Topic: Microtrack setup

[suites]

I want to buy the Microtack to do some concert recordings and I had a few questions:

1.   Why cant I just buy that with the memory card and tape at shows?  It seem like everyone adds mics, add'l power, wires and such.

2.   If it is that much better with the add'l mics, ect.....Can anyone give me a simple rig plan and a place that I can purchase the entire package togther.

Thanks

I just want a stelth type setup that is easy to use.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance.......I would like to get it in time for Langerado Festival in March.

SUITES

[Brian Skalinder]

1.   Why cant I just buy that with the memory card and tape at shows?  It seem like everyone adds mics, add'l power, wires and such.

You can.  But you likely won't be happy with the results.  Try it, see if you like it.  If not, then add gear as necessary.

2.   If it is that much better with the add'l mics, ect.....Can anyone give me a simple rig plan and a place that I can purchase the entire package togther.

Start here.  Read.  Learn.  Listen.  Then provide some additional information:

Open or stealth?
What kind of music in what sort of venues?
Budget?

[suites]

Thanks for the response.

Mostly Stealth, rock shows, Wilco, Drive By Truckers, U2, MMJ, Stones.....basically that kind of stuff.

Lets say budget of $1000-$1500 total.

Is there a place where I can purchase the MT and the otehr stuff at one time (bundle).

Thanks again

[bconnolly]

Is there a place where I can purchase the MT and the otehr stuff at one time (bundle).

www.sound-professionals.com

Get some SP-CMC-8s with a SP-SPSB-6 battery box.  Run the battery box into the MT's 1/4" inputs using soundpro's MINI-TRS dongle.  That's all you need and it won't run you more than 300 dollars.

[grider]

well known retailers for this unit and all the other recording gear you would need, including mics and such, are:

sonicsense.com
cascademedia.net
oade.com
micsupply.com

as for why you need the additional gear, with the microtracker you will need to patch a signal from a taping rig to your unit, all this Microtracker does is record a signal, it of course does not have mics or anything else, its just a recorder, so if there are no tapers at a show and you show up with your Microtracker you will not be able to record the show, which is why you really need all of your own gear in addition to the Microtracker unit

[Brian Skalinder]

At that budget, for stealth, I'd consider DPA 4061 > battery box > R1

[RebelRebel]

[suites]

so you would not recomend getting the MT?

[RebelRebel]

i bought one as a inexpensive backup to my 722 and it did not impress me...couldnt even get it to charge or power on so I took the thing back to the store(here in germany) and took it as a sign not to get one.

reviews are mixed here....search all the threads..you have people on both sides of the fence.

i personally wouldnt take another one if it was given to me.

do yourself a favor and grab the r-1......
Teddy

[Brian Skalinder]

For running analog-in, which you'll be doing, the R-1 is probably a better choice based on some anecdotal feedback I've seen here.  Less noisy and more proven in the field.  You may wish to consider buying the R-1 direct from the Oade Bros, since they offer an upgrade to the analog inputs.  You don't need to get the upgrade right away, but they only modify units purchased from them - so if you buy from them you'll have the option to send it back for an upgrade at a later date.

[pfife]

For running analog-in, which you'll be doing, the R-1 is probably a better choice based on some anecdotal feedback I've seen here.  Less noisy and more proven in the field.  You may wish to consider buying the R-1 direct from the Oade Bros, since they offer an upgrade to the analog inputs.  You don't need to get the upgrade right away, but they only modify units purchased from them - so if you buy from them you'll have the option to send it back for an upgrade at a later date.

Their price on a stock, unmodified R-1 is competitive as well.

[suites]

If I got this....would I need anything else?

2 Schoeps CMBI with 2 Schoeps MK4 Cardioid Capsules Plus an Edirol R1 24 bit digital recorder with both mic and line input upgrades at a great price . The CMBI/MK4 package used with a Y to 3.5MM stereo plug combined with the Oade Modified R1 offers exceptional sound quality in a tiny package

[Brian Skalinder]

If I got this....would I need anything else?

2 Schoeps CMBI with 2 Schoeps MK4 Cardioid Capsules Plus an Edirol R1 24 bit digital recorder with both mic and line input upgrades at a great price . The CMBI/MK4 package used with a Y to 3.5MM stereo plug combined with the Oade Modified R1 offers exceptional sound quality in a tiny package

I'll be stunned if you can get 2 x CMBI + 2 x MK4 + R1 + compact flash card within your budget of $1,000 - $1,500.

[JasonR]

The CMBI isn't really a stealthy setup.  See http://www.schoeps.de/E-2004/cmbi.html for full specs.

Dunno if you've gotten a price quote yet, but a rig like that would also require an adjustment to your budget.  If you can swing more like $2500, then you could assemble a rig like that, or something similar but better suited to stealthing.

- Jason

[suites]

forget budget for a second....If I got that package, would it be complete and easy to use.

[JasonR]

forget budget for a second....If I got that package, would it be complete and easy to use.

Complete: Yes
Easy to use: Yes
Stealthy: Not on yer life. 

[suites]

The CMBI isn't really a stealthy setup.  See http://www.schoeps.de/E-2004/cmbi.html for full specs.

Dunno if you've gotten a price quote yet, but a rig like that would also require an adjustment to your budget.  If you can swing more like $2500, then you could assemble a rig like that, or something similar but better suited to stealthing.

- Jason

Yeah...I want Stealthy and easy to use....

[suites]

At that budget, for stealth, I'd consider DPA 4061 > battery box > R1

What is battery box....is that a generic term.

[RebelRebel]

stealth???..ok DPA 4061, MMA 6000 and r1....(doesnt get much stealthier!! mma is tiny...not much biggert than a deck of cards!)

the mma 6000 is the heat. the 4061s are the heat...the oade r1 is the heat....

schoeps mk4>>>lemosax/nbox>>>r1/mt(need actives for sax)

those two are both top notch

[Brian Skalinder]

What is battery box....is that a generic term.

Generic term, yes.  It provides power to the mics - learn more here:  http://taperssection.com/index.php?board=46.0

There are at least a couple different ones available for the DPA 4061s - the DPA model (MPS something-or-other), a Sound Professionals model (don't know the specific model #), or a custom battery box.

stealth???..ok DPA 4061, MMA 6000 and r1....(doesnt get much stealthier!! mma is tiny...not much biggert than a deck of cards!)

schoeps mk4>>>lemosax/nbox>>>r1/mt(need actives for sax)

those two are both top notch

The latter is also WAY above budget.  The former as well, but not by as severe a margin.

[RebelRebel]

above budget, etc

forget budget for a second....If I got that package, would it be complete and easy to use.

[Brian Skalinder]

Ah, well, if budget is no concern, my favorite stealth package would be:

Schoeps MK41 (or MK4) / KCY 250/2 Ig > Sonosax SX-M2/LS2 > Oade-modded Edirol R-1

[TNJazz]

the mma 6000 is the heat. the 4061s are the heat...the oade r1 is the heat....

Wait a minute...I thought I read somewhere that C1000s were the heat?   

Without an extra $1K or so you won't be able to make a nice stealthy Schoeps setup for what you're trying to do.  The DPA recommendations are right on the money, although I think the Microtrack is not as bad as some folks make it out to be.  It has clear advantages over the R1, but then again a lot of people really like the A/D in the R1...

Dirk

[NJFunk]

as for why you need the additional gear, with the microtracker you will need to patch a signal from a taping rig to your unit, all this Microtracker does is record a signal, it of course does not have mics or anything else, its just a recorder, so if there are no tapers at a show and you show up with your Microtracker you will not be able to record the show, which is why you really need all of your own gear in addition to the Microtracker unit

Just to clarify, the MT does come with a microphone, a little T-mic that plugs into the 1/8" socket.  I assume that is the reason for the initial inquiry.  I wouldn't recommend recording with that mic, but there's no reason it wouldn't technically work.

On another note, my MT has worked perfectly since day one, although I've only used it with the SPDIF input.  YMMV.

[suites]

stealth???..ok DPA 4061, MMA 6000 and r1....(doesnt get much stealthier!! mma is tiny...not much biggert than a deck of cards!)

the mma 6000 is the heat. the 4061s are the heat...the oade r1 is the heat....

schoeps mk4>>>lemosax/nbox>>>r1/mt(need actives for sax)

those two are both top notch

Cool...would I need 2 4061 or do you get just 1....

If I get the 4061..MMA6000 and RI...I would be all set to record.

[pfife]

stealth???..ok DPA 4061, MMA 6000 and r1....(doesnt get much stealthier!! mma is tiny...not much biggert than a deck of cards!)

the mma 6000 is the heat. the 4061s are the heat...the oade r1 is the heat....

schoeps mk4>>>lemosax/nbox>>>r1/mt(need actives for sax)

those two are both top notch

Cool...would I need 2 4061 or do you get just 1....

2

If I get the 4061..MMA6000 and RI...I would be all set to record.

You'd still need a memory card for the R1, and a cable to go from the mma6000 to the R1.   That's the rig I have right now, and I like it much.

[Ed.]

if i were starting over and had no budget to assemble a stealth rig, it'd either be 4061's>mma6000>r1 or mk4's>nbox+>r1.  The latter of the two being more expensive and a bit bigger...but they're also cards...which is another choice for ya...cards or omni's.

either way, you're gonna make nice tapes.

the mt, is hit and miss.  So far out of all of my taping experiences with it...I've lost about half the shows I've recorded with it....either due to corrupt files, it locking up, resetting itself to default settings, etc.  Its starting to get old...but if they ever get it right, it'll be a great little machine.  still, the r1 has clear advantages especially running line in.

[cpatch]

At this point in the game you may want to wait until more information is available about the Edirol R-09 unless you're in a hurry. For stealth I'd definitely consider that over an R-1 if you've decided against the MT.

Craig

[suites]

stealth???..ok DPA 4061, MMA 6000 and r1....(doesnt get much stealthier!! mma is tiny...not much biggert than a deck of cards!)

the mma 6000 is the heat. the 4061s are the heat...the oade r1 is the heat....

schoeps mk4>>>lemosax/nbox>>>r1/mt(need actives for sax)

those two are both top notch

Cool...would I need 2 4061 or do you get just 1....

2

If I get the 4061..MMA6000 and RI...I would be all set to record.

You'd still need a memory card for the R1, and a cable to go from the mma6000 to the R1.   That's the rig I have right now, and I like it much.

Great that is what I want to get.....can I buy all those things at 1 place like oade...should I get the R1 upgrade from them....what do you think we are talking as far as $$$$?

[RebelRebel]

I would get it all from Mr. Oade. If for some reason he doesnt have the mma6000(dont see it on his site)

then you can go to sonic sense www.sonicsense.com or cascade media. www.cascademedia.net OR www.sweetwater.com is another great place.

definitely get the r1 from Oade. Evil Taper here runs a modified r1, pm him and see how he likes it compared to stock.

[pfife]

I think you could probably find a memory card cheaper than what Oade sells them for, but otherwise, I think you could probably get everything from Oade.

[NJFunk]

I think you could probably find a memory card cheaper than what Oade sells them for, but otherwise, I think you could probably get everything from Oade.

I bought my MT from Oade, and at the time, he didn't even sell memory cards for them because he couldn't sell enough to be able to buy in bulk cheap enough to make a profit competing with computer and/or camera stores.  He recommended http://www.newegg.com for flash memory on-line.

[tightglobes]

I think you could probably find a memory card cheaper than what Oade sells them for, but otherwise, I think you could probably get everything from Oade.

I bought my MT from Oade, and at the time, he didn't even sell memory cards for them because he couldn't sell enough to be able to buy in bulk cheap enough to make a profit competing with computer and/or camera stores.  He recommended http://www.newegg.com for flash memory on-line.

i bought mine at http://www.zipzoomfly.com -  great prices & 2 day shipping is usually free!

[RebelRebel]

www.flashmemorystore.com

they will match prices, or did the last time I called.

teddy

[silentmark]

www.dealram.com , great site for the cheapest prices on various types of memory ...

[Gebs]

I have taken several recordings on the Microtracker.....I dont want to try and take a load of equipment into a venue with me so have kept it simple

Microtracker CF 4GB
A3 Bbox (No roll off, 0dB)
OKMII Rock

Mic in connected.....and note this

Firmware 1.5 MT, Mode set to line in, 0dB TRS input, 24/48
Attenuated by Microtracker level controls


Try it.....if you want to be stealthy you can for sure get a great recording from that set up.

I really dont want to try and take a PMD-671 or a DAT plus Phantom etc...into a very searchable show......dont get me wrong....if an open allowable show then would for sure....the UK dont have such shows tho

gebs

[tightglobes]

Firmware 1.5 MT, Mode set to line in, 0dB TRS input, 24/48
Attenuated by Microtracker level controls

where did you get firmware 1.5?  1.2.3 is the latest on the m-audio website.  i've had a huge issue with not being able to set the gain on the input to 0db & built balanced attenutating cables to compensate.

[cpatch]

Chances are he's referring to 1.1.5 and by 0dB he means without the boost.

Craig

[ghibliss]

I am using the Microtrack 2496 with a CoreSound Mic 2496 a/d which I plug my DPA 4061's into.  I run spdif Coax from the Mic 2496 to the MT and run at 24 bit/44.1 for most of the concerts which I have been to and get great results.  I am using a Kingston compact Flash Elite Pro 4GB card which is a 45X speed card.  The prices on Flash memory has dropped very quickly as you can now get a 140x speed card for the same price I paid for the 45X card three months ago.  The set-up I have is as stealthy as one could ask for and provides high performance which will satisfy the most discriminating audiophile.  If you tape at any of the smaller venues (nightclubs) which have audiences which are well behaved (quiet) the sound quality is better then any CD I have ever listened to due to the microphones and 24 bit rate.  This set-up cost very close to $2K and i am very happy with the purchase. 

I have no problems with the meters on the MT as I personally set the levels from my Mic 2496 which has reference LED's for a level of -12.5 db as well as at -1 db.  i generally set the level to have the -12.5 db lights on and then sit back and enjoy the show.  I have checked the levels on both the software which I use on the pc as well as on an Alesis recorder and the levels are exactly where they should be.  I don't seem to see any major error on levels being displayed on the Microtrack while recording however it is really not important as I am using the external a/d convertor which has a far superior dynamic range and better quality preamplifier stage.  Bypassing the front-end of the Microtrack recorder makes the greatest performance enhancement to the system.  I like the MT as a simple transport to get the digital information to the CF card and it does this without any issues presently.  I look forward to M-Audio enabling the piece to provide the 24/96 capability via spdif in the near future for even greater detail in the recordings when playback is on a high-end system. 

[dallman]

Firmware 1.5 MT, Mode set to line in, 0dB TRS input, 24/48
Attenuated by Microtracker level controls

where did you get firmware 1.5?  1.2.3 is the latest on the m-audio website.  i've had a huge issue with not being able to set the gain on the input to 0db & built balanced attenutating cables to compensate.

I had the same huge issues with the gain on the input, but just set up a cable that goes 1/8> 1/4 TR (Left and Right), and the problem went away. It really didn't impact the stealth very much, but it really improved my recordings and the feel if those long 1/4 " jacks into the MT is more solid.

I too have had tremendous success with the Microtrack, it is simple to use, but has a lot of possibilities on use, so reading the manual and experimenting will really eliminate most of the issues I've read about. The meters are really excellent!