Topic: microphonetips for use without preamp?

[perik]

hi!

I´m going to use my Iriver H120 for recording sounds in different atmospheres, sometimes very quiet sounds (if u excuse the expression, dont think its correct english)

have anyone got a microphone tips for me. I dont want to use the preamp in the rockbox to much, not louder than + 20DB cause noticed it started to be some hizz and bums and want to avoid that. and I dont want to use an extarnal preamp cause then there are so much things to carry around.

so do anyone know a good sounding microphone with loud outputlevel (or what its called?) ?

I have been looking on the two microphones: Sony ECM-MS907 and the cheaper one Sony ECM-DS70P. Do anyone have any experience of these two mics and how they works with H120 and rockbox?

Can you anywhere in the specifications see what "outputlevel" it comes from the mics if u look on this site: http://www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/%20INTERSHOP.enfinity/eCS/Store/en/-/USD/SY_DisplayProductInformation-Start?CategoryName=pa_PADepartmentAccessories_Microphones_DigitalMics&ProductSKU=ECMDS70P&TabName=specs&var2=

or this:
http://www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/eCS/Store/en/-/USD/SY_DisplayProductInformation-Start?CategoryName=pa_PADepartmentAccessories_Microphones_DigitalMics&ProductSKU=ECMMS907&TabName=specs&var2=

Is it this?:
ECM-DS70P: Sensitivity: -38dBV, ±3.5dB for the and
ECM-MS907: Effective Output Level-56 dBm <+->4dB (0dB=1mW/Pa, 1kHz)

so the ECM-DS70P has got higher outputlevel then?


So.
Do anyone have got experience of these two mics?
Has anyone used it together with H120?
Will the input level be enough without gaining up över 20 Db and in that way avoiding noise?
any other tips on other mics that would suit my purpose? Think the most important is to get good inputlevels without using the gain in H120 to much, but the sam time having good result from my mic.


AND do anyone know any mic that is good and get "high outputlevels" if u understand what i mean?


Thanks a lot for your help

/ Perik

[perik]

No one got any tips? I´m sure you do. I´ve read quit a lot of posts and I know a lot of you know a lot of things. Please give me some tips. Would really apreciate it!!!

Anyone got any tips of a mic with high output Level? The higher the better so I don´t have to use the Iriver H120 digital gain to much. Think that´s what I´m looking for.

My budget is up to $200

thanks

/ Perik

[funk_pie]

Hey there! 
I've used both the DS70P and the MS907 when I started out with a mini disc player.  I always ran mic-in for both.  I had drastically better results with the 907, although neither produced much to brag about.  Anyhow, the DS70P is phantom powered only and I don't know if the Iriver provides phantom power.  If it doesn't, you'll also need a battery box.  The 907 runs off a single AA battery, so you will not need the battery box with it.  As far as gain, you'll need something to boost the levels with both of these, unless the sound source is really loud.  For mic-ing soft sounds, the higher the mic's sensitivity, the better and you may still need to provide some gain.  I would check out soundprofessionals.com or PM Chris Church from this board.  Both venders will likely have what you're looking for for under $200.  If only I'd known about the taperssection board back when I started out, I would've probably never gotten either the DS70P or the 907       Good luck!   

EDIT:  You only need to post a question on one thread.  This forum is likely the best place for your questions about mics.

[stirinthesauce]

If you want to boost gain without a pre amp try line transformers.  Relatively cheap.  As for mics with an internal battery, what about an AT 822, or a pair of akgc1000's, or some used nak 100's/300's?  All should be around your price point. 

[perik]

hi!

thanks for replies!!

Ok, can see that the ECM-DS70P has got Sensitivity: -38dBV. Is it possible to find microphones with sensitivity around 0dBV or something simillliar? That must be considered as very high sensitivity? Do u think this would be enough?

Regarding line transformers (tha same as DI or Line-box isn´t it?) That doesnt boost the signal do they? Isn´t the line box for the opposite? (at least as I used them) for taking a line signal into a microphone input in a mixer? not for taking a microphone signal into a line input. that requires a boost in volume and do really the line-box provide that? for example this one http://www.technosound.com.cy/easyconsole.cfm?id=2727

?

/ Perik

I actually got one AKG c1000s but that one are also not high enough in sensitivity.

[stirinthesauce]

line transformers add gain, or in other words, *boosts* the signal.  Attenuators decrease the signal, act as a pad db pad.  Some mics have built in pads, some don't, hence the need for attenuators in loud situations to decrease a hot signal.

Here is two (2) pages of example of different kinds of line transformers with prices from B+H photo
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home;jsessionid=GtchTXPXJC!-914139433!1156439066137?ci=1&sb=ps&pn=1&sq=desc&InitialSearch=yes&O=RootPage.jsp&A=search&Q=*&bhs=t&shs=line+transformers


Here are examples of attenuators
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?ci=1&sb=ps&pn=1&sq=desc&InitialSearch=yes&O=productlist.jsp&A=search&Q=*&bhs=t&shs=line+attenuators&image.x=6&image.y=4

Line transformers are a cheap (what I *think* you are looking for) way to boost the signal for quiter recordings if you have phantom power solution or self powered(battery) mics.  Otherwise you will have to have a pre-amp in the mix which will cost a little to a lot more depending on your needs.