Topic: Neumann KM184 Caps?

[phanophish]

So i notice the capsule is removable on my KM184s.  Can you get other polar pattern caps to go on the body or is there something that prevents you from switching caps?

[su6oxone]

I used to own km184s but wasn't aware that they had removeable caps.  They are not modular mics though, so you can't switch caps like the 140s, at least AFAIK.

[johnw]

There are a few threads on this and the bottom line is the caps aren't supposed to be removed and doing so risks ruining the diaphragm and voiding your warranty

[DSatz]

In Neumann's KM 180-series microphones, the amplifiers are all absolutely identical in terms of their circuitry and capsules are removeable (mainly for repair purposes), but the near-hemispherical plastic part behind the capsule is shaped differently for the three different models. So although you might be able to obtain capsule heads for the KM 183 and KM 185 as replacement parts if you made enough phone calls, the KM 185 capsule head wouldn't be in its proper acoustical setting if you put it onto your KM 184 body, and wouldn't have the specified high-frequency response.

The KM 183 capsule, on the other hand, has a sealed backplate and doesn't care what is or isn't behind it. So it's like having the blood type that's the universal donor (O-negative?)--that capsule can go on any of the bodies and work correctly. But the reverse isn't true, because the series simply wasn't designed for interchanging the capsules. For that you need the KM 100 series, which has seven interchangeable capsule types if I recall correctly.

--best regards

[phanophish]

In Neumann's KM 180-series microphones, the amplifiers are all absolutely identical in terms of their circuitry and capsules are removeable (mainly for repair purposes), but the near-hemispherical plastic part behind the capsule is shaped differently for the three different models. So although you might be able to obtain capsule heads for the KM 183 and KM 185 as replacement parts if you made enough phone calls, the KM 185 capsule head wouldn't be in its proper acoustical setting if you put it onto your KM 184 body, and wouldn't have the specified high-frequency response.

The KM 183 capsule, on the other hand, has a sealed backplate and doesn't care what is or isn't behind it. So it's like having the blood type that's the universal donor (O-negative?)--that capsule can go on any of the bodies and work correctly. But the reverse isn't true, because the series simply wasn't designed for interchanging the capsules. For that you need the KM 100 series, which has seven interchangeable capsule types if I recall correctly.

--best regards

Awesome reply.  Makes total sense.  Obviously not the answer I was hoping for but I appreciate the detailed and informative response

Thanks !!!

[sparkey]

Now if anyone could just quantify the acoustic differences between the 140s and the 184s....

In Neumann's KM 180-series microphones, the amplifiers are all absolutely identical in terms of their circuitry and capsules are removeable (mainly for repair purposes), but the near-hemispherical plastic part behind the capsule is shaped differently for the three different models. So although you might be able to obtain capsule heads for the KM 183 and KM 185 as replacement parts if you made enough phone calls, the KM 185 capsule head wouldn't be in its proper acoustical setting if you put it onto your KM 184 body, and wouldn't have the specified high-frequency response.

The KM 183 capsule, on the other hand, has a sealed backplate and doesn't care what is or isn't behind it. So it's like having the blood type that's the universal donor (O-negative?)--that capsule can go on any of the bodies and work correctly. But the reverse isn't true, because the series simply wasn't designed for interchanging the capsules. For that you need the KM 100 series, which has seven interchangeable capsule types if I recall correctly.

--best regards

Awesome reply.  Makes total sense.  Obviously not the answer I was hoping for but I appreciate the detailed and informative response

Thanks !!!

[DSatz]

> Now if anyone could just quantify the acoustic differences between the 140s and the 184s....

There's essentially zero difference acoustically. There is a small difference electrically (the KM 184 draws somewhat more current from a phantom power supply and has a very slightly lower noise floor).

By the way, John Willett spilled some beans on Neumann's on-line forum to the effect that there will soon be an analog body for the capsules Neumann sells for its KM D digital microphones. Since those are the same capsules as in the KM 100 series, I wonder what the plan is for the modular series, but something is surely afoot.

[sparkey]

> Now if anyone could just quantify the acoustic differences between the 140s and the 184s....

There's essentially zero difference acoustically.

After running both of these mics, my ears tell me differently.....

[page]

> Now if anyone could just quantify the acoustic differences between the 140s and the 184s....

There's essentially zero difference acoustically.

After running both of these mics, my ears tell me differently.....

I'd be curious if people can ABX them in a shootout environment or if there is some sort of inherrant confirmation bias.

[datbrad]

> Now if anyone could just quantify the acoustic differences between the 140s and the 184s....

There's essentially zero difference acoustically.

After running both of these mics, my ears tell me differently.....

I have noticed a difference in sound between recordings made with KM140s running without actives, versus AK40>LC3>KM100, but I don't know if I am the only one that hears it.

I have always wondered if there is a sonic change introduced with actives, or if it's just a consequence of the length of unbalanced wire running between the caps and bodies.

[fleish]

> Now if anyone could just quantify the acoustic differences between the 140s and the 184s....

There's essentially zero difference acoustically.

After running both of these mics, my ears tell me differently.....

I'd be curious if people can ABX them in a shootout environment or if there is some sort of inherrant confirmation bias.

If someone wants to send me their 184's for a blind mic taste taste test of sorts ...

[page]

I'd be curious if people can ABX them in a shootout environment or if there is some sort of inherrant confirmation bias.

If someone wants to send me their 184's for a blind mic taste taste test of sorts ...

What 4 channels do you have that are identical? I thought your R-4 had a 2+2 arrangement as far as identical channels and not 4 channels of the same mod.

[fleish]

I'd be curious if people can ABX them in a shootout environment or if there is some sort of inherrant confirmation bias.

If someone wants to send me their 184's for a blind mic taste taste test of sorts ...

What 4 channels do you have that are identical? I thought your R-4 had a 2+2 arrangement as far as identical channels and not 4 channels of the same mod.

True - I was thinking of a mono configuration with one of each mic plugged into a pair of channels. Just talking out of my a$$ really

[John Willett]

> Now if anyone could just quantify the acoustic differences between the 140s and the 184s....

There's essentially zero difference acoustically.

After running both of these mics, my ears tell me differently.....

There is no "acoustic" difference at all - any differences are in the electronics.  The KM 100 series is an older design.

[page]

> Now if anyone could just quantify the acoustic differences between the 140s and the 184s....

There's essentially zero difference acoustically.

After running both of these mics, my ears tell me differently.....

There is no "acoustic" difference at all - any differences are in the electronics.  The KM 100 series is an older design.

Ok, so if the caps are the same but electrics are different, would that effect the sound *any* (and if so, then how much which goes back to my question if people could tell them apart).

[sparkey]

> Now if anyone could just quantify the acoustic differences between the 140s and the 184s....

There's essentially zero difference acoustically.

After running both of these mics, my ears tell me differently.....

There is no "acoustic" difference at all - any differences are in the electronics.  The KM 100 series is an older design.

I tended to run my 140s with the actives, so that could be what I'm hearing.    But there was definitely a difference.