
Richard
no...not part of the collette design. nick found a bastardized video connector that works fine. that's also why more room is needed in the collette.
yes, these collettes are brass, and we have access to powdercoat
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Wow.... Totally off topic but I noticed we hit page 26. Didn't everything used to blow up at threads once they hit/got past page 25?
Anyway... I'm actively watching the progress of this thread. I wish I could help but I'm not that handy when it comes to anything more than screwing parts together and hooking up cables. If there is anything I can do to help let me know.
Dana
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I have a "yet-to-be-used" mk46 single cable I bought off ebay that I am not presently using since its a single, I can lend it to the experimenters in this thread if necessary, though I will need it back at some point, pm me if it would be of use in the manufacture of the collettes
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i would also be willing to support this project $$ wise to get it going. this is great, good work.
luke
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The recent news that Jon K has been in contact with some of his past clients is encouraging.
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,40094.180.html
Maybe we can get some info from him to get this project back up and running ???
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The recent news that Jon K has been in contact with some of his past clients is encouraging.
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,40094.180.html
Maybe we can get some info from him to get this project back up and running ???
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,80861.0.html
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hello i think it may interest some of you:
a used, perfect working order: AKG A61 is up on ebay .co.uk ;)