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Gear / Technical Help => Recording Gear => Topic started by: Duconlajoie on July 18, 2011, 12:49:20 PM
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Sorry for this newbie query, apart from the SD 702 (expensive even in second hand), is there other devices allin one on the market? With four tracks that would be great.
The USBPre 2 doesn't record if I understand well.
If you can give me the full brand name and the name of the device, it will be easier to found it. Some acronymes send too many answers by google.
Thanks
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Assuming you want 4 channels or more with at least 4 preamps... ->
Edirol R44, Tascam DR-680, Edirol R-4/Pro
Nagra, Zaxcom and Sound Devices all make high end multichannel recorders as well.
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...and with stereo only, you have a few more - the Tascam DR-100 and the Marantz PMD661, among others.
Do you have specific mics in mind to run with this machine?
Also, to clarify, the responses to your question, which I assume is what you wanted, refer to recorders that provide 48 volt phantom power. All recorders have preamps in them, but they cannot power a condenser mic that requires phantom power.
You're correct that a USBpre2 is just a preamp, not a recorder.
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Assuming you want 4 channels or more with at least 4 preamps... ->
Edirol R44, Tascam DR-680, Edirol R-4/Pro
Nagra, Zaxcom and Sound Devices all make high end multichannel recorders as well.
Yes. The three ones are a bit big to record live shows. I am looking for the smallest possible. Other brands are expensive although i really like the NAGRA VI, nice one.
Do you have specific mics in mind to run with this machine?
Also, to clarify, the responses to your question, which I assume is what you wanted, refer to recorders that provide 48 volt phantom power. All recorders have preamps in them, but they cannot power a condenser mic that requires phantom power.
You're correct that a USBpre2 is just a preamp, not a recorder.
Yes, two sets of mics like CA-11 or 14/SP-CMC-4 or 8, later one pair of Berliner CM-33 (just because I heard one recording and found it very good but i'am a newbie). For this last kind of mics (AKG, schoeps or other saw in different signature's members) I don't know what I need for power and preampli. But I guess they need phantom power. My education on that subject is at the beginning. I want to record simultaneously 4 tracks, was thinking about the DR-2d but will need 2x 9200/tinybox or a 4 channel preampli (another subject to go into detail). Unless I built a DIY preampli !!
I want to face a lot of situations with one device, small, light .... and good enough to make a good work.
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Tascam makes several all-in-one units: http://tascam.com/products/field_recorder/
I have a Tascam HD-P2. http://tascam.com/product/hd-p2/
Marantz also makes several units: http://www.d-mpro.com/users/folder.asp?FolderID=3507
Terry
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Yes, two sets of mics like CA-11 or 14/SP-CMC-4 or 8, later one pair of Berliner CM-33 (just because I heard one recording and found it very good but i'am a newbie). For this last kind of mics (AKG, schoeps or other saw in different signature's members) I don't know what I need for power and preampli. But I guess they need phantom power. My education on that subject is at the beginning. I want to record simultaneously 4 tracks, was thinking about the DR-2d but will need 2x 9200/tinybox or a 4 channel preampli (another subject to go into detail). Unless I built a DIY preampli !!
I want to face a lot of situations with one device, small, light .... and good enough to make a good work.
Of the mics you mentioned, only one (the Berliners) requires phantom power. To use CA-11s or the SP (actually Audio Technica) mics you mentioned in a 4-channel setup, you'd need the small, light Tascam DR-2D and a couple small battery boxes, or Chris Church can design a custom 4-channel one. Such a setup is thousands less than the other things you're talking about.
If you are that new to taping, what is motivating you to want to play with 4-channel? It makes it a LOT more complicated to record shows (it's definitely more than twice the work of a two-channel recording) and really, I think it's overkill to run 4 mics in a lot of situations unless there is a specific need for more than one pattern. More common would be running 2 mics + SBD - which again can be done with the DR-2D.
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Can the PM661 record 2 stereo tracks at the same time? What I saw tells me no. It seems to be a great device with phantom power and preamp for a small size and robust. The 671 is too big as the tascam.
I saw in a thread something about a custom preampli from chris church and guess it's possible to do something like i want, from him or from naint. I have in mind some particular features I desire but will they want? Chris didn't seem to speak about the technical feature of his devices. But this is another story.
My motivation is to make surround records.
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Chris Church does custom versions of his mics that can be powered on plugin power (so does guysonic, but at a higher cost).
This way, you could run CA-11 > M10 straight, or if you need four track CA-11 (+ second set of mics?) >DR-2d.
Haven't seen H4n mentioned in this thread, but it's inferior to the D-100 according to most users here.
Check out gutbucket's posts in the DR-2d thread if you're interested in doing surround. He's got some crazy gear going...
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For the mics you're wanting to use, I would suggest the Tascam DR-2D. I've never used this recorder but most people seem to like it and it would be useful for your four channel mics.
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Not 4 channel, but the Fostex FR2-LE is a nice all-in-one.
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From the top:-
- Nagra VI (http://www.nagraaudio.com/pro/pages/products_nagra_vi.php)
- AETA 4MinX (http://www.aeta-audio.com/produits_detail.php?id=23)
- Sound Devices 788T (http://www.sounddevices.com/products/788t.htm)
- Sound Devices 744T (http://www.sounddevices.com/products/744t.htm)
- . . . . . big gap . . . . .
- Tascam DR-680 (http://tascam.com/product/dr-680/)
- Edirol R-4 Pro (http://www.roland.com/products/en/R-4_Pro/)
- Edirol R-44 (http://www.roland.com/products/en/R-44/index.html)
The mic. pre-amps on the Nagra and AETA are superb.
The SD is a step down but still excellent.
Then there really is a big step down, but the ones I mentioned are all top of the class in their price bracket.
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Thanks sunjan for these informations (others too).
I've seen the H4n but forget to mention it. Like the PM661 it seems to be not able to record 2 stereo tracks.
From the top:-
- Nagra VI (http://www.nagraaudio.com/pro/pages/products_nagra_vi.php)
- AETA 4MinX (http://www.aeta-audio.com/produits_detail.php?id=23)
- Sound Devices 788T (http://www.sounddevices.com/products/788t.htm)
- Sound Devices 744T (http://www.sounddevices.com/products/744t.htm)
- . . . . . big gap . . . . .
- Tascam DR-680 (http://tascam.com/product/dr-680/)
- Edirol R-4 Pro (http://www.roland.com/products/en/R-4_Pro/)
- Edirol R-44 (http://www.roland.com/products/en/R-44/index.html)
The mic. pre-amps on the Nagra and AETA are superb.
The SD is a step down but still excellent.
Then there really is a big step down, but the ones I mentioned are all top of the class in their price bracket.
So between your last and the DR-2d, there's nothing with 4 tracks recording with preamp. Do i understand well ?
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I've seen the H4n but forget to mention it. Like the PM661 it seems to be not able to record 2 stereo tracks.
This is incorrect, the H4n does four channels with the latest firmware update (although with unimpressive quality):
http://www.gearslutz.com/board/so-much-gear-so-little-time/369147-zoom-h4n-recording-4-tracks-simultaneously-2.html#post6197986
For an exhaustive list, one could also mention the following, although they are hardly "the smallest possible" as the OP put it:
Zoom R series (R8, R16...)
Tascam DP series (DP-004, DP-008)
Tascam HS-P82
Zaxcom (Nomad/Fusion/Deva in various flavors)
Sonosax (MINIR82/SX-R4/SX62R)
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Sorry for this newbie query, apart from the SD 702 (expensive even in second hand), is there other devices allin one on the market? With four tracks that would be great.
Actually, the 702 is only 2 tracks. It's the 744 that has 4 tracks.
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Thanks sunjan for these informations (others too).
I've seen the H4n but forget to mention it. Like the PM661 it seems to be not able to record 2 stereo tracks.
From the top:-
- Nagra VI (http://www.nagraaudio.com/pro/pages/products_nagra_vi.php)
- AETA 4MinX (http://www.aeta-audio.com/produits_detail.php?id=23)
- Sound Devices 788T (http://www.sounddevices.com/products/788t.htm)
- Sound Devices 744T (http://www.sounddevices.com/products/744t.htm)
- . . . . . big gap . . . . .
- Tascam DR-680 (http://tascam.com/product/dr-680/)
- Edirol R-4 Pro (http://www.roland.com/products/en/R-4_Pro/)
- Edirol R-44 (http://www.roland.com/products/en/R-44/index.html)
The mic. pre-amps on the Nagra and AETA are superb.
The SD is a step down but still excellent.
Then there really is a big step down, but the ones I mentioned are all top of the class in their price bracket.
So between your last and the DR-2d, there's nothing with 4 tracks recording with preamp. Do i understand well ?
I didn't say there were not others - just that the R-44 or the DR-680 is the lowest I would go for a 4-track.
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Agree on the Tascam recc- also on 4 chan post work. I do it, 2 sets of mics, but rarely and for a specific purpose,club. Run stage lip, then further back in the sweet spot. Which is a really nice way to capture a show (2 completely diff setups/recorders ect). Also suggest alot more reading and nothing "wrong" with the mics you mentioned, but just seems silly to put alot of money in a higher end 4 chanel device with lower level mics. Seems kinda backwards...But if thats your route i'd def go for the DR-2D
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Thanks to correct my mistakes and to give advices, a lot of searches to do. It's clear that the whole set of equipment must be consistent.
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there is more information on this site, and amongst the people here to measure, absorb. I actually always amazed at how nice and helpful most people are with new/beginner questions. People used to write "SEARCH IS YOUR FRIEND". not a very kind welcome. So ask away, just saying do your research for your own benefit, you'll find threads and threads and threads on all the recorders people use here, mics also, more info than you want to know. And you'll notice ALOT of the same gear be it preamps, rec's, microphones, common amongst the users as you were saying with it needing to be "consistent"--- Which is a good sign of how well they work together. And listen to mics/pre/recorder combos on the archive, and listen and listen and listen. And I haven't met the guy who bought exactly what he wanted;same rec/same mics/ never switched or upgraded. But i do wish you the best on the learning curve. and welcome to the wonderful expensive addictive always wanting more world of taping, as they say; check your wallet at the door ;D