Topic: Best Portable Recorder for Concert shows

[Rogueleader]

Im sure you guys must get asked this a gazillion times. If so, kindly point me to the thread...

Anyway, here is the deal: I do 2-3 steady gigs a week with my jazz/fusion band here in town in the local clubs/bars.
I needed a new recorder to record the shows, edit the tunes, make CD's, make some money...yadda yadda.
 
Anyway, I wanted to know what the best inexpensive recorder is, that will afford me good CD quality sound?

In a rush just today, I bought the Sony IC Recorder ICD-SX57. It is just a tiny stereo recorder with 256 megs that I got it at Circuit City for $150.00.

I will probably take it back after tonights gig, but I need some advice.
So for all you tapers out there: What do you guys suggest?

I need a good mini digital recorder and maybe some stereo mikes on a stand? Or are the miles overkill?

Please any suggestions will be appreciated!
Thanks alot!
q

[NOLAfishwater]

First you need to give us a price range of what you can afford and then plenty of reccomendations will be given. Good luck in your search.

[Belexes]

Recorder:

Edirol R-09 or another type of flash recorder.

Check the Yardsale thead for some great used gear that is for sale now..I see an R-09...a MT2496, etc...

Some have built-in mics which you can try and use, but if you are pressing shows, try going to the Retail thread and picking up a Church Audio pre-amp/mic package.

You can then get a stand for the mics and then SP does make nice t-bars for the small mics:
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/category/360/mics

The Sony recorder you picked up is a voice recorder. I don't think it's going to give you the dynamic range you'll want.

Just my 2 cents..

[Rogueleader]

First you need to give us a price range of what you can afford and then plenty of reccomendations will be given. Good luck in your search.

Thanks for the reply. For the recorder.. I guess $200-$350 or so. I really want to capture the live recordings in stereo and press CD's with them, so frequency response is an important issue. Also additional mikes are important, maybe ones I can kinda point in one direction or the other.

I guess the ultimate would be some sorta mixer with 3 or 4 mikes, one for the drummer, one for the guitar, one for the bass etc... and then do a stereo mix.. not too sure if that is possible in a portable set up...

The goal really is to get some good recordings for a mix down to a CD that is going to sound good clear and balanced.

thanks again in advance!
q

[Rogueleader]

Recorder:

Edirol R-09 or another type of flash recorder.

Check the Yardsale thead for some great used gear that is for sale now..I see an R-09...a MT2496, etc...

Some have built-in mics which you can try and use, but if you are pressing shows, try going to the Retail thread and picking up a Church Audio pre-amp/mic package.

You can then get a stand for the mics and then SP does make nice t-bars for the small mics:
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/category/360/mics

The Sony recorder you picked up is a voice recorder. I don't think it's going to give you the dynamic range you'll want.

Just my 2 cents..

I see the Endirol R-09 seems pretty popular. Is this currently the best on the market for what I am trying to do?
Can you use external Mikes with this? IS Church Audio a brand name? What model mikes do you suggest?

I really want something I can set and forget....and then when I play it back the next day, one instrument is not louder than another... I know that depends on the stage volume etc.. but something I can sorta adjust in Audition or what ever... with out too much hassle

I really appreciate all your suggests, and bear with me, I'm a newbie on this, so I'm slowly learning all the lingo... 

Thanks again for your input.
q

[Robobo1]

Hi,

I'd suggest that if you are looking to produce a commercially-viable recording (and by that I mean you plan on selling it, whatever the market), you should hire a professional to record a night or two of your gigs.  You'll get a MUCH better product and will have options in regards to balance, mixing, etc. (assuming it's multitracked).

A cheap $300 recorder isn't going to do much for you other than let you set up a pair of mics somewhere in the room (out of the way of the diners/bar-goers/dancers/whoever) and hit record.  That's totally fine for your own purposes, but it won't compete and won't be sellable.  You'll also have no control over balance - you seem to hint that you'd like that ability.  This option is wonderful if you just need documentation of your gigs for whatever reason.

Good luck!

[Tim]

where do you live at? In keeping with the poster above, maybe there is a taper in the area who'd record some gigs and help set you up?

[colors]

I am in the same boat as you, being a gigging jazz musician.  I've recording my gigs with a cheap stereo mic for years.  About a year or so ago, I started hosting a weekly jazz jam and made a point to experiment with using external mics and recording to a mini disc.  I really fell in love with 2 Shure SM-57's sitting right on the stage.  One pointed at the bass, on right, one pointed at the guitar, on left.  Drums in middle.  I ran them into an Audio Buddy Preamp before going analog into the MD.  The whole setup costs around $500.  I am using the Edirol R-09 nowadays.  Some people here may freak of the idea of someone selling a pressed disc that has been recorded on a stereo pair of 57's.  For my money, when you have musicians that are very acoustically aware, have great dynamics and can switch gears on the drop of a hat, the music really benefits from not being manipulated after it's been captured.  Find a good balance beforehand, get the mics in a neutral spot, and GO!
   Alan

[illconditioned]

I am in the same boat as you, being a gigging jazz musician.  I've recording my gigs with a cheap stereo mic for years.  About a year or so ago, I started hosting a weekly jazz jam and made a point to experiment with using external mics and recording to a mini disc.  I really fell in love with 2 Shure SM-57's sitting right on the stage.  One pointed at the bass, on right, one pointed at the guitar, on left.  Drums in middle.  I ran them into an Audio Buddy Preamp before going analog into the MD.  The whole setup costs around $500.  I am using the Edirol R-09 nowadays.  Some people here may freak of the idea of someone selling a pressed disc that has been recorded on a stereo pair of 57's.  For my money, when you have musicians that are very acoustically aware, have great dynamics and can switch gears on the drop of a hat, the music really benefits from not being manipulated after it's been captured.  Find a good balance beforehand, get the mics in a neutral spot, and GO!
   Alan

Excellent advice.  Get good sound in the room (or on stage) and you're almost done.  I have not tried the 57's (or any dynamic mic, for that matter), but they should sound OK.  I bet if you got a set of inexpensive to mid-range condensers, and put them in the exact same place as the dynamics you'd have a killer recording!  Try something like Studio Projects C4.  A great starter mic, and available for approx $200 used (see the Yardsale on this site).

If you've doing regular gigs at the same place, you could find the sweet spot in the room, and perhaps hang/clamp the mics there.  I had a set of Studio Projects C4s hanging from the ceiling at a local bar for more than a year.  Some great recordings were made!

 Richard

[Chuck]

I agree with illconditioned about the Studio Projects C-4's. A used pair will not cost much more than a couple SM57's and will make a noticably better sounding recording. I also like the Church STC-11's. If you go that route, you won't need phantom power either.

[colors]

Just to clarify, I know that 57s are dynamics mics, and logically thinking, probably not anyone's first choice.  I actually had a choice between a few different condensers pairs, including a pair of ATM33a's.  I tried them all and liked the sound of the dynamics best for what we were doing.  Such and amazing warm sound.  I will admit for different rooms and ensembles, a condenser pair is probably the best route though.

[illconditioned]

Just to clarify, I know that 57s are dynamics mics, and logically thinking, probably not anyone's first choice.  I actually had a choice between a few different condensers pairs, including a pair of ATM33a's.  I tried them all and liked the sound of the dynamics best for what we were doing.  Such and amazing warm sound.  I will admit for different rooms and ensembles, a condenser pair is probably the best route though.

I don't think ATM33a are that good.  Try a condensor pair, a little better one, and see what you think.  The lowest I would go is the Studio Projects C4, $200 used.  If you've got money, get Beyerdynamic MC930set (stereo pair) for approx. $800 street.  Perhaps you can borrow (or rent) a pair to try out.  Then you will know if you want to buy them.

  Richard

[Belexes]

I just used the SP C4's I got from the YS for the first time this weekend and am very pleased with the results.  A lot of performance for not a lot of $.

[Javier Cinakowski]

If you don't have vocals, boundry mics are the way to go for Jazz.   Get two boundry mics (perhaps the Audio Technica -U851R)  and a Marantz PMD660.

This way you can place the mics unobtrusivly, on-stage, in any possition you desire.  With the package I described below you dont need a mic stand or cables....

2- U851R = $300
1- Marantz PMD660 = $425
 

[dallman]

Just to clarify, I know that 57s are dynamics mics, and logically thinking, probably not anyone's first choice.  I actually had a choice between a few different condensers pairs, including a pair of ATM33a's.  I tried them all and liked the sound of the dynamics best for what we were doing.  Such and amazing warm sound.  I will admit for different rooms and ensembles, a condenser pair is probably the best route though.

I don't think ATM33a are that good.  Try a condensor pair, a little better one, and see what you think.  The lowest I would go is the Studio Projects C4, $200 used.  If you've got money, get Beyerdynamic MC930set (stereo pair) for approx. $800 street.  Perhaps you can borrow (or rent) a pair to try out.  Then you will know if you want to buy them.

  Richard

Not yet know but really well priced and (perhaps) barely in production are the Berliner CM 33's. Anyone out there who has heard what they can do chime in. For under $500 for a pair, it is a great deal.
http://www.berlinerusa.com/index-3.html
http://www.vintagesonics.com/index.php?main_page=advanced_search_result&search_in_description=1&keyword=berliner+cm+33