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Author Topic: Edirol R-44 - 4 Channel Recorder (Part Tres)  (Read 97038 times)

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Offline DSatz

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Re: Edirol R-44 - 4 Channel Recorder (Part Tres)
« Reply #165 on: February 18, 2009, 09:45:56 PM »
Hi--just checking in. I bought an R-44 this afternoon, just got home, and am unpacking it now. I have a concert to record Friday night that'll need four microphones. My laptop computer setup for four-channel recording has been adequate but unwieldy, and it ties me to AC power, so I hope this thing will work.

The 8 GB SDHC card that I bought with the unit is from Lexar, but isn't on the lists I see posted here--in fact I can't find a model designation at all, unless "SD8GB-711" is it.

The only bench test I've made so far is to see whether it can light up four Schoeps PHS 48 phantom power testers simultaneously. The answer is no--three's the limit. So if I'm recording with four CMC-series microphones I'll have to use external phantom powering for two of them, which ain't the end of the world; alternatively I could use one pair of lower-current microphones along with a pair of CMC-series mikes.

--best regards
« Last Edit: June 06, 2009, 02:07:15 PM by DSatz »
music > microphones > a recorder of some sort

Offline boojum

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Re: Edirol R-44 - 4 Channel Recorder (Part Tres)
« Reply #166 on: February 19, 2009, 02:22:35 AM »
You may need an external battery pack if you are not running on wall power. 
Nov schmoz kapop.

Offline Todd R

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Re: Edirol R-44 - 4 Channel Recorder (Part Tres)
« Reply #167 on: February 19, 2009, 10:17:13 AM »
Do you know what current draw it takes to light up the PHS48 testers?  I didn't think the CMC range drew that much power (not like Audix micros or earthworks).  It's a bit disturbing to think the R44 can't adequately power 4 mics at once.
Mics: Microtech Gefell m20/m21 (nbob/pfa actives), Line Audio CM3, Church CA-11 cards
Preamp:  none <sniff>
Recorders:  Sound Devices MixPre-6, Sony PCM-M10, Zoom H4nPro

Offline Ozpeter

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Re: Edirol R-44 - 4 Channel Recorder (Part Tres)
« Reply #168 on: February 19, 2009, 04:12:40 PM »
I don't recall anyone else criticising the R-44 phantom power adequacy.  This must represent a severe test.

Offline cybergaloot

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Re: Edirol R-44 - 4 Channel Recorder (Part Tres)
« Reply #169 on: February 19, 2009, 04:14:45 PM »
How many of us are running phantom powered four mics? Seems like a lot of the R-44 crowd is running two mics and maybe pulling the soundboard.
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Offline Todd R

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Re: Edirol R-44 - 4 Channel Recorder (Part Tres)
« Reply #170 on: February 19, 2009, 04:52:34 PM »
Most of the time I use the R44, it is for running 4 mics.  Occasionally I get the opportunity to get a board feed and run that with 2 mics.  And I've been generally using my Sony D50 for 2ch work, and only run the R44 when I want to do 4ch.  As I said, sometimes for sbd+mics, but more often with 4 mics.  So far usually just to see which mic pair I prefer and not 4ch mic mixes, but I imagine I'll do that at times too.
Mics: Microtech Gefell m20/m21 (nbob/pfa actives), Line Audio CM3, Church CA-11 cards
Preamp:  none <sniff>
Recorders:  Sound Devices MixPre-6, Sony PCM-M10, Zoom H4nPro

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Re: Edirol R-44 - 4 Channel Recorder (Part Tres)
« Reply #171 on: February 19, 2009, 05:01:22 PM »
What I want to try one day is two mics at stage lip, one channel from the soundboard (its running mono anyway) and one mic pointing back at the audience. In post I can mix the soundboard channel and with the stage mics. Then take the audience track and mix it back in as needed for applause and the occasional pithy comment yelled at the band. That way I'll get a nice band recording but the applause wont sound like it is coming from so far away.
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Offline digifish_music

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Re: Edirol R-44 - 4 Channel Recorder (Part Tres)
« Reply #172 on: February 19, 2009, 06:24:46 PM »
How many of us are running phantom powered four mics? Seems like a lot of the R-44 crowd is running two mics and maybe pulling the soundboard.

Me, I have run 2 x NT1-A and 2 x AT3032 recently recording a piano, off batteries, no problems. I was only recording for 30 minutes, so I can't say anything about battery life under these conditions.

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Offline rastasean

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Re: Edirol R-44 - 4 Channel Recorder (Part Tres)
« Reply #173 on: February 19, 2009, 06:45:09 PM »
How many of us are running phantom powered four mics? Seems like a lot of the R-44 crowd is running two mics and maybe pulling the soundboard.

Me, I have run 2 x NT1-A and 2 x AT3032 recently recording a piano, off batteries, no problems. I was only recording for 30 minutes, so I can't say anything about battery life under these conditions.

digifish

So would this produce less power or the same power than the mics mentioned above?
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Re: Edirol R-44 - 4 Channel Recorder (Part Tres)
« Reply #174 on: February 19, 2009, 07:54:27 PM »
How many of us are running phantom powered four mics? Seems like a lot of the R-44 crowd is running two mics and maybe pulling the soundboard.

I'm running two pres in front of mine so I can't really say.  But I am shocked that the phantom fell short.

Offline DSatz

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Re: Edirol R-44 - 4 Channel Recorder (Part Tres)
« Reply #175 on: February 19, 2009, 11:41:36 PM »
The specifications for the R-44 give the combined limit for all four inputs as 20 mA. The PHS 48 nominally draws 4.5 mA, so four of them at once should draw about 18 mA combined--though they aren't precision instruments, so this is really only approximate.

It's even possible that the unit is just barely meeting its spec, though at the moment it doesn't quite look that way. Anyway I'll measure carefully later on and post the results. Some microphones draw more current than a Schoeps does, and people should realize that the available current is no more than what the spec sheet says.

I'm planning to record tomorrow night's concert with the first two channels fed via S/P-DIF from a Grace V3, which will power the main pair of mikes. The second pair of mikes will be needed only for the first half of the concert; I'll connect that pair directly to the recorder and power them from it. I think I should be OK that way.

--best regards
« Last Edit: June 06, 2009, 02:08:10 PM by DSatz »
music > microphones > a recorder of some sort

Offline Ozpeter

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Re: Edirol R-44 - 4 Channel Recorder (Part Tres)
« Reply #176 on: February 20, 2009, 06:29:45 AM »
So what happens if the load is exceeded?  Presumably voltage drop below 48v which would be significant for some mics and perhaps not others.

Offline Todd R

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Re: Edirol R-44 - 4 Channel Recorder (Part Tres)
« Reply #177 on: February 20, 2009, 11:05:29 AM »
So what happens if the load is exceeded?  Presumably voltage drop below 48v which would be significant for some mics and perhaps not others.

I don't imagine it would affect the voltage level of the phantom power -- it should still stay at 48v.  The issue seems to be with how much current is available.  With not enough current available, the mics will not get enough power which will lead to distortion increasing.  Lack of available current for the microphone operation would be a problem for any mic, it wouldn't be the same as whether certain mics are more or less sensitive to getting exactly 48v of phantom.
Mics: Microtech Gefell m20/m21 (nbob/pfa actives), Line Audio CM3, Church CA-11 cards
Preamp:  none <sniff>
Recorders:  Sound Devices MixPre-6, Sony PCM-M10, Zoom H4nPro

Offline Todd R

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Re: Edirol R-44 - 4 Channel Recorder (Part Tres)
« Reply #178 on: February 20, 2009, 11:10:48 AM »
Also, good to know the spec is for 20ma of total current available for phantom power.  When I got the R44, I thought I'd be using an external preamp on at least 2ch so I didn't much pay attention, but several times I find myself running 4 mics directly into the R44.

Hopefully it will provide the spec'd 20ma.  It seems a lot of condensor mics use somewhere in the range of 2-4.5ma.  IIRC, the audix m12xx micros use about 6.5ma which is somewhat high, and earthworks mics use 10ma, which is very high.  My Milabs use 4ma per mic, and the MBHOs I just picked up use 4.5ma.  So for me, even running 4ch of mics directly into the R44 shouldn't be a problem (again, if it provides the specified 20ma).

It is close enough though that if you plan to run 4 mics directly into the R44, you should find out the current draw of your mics (which unfortunately isn't always published).
Mics: Microtech Gefell m20/m21 (nbob/pfa actives), Line Audio CM3, Church CA-11 cards
Preamp:  none <sniff>
Recorders:  Sound Devices MixPre-6, Sony PCM-M10, Zoom H4nPro

Offline Scooter

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Re: Edirol R-44 - 4 Channel Recorder (Part Tres)
« Reply #179 on: February 20, 2009, 03:54:51 PM »
if the spec is exceeded the supply may overheat and fry.

Dsatz will know for sure, but even if the supply is regulated, and if the capacity is exceeded, my guess is that the voltage will indeed drop by some amount.  IIRC when the capacity for supplying current reaches max, then as more demand is placed on the crkt, voltage drops.  How this is effected by a regulator, I don't know?
« Last Edit: February 20, 2009, 04:03:23 PM by Scooter »
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