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Author Topic: SP-CMC-4U into a pocket camera?  (Read 670 times)

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Offline OrionMan

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SP-CMC-4U into a pocket camera?
« on: September 08, 2021, 12:07:16 AM »
So I finally ordered this mic today, with a battery pack.   I also got a Roland R-07 (may exchange for the back-orders Sony PCM-A10, but so far I'm liking the R-07).
My current pocket camera does not have a mic input, but one day I may upgrade it to the Sony RX100vii for better video, but it also has a mic input. 

Thant just makes me wonder. Would the 4U mic recordings sound as good or at least close to being as good with the Sony camera as with the recorders?

Offline DavidPuddy

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Re: SP-CMC-4U into a pocket camera?
« Reply #1 on: September 08, 2021, 08:36:37 AM »
Camera mic preamps are generally garbage. I wouldn't rely on using just the camera to record audio - Run the recorder line out to the camera input on line-in and you're good.

Also, the camera won't give the mics the voltage they need to run without brickwalling.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2021, 09:44:35 AM by DavidPuddy »
mk41/mk22 > CMC1L > Mixpre 6ii

Offline DSatz

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Re: SP-CMC-4U into a pocket camera?
« Reply #2 on: September 09, 2021, 04:09:54 PM »
A lot depends on whether the camera's menu lets you turn off ALC (automatic level control) for the microphone input or not. It's important to use manual level settings. Sony's better camcorders let you do that, but the RX100 VII may not, I don't know.

Also, the smaller body of a pocket camera may not dissipate heat well enough for continuous 4K video recording. If a show goes on longer than an hour or so, you may need to record HD rather than 4K. I seem to recall that the RX100 cameras that can record in 4K have this time limit, but I could be mistaken (mine is an RX100 III which doesn't offer 4K resolution, and anyway I only record very short videos with it, but I like it very much for still photography).
music > microphones > a recorder of some sort

Offline guitard

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Re: SP-CMC-4U into a pocket camera?
« Reply #3 on: September 10, 2021, 06:33:33 PM »
Also, the smaller body of a pocket camera may not dissipate heat well enough for continuous 4K video recording. If a show goes on longer than an hour or so, you may need to record HD rather than 4K.

I can't speak for any of the Sony cams, but my anecdotal experience with the Panasonic ZS100 point-and-shoot camera - I regularly shoot video in 4K for two hours plus.  I recently shot the opening act (50 mins) and the headliner (2 hrs 40 mins) at a show with the ZS100.  Of course, there was a break between bands.  This was outdoors in a stadium and it was in the low 90s when the first band took the stage; and probably in the 80s throughout much of the headliner's set.  I had no problems.
Mics: Schoeps MK41s
Pre-amps: BabyNbox & Platinum Nbox
Deck: Sony A10

Video: Sony FDR AX100 (4K), Pany ZS100 (4K) & Sony DSC HX50V (HD)
Photo: Canon EOS 60D

A/V software: Sony Vegas Pro 13.0 (build 453) 64 bit / DVD Architect Pro 6.0 (build 237)

Offline OrionMan

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Re: SP-CMC-4U into a pocket camera?
« Reply #4 on: September 10, 2021, 07:06:06 PM »
Camera mic preamps are generally garbage. I wouldn't rely on using just the camera to record audio - Run the recorder line out to the camera input on line-in and you're good.

Also, the camera won't give the mics the voltage they need to run without brickwalling.

Definitely I would be using the battery box with the mics and pocket camera.
I know that in general the preamps in cameras are not that great but couldn't find any real world experiences online.  Not even any comparisons between the Panasonic ZS100/200 and the RXV100VI/VII with just their internal mics.

My balls must be soft because the last 2 nights I was too afraid to bring a recorder in a clear bag but after the experience, I  think I would've been ok.  I did great at video, but the audio is so bad :(   
(Waiting for my mics and battery box to come in to use with my new recorder that I believe would be less problematic that my older recorder.)

So 2 nights ago I recorded with:
ZS100 internal mic (this one has no mic input)
My gf Samsung 10+ internal mic
10+ with an Sennheiser XS Lav

ZS100 distorted the least, so I used that
Cell phone's internal sounded the best but distorted (strange, because other shows ,where it was much louder, it didn't distort as much)
XS distorted the most (kinda surprised) so that is being returned.  I only got that as a backup and possibly for v-logging but not worth the $50

Some shows are general admin so we show up early to get in line to get the best view.  My gf can't always see the band if all the good spots are taken.  So in case I need to go back to the car, I'd rather take with me what I know will not be a problem...until my balls harden up.  So that's why I asked.

Offline OrionMan

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Re: SP-CMC-4U into a pocket camera?
« Reply #5 on: September 10, 2021, 07:24:14 PM »
A lot depends on whether the camera's menu lets you turn off ALC (automatic level control) for the microphone input or not. It's important to use manual level settings. Sony's better camcorders let you do that, but the RX100 VII may not, I don't know.

Also, the smaller body of a pocket camera may not dissipate heat well enough for continuous 4K video recording. If a show goes on longer than an hour or so, you may need to record HD rather than 4K. I seem to recall that the RX100 cameras that can record in 4K have this time limit, but I could be mistaken (mine is an RX100 III which doesn't offer 4K resolution, and anyway I only record very short videos with it, but I like it very much for still photography).

The Sony RX100VII definitely lets the user adjust audio levels.  I have to do some research to see if it lets you do it while recording (my Canon M50 doesn't let me do it during recording, but my Sony A6400 does).  Otherwise I would probably not get it and wait for a future model that does 4K60p.

VII also let's the user record much longer in 4K before overheating.  The models before would max out about 10-15 minutes but in comparison videos and reviews, this latest one lasted over 45 minutes.  But I never record more than 2 songs in a row.  Usually only 2 songs max for the entire show.  My Sony A6000 would sometimes shut down in just one song, and that onlu recorded in 1080! (Hence the upgrade to A6400). 

I usually record in 1080 anyway because I prefer 60p over 24/30p and use 4K if I need more reach. (Not many cameras out there with 4K 60P) In 4K I'll crop in during post.

Offline OrionMan

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Re: SP-CMC-4U into a pocket camera?
« Reply #6 on: September 10, 2021, 07:30:05 PM »
Also, the smaller body of a pocket camera may not dissipate heat well enough for continuous 4K video recording. If a show goes on longer than an hour or so, you may need to record HD rather than 4K.

I can't speak for any of the Sony cams, but my anecdotal experience with the Panasonic ZS100 point-and-shoot camera - I regularly shoot video in 4K for two hours plus.  I recently shot the opening act (50 mins) and the headliner (2 hrs 40 mins) at a show with the ZS100.  Of course, there was a break between bands.  This was outdoors in a stadium and it was in the low 90s when the first band took the stage; and probably in the 80s throughout much of the headliner's set.  I had no problems.

Panasonics are usually larger than other brands.  Even their M4/3 is just as large as other brands larger APS-C sensor cameras.  Recently their Full Frame bodies have gotten a little smaller than usual.  This I feel is the main reason their IBIS is very good as well as why they don't over heat.

Sony's are all super small in comparison.  And that's why they overheat.  But the last year or so, the newer models have gotten a whole lot better.  Not little steps, but huge steps. Almost up to par with Panasonic.

 

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