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Gear / Technical Help => Microphones & Setup => Topic started by: vanark on February 08, 2019, 09:35:55 PM

Title: Shockmount options for Shapeways Active DINa and ORTF mounts
Post by: vanark on February 08, 2019, 09:35:55 PM
Recently got some actives and ordered a couple of SRS Recording Services Shapeways mounts. My mounts are Rycote InVision INV 7HG MKIII and they are a bit too wide for the SRS active mounts. The DINa center portion is 2 3/8" wide and the ORTF is 2 1/4". When placed in the Rycote, the DINa is a tight fit (width-wise) and the actives do fit, but the ORTF has the active holders too close to the Rycote mount and is not usable.

Is there a different Rycote model that will work for this?
Should I switch to a Shure A53M instead? Will the SRS mount fit through the center easy enough? I'm trying to imagine how to get the end through the hole far enough to slide the center portion through.

Here is a image of the SRS mount style

(https://images1.sw-cdn.net/product/picture/710x528_17311122_10011990_1484406992.jpg)
Title: Re: Shockmount options for Shapeways Active DINa and ORTF mounts
Post by: heathen on February 08, 2019, 09:47:18 PM
You could try the Rode SM4-R.  The lyres can be moved around, and you can get them down to 1" apart if you want.
Title: Re: Shockmount options for Shapeways Active DINa and ORTF mounts
Post by: vanark on February 08, 2019, 10:00:20 PM
That looks interesting. Is there a low profile base like the SRS Rycote base?
Title: Re: Shockmount options for Shapeways Active DINa and ORTF mounts
Post by: darby on February 08, 2019, 10:02:53 PM
Scott at Shapeways makes mounting bases (https://www.ebay.com/itm/Mounting-Base-for-Rycote-Single-and-Duo-Lyres-/132053321076?hash=item1ebefdc574) and you can order lyres (https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1083022-REG/rycote_042270_cyclone_pair_of_univ.html) from B&H
this is what I do for DINa and ORTF where the typical Rycote is too wide
Title: Re: Shockmount options for Shapeways Active DINa and ORTF mounts
Post by: vanark on February 08, 2019, 10:07:35 PM
I have the base, so just need the lyres. I think I knew that, but forgot I could get just the lyres. Might have to buy another base to use with my PAS bar setup that will be more stable in the standard Rycote mount. Thanks for the idea.

Anyone other ideas?
Title: Re: Shockmount options for Shapeways Active DINa and ORTF mounts
Post by: vanark on February 08, 2019, 10:08:45 PM
Which shore do I want?
Title: Re: Shockmount options for Shapeways Active DINa and ORTF mounts
Post by: voltronic on February 09, 2019, 04:31:09 PM
Which shore do I want?

For anything very light weight, you absoultely want the the softest 62-shore, part number 042255.  This is what I used for my DIY mounts that I use with my CM3s which are very light.
http://mymic.rycote.com/products/lyre/modular-lyre-upgrades/pair-of-single-lyre-62-19_25-with-modular-adaptor-screws/ (http://mymic.rycote.com/products/lyre/modular-lyre-upgrades/pair-of-single-lyre-62-19_25-with-modular-adaptor-screws/)

Here is where I bought mine.  Other sellers typically have them on special order, but this company tends to keep them in stock:
https://www.performanceaudio.com/rycote-modular-lyre-set-19-25mm-soft-2-pack.html (https://www.performanceaudio.com/rycote-modular-lyre-set-19-25mm-soft-2-pack.html)

I don't know which actives you have or what they weigh with the capsules.  If they have a decent amount of weight to them, then you may actually want the 72-shore lyres.  I use a pair of these with an SRS base when using my CM3s with an SRS stereo bar, but they are too stiff to effectively isolate the CM3s when mounted individually.  The 62 lyres work perfectly for this.
Title: Re: Shockmount options for Shapeways Active DINa and ORTF mounts
Post by: vanark on February 09, 2019, 05:00:43 PM
Thanks for the feedback.

Ironically, they are out of stock at the link you provided, but in stock at B&H.
Title: Re: Shockmount options for Shapeways Active DINa and ORTF mounts
Post by: vanark on February 09, 2019, 05:13:12 PM
BTW, 2 capsules and 2 actives together weigh 108g/3.8oz., 120g/4.2oz. with SRS mounting bar.
Title: Re: Shockmount options for Shapeways Active DINa and ORTF mounts
Post by: voltronic on February 09, 2019, 06:42:57 PM
Thanks for the feedback.

Ironically, they are out of stock at the link you provided, but in stock at B&H.

Whoops; missed that.  Usually it's the other way around.

EDIT: Actually, they aren't in stock at B&H either.  They are a special order item.  In any case, I no longer recommend 62 lyres for your application - see my other reply below.
Title: Re: Shockmount options for Shapeways Active DINa and ORTF mounts
Post by: voltronic on February 09, 2019, 06:53:57 PM
BTW, 2 capsules and 2 actives together weigh 108g/3.8oz., 120g/4.2oz. with SRS mounting bar.

In that case, I think you might be better off going with the 72-shore lyres, which are what comes standard with the INV-6 and INV-7.  The CM3s are only around 30g each, and the 62-shore lyres are intended for the Sennheiser MKH which are around the same mass.  62-shore is perfect for them, but for something more than double the mass, I would go with 72.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/629607-REG/Rycote_042210_042210_19_25mm_Lyre.html (https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/629607-REG/Rycote_042210_042210_19_25mm_Lyre.html)
https://www.amazon.com/Rycote-Universal-19-25mm-Lyres-Upgrade/dp/B012F5PPUM (https://www.amazon.com/Rycote-Universal-19-25mm-Lyres-Upgrade/dp/B012F5PPUM)
https://www.adorama.com/ry042271.html?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIxJaSoo7F2QIV0IKzCh0CEwLwEAYYASABEgJyvfD_BwE (https://www.adorama.com/ry042271.html?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIxJaSoo7F2QIV0IKzCh0CEwLwEAYYASABEgJyvfD_BwE)
Title: Re: Shockmount options for Shapeways Active DINa and ORTF mounts
Post by: vanark on February 09, 2019, 10:17:23 PM
Thanks, volt.  I was hoping you'd step in and give feedback.
Title: Re: Shockmount options for Shapeways Active DINa and ORTF mounts
Post by: Ronmac on February 24, 2019, 08:57:08 AM
Another thing to consider with shock mounting mics is the effect the cables have on transmitting mechanical noise. The cable should be looped and secured in a way that it does not add significantly to the weight borne by the suspension and offers as little as possible impedance to the movement of the lyres. An improperly secured cable will render any shock mount system useless.

Title: Re: Shockmount options for Shapeways Active DINa and ORTF mounts
Post by: voltronic on February 24, 2019, 12:16:35 PM
Another thing to consider with shock mounting mics is the effect the cables have on transmitting mechanical noise. The cable should be looped and secured in a way that it does not add significantly to the weight borne by the suspension and offers as little as possible impedance to the movement of the lyres. An improperly secured cable will render any shock mount system useless.

Yes, this is critically important.  DSatz and a few others have discussed this at length recently.
Title: Re: Shockmount options for Shapeways Active DINa and ORTF mounts
Post by: DSatz on May 02, 2019, 05:53:20 PM
I ordered some Rycote lyres from daleproaudio.com on Sunday and received them yesterday (Wednesday). I didn't ask for special rush service, either.

(I prefer to buy pro audio equipment from local, independent pro audio dealers because if people don't do that, there soon won't be any local, independent pro audio dealers--and I want them to exist.)

By the way, voltronic, I've been helped quite a lot by your posts on this topic.
Title: Re: Shockmount options for Shapeways Active DINa and ORTF mounts
Post by: voltronic on May 02, 2019, 06:49:55 PM
I ordered some Rycote lyres from daleproaudio.com on Sunday and received them yesterday (Wednesday). I didn't ask for special rush service, either.

(I prefer to buy pro audio equipment from local, independent pro audio dealers because if people don't do that, there soon won't be any local, independent pro audio dealers--and I want them to exist.)

By the way, voltronic, I've been helped quite a lot by your posts on this topic.

Dale was not on my radar as a good source of Rycote lyres, but they are now, thanks to you.

Also, I'm glad my incessant Rycote posts have been helpful.  If I can help you with something in this realm, that's saying quite a bit.  My experience using the very lightweight and vibration-sensitive Line Audio mics is what initially led me to dig below the surface of shock mounting.

As I said in another one of these threads, I have to give credit to John Willett who pointed me in the right direction, and then especially to Simon Davies at Rycote who finally de-mystified the single lyre / duo-lyre situation I was struggling with.

I get the strong impression that Rycote is similar to Schoeps, in the sense that both are highly respected companies with a large international customer base, but neither has compromised their customer relations or service as they have grown to what they are today.
Title: Re: Shockmount options for Shapeways Active DINa and ORTF mounts
Post by: John Willett on May 05, 2019, 06:39:50 AM
Another thing to consider with shock mounting mics is the effect the cables have on transmitting mechanical noise. The cable should be looped and secured in a way that it does not add significantly to the weight borne by the suspension and offers as little as possible impedance to the movement of the lyres. An improperly secured cable will render any shock mount system useless.
Yes, this is critical.

I have a bundle of the Rycote thin and flexible XLR tails which are connected from the microphone, looped and go through the cable clamp - the main cable is connected after the cable clamp.

I have talked a lot to the person who did all the acoustic research and designed the Rycote mounts and he went into detail with me how important this is - in fact, the cable is xmore important than the shockmount itself in minimising "handling" noise.

(https://cvp.com/images/products/altimage/21%2011%2020141416585591017013%20image%201.jpg)