Author Topic: Mount for Church Audio Cardoids (Read 8023 times)

MarkF · « **on:** June 13, 2007, 11:46:41 PM »

I am looking for a mount for the CA cardoid mics to be used open situations.

Is this what I need?

SOUND PROFESSIONALS - PREMIUM T MOUNT FOR ALL MINI MICROPHONES.
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/SP-GNA-3

Whats a good span length - 12inches?

Are there other already made options?

evilchris · « **Reply #1 on:** June 14, 2007, 01:27:02 AM »

I think I'd go for the 24" and add the shockmount.

Keyd · « **Reply #2 on:** June 15, 2007, 04:10:28 AM »

How do they mount to the mics?

Kindguy · « **Reply #3 on:** June 15, 2007, 02:12:18 PM »

I use this & it is the 12in version. The 24 would be to long IMO. It would be to hard to get the mics DIN/ortf ect ect......

Keyd, The mics slip into the windscreens.

Keyd · « **Reply #4 on:** June 15, 2007, 07:14:07 PM »

Quote from: Kindguy on June 15, 2007, 02:12:18 PM

I use this & it is the 12in version. The 24 would be to long IMO. It would be to hard to get the mics DIN/ortf ect ect......

Keyd, The mics slip into the windscreens.

Thanks for all the info. That is easy. I didn't realize the wind screens came with it. Too easy I missed it.

I will give you a ticket when I am allowed to you Kindguy.

1westkc3 · « **Reply #5 on:** June 15, 2007, 08:13:35 PM »

Quote from: Kindguy on June 15, 2007, 02:12:18 PM

I use this & it is the 12in version. The 24 would be to long IMO. It would be to hard to get the mics DIN/ortf ect ect......

Keyd, The mics slip into the windscreens.

SP will cut this mount to any length you desire. (Naturally you will pay for the extra length they cut.) I got a 24" cut to 17" for a specific application. It works great. So they'll cut down the 12" to 7.9" (DIN) or 6.7" "ORTF" if you want.

Chomps · « **Reply #6 on:** June 19, 2007, 08:07:03 AM »

so the SP Tbar works for the CA mics?
I have this bar already and used it with my cmc2a's.
just ordered some CA mics and was thinking i was going to need something else.

Keith

greatape · « **Reply #7 on:** July 12, 2007, 05:46:11 PM »

Does this mount come with the adapter for attaching to my camcorder accessory shoe, as shown in this picture?:
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/images/gold/full/SP-GNA-4.jpg

Also, I'm still a little confused how I'll get my Church Audio mics in this thing. You just slide them into the holes in the windscreens? Is there a clamp that tightens?
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/images/gold/full/SP-GNA-3-F.jpg

One more thing. . .how badly will I miss the shock mount if I don't order it?

stantheman1976 · « **Reply #8 on:** July 14, 2007, 04:12:21 PM »

I'm working on a DIN mount made from PVC if anyone is interested. I'm making a couple extras just in case. I built 3 this afternoon and painted them black. They are drying now. I'll post pics if anyone is interested. It's basically a short piece of 1/2" PVC with a 45 degree slip on each side and a 1 1/2" pice of the same PVC protruding. I drilled holes in the back where the mics slip through. Then if I put the windscreens on and tuck them inside the pipe a bit and drape the wires so there's a small amount of tension the mics sit in place perfectly. I also drilled a hole in the middle on the main bar and put a 3/8" bolt through that can be used with an adapter or like I'll do put inside a clamp that has a removable piece.

kuuan · « **Reply #9 on:** July 14, 2007, 08:59:51 PM »

good, good stantheman, very interesting, wish good succes for your build!
Yes please do post pics of your mounts!
( just abt, tobuild my own )

cheers,
kuuan

stantheman1976 · « **Reply #10 on:** July 14, 2007, 10:24:40 PM »

Here's what I came up with. The mics slip in through the holes in the back and with the windscreens on they fit in just right and stay secure. It's pretty obvious I went for function, not beauty. I plan to leave the screw and get a nut to secure it. I bough some nuts, but they were fine thread and won't work. The capsules might actually end up being about 18cm apart so whether they are true 100% DIN configuration is up to personal opinion. 1cm isn't going to make a huge sonic difference so I'm not that concerned. I did build a couple extra if anyone is interested.

h4nk3f4n · « **Reply #11 on:** July 15, 2007, 01:34:50 AM »

Niiiiice man! I thought you said you weren't good at measuring and cuttin and stuff?

Anyhow man good job! +T

h4nk3f4n

MSTaper · « **Reply #12 on:** July 15, 2007, 01:43:03 AM »

Hey stan, does it matter how far apart the mics are? How far apart are yours. Nice mount! rWc3523

jkbyram · « **Reply #13 on:** July 15, 2007, 03:31:12 AM »

http://www.dpamicrophones.com/

they have a section called microphone university which discussed various stereo recording techniques. spacing does matter.

stantheman1976 · « **Reply #14 on:** July 15, 2007, 08:56:40 AM »

Spacing supposedly does matter a good deal, but be very truthful in this answer: Is ANYONE going to notice if a pair of mics were spaced 18cm apart instead of 20cm? No. I cut these having DIN and DIN-A mixed in my head. I was measuring for 17cm thinking it was DIN. When all is said and done the mics end up 18cm apart measuring from the middle of each capsule, 17cm from inside to inside. So in reality these are DIN-A bars. I personally thing a fussing over a couple centimeters is splitting hairs. I made these so they'd look half decent and hold my mics in the same configuration every time.

jkbyram · « **Reply #15 on:** July 15, 2007, 09:16:10 AM »

i agree that a centimeter here or there is not much. russ was talking about a 24" bar though. 18cm and 24" would be a different soundstage to listen too.

stantheman1976 · « **Reply #16 on:** July 15, 2007, 01:18:07 PM »

Agreed. You just never know who technical some people want to get. I try to see things from all sides.

MSTaper · « **Reply #17 on:** July 16, 2007, 10:18:13 AM »

So is there an ideal distance, as far as the CA cards go, or is it the same for all mics? I'll be using the CA cards if that helps. Thanks, rWc3523

stantheman1976 · « **Reply #18 on:** July 16, 2007, 10:41:56 AM »

There are numerous configurations. Spacing and positioning depends on the type of mic used and the recording technique. Brand of the mics doesn't matter. You can experiement with any style you want. The main thing is to get the mics pointed at the source and make sure they stay there. I'm of the belief that 9 out of 10 people won't hear the difference between mics spaced 2' apart or 2" apart. As long as you are close enough to your source to pick up clear sounds and have good quality mics I honestly don't believe spacing matters that much. Audiophiles sometimes get caught up in the minute details. The whole point of recording is to capture a moment and enjoy it.

MSTaper · « **Reply #19 on:** July 16, 2007, 11:30:20 AM »

Cool. As soon as I get the mics I'll be able to do that. In the meantime, I'll be playing with the R-09 and its internal mics.

For a loud rock band (one you really can't talk over), how close is "close". I would think too close would create some distortion, but I haven't tried it so I really don't know. Is it all tied to the recording levels? rWc3523

SparkE! · « **Reply #20 on:** July 16, 2007, 11:30:50 AM »

Spacing will matter more to you if you listen to the recording through headphones.

stantheman1976 · « **Reply #21 on:** July 16, 2007, 11:48:05 AM »

Quote from: russ3523 on July 16, 2007, 11:30:20 AM

Cool. As soon as I get the mics I'll be able to do that. In the meantime, I'll be playing with the R-09 and its internal mics. For a loud rock band (one you really can't talk over), how close is "close". I would think too close would create some distortion, but I haven't tried it so I really don't know. Is it all tied to the recording levels? rWc3523

I'm sure there's some "ideal" distance but I don't know it. On most occasions the soundboard will be set pretty much dead center and at a distance that everything can be heard clearly and the mix can be judged correctly. So most times if you can get directly in front of the board this is best. You'll often see the acronym FOB used when discussing a recording. It stands for Front Of Board. If you can get in front of the soundboard and get the mics elevated over peoples' heads you'll pull a good recording most times.

If you are off center then I've seen it recommended a few times to try and get directly in line with the speakers on that side and point directly at that stack.

In either of those cases you should pull a good recording as long as the venue acoustics are decent.

MSTaper · « **Reply #22 on:** July 16, 2007, 12:23:49 PM »

Yeah, well, I will probably have some interesting results here locally since I don't know if there's a venue here with decent acoustics!

In many cases, I will NOT be able to get dead center just because of the layout of the venues. We have some rather creative set ups here. One has an elevated stage so that one will be tricky and I wouldn't set up mics in the center because of the dancers! Most likely I will be off center. Like I said, there will definitely be a period of experimentation! Thanks for the advice, rWc3523

stantheman1976 · « **Reply #23 on:** July 16, 2007, 01:08:19 PM »

As long as you can keep the mics aimed at the actual source you should be alright. If you're off center get to one side and aim at that speaker stack. Be creative and have fun. If you happen to know any owners or workers at a local bar or club see if you can attach a permanent mount somewhere good. I know one user here did that. He got permission and put a T bar on the ceiling of a couple different places. That way you never have to worry about placement or people getting in your way. If you don't know anyone simply ask to speak to the manager and be very nice no matter what reaction you get. Make sure you tell them you'd be recording bands that don't mind you taping them and offer copies of what you record. Another idea is to use clamps or other means to attach to a support pole if the building has any. I'd say pick a couple venues and check them out beforehand if you are able.

MSTaper · « **Reply #24 on:** July 16, 2007, 02:19:17 PM »

Thanks. Luckily I know most of the local bands (I've written about them for the local newspaper) and some of the venue owners. I've contacted a few bands already and they're all cool with recording. Some of the older musicians here I doubt would allow it, but that's a generational thing. Thanks, russ c

Brennan · « **Reply #25 on:** July 17, 2007, 11:33:11 PM »

My CA mics have the clips, for use in stealth situations. Could you still use them w/ a stand, or would you have to rig something up made of PVC to allow space for the clips?

That make any sense?

MSTaper · « **Reply #26 on:** July 18, 2007, 01:41:44 PM »

That's probably what I'll have to do since I ordered mine with the clips. Seems like you could cut a notch for the clips to slide through into the pvc. I have ideas, but carrying them out is another thing!

russ3523

evilchris · « **Reply #27 on:** July 18, 2007, 03:22:54 PM »

I'm working on DIY plans to build a mount similar to the Neumann DA-AK, but designed to have one mic and mount on a t-bar of some sort.

That should let me use my CA cards (w/ clips) and the DIY dead rats that I made with little or no trouble.

I might build one specifically for XY/90, too.

greatape · « **Reply #28 on:** July 19, 2007, 08:04:30 PM »

Quote from: Brennan on July 17, 2007, 11:33:11 PM

My CA mics have the clips, for use in stealth situations. Could you still use them w/ a stand, or would you have to rig something up made of PVC to allow space for the clips?

That make any sense?

Sound Professionals has this mount that accommodates Church Audio mics with alligator clips:
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/SP-GNA-2

I think I'm going to buy it.

Brennan · « **Reply #29 on:** July 19, 2007, 08:14:28 PM »

Looks nice, but $25/clip?

Humbug · « **Reply #30 on:** July 20, 2007, 09:20:00 AM »

I know I've posted this before (another person on here has used a wooden ruler), but this is an extremely cheap way of open taping with stealth mics. Note I've since modified my technique to DIN (it'a a piece of scrap plastic, held tight with a mic supply adaptor, so you can clip the mics how you like), and tidied the cables:

heyitsmejess · « **Reply #31 on:** July 21, 2007, 01:27:04 AM »

Quote from: greatape on July 19, 2007, 08:04:30 PM

Quote from: Brennan on July 17, 2007, 11:33:11 PM
My CA mics have the clips, for use in stealth situations. Could you still use them w/ a stand, or would you have to rig something up made of PVC to allow space for the clips?

That make any sense?

Sound Professionals has this mount that accommodates Church Audio mics with alligator clips:
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/SP-GNA-2

I think I'm going to buy it.

all you would need is some rigid tubing of some sort....like small electrical conduit, fuel line, or something similar.

cut to size, bend to desired angle, attach the clips to each end, mount on your stand and go with it.

edit....just saw this.....

http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,87831.0.html