Topic: Getting open taping gear into the venue...

[melontracks]

I know there must be info on these boards about it, but I can't find it.  Does anyone have any advice on how to get gear into venues to record taper-friendly bands?  I have never tried to take an open setup in, always assuming that the venue probably doesn't know/care if the bands allow taping and I'll be left standing at the door with my gear.

As a result, I've been taping with a stealth setup that works fine for me, but when the new gear I recently ordered arrives, I'll want to be able to get a stand in to record FOB.  Any advice or links to threads that I couldn't find?

I don't even want to think about the hoops you guys must be jumping through to get on the soundboard...
 

I'll be trying to get gear into the venues in the near future, and each (i think) will be really different:

- Irvine Meadows amphitheater (18,000 capacity)
- House of Blues, San Diego (1,100 capacity, but "big-corporate")
- the Majestic Ventura Theater, Ventura, CA (1,150 capacity, privately owned)
- The Wiltern, LA (2,200 capacity, not really friendly staff in my experience...)


thanks

[willndmb]

what bands?
most taper friendly bands try to inform the venue, that doesn't always mean they do or that the venue isn't just jerks
typically though any venue i have been to that the band is open taping there isn't much of a problem
if there is its best to have a copy of the bands taping policy printed out and if poss know who to ask for "in the band" that could help clear things up
(thats why i made this thread) http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,90261.0.html
the biggest thing is to stay relaxed and nice

irvine has had many taper friendly acts and should be pretty easy to get it
hob can be a big bitch
never heard of the others - try emailing them ahead of time if they are privately owned too

[melontracks]

thanks, that's helpful stuff.

the show at irvine meadows is Muse, and may not be an issue since I can't find any info on whether or not they are taper friendly (though I see torrents of their live shows out there).

the other three venues are Ween shows, which always have a few tapers with nice setups.  I'll follow your advice and keep my fingers crossed!

[easy jim]

The HoRules (San Diego in particular) tends to put such onerous conditions on bands to allow open taping that many who generaly are open will not be willing to go through the hoops to make it happen.

Some bands will go through the hoops (Ween may since they're historically pro-taper), but do not expect to get through to band folks via house security if denied at the door unless you know the right person/title to ask for (and have their info., etc.)  They have allowed taping from an area at the back of the main floor which is under the balcony, behind and to the side of the SBD.

The rest of the venues you mentioned will be less restrictive if an artist has duly cleared open taping for the night, however, NONE of them will allow you to run FOB. 

[boojum]

I have all my stuff in a sack and walk in, carrying the mic stand.

[terrapinj]

Wiltern is usually very easy going with taper friendly artists

staff tends to look the other way for FOB type stuff depending where you are set up etc

there will be at least 2 or 3 of us taping Ween at the Wiltern

majestic shouldn't be a problem at all

HoB will be hit or miss at the door - best bet is to be friendly and make sure they check with the band FOH or tour manager, if you see Ween before that show may want to try to get some contact info from their FOH guy. if you do get gear in though don't expect FOB unless you are really gonna work hard for it and can pull it off

Irvine Meadows will likely need to be very clearly open taping and arranged things in advance - if so policy will likely be tape from the lawn area - if you've got good seats you are probably better off stealthing, security isn't too bad there

[ScottT]

I taped Blues Traveler @ HoB San Diego a couple years ago.  I made it through the door without a problem and set up in front of the board.  Then, TWICE during the opening act, I got pulled aside by bouncers asking what I was doing.  They made me stand away from my rig while they confirmed that it was OK.... it worked out in the end but it was a pain.

[firmdragon]

thanks, that's helpful stuff.

the show at irvine meadows is Muse, and may not be an issue since I can't find any info on whether or not they are taper friendly (though I see torrents of their live shows out there).

the other three venues are Ween shows, which always have a few tapers with nice setups.  I'll follow your advice and keep my fingers crossed!

let us know how it goes with muse.

[greenone]

I taped Blues Traveler @ HoB San Diego a couple years ago.  I made it through the door without a problem and set up in front of the board.  Then, TWICE during the opening act, I got pulled aside by bouncers asking what I was doing.  They made me stand away from my rig while they confirmed that it was OK.... it worked out in the end but it was a pain.

Hope the Belly Up gig in December goes better for ya.

[terrapinj]

I taped Blues Traveler @ HoB San Diego a couple years ago.  I made it through the door without a problem and set up in front of the board.  Then, TWICE during the opening act, I got pulled aside by bouncers asking what I was doing.  They made me stand away from my rig while they confirmed that it was OK.... it worked out in the end but it was a pain.

Hope the Belly Up gig in December goes better for ya.

hands down, best venue in SD, no issues at all taping there

[easy jim]

I taped Blues Traveler @ HoB San Diego a couple years ago.  I made it through the door without a problem and set up in front of the board.  Then, TWICE during the opening act, I got pulled aside by bouncers asking what I was doing.  They made me stand away from my rig while they confirmed that it was OK.... it worked out in the end but it was a pain.

Hope the Belly Up gig in December goes better for ya.

hands down, best venue in SD, no issues at all taping there

You bet.  The Belly Up and Winston's, both in San Diego, are two of the most taper friendly venues in SoCal.

[melontracks]

let us know how it goes with muse.

I will, though I'm leaning toward just going stealth at this show (doesn't look like the new gear will be here in time... show is only a couple of days away).  Also, I'm thinking it might not be a stellar tape...all I'll have is omnis and a ticket to sit in the lawn section!  Had a couple of orchestra tickets that I gave away thinking I'd have a pair of cards and could set up in the lawn to tape.  Now, I'll need a lot of luck (and some quiet neighbors!) to get a decent tape.  Oh well!

[melontracks]

I have all my stuff in a sack and walk in, carrying the mic stand.

Why didn't I think of that?   

[terrapinj]

let us know how it goes with muse.

I will, though I'm leaning toward just going stealth at this show (doesn't look like the new gear will be here in time... show is only a couple of days away).  Also, I'm thinking it might not be a stellar tape...all I'll have is omnis and a ticket to sit in the lawn section!  Had a couple of orchestra tickets that I gave away thinking I'd have a pair of cards and could set up in the lawn to tape.  Now, I'll need a lot of luck (and some quiet neighbors!) to get a decent tape.  Oh well!

where do you live?

and for the future, you can always access the lawn with a ticket to any other location in the venue at Irvine

we may be able to get a pair of cards for you to run, but the lawn is so fucking far away even guns would be questionable as to worthwhile

i wouldn't even bother running omnis up there, plus I can't recall there being a relay stack up there

[melontracks]

Wiltern is usually very easy going with taper friendly artists

staff tends to look the other way for FOB type stuff depending where you are set up etc

there will be at least 2 or 3 of us taping Ween at the Wiltern

majestic shouldn't be a problem at all

If there's going to be people with quality rigs at the wiltern show, I'll probably just try to get there early and get up front with a stealth rig.  The last time Ween was out here in socal (2004) there were a number of good recordings floating around, including one from each venue that had been taped by a guy whose e-mail i remember started with "bpottenger@..."  no idea why I remember that, but I'm not going to get a tape like the ones that he was getting, so may as well get something different.  I like binaural audience recordings sometimes...

What gear will you be bringing to the Wiltern show?

[terrapinj]

i'll likely be running

JWmod AKG 460/ck63 > psp-2 > 722

Justin will probably run
AKG 480/ck63 or ck61 > V3(?) > 722

Ian Stone will probably be there as well, likely with
CCM4v or cmc6/mk6 > V2 > 722

and im sure a couple others will end up being there as well

[melontracks]

where do you live?

and for the future, you can always access the lawn with a ticket to any other location in the venue at Irvine

we may be able to get a pair of cards for you to run, but the lawn is so fucking far away even guns would be questionable as to worthwhile

i wouldn't even bother running omnis up there, plus I can't recall there being a relay stack up there

I'm in Redlands.  I was looking at this picture of the venue from virtual earth and thinking the same thing... a pair of omnis might make a tape that'd be fun for me to listen to, but would be pretty useless for anyone else, but I was thing an x-y card setup might return something useful...though you're right... don't see any sign of a relay...

[melontracks]

i'll likely be running

JWmod AKG 460/ck63 > psp-2 > 722

Justin will probably run
AKG 480/ck63 or ck61 > V3(?) > 722

Ian Stone will probably be there as well, likely with
CCM4v or cmc6/mk6 > V2 > 722

and im sure a couple others will end up being there as well

Well, sounds like I'd be doing a service grabbing an audience recording from the pit.  I can't match that gear, and i'm sure i can't match the skill either.  Ween tapes well from the audience I think.  My recording from in front of the stage at their night show at the hard rock hotel during vegoose 2005 was good enough that a guy who videotaped it used my audio in his video.  kind of fun to have an "in the thick of it" taping, though i think they work better in smaller venues than they do in places like the wiltern where it might be tough to get a spot "in the middle" that doesn't have a little too much crowd noise...


Stoked that there will be some good tapes from the shows though, even if they're not my tapes!

[terrapinj]

we will likely be FOB - ideally right above the pit area if we can get there early enough to get a place on the wall there

come introduce yourself if you've got time and see us before/after the show


i don't even know if you would enjoy an omni recording from Irvine, may be more frustrating than anything - sounds is pretty shitty back there and likely have tons of talkers - id find the people you gave the orch tix to and have them wear your gear for you 

[melontracks]

we will likely be FOB - ideally right above the pit area if we can get there early enough to get a place on the wall there

come introduce yourself if you've got time and see us before/after the show


i don't even know if you would enjoy an omni recording from Irvine, may be more frustrating than anything - sounds is pretty shitty back there and likely have tons of talkers - id find the people you gave the orch tix to and have them wear your gear for you 

Cool, i'll check in with you at the wiltern for sure.  Here's a revised picture of irvine meadows to illustrate how much thought I put into my ticket-giving decisions.  Ha!  Actually, a number of friends have tickets on the lawn, so I figured I'd just sit with them and get what I could get.  Maybe a good chance for me to try out recording in wavpack on the  h120 and test the latest rockbox build before the ween shows...

still, that looks pretty silly, giving away good seats like that!   

Chris

[terrapinj]

damn, woulda be perfect seats, but you hooked some people up

if you are testing new gear/firmware it would be a great opportunity, might pick up some great conversations 

[dorrcoq]

Is that photo distorted because of the angle, or are the seats really steep?

[terrapinj]

Is that photo distorted because of the angle, or are the seats really steep?

pretty steep

[melontracks]

Wow-

Muse was awesome.  They're not my favorite band by any means, but I can confirm that they put on a hell of a show.  When I first heard them (on an album, that is), my thoughts were "Wow, this band reminds me of Queen."

Though I never saw Queen live, I've read of their performances, massive light shows, and general showmanship.  I can only assume that Muse models itself after Queen in that regard too.  The show was tight, these guys are exemplary musicians, and I was amazed at how well my recording turned out.

I decided to just tape a binaural recording so I could "go back" to the show with a pair of headphones, but I think it might be worth sharing.  Although it's a pretty dirty recording and there's a lot of crowd noise (of course, as I was on the lawn) there's still a good deal of nice sound. I'll post a note here when it's up on etree.

Melon

BTW, the opening acts were pretty good too.  though they're not my cup of tea, the show started with a U2-sounding band from San Francisco called "Immigrant."  They were followed by "Juliette and the Licks," a very energetic show.  Hard to get past the idea that the band is fronted by Juliette Lewis, but whatever...

[faninor]

Muse is very good live.

I'll be posting a recording of this show on dimeadozen. I haven't listened to very much of my recording yet, but what I did hear sounded good. I look forward to hearing yours!

[melontracks]

Roll call for tapers tonight at the Wiltern?

[terrapinj]

I'm in as well as Justy and Ian Stone - look for use in the front of the 2nd tier DFC 

wouldn't be surprised if there were a couple others as well

[melontracks]

I'll be looking for you guys.  I have floor tickets, though, so don't know if I can get up there.  you're going to be in the balcony, right?

take a look at my post here if you get a sec:

http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,93995.0.html

[terrapinj]

I'll be looking for you guys.  I have floor tickets, though, so don't know if I can get up there.  you're going to be in the balcony, right?

take a look at my post here if you get a sec:

http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,93995.0.html

nope we are on the floor 

http://www.tickco.com/images/venues/Wiltern_theater.gif
probably right around the "G"

[melontracks]

nope we are on the floor 

http://www.tickco.com/images/venues/Wiltern_theater.gif
probably right around the "G"

nice-  I'll be looking for you guys!

[terrapinj]

nope we are on the floor 

http://www.tickco.com/images/venues/Wiltern_theater.gif
probably right around the "G"

nice-  I'll be looking for you guys!

we may end up being around "A" but you should be able to spot us either way

[Cheesecadet]

I actually have had two recent experiences at the Belly Up where the security were total assholes.  Once for the Mother Hips who I've taped several time at the Belly Up with no problems until recently.  The other band were Railroad Earth & Hot Buttered Rum.  It was crazy, 3 security guys all asking me to get in touch with the owner of the Bely Up and then I had to get Mollie from HBR to let him know it was okay.  Never had I experienced this until recently...the Hips show was at the end of September/ RRE & HBR were beginning of October.

 

Ryan in CA

[terrapinj]

woah, thats really really unheard of there

ive had them check my bags a few times but other than that never had any issues

sorry to hear you were hassled

[easy jim]

I actually have had two recent experiences at the Belly Up where the security were total assholes.  Once for the Mother Hips who I've taped several time at the Belly Up with no problems until recently.  The other band were Railroad Earth & Hot Buttered Rum.  It was crazy, 3 security guys all asking me to get in touch with the owner of the Bely Up and then I had to get Mollie from HBR to let him know it was okay.  Never had I experienced this until recently...the Hips show was at the end of September/ RRE & HBR were beginning of October.

 

Ryan in CA

I've noticed some newer guys working the door lately when I came in with tix through the front door.  Both times they asked me to open up my gear bag and show them what I had before the head of security or House Mgr. who both know me came up and told them to just let me pass.

I'm sure the new guys just did not know yet that taping was cool that night, and they needed a quick verification.  Once they know it's cool, they should only ask you to show them it's only audio gear and they'll stamp your hand and wave you through.  

If you have trouble again, ask for Steve Roder (House Mgr.) or the head of security (I believe his name is Sammy) and ask them to confirm that taping is OK.  The venue staff/security is generally very scrupulous about always asking/clearing with the bands before they open the doors whether or not the show is open taping or not.

[OOK]

I actually have had two recent experiences at the Belly Up where the security were total assholes.  Once for the Mother Hips who I've taped several time at the Belly Up with no problems until recently.  The other band were Railroad Earth & Hot Buttered Rum.  It was crazy, 3 security guys all asking me to get in touch with the owner of the Bely Up and then I had to get Mollie from HBR to let him know it was okay.  Never had I experienced this until recently...the Hips show was at the end of September/ RRE & HBR were beginning of October.

 

Ryan in CA

I've heard that the belly up is now controled by live nation and or there is some kinda funky rule that only the house can record the performances...now and the owner is a real dick about it now, even as far as tearing rigs down before the show goes on.  That is if they even get in the door.  Atleast thats what I have heard from a freind in san diego who hits the Bellyup a lot...

[terrapinj]

I actually have had two recent experiences at the Belly Up where the security were total assholes.  Once for the Mother Hips who I've taped several time at the Belly Up with no problems until recently.  The other band were Railroad Earth & Hot Buttered Rum.  It was crazy, 3 security guys all asking me to get in touch with the owner of the Bely Up and then I had to get Mollie from HBR to let him know it was okay.  Never had I experienced this until recently...the Hips show was at the end of September/ RRE & HBR were beginning of October.

 

Ryan in CA

I've heard that the belly up is now controled by live nation and or there is some kinda funky rule that only the house can record the performances...now and the owner is a real dick about it now, even as far as tearing rigs down before the show goes on.  That is if they even get in the door.  Atleast thats what I have heard from a freind in san diego who hits the Bellyup a lot...

4th and B possibly? they were taken over by live nation or else HoB. I know they tore down Boas rig from inside the Sound booth during the crowes run

i just recorded at the Belly Up on Friday and no one batted an eye, we even got a board feed. i don't believe there has been any ownership/management change there

[easy jim]

I actually have had two recent experiences at the Belly Up where the security were total assholes.  Once for the Mother Hips who I've taped several time at the Belly Up with no problems until recently.  The other band were Railroad Earth & Hot Buttered Rum.  It was crazy, 3 security guys all asking me to get in touch with the owner of the Bely Up and then I had to get Mollie from HBR to let him know it was okay.  Never had I experienced this until recently...the Hips show was at the end of September/ RRE & HBR were beginning of October.

 

Ryan in CA

I've heard that the belly up is now controled by live nation and or there is some kinda funky rule that only the house can record the performances...now and the owner is a real dick about it now, even as far as tearing rigs down before the show goes on.  That is if they even get in the door.  Atleast thats what I have heard from a freind in san diego who hits the Bellyup a lot...

4th and B possibly? they were taken over by live nation or else HoB. I know they tore down Boas rig from inside the Sound booth during the crowes run

i just recorded at the Belly Up on Friday and no one batted an eye, we even got a board feed. i don't believe there has been any ownership/management change there

Yeah...you got bad info. about the Belly Up.  They are still an independent venue.  It is 4th & B that recently changed ownership and then signed over control in a production contract with Live Nation/House of Rules.

The HoRules policy about recording is a little more invloved than "only the house can record performances."  It is more like they view tapers and live recording by bands as competition to the service of recording which they wish to sell to the bands...well, that and the huge orgination fees they want for a commercialized recording marked "Live at the House of Rules."  They will allow recording, but they make the band/band rep. sign an archival agreement making them personally liable for origination fees if the recoridng is ever commercialized; and, to allow open taping for fans, I believe they require an additional liability waiver.  $th & B is now run with this policy in effect.

[melontracks]

Who's gonna post the wiltern show?


My tape is far from the best I'm sure, so I'll wait to see what surfaces.  I got there too late to meet up with anyone, and wasn't able to spot anyone's mic stands when I did arrive!  I think that anyone who was at the San Diego or Ventura shows will agree that they were better shows, overall, though Claude did kick an unusual amount of ass at the Wiltern during "never squeal."

I'll be looking for a posting of the show--

Mel.

[thepassionofyonder]

wasn't able to spot anyone's mic stands when I did arrive! 

we set up at the back of the first tier.
had mics at head level until lights went down, then we raised them a lil bit.
the wiltern wasnt gonna allow us to bring our stand in, so we left it at the coat check.
tracked down kirt (foh) and he went with us while we retrieved our stand.
he said he didnt care were we ran as long as we stayed out of his sight lines.
they wouldnt allow a tri-pod for video though, so other guy had a bunch of hassles in that dept.

[melontracks]

wasn't able to spot anyone's mic stands when I did arrive!

we set up at the back of the first tier.
had mics at head level until lights went down, then we raised them a lil bit.
the wiltern wasnt gonna allow us to bring our stand in, so we left it at the coat check.
tracked down kirt (foh) and he went with us while we retrieved our stand.
he said he didnt care were we ran as long as we stayed out of his sight lines.
they wouldnt allow a tri-pod for video though, so other guy had a bunch of hassles in that dept.

Wish I'd gotten myself down there sooner to meet with you guys, but the group I was with was having too good a time tailgaiting and we ended up cutting it TOO close.  That place was jammed on the floor.  Even if they hadn't started playing moments after we got in, I doubt I'd have been able to find you.  Lesson learned, i suppose.  next time I'll get there sooner.  Anyone going to post this show soon?

[thepassionofyonder]

Anyone going to post this show soon?

i dont think i'll have time to torrent this until sat night, or monday night.

[terrapinj]

i prob won't get it up till early next week, but i'll see what i can do when i get home from work

melontracks, are you planning on any other shows in the area coming up?

[melontracks]

i prob won't get it up till early next week, but i'll see what i can do when i get home from work

melontracks, are you planning on any other shows in the area coming up?

 I didn't have any plans, no, but I was just thinking about looking into the local venues this morning.  Been anticipating these Ween shows so much that I forgot there were other bands, I guess!

I think that I saw Hank III lined up to play HOB anaheim or something near the end of the year.  maybe that... 
Also, see the decemberists at Wiltern at the end of the month.  I think I'll be there...

[OOK]

I actually have had two recent experiences at the Belly Up where the security were total assholes.  Once for the Mother Hips who I've taped several time at the Belly Up with no problems until recently.  The other band were Railroad Earth & Hot Buttered Rum.  It was crazy, 3 security guys all asking me to get in touch with the owner of the Bely Up and then I had to get Mollie from HBR to let him know it was okay.  Never had I experienced this until recently...the Hips show was at the end of September/ RRE & HBR were beginning of October.

 

Ryan in CA

I've heard that the belly up is now controled by live nation and or there is some kinda funky rule that only the house can record the performances...now and the owner is a real dick about it now, even as far as tearing rigs down before the show goes on.  That is if they even get in the door.  Atleast thats what I have heard from a freind in san diego who hits the Bellyup a lot...

4th and B possibly? they were taken over by live nation or else HoB. I know they tore down Boas rig from inside the Sound booth during the crowes run

i just recorded at the Belly Up on Friday and no one batted an eye, we even got a board feed. i don't believe there has been any ownership/management change there

Yeah your right I was thinking 4th and B not the Belly up.  Serve me right, if you not sure what your talking about stay quit.  Thanks for correcting me.  But there has been a unsettleing amount of places no longer allowing tapers, due to live nation, clear channel, HOB and such and or people getting hastled.  Hope we are not a dying breed....OOK

[F.O.Bean]

sorry for the sliht highjack, but what is that dog doing in your avatar? And the venues here in PA are ALL taper friendly. Do be aware if you have your stuff in a backpack tho. A few venues around here wont allow backpacks in the venue NO MATTER WHAT. I have had to carry ALL of my gear in without a bag just once. After that, I switched to a messenger style bag and a PortaBrace bag setup!

[melontracks]

sorry for the sliht highjack, but what is that dog doing in your avatar?

That's my dog, "The Biz" drinking from a water fountain that he frequents on one of our walks.  Gotta always make sure there's nobody nearly when he gets thirsty.

Mel

[F.O.Bean]

sorry for the sliht highjack, but what is that dog doing in your avatar?

That's my dog, "The Biz" drinking from a water fountain that he frequents on one of our walks.  Gotta always make sure there's nobody nearly when he gets thirsty.

Mel

+T AWESOME! Dogs RULE!