Topic: Need some Answers from Tapers for a Paper! Help a sista out! :)

[manda8801]

Hey guys. The land of PT sent me here because they thought you'd be able to help me out a lil bit!

I have a research paper that's based upon the free music sharing throughout the jamband community and kind of why it's so accepted by the artists themselves, etc...

soo if you wonderful people are feeling like you'd like to help me out by answering the following, it'd be greatLy appreciated!!!

1. Why did you start taping?

2. What do you get out of it?

3. Do you trade studio releases or official releases the way you trade bootlegs and do Do you ever feel guilty? (giving away free music and all that jazz thats unaccepted in the "popular" music world)

4. Do you think allowing fans to tape hurts or helps bands in getting bigger and gaining recognition

5. How much money have you invested in taping gear and has it been a benefit to you and your friends in the community or do you feel like it's a waste of money?


6. do you think taping shows increases the fanbase by getting people interested in the music for free, before they have to buy anything?

7...does it also increase attendance at these mostly improvisational shows?

8. if these bands suddenly disallowed taping would it hurt there bottom line (money they make on tour and through record sales)

9. and lastly, is this whole debacle just the dinosaur record companies grasping for straws in an era when technology has made them obsolete?

Thank you so much y'all! much LOVE xoxo.

[twatts (pants are so over-rated...)]

1. Why did you start taping?

Followed PH, so I knew about it for a long time...  Saw Trans Am and they rocked.  Their CDs didn't.  I decided it was time to start taping because there were lots of bands that needed it but weren't getting it...

2. What do you get out of it?

I get to hear the show again.  Most of the time, its crap.  But sometimes, there is that 5sec. of FANTASTIC(!!!) that I want to hear again.  Its all worth it for those moments.

3. Do you trade studio releases or official releases the way you trade bootlegs and do Do you ever feel guilty? (giving away free music and all that jazz thats unaccepted in the "popular" music world)

I don't trade studio/official releases...  The handful that I've gotten from shady DL sites, I've either deleted them or bought the actual CD later.

4. Do you think allowing fans to tape hurts or helps bands in getting bigger and gaining recognition

I think it is helpful for any band willing to do it.  Its another useful marketing tool, if used correctly.

5. How much money have you invested in taping gear and has it been a benefit to you and your friends in the community or do you feel like it's a waste of money?

$2000+ over the 4+ years.  Right now, I have about $1300 in my rig.  It is totally worth it.

6. do you think taping shows increases the fanbase by getting people interested in the music for free, before they have to buy anything?

Yes and no.  I don't think people get interested in music because its free - they do because they like the music.  Regardless of the source (show tape or studio), fanbase is increased through writing better songs, not by allowing taping.

7...does it also increase attendance at these mostly improvisational shows?

I doubt it.  Of course, more music being accessible to the masses make for more potential fans.  But like I said above, its not how much you put out, its what you put out.  100s of crappy tapes won't make any fans.  1x really good single can sell out a Stadium.

8. if these bands suddenly disallowed taping would it hurt there bottom line (money they make on tour and through record sales)

No, this happens a lot when bands get signed to major labels.  Its not a big deal...  Frankly, the bottom line is why they stop taping.  Allowing taping and trading DOES take away from CD Sales.

9. and lastly, is this whole debacle just the dinosaur record companies grasping for straws in an era when technology has made them obsolete?

What debacle is that???

[Belexes]

Allowing taping and trading DOES take away from CD Sales.

It does? I'd say that's debatable.

[twatts (pants are so over-rated...)]

Allowing taping and trading DOES take away from CD Sales.

It does? I'd say that's debatable.

Yeah, I know.  I think most of us here follow through and buy the CDs...  But I have a lot of my friends don't even think twice about "booting" official releases...

T

[Jeremy Lykins]

I have a lot of my friends don't even think twice about "booting" official releases...

I know people who are like that, but would those people actually buy the official release if they didn't burn someone else's copy?  My guess is that at least 90% of the the answer is "no".  That's what burns me about the RIAA's stance on downloading songs--they try to say that every single download is a lost sale, but 90% of those people wouldn't bother buying the song if they can't download it for free. 

Sorry for the threadjack, so I'll answer the survey:

1. Why did you start taping?

--I like having shows that I've seen on cd (that's basically all I collect), and most of the shows that I see have no tapers.

2. What do you get out of it?

--I enjoy having recordings of shows that I've attended, I enjoy helping smaller bands by taping them, and I enjoy providing people with music that they want.

3. Do you trade studio releases or official releases the way you trade bootlegs and do Do you ever feel guilty? (giving away free music and all that jazz thats unaccepted in the "popular" music world)

--No.  I give away lots of free cd's of live recordings, but never official releases.

4. Do you think allowing fans to tape hurts or helps bands in getting bigger and gaining recognition

--I think that it only helps, even for large and established bands.

5. How much money have you invested in taping gear and has it been a benefit to you and your friends in the community or do you feel like it's a waste of money?

--I just started, and I've got a little over $900 in my rig and I couldn't be much happier (except that I want more!).

6. do you think taping shows increases the fanbase by getting people interested in the music for free, before they have to buy anything?

--Yes, of course!  I've become interested in literally dozens of bands because I heard a live recording of one of their shows.

7...does it also increase attendance at these mostly improvisational shows?

--Yes, I think that it does.  I've had several conversations with people at shows where they've said that they were only there because they'd heard a show by the performer on archive.org or another live music website.

8. if these bands suddenly disallowed taping would it hurt there bottom line (money they make on tour and through record sales)

--Yes, it would.  There are very few bands that I would continue to see if they disallowed taping.

9. and lastly, is this whole debacle just the dinosaur record companies grasping for straws in an era when technology has made them obsolete?

--I don't follow.

[rdfager]

1. Why did you start taping?

I traded tapes for many years before I could afford gear of my own.  Once I got a job and could afford the gear, it seemed like a natural progression.

2. What do you get out of it?

I get to listen to the show again right away.  I no longer have to search for the recording.  I get to give back to the community that I leached from for many years.  I get to play with fun electronic stuff (I'm a geek like that)

3. Do you trade studio releases or official releases the way you trade bootlegs and do Do you ever feel guilty? (giving away free music and all that jazz thats unaccepted in the "popular" music world)

No and no.

4. Do you think allowing fans to tape hurts or helps bands in getting bigger and gaining recognition

I think it helps them.  There are a lot of bands that I found out about by listening to recordings of their performances.  I certainly support bands that allow taping more than those that don't and did so even before I started taping.

5. How much money have you invested in taping gear and has it been a benefit to you and your friends in the community or do you feel like it's a waste of money?

I've got about $3500 into the gear I currently use.  I've bought and sold some other gear too.  I hope it's a benefit.  I've wasted a lot of money otherwise.

6. do you think taping shows increases the fanbase by getting people interested in the music for free, before they have to buy anything?

Like I said, I've found out about a lot of bands through listening to their shows.  I'm sure I'm not the only one.

7...does it also increase attendance at these mostly improvisational shows?

If it increases their fanbase, this only seems logical.

8. if these bands suddenly disallowed taping would it hurt there bottom line (money they make on tour and through record sales)

I doubt it.  Once the band has a fanbase, most of those people aren't going to care if the band allows taping.  Where I see taping helping a band is in building their fanbase.

9. and lastly, is this whole debacle just the dinosaur record companies grasping for straws in an era when technology has made them obsolete?

I'm not 100% sure they're obsolete.  Maybe they are, but they may serve a purpose in finding talent - separating the wheat from the chaff if you will.  However, they do need to revise their pricing and distribution models.  I don't see the big record companies staying as big, there just isn't as much work for them to do any more.

[OFOTD]

1. Why did you start taping?

I was going to so many shows of different bands back when I was younger that I always wanted to hear the show again and again.  Also selfishly I got sick of waiting 6+ months after a show to get a 5th gen cassette of it.

2. What do you get out of it?

The ability to listen to music how I prefer it, live and not in the studio.  Rarely to I put in a studio album over a live show.   As a side note it has allowed me to make some really good friends taping.

3. Do you trade studio releases or official releases the way you trade bootlegs and do Do you ever feel guilty? (giving away free music and all that jazz thats unaccepted in the "popular" music world)

No and no.

4. Do you think allowing fans to tape hurts or helps bands in getting bigger and gaining recognition

It depends on the quality of the product the band is putting out on a nightly basis.  I think it may help to weed out bands that sound like shit in a live setting.

5. How much money have you invested in taping gear and has it been a benefit to you and your friends in the community or do you feel like it's a waste of money?

Currently i'm sitting at around $11k with everything i've got.   A waste of money?  That's a loaded question.  It's like asking a woman if having several different handbags is worth the money.

6. do you think taping shows increases the fanbase by getting people interested in the music for free, before they have to buy anything?

Free isn't really the reasoning.  Moreso that folks can tell who is really a good band and who is a product of a studio and its gadgets.

7...does it also increase attendance at these mostly improvisational shows?

If someone who has never heard of a band gets to listen to them on the archive or somewhere else then I can only hope that it increases attendance at shows.

8. if these bands suddenly disallowed taping would it hurt there bottom line (money they make on tour and through record sales)

Depends on the size of the band.  I can see how it hurts some newer and smaller bands but I tend to think a band like Panic would still kick ass and thrive without taping.

9. and lastly, is this whole debacle just the dinosaur record companies grasping for straws in an era when technology has made them obsolete?

People got to get paid and the record companies are usually the first, second and third in line. 

[Belexes]

Allowing taping and trading DOES take away from CD Sales.

It does? I'd say that's debatable.

Yeah, I know.  I think most of us here follow through and buy the CDs...  But I have a lot of my friends don't even think twice about "booting" official releases...

T

Sorry for the thread hijack, but good questions and answers so far. I'll post my response shortly.

Ugh, I'd feel sick to my stomach if I did that. I'll support the bands I like to the death and then the live recordings are a great added bonus, or at least that's what I like to think.

T

[spcyrfc]

for the most part, i do not tape jambands, but here it is anyways

1. Why did you start taping?

I saw my favorite band play acoustic and live every sunday.  nobody ever recorded them.  By the time i had gathered the scratch, it was almost too late.  my first show recording was one of their last.

2. What do you get out of it?

Music, good live music.  Also an archive of music that would otherwise gone unrecorded.  more than 90% of the music i record, i am the only recordist present.

3. Do you trade studio releases or official releases the way you trade bootlegs and do Do you ever feel guilty? (giving away free music and all that jazz thats unaccepted in the "popular" music world)

I do not trade studio releases and i do not make BOOTLEGS.  [you might want to search this word on the site and read up about it if you are writing a paper... in short bootlegging is bad, we do not bootleg.

4. Do you think allowing fans to tape hurts or helps bands in getting bigger and gaining recognition

Depends on how the recordings are used.  i think of my recordings as a historical record for posterity (but i will spread them when the bands want me to)

5. How much money have you invested in taping gear and has it been a benefit to you and your friends in the community or do you feel like it's a waste of money?

$2000+.  It pays for itself every time i get out, which i do at least a few time a week.

6. do you think taping shows increases the fanbase by getting people interested in the music for free, before they have to buy anything?

---------- probably for some large touring jambands.

7...does it also increase attendance at these mostly improvisational shows?

8. if these bands suddenly disallowed taping would it hurt there bottom line (money they make on tour and through record sales)

9. and lastly, is this whole debacle just the dinosaur record companies grasping for straws in an era when technology has made them obsolete?

"What debacle is that???"
[/quote]

[Belexes]

Paragraph summary:

I started taping to capture great musical performances that were not being taped by others from the concerts I was attending.  Someone had to start doing it, so why not me?  I get out of it the satisfaction of preserving a performance for the ages instead of letting it slip away over time with fading memories.  I never trade official releases, bad form.  Taping in general is a good vibe and nod to the fans and I think benefits a band.  $2000+ in gear and well spent, never a waste.  I think taping allows people to get a taste of what the band sounds like live and then once they are hooked the now "fan" dives in and purchases official material. < Has happened to me.  To disallow taping, probably would not affect the bottomline, but isn't doing them any favors.  The big record companies had their chance when digital music hit to take the lead and they failed. Now they are paying the price. No tears shed by me. I like it when I buy artist music direct.  More $ for the creator. Win-win.

[Chuck]

I started responding, but it ended up sounding self serving... 

[heyitsmejess]

1. Why did you start taping?
ive seen too many show that blew my head off that no one taped.

2. What do you get out of it?
i have always enjoyed sharing music, and knowing that im personally doing something to contribute to others happiness makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside....

3. Do you trade studio releases or official releases the way you trade bootlegs and do Do you ever feel guilty? (giving away free music and all that jazz thats unaccepted in the "popular" music world)
no, tho i am guilty of trying before i buy...i.e. i will d/l an album before i buy it, so i dont wind up wasting 15 bucks on 2 great songs and 10 more of shit.

4. Do you think allowing fans to tape hurts or helps bands in getting bigger and gaining recognition
i think it helps.  most people are likely to download/listen to an unknown band if they have free access to the music.  alot of bands i enjoy wouldnt be where they are now without an active taper (or 100) spreading the word.

5. How much money have you invested in taping gear and has it been a benefit to you and your friends in the community or do you feel like it's a waste of money?
its been a benefit to me and my friends...they enjoy the shows, and i enjoy recording them.  i have invested very little, because i am broke, but i think i make decent recordings for what i have.


6. do you think taping shows increases the fanbase by getting people interested in the music for free, before they have to buy anything?
yes.

7...does it also increase attendance at these mostly improvisational shows?
i dont know....ive been activley taping a band for the past 5 months (the rumpke mountain boys) but i cant say if there has been a boom in attendance because of my recordings.

8. if these bands suddenly disallowed taping would it hurt there bottom line (money they make on tour and through record sales)
to an extent, yes. 

9. and lastly, is this whole debacle just the dinosaur record companies grasping for straws in an era when technology has made them obsolete?
dont know/ no comment.



best of luck on your paper!

[gtalife]

1. Why did you start taping?

>Archive and share audio of my favourite band, especially when others do the same for me. Pretty much i record everything i see live.

2. What do you get out of it?

>The enjoyment of trying to make a great recording, listening to the finished results, sharing with others and the bands (if they want to hear it).

3. Do you trade studio releases or official releases the way you trade bootlegs and do Do you ever feel guilty? (giving away free music and all that jazz thats unaccepted in the "popular" music world)

>I do not trade official releases, and never feel guilty about trading unofficial releases, especially in the taping/trading community.

4. Do you think allowing fans to tape hurts or helps bands in getting bigger and gaining recognition

>Helps, lots of eveidence to that on this forum. Keeps fans interested in the bands music.

5. How much money have you invested in taping gear and has it been a benefit to you and your friends in the community or do you feel like it's a waste of money?

>Too much! more than some, less than others.

6. do you think taping shows increases the fanbase by getting people interested in the music for free, before they have to buy anything?

>Yes.

7...does it also increase attendance at these mostly improvisational shows?

>yes.

8. if these bands suddenly disallowed taping would it hurt there bottom line (money they make on tour and through record sales)

>Probably, due to most folks losing interest in the band, but would not signifiactly hurt the bottom line.

9. and lastly, is this whole debacle just the dinosaur record companies grasping for straws in an era when technology has made them obsolete?

>Not sure what you mean by your question in regards to our hobby, totally different compared to folks downloading official audio on Bit Torrent
and file sharing sites.

[randallanddarcy]

Hey guys. The land of PT sent me here because they thought you'd be able to help me out a lil bit!

I have a research paper that's based upon the free music sharing throughout the jamband community and kind of why it's so accepted by the artists themselves, etc...

soo if you wonderful people are feeling like you'd like to help me out by answering the following, it'd be greatLy appreciated!!!

1. Why did you start taping?
Good question. I think I liked the idea of having my own copy of a show I attended. Being able to listen to it straight away was magic. I started back in 1998 with an analogue Sony deck.

2. What do you get out of it?
See (1).

3. Do you trade studio releases or official releases the way you trade bootlegs and do Do you ever feel guilty? (giving away free music and all that jazz thats unaccepted in the "popular" music world)
No. I might copy an album for someone if I think they'll dig it, but that's rare. I don't listen to many 'new' bands, so I don't go downloading albums. I just wait for my fave bands' albums to be released in the stores.

4. Do you think allowing fans to tape hurts or helps bands in getting bigger and gaining recognition
Most tapers and traders are fanatical about the band they get the live shows of. I'm not into Green Day. I'm not gonna buy their albums. I'm not interested in their live shows. I do, however, like a band like Pearl Jam. Once there was no official shit left to buy, I got into the live stuff.

5. How much money have you invested in taping gear and has it been a benefit to you and your friends in the community or do you feel like it's a waste of money?
Don't know how much I've invested. It's not a waste. It's all paid for itself. I've taped literally hundreds of shows.

6. do you think taping shows increases the fanbase by getting people interested in the music for free, before they have to buy anything?
Not particularly. Like I say, I'm not gonna listen to live shows of bands I don't ALREADY like. However, I was tossing about whether to go to a show and I hadn't heard that band's album (they only have 1 album). I didn't download their album, though. I downloaded a bootleg from the current tour, listened to it, and decided I didn't want to go to the gig.

7...does it also increase attendance at these mostly improvisational shows?
I don't know.

8. if these bands suddenly disallowed taping would it hurt there bottom line (money they make on tour and through record sales)
No, it wouldn't. It would if most fans were tapers, but most fans are not.

9. and lastly, is this whole debacle just the dinosaur record companies grasping for straws in an era when technology has made them obsolete?
Probably. They need new ways of doing business. The Pearl Jam trick of selling fully mixed multi-track recordings of every show was one way. I don't need to tape 'em if I get a 'perfect' copy online.

Thank you so much y'all! much LOVE xoxo.

[newscane]

1. Why did you start taping?
In 2002, I started downloading DMB tapes.  Soon after, I started making note of equipment and things like that.  In 2005, I wound up talking with a taper who I often saw at Matt Nathanson shows.  We became friends, and she offered to loan me her rig for the summer of 2006, since she was going to be out of the country.  I accepted, and taped some DMB shows and a few others.  Within a few months, I was trying to figure out how to afford my own rig

2. What do you get out of it?
I enjoy it.  I'm a bit of a geek, which probably explains part of it.  It's nice to be able to preserve the music, and give back to the fan community.

3. Do you trade studio releases or official releases the way you trade bootlegs and do Do you ever feel guilty? (giving away free music and all that jazz thats unaccepted in the "popular" music world)
Nooo.


4. Do you think allowing fans to tape hurts or helps bands in getting bigger and gaining recognition
I think it generally helps bands, especially when it's so easy to share music these days.  DMB gained fans because their tapes would be traded among college students -- no taping/trading, and who knows if they would have grown like they have.  I think this holds true for plenty of bands.

5. How much money have you invested in taping gear and has it been a benefit to you and your friends in the community or do you feel like it's a waste of money?
I've probably invested $800-900.  I'd say it's definitely been a benefit to the community -- I was the only taper to release a tape for DMB's 3 Florida shows in 2006.  When I've taped local shows of national acts, I'm generally the only taper -- and these are bands that are known to be taper friendly.  Thousands of downloads on the LMA are proof of the benefit, I think.

6. do you think taping shows increases the fanbase by getting people interested in the music for free, before they have to buy anything?
sure, see #4

7...does it also increase attendance at these mostly improvisational shows?
I think it does.  It lets fans know that the songs are different all the time, and you have a shot at hearing a "one of a kind" version.

8. if these bands suddenly disallowed taping would it hurt there bottom line (money they make on tour and through record sales)
Possibly, moreso on tour money than on record sales.  I would think there would be some ill-will among fans, depending on the reasons for it.

9. and lastly, is this whole debacle just the dinosaur record companies grasping for straws in an era when technology has made them obsolete?
I don't know if I'd say that technology has made them entirely obsolete, but they definitely need to change their business model.  Having some corporate backing probably helps you in terms of studio production... but the old way of distribution just doesn't really hold anymore.
Thank you so much y'all! much LOVE xoxo.