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Author Topic: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend  (Read 66872 times)

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #90 on: January 30, 2012, 01:30:10 PM »
I don't see why it wouldn't work.  The basic thing to consider is which range you want a particular effect to act upon.  Anything which you would like to act primarily on the quieter, lower level sections would be best done in the parallel compression chain, whereas a effect or flavor you want to target primarily at the higher level, loud sections would be best applied to the non-parallel chain.

Some DAWs automatically apply sample delay compensation for whatever plugins you use, which means you don't need to think about the delays the processing causes.  I know Samplitude does this.  If the DAW you are using does not do that automatically, there are other plugings which can do the compensation by delaying everything else to match.  I think Voxengo has a free VST dedicated to offsetting the delay compensation of other plugins, but I'd have have to check.  Im sure there are others as well.

I'm not sure it's the DAW so much as the plug itself, I have others that are peachy keen on rendering the altered audio in it's original position. I've gotten this effect in three different places now with that compressor, so I'm tempted to say it's something with the plug. Anyway, Reaper has a delay function that can work at fractional sample rates, so I can get it lined up, but figuring that out took a test or two first.
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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #91 on: January 30, 2012, 02:18:27 PM »
The automatic delay compensation feature simply looks at the precessing delay imposed by the plugin and then delays everything else that didn't pass through the plugin to match.  Its a feature of the DAW that corrects for the delay imposed by the plugin, to avoid unintended delay effects like combfiltering.

It sounds like you are doing the same thing by calculating and applying the same compensation manually, which achieves the same result, but requires you to do the work.

But agreed that the necessity for needing to make the correction (either automatically or manually) is determined by the behavoir or the plugin itself, not the DAW.

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #92 on: January 30, 2012, 09:46:51 PM »
The automatic delay compensation feature simply looks at the precessing delay imposed by the plugin and then delays everything else that didn't pass through the plugin to match.  Its a feature of the DAW that corrects for the delay imposed by the plugin

that's hawt.
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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #93 on: January 31, 2012, 12:47:28 AM »
OwhYeah.
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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #94 on: February 01, 2012, 05:07:04 PM »
..Carver sonic holography unit..

OT, but tell me more about your experience with that part in your playback chain, Kevin.  Do you need to stay glued to the sweet spot?

To hear the effect, that's the best place to experience it with the C-9.  That Bob Carver was onto something.....or ON something  :P

I also had one of those Carver boxes.  The sonic holography thing never really worked well.  Also had some broken buttons and an intermittent channel.  It was scrapped for parts (cool looking knobs!)
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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #95 on: February 03, 2012, 01:39:08 AM »
OwhYeah.


soo yeah...

it was due to the lookahead function being turned on in the plug (44.1 samples corresponds to 1ms at redbook rates). :-[

learn something every day.
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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #96 on: May 20, 2012, 07:17:06 PM »
To the top....  Use this and your recordings WILL sound better
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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #97 on: May 21, 2012, 09:45:13 AM »
Parallel processing....not just for compression!

I've been playing around lately with using parallel processing with EQ and stereo width, and have found it to make a huge difference, especially with big room/far field recordings where the bass can get out of hand. What I've been doing is duplicating the track, then placing a high pass filter on one track & a low pass filter on the other, effectively splitting the frequency range into independent signals. You'll have to fiddle around to find the optimum cross over point of the filters of course. Next, the real key - on the bass track, reduce the stereo width down as low as you can go. This should concentrate all the bass & kick into the center of the stereo field, and add a crispness to the edges because all of the low frequency information is gone. You can add a little width to it, but I personally prefer keeping mine as centered as possible.

At this point, I like to add an EQ and a compressor to both the high & low chains, and adjust until I have everything balanced nicely, volume & tone wise. Then I combine both of those signals into one, and run that mixed signal through a final super gentle compressor (sometimes with no gain at all) just to sort of glue the 2 frequency ranges back together a bit, and stick a hard limiter on the end to keep everything in check.
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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #98 on: May 21, 2012, 03:45:04 PM »
That's great Matt. 

Historically, limiting stereo width in the low bass region was an important step in mastering for technical reasons when everything was released on vinyl, and still is if vinyl is the target medium.  High levels of side component (width) in the bass region produce vertical cutting head undulations which can cause the playback stylus to jump out of the groove.  That limitation goes away completely with digital media, but there can still be sonic reasons for wanting to modify width of the low bass besides trying to make things sound like LPs.  It's a technique often used in bass heavy music styles to maximize bass loudness and impact.  To a lesser degree, managing low frequency width may also be important for optimizing playback on satellite systems which share a single subwoofer as opposed to systems with stereo woofers.  In that case the low frequency rage is summed to a single woofer and the difference components in that range tend to cancel.  In our case, I can see how it could help manage the often problematic bass region with some AUD tapes.

Like anything else, be judicial, use your ears and don’t go overboard in mono-ing the bass.  Low frequency phase differences contribute strongly to spatial envelopment (the sensation of being in the environment in which the recording was made) and externalization (sound seeming to emanate from the world around you, rather than from ‘inside your head’).  When it behaves, I prefer slightly wider that just ‘wide enough’ bass because I'm somewhat of an envelopment junkie, but if narrowing it helps improve things in the bass or in the overall, I’m all for making adjustments that improve things.

There are some plugins, including free ones I think, which do similar multiband stereo width processing simply, in one process.  If you do this regularly it may be worth your time checking them out since they eliminate the need for you to do the track duplication, crossover filtering, and summing after processing.  The terminology used varies- some call it mono-izing the bass region, some may refer to it as reducing the Side component and increasing the Mid component of the bass region.. it's the same thing.   You can also do this manually another way by converting the stereo signal to Mid/Side, equalizing the Mid and Side components differently, and then recombining them.  Reducing the level of the Side-signal while introducing a complementary, offsetting boost in the Mid-signal has the same effect of narrowing the stereo width.  Where in the frequency range you make the boost/cut determines at which frequency range that width adjustment takes place- it basically gives you as many stereo width adjustment bands as you have in the equalizer.  I see more and more stereo plugins (EQ, compression, etc) offering a way to switch from Left/Right mode to Mid/Side mode which takes care of the stereo>M/S>stereo conversion all within the plugin.  I use Samplitude which has stereo width control functions built in that feature mulitband options allowing adjustment via one, two or three separate bands. 


One clarification- I don't mean to be pendantic, and only mean to help clarify the terminology here- but the correct term for splitting the audio regions up and processing them this way is mulitband processing as opposed to parallel processing.  The difference is that multiband splits the audio into two or more frequency ranges, does separate processing on each rage, then combines them again.  Parallel processing does it’s thing on a full frequency copy (mult) of the audio and mixes that with the original. Mulitband processing it's most often used for compression, or things like stereo width adjustment you are doing.  EQ is already multiband by nature.
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Offline ScoobieKW

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #99 on: May 21, 2012, 05:26:40 PM »
This free VST plugin is a mid-side eq.

http://freemusicsoftware.org/1780

One of the presets is to center (tighten) the bass.
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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #100 on: May 23, 2012, 11:44:45 AM »

It's a technique often used in bass heavy music styles to maximize bass loudness and impact. 



Yes, and this is what I'm taping 99% of the time. This technique has really allowed me to put a lot more focus on the kick, which is the heart of everything in the music I tape.


There are some plugins, including free ones I think, which do similar multiband stereo width processing simply, in one process.  If you do this regularly it may be worth your time checking them out since they eliminate the need for you to do the track duplication, crossover filtering, and summing after processing.  The terminology used varies- some call it mono-izing the bass region, some may refer to it as reducing the Side component and increasing the Mid component of the bass region.. it's the same thing.   You can also do this manually another way by converting the stereo signal to Mid/Side, equalizing the Mid and Side components differently, and then recombining them.  Reducing the level of the Side-signal while introducing a complementary, offsetting boost in the Mid-signal has the same effect of narrowing the stereo width.  Where in the frequency range you make the boost/cut determines at which frequency range that width adjustment takes place- it basically gives you as many stereo width adjustment bands as you have in the equalizer.  I see more and more stereo plugins (EQ, compression, etc) offering a way to switch from Left/Right mode to Mid/Side mode which takes care of the stereo>M/S>stereo conversion all within the plugin.  I use Samplitude which has stereo width control functions built in that feature mulitband options allowing adjustment via one, two or three separate bands. 


It's actually remarkably easy to do all this stuff in Ableton. Instead of making a 2nd track, Ableton allows you to process parallel chains in a single track, then you can drop your effects onto the separate chains, and the output is summed automatically at the end of the track. It allows you a ton of versatility, and it can all be played with real time as opposed to rendering out a file to listen to the changes. I use T-Racks Deluxe a lot, and it definitely allows you to process L/R or M/S, but I haven't played with that feature much as Ableton has a built in plus in called Utility that allows you to go from 0% to 200% Stereo width.



One clarification- I don't mean to be pendantic, and only mean to help clarify the terminology here- but the correct term for splitting the audio regions up and processing them this way is mulitband processing as opposed to parallel processing. 


Ah yes, you're totally correct.  I had a brain fart since I'm always in Ableton mode in my head, and they tend to refer to anything processed with chains as parallel, as opposed to serial (one effect after the other). That is the technique I use but yes, outside Live's terminology it's definitely not a parallel process.
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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #101 on: July 29, 2012, 11:30:33 PM »
For the most part, this seems to work great :)

However, an unfortunate side-effect is some low-intensity crowd noise (during quiet music) which was barely noticeable before is much more noticeable after parallel compression.  What do you guys do in this situation?

I'm thinking about just leaving parallel compression on the whole recording since most of it does sound better.

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #102 on: July 30, 2012, 09:18:20 AM »
High levels of side component (width) in the bass region produce vertical cutting head undulations which can cause the playback stylus to jump out of the groove.  That limitation goes away completely with digital media

Or you can just tape a nickel on.

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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #103 on: July 30, 2012, 09:42:21 AM »
..unfortunate side-effect is some low-intensity crowd noise (during quiet music) which was barely noticeable before is much more noticeable after parallel compression.

It's sometimes referred to as 'bottom-up' compression because it brings the quiet details up in level, which could just as well be crowd noise as well as musical sounds.  Cast a big net and you get some bycatch.

The simplest answer is to find compromise settings that work well enough for the whole recording.  If its worth the time and effort to do so, sometimes I set automation to adjust the level of the compressed portion for some portions and between songs.  If doing that be careful so that the changes aren't obvious, noticable audible changes in background level are more destracting to me than clearly hearing the background crowd noise.

High levels of side component (width) in the bass region produce vertical cutting head undulations which can cause the playback stylus to jump out of the groove.  That limitation goes away completely with digital media

Or you can just tape a nickel on.

I've heard stories of the cannon fire on the Telarc 1812 LPs actually ripping needles out of cartridges!
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Re: Parallel compression, my new love & best friend
« Reply #104 on: August 13, 2012, 09:16:55 PM »
Just reread the thread, and was also rereading the Bob Katz book (Mastering Audio), and wanted to mention Katz's starting points for numbers . . .

In the "Transparent Parallel Compression" section, he lists:

  • Threshold -50
  • Attack time "as fast as possible", one millisecond or less if available
  • Ratio 2:1 or 2.5:1 (he prefers 2.5)
  • Release time medium length: "experiments show that 250-350 milliseconds works best to avoid breathing or pumping"
  • Crest factor set to Peak
  • Output level or makeup gain adjusted to taste

Obviously using one's ear is key, but I thought others might be interested in fiddling with this as a beginning . . .

 

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