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Author Topic: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System  (Read 20646 times)

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Offline nebulax

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Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« on: December 17, 2021, 10:02:02 PM »
So Neumann finally comes out with a electret condenser microphone. Wonder if it'll suitable for stealth mic use?

https://www.soundonsound.com/news/miniature-instrument-mics-neumann
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Offline fireonshakedwnstreet

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Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #1 on: December 17, 2021, 10:21:47 PM »
Interested in seeing the frequency response graph.
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Offline morst

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Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #2 on: December 18, 2021, 07:17:58 AM »
OMG I WANT TWO OF THEM.
If they suck I'll figure out what to do with them.
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Offline capnhook

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Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #3 on: December 18, 2021, 08:30:29 AM »
from that page:

On its own, a KK 14 capsule is set to cost €279, but Neumann are also introducing a large range of attachment and connection options, the latter including mini-XLR, 3.5mm jack, Lemo and MicroDot connectors, and the former comprising nine mounts for various instruments including brass, strings, piano and percussion. Complete sets comprising a capsule, a gooseneck, cables, an XLR adaptor, an instrument mount and a windshield are priced at €629.
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Offline Popmarter

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Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #4 on: December 18, 2021, 03:34:32 PM »
Looks nice, hope it can handle high rockconcert db's...

Found this on: https://www.thomann.de/gr/neumann_mcm_kk_14.htm

"Neumann MCM KK 14; capsule head of the Miniature Clip Microphone System MCM; electret technology; polar pattern: cardioid; max. SPL: 152 dB; native interfaces to most transmitter bodypacks (3.5 mm jack / MicroDot / Lemo / 4-pin mini-XLR); titanium housing"
« Last Edit: December 18, 2021, 03:45:26 PM by Popmarter »
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Offline heva

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Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #5 on: December 18, 2021, 05:18:28 PM »
Interesting it's numbered 14; related to sennheiser ke14 (Ambeo)?

Offline jbell

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Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #6 on: December 19, 2021, 11:54:48 AM »
Me too!  These look pretty sweet. I wonder when U.S. vendors will have them.

OMG I WANT TWO OF THEM.
If they suck I'll figure out what to do with them.
« Last Edit: December 19, 2021, 01:29:37 PM by jbell »
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Offline Fatah Ruark (aka MIKE B)

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Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #7 on: December 19, 2021, 06:20:34 PM »
Interesting they can terminated to microdot. I wonder if the DPA MMA-A can power them?
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Offline Popmarter

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Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #8 on: February 12, 2022, 04:47:11 PM »
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Offline WiFiJeff

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Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #9 on: February 14, 2022, 10:04:20 PM »
B&H has them up for pre-order, but the listing is light on specs.  The B&H summary mentions a 12mm diaphragm, while the article linked above mentions  something about 8mm.  The DPA 4006 etc. caps are about 18mm in diameter and can be powered by an MMA-A and DPA active cables.  It's not yet clear how much smaller the Neumann kk14 will be, nor what voltage will be needed for them.

Offline fireonshakedwnstreet

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Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #10 on: February 14, 2022, 10:59:54 PM »
Thanks for the link and frequency graph. These things look like the roll off A LOT of bass.
some pics on Instagram and this article

https://en.soundlightup.com/archives-3/reports/neumann-mcm-ein-stern-ist-geboren.html
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Offline DSatz

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Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #11 on: February 15, 2022, 02:03:54 AM »
That rolloff is typical of directional microphones designed for placement close to their sound sources. Neumann typically shows on-axis response at a 1-meter pickup distance. Other manufacturers may use shorter measurement distances (30 or even 15 cm).

The reason this matters so much is proximity effect. At 15 or 30 cm (ca. 6" - 12") it boosts the bass and midbass significantly across a wide range of frequencies. So if you plot a graph for such close placement (as DPA does, and Audio-Technica for some graphs), the graph may show full low frequency response--but at greater miking distances, that bass won't be there in nearly the amounts shown. It's not a small effect--it can very well be 10-12 dB of bass boost close up. If that boost is what creates flat low-frequency response at close range, you need to deduct that amount to understand what you will get for more distant pickup.

Consider the two graphs that I've attached, from two older, closely-related Neumann microphones (identical amplifiers; different capsules based on the same acoustical design). These curves were both made at a 1-meter distance (OK, actually they were almost certainly taken from farther away, then adjusted to approximate a 1-meter response--and obviously smoothed for presentation; all of that is typical practice). The point is that if you measured the KM 85 from 15 cm, where there's much more proximity effect than at 1 meter, its curve might look almost exactly like the KM 84's 1-meter curve. Then if you went by the curves and didn't consider measuring distances, you might buy the "speech cardioid" KM 85 without realizing that it was a microphone for close pickup, rather than a general-purpose studio cardioid.

Often we as consumers don't know how the manufacturer's curves were obtained. Even if we do know, how exactly does one convert a 15- or 30-cm curve into a 1-meter curve? There's no fixed formula. And even at one meter there is still some proximity effect. It's an industry-wide problem but it persists because the manufacturers don't seem interested in solving it--or more precisely, no one wants to be the first to show realistic performance curves at various distances, and thus risk losing customers to the other manufacturers who reveal less, and let consumers keep their illusions. When a manufacturer says that their microphone was designed mainly for a certain type of use, we should understand that it probably isn't equally good for other situations that have very different technical requirements.

(Pressure transducers don't have proximity effect--single-diaphragm omnidirectional microphones--but all directional microphones do have it to some extent.)

--WiFiJeff, the article seems to say that smaller diameters such as 8 mm were considered, but 12 mm was ultimately chosen. That dimension normally refers to the active area of the diaphragm (i.e. the part of the Mylar that gold is evaporated onto) rather than its entire physical size. 12 mm is only slightly smaller than average as the diameter of the active area for small-diaphragm condenser microphones.

--best regards
« Last Edit: October 02, 2023, 01:05:35 PM by DSatz »
music > microphones > a recorder of some sort

Offline DavidPuddy

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Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #12 on: February 15, 2022, 12:43:45 PM »
I wonder if the cable will be easily able to be separated from the gooseneck. I don't see any pictures of the mics without.
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Offline jbell

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Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #13 on: July 08, 2022, 03:35:45 PM »
Looks like you buy the caps and then the goose neck or a cable system for p48 adapters or minixlr's

I wonder if the cable will be easily able to be separated from the gooseneck. I don't see any pictures of the mics without.
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Offline Popmarter

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Re: Neumann KK 14 Miniature Clip Mic System
« Reply #14 on: July 17, 2022, 03:24:23 AM »
Has anyone tried this one yet? any more info on of it is useful to us?
Recorders: Zoom F3; SD MixPre 3 II; Sony A10; Edirol R44; Sony M10; Sony WM-D6; iRiver IHP-120; Sharp MD-MT20; Sharp MD-MT190
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Preamps: Beyerdynamic MV100; JK Laboratories DVC-X-17b; Naiant IPA; Nakamichi MX-100 modded for 9v battery use ; Baby Nbox

 

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