Topic: Tascam DR-40 vs Zoom H4N (and question on their internal capsules)

[LikeASong]

Hi there, tapers!

A friend of mine is terribly undecided on which recorder he should get. He's a sound ingeneer -to-be so he's pretty picky with what he thinks is good and what not. His budget ain't infinite, something around 250$ (fees not included). I've been giving me my opinions and we've finally got it down to these recorders on the subject: the Tascam DR-40 and the Zoom H4N, since he wants a recorder with configurable internal mics, with XLR inputs and phantom-power supplier.
He (and me too) is leaning slightly towards the Tascam, not only because it's almost 100$ cheaper, but also because all reviews and comparatives seem to be more positive than towards the H4N. He truly likes the dual recording mode at -12dB on the Tascam, but he also enjoys some of the features on the Zoom.

What do you think? It'd be amazing if some of you had used both recorders and could give your contrasted opinion on both.


Oh, and one last question: WHY do Tascam, Roland, Zoom, Sony, etc. NOT tell which capsules they mount on their internal mics or at least their specs? It's a nightmare! I couldn't care less about the capsules, but my friend is planning to record an audience feed plus an IEM feed of some shows and he'd definitely need to know which capsules they have. We've searched the net up and down and haven't found any info. Do any of you know it? (it's ok by personal message, if you prefer it).


Thanks a million 

[acidjack]

One of them has "Zoom" in the name and the other is made by a real audio manufacturer.  The H4N is designed mostly for people too lazy to use something else. I've seen countless neophytes show up at shows with one of these, explain to me how they're "recording the show" and then come begging for my recording after they make a horribly screwed up recording.

None of these manufacturers probably want to tell you much about the caps on their internals because a) their specs are awful, and b) the caps used in them aren't very good.  That said, many of the popular types of mic at the low budget range are based off of the same Panasonic WM61A and other capsules that are very inexpensive.  However, folks who know what they're doing modify them to work properly for what we do.  Manufacturers of portable recorders don't.

You can at least find out what the polar pattern of the internal capsules are pretty easily.  The H4Ns are, I believe, X/Y cardiods, which means you'd better point that deck at the sound source if you want it to sound right. I believe the Roland allows you to pick between omni and cardiod (?)

[hardrain62]

I assume you're talking about the Tascam DR-40, not the Roland. As you can tell from my forum signature, I like Tascam products and would definitely throw in my support for the DR-40 over the Zoom H4N. To be honest, I have never held nor used a DR-40, but if it is anything like my DR-100 or DR-680 (and I assume it is), it will be rugged and well-built with good to very good pres and a friendly interface. That being said, I'm with acidjack in saying that internal mics are almost useless if you're recording shows. I feel like the manufacturers of these units include them almost as a novelty, just like how a speaker is included on some units. The internal mics are fine for interviews or spoken word, but will likely not be where you want them to be for capturing music. But if you're still dead set on using them, you can configure the mic placement on the DR-40 but not on the H4N, which is locked into XY. I have handled an H4N, and just as with the H2 and original H4, I feel like if you look at it the wrong way, it's going to fall apart. For me personally, I find the build quality to be a little on the cheap side. Also, according to Tascam's web site, their internal mics are cardioid pattern.

[cybergaloot]

There is a thread elsewhere here about the DR-40. I just got one. It seems well enough built for the money.

Here's a song from Friday night recorded on the DR-40, Internal mics, X-Y, placed on a shelf behind the bar approx. centered with the stage, recorded at 48kHz/24 bit, dithered down to 44.1/16 but no other changes: http://yodaslai.ipower.com/bradfordvilleblues/media/TASCAM_0002S12.wav

[cybergaloot]

The other DR-40 thread: http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=148888.0

[cybergaloot]

BTW, I own a ZOOM H2 and it has held up quite well structurally despite comments to the contrary. I'm not about to throw it away even though it has taken a backseat to other recorders. It is true, you usually get what you pay for but if I'm not mistaken the DR-40 is cheaper than the H4N. I think the DR-40 is a bit smaller than the H4N but not a lot. It does seem to have some feature I could care less about like the speaker and some silly functions. It will even complain if you have one mic turned in and one out. BTW, there is no in between, they have to be set all the way X-Y or all the way out, which they call A-B (not my idea of A-B).

I ran a couple of tests this weekend on the internal mics which will probably be rarely used. I bought it for the XLR and 1/4 TRS inputs.

[LikeASong]

I assume you're talking about the Tascam DR-40, not the Roland

Absolutely. Sorry for the repeatitive mistake, I've edited it both in the title and the text. I was a lil bit saturated of work&info and got it messed-up. Thanks for correcting me


Thank you all for your feedback. My friend Daniel is definitely going to get the Tascam recorder, it's a great value for the low price it has. He's got an eBay deal for 150$+fees (coming from the USA), not bad


Regarding the capsules, ok, that's what I thought. They don't want the users to know which caps they use because they're basically crap. It makes sense. Nevertheless, I must say that I've recorded loud shows with my Zoom Q3HD internals and the sound came up surprisingly clear and undistorted all the times. Surely they don't sound like $4000 Schoeps', but they're decent and those recordings will be my backups just in case something goes wrong when I start recording with a lil more professional gear.

[cybergaloot]

If he's getting it from the eBay seller in San Diego he can expect a rapid delivery considering they use USPS. That guy was the lowest price I found at the time I ordered.

Chris Church told me what brand the mics the H2 uses. I can't quite recall the name other than it starts with a P.

[LikeASong]

Tascam bought and on the way. I'm jealous of my pal now  hahaha... Thank you all for your help!