Topic: Edirol R-44 - 4 Channel Recorder (Part Tres)

[Gutbucket]

Danlynch, the phantom powering of my R-44 is a little below spec when driving four transformerless Schoeps microphones, and I prefer to avoid that situation for myself. But both the Neumann KM 150 and the DPA 4021 draw distinctly less current than the Schoeps; I wouldn't worry about using pairs of those.

David, do you have any idea how much current the Gefell MV692 draws?  I've been unable to unearth that spec and
I'm trying to determine if the R-44 will properly power two pairs of my various mics.

[Gutbucket]

Mine just arrived this afternoon.  I'll fiddle widit and re-scan the threads tonight.

[busterr]

Anyone ever use a batterygeek 10-14-88 to power the R-44? I've read they work with the R-4 so I assume they would work with this as well. The battery is (10V~14V) 8A max current output. Im not to good with specs, I assume since the R-44 takes 9-16V/1.2A, its all good on voltage, just wondering about the 8A max current...

EDIT: after a little crash course in electricity, I've learned the difference between voltage & amperage. The voltage is the the amount of power, while amperage is how fast it flows from the battery to the device, or current. Thus, on the 10-14-88, the maximum flow of power, or current, it can supply, is 8A. Since the R-44 only requires 1.2A, this is well within the limits of that particular battery. And since the voltage the batt supplies is also within the range the R-44 accepts, this battery should work just fine. (granted one of the connector tips fits), not to mention power it FOREVER, you can't kill this thing!

Im sure you folks already know all this, but Im just all proud of myself for figuring it out.  Please let me know if Im off base here...

I think you are right on track here skotdee...I own a 10-14-88 but have actually never tried it with my r-44 due to the way I do things at shows particularly w/the r-44(swap wally's and sdhc cards at every setbreak, for the sake of always coming home with something). Plus I'm often running my mr1k as well and that is the power source for that deck.
But I agree it should power it for quite some time, far longer than the standard wally's anyway.

I'm sure I could run a few tests if you would like...

[andyjah]

If it helps at all I have run two sets of Schoeps Mk21/MK22 both with CMC6 bodies into my R-44 with no issues.

[Brian Skalinder]

Breaking down the R-44 and 10-14-88 battery thing a bit...(bear with me, I had a margarita or two tonight...)

The 10-14-88 is rated at 88 watt-hours (WH).  Many people (including myself) find WH a bit confusing.  Most batteries are rated in amp-hours (AH),  not WH.  Theoritical run-time calculations are easier when using AH.  To calculate theoretical run-time¹ with a battery spec'd in AH, simply divide the AH spec of the battery by the amp (A) draw of the device one is running.  For example, a 7 AH battery using a 1 A device will provide a theoretical run-time of 7 hours (7 AH divided by 1 A).

For a battery spec'd in WH (att-hours), it's easiest if we first convert WH to AH.  Then, we may use the simple calculation noted above.  To convert a battery's WH to AH, divide the WH rating by the voltage (V).  So, using the 10-14-88 battery as an example:  an 88 WH battery using a 10V device (for example, the R-44²) provides 8.8 AH of capacity (88 WH divided by 10V = 8.8 AH).  Going back to the run-time calculation above based on AH:  since the battery's AH rating is 8.8 AH, and the R-44 draws 1.2A, the theoretical run-time is 8.8 AH divided by the 1.2 A draw, or 7.3 H (hours).

¹Note this is the theoretical run-time, which assumes perfect efficiency.  Actual run-times will be somewhat shorter.

²While the R-44 runs on 9V - 16V, the 10-14-88 battery runs on 10V - 14V.  For our calculations, we must use the lowest common voltage between the device (R-44) and battery (10-14-88):  10V.

HTH.

[kbergend]

JFTR, I ran pairs of Milab DC-196 + Senn 8040 (for alternate stereo recordings, not 4 mic) into the R-44 at Joe's Pub tonight with no problems.

Also FTR, I use a PM85-50 Li-ion 13200 mAh battery @ 11V and get about 7 hours powering the same 4 mics.

(and you're welcome, Dan)

[Gutbucket]

Thanks to lee [hookem] for answering the power-cable question three times, and everyone else for some really useful information.

I guess my major question is the phantom issue running 4-mics directly into the R-44...

Another thanks here.  Made it easy for me to find the powering info in the thread last night. Off to R-shack tonight.

I asked Doug Oade about the current of the phantom supply and he assured me there should be no problem running 4 of my mics, all of which draw around 4ma or less  (He confirmed that the Gefell MV692s draw 3ma, which is the one I was unsure about).

[Gutbucket]

Didn't need to make the Rad-shack run.  Found an extra size M plug in my desk and hacked one of the cables that came included with the 3 new Li-ion batteries I picked recently.  Ground a slot in the plug's screw-on housing for right angle cable entry and soldered it up with the correct polarity (sleeve positive, center negative).  Works a charm as a dedicated cable and needs no adapters.  I'm not going to bother making a 'Y' cable for two batteries like I did for the V3 since the internal, low-discharge rechargeable AAs I'll keep in there take over gracefully during an external battery swap.

photos-

[cybergaloot]

I like the right angle idea! Rat Shack, here I come! A little JB Weld might help. Since I'm getting four batteries I think I'll build a single battery cable and a dual battery cable for various scenarios. It'll be nice to not have to change batteries all night in the dark at a fest.

Now to get a couple of SDHC cards that will hold a run that long too (16GB 32GB ). My one gripe with the R-44 so far is that changing the SD card can be awkward. I carry a small pair of Leatherman pliers which helps.

[Gutbucket]

Testing this Kingston SD4/32GB card in there with 4 tracks running now.  When I put the card in, the machine was set for 1xstereo 24/48 and remaining time on the display read 31:26:42, which is a nice number.  With 4 tracks running for 3hrs so far, it currently shows over 12 1/2 hrs of recording time remaining.

What is the purpose of the Check function on the SD Card Utility screen?  I went looking through the menu for a R-09-like Card Info screen and that seems substituted.  The manual doesn't say much about it other than a warning that it could mangle data and to be sure to back up projects first.  Why not just reformat then?

[kbergend]

What is the purpose of the Check function on the SD Card Utility screen?  I went looking through the menu for a R-09-like Card Info screen and that seems substituted.  The manual doesn't say much about it other than a warning that it could mangle data and to be sure to back up projects first.  Why not just reformat then?

Haven't had to use it yet thankfully, but it's probably like the DOS chkdsk /f command that attempts to save the data in unclosed files if the directory gets scrambled (usually due to a sudden loss of power).

[cybergaloot]

I haven't used it either but when you move files off the card via the USB cable, it will say that it is checking the card when you disconnect from the computer.  Is that the same "check"? I dunno.   

I always reformat the card after removing all the files. I'm hoping it will prevent any error writing to the card the next time I record. Does it work? I dunno but it makes me feel better. 

[busterr]

I know some of you plan on using or do use one large SDHC card, I urge you to at least have a 2nd card with you at all times when recording. I attempted to record the headliner last night with a fresh card that had been formatted in the r-44 previously and I could not get the R-44 to stop "loading" upon power up...I was eventually forced to pull the power, eject the card, re-insert and try again to the same result..Once I switched back to the card I used for the opener it loaded in about 2 seconds. Luckily I had been recording @24/44.1 as opposed to a higher sample rate or I would not have fit the headliners set on the first card.

Not sure what the issue was. I believe I saw mention of this previously by someone in this or the team thread...just be warned, don't leave yourself without options, these cards, especially the 8 and 16gb, are quite affordable so keep a few extras in your gear bag just in case this happens to you right before showtime.

[Gutbucket]

Wise words.  I have two of these plus other smaller cards I can switch too if necessary.

I haven't used it either but when you move files off the card via the USB cable, it will say that it is checking the card when you disconnect from the computer.  Is that the same "check"? I dunno.   

Noticed that too.  I don't think it's the same check.  The menu option check takes much longer to process and asks if you're sure brfore doing it.  It does not report anything after the check, however.

The 32GB Kingston card seemed to work fine for this initial test.   No problem with 2 x stereo 24/48, 4 x mono 24/48, or 1 x mono 24/96.  The buffer monitor never seemed to fill beyond than the 1st bar.  True test will be next weekend.

[cybergaloot]

How do y'all organize your SD cards? Both physically and so that you don't get them mixed up?

For the cards I use for recording, I have a small 'leather' case that I carry them in and I've labeled them with a Sharpie with a A/B scheme, A being the size of the card and B being an individual identifier, pretty much the order in which I've bought them. So the first card in my holder is 4/1 (a 4GB card) and the last card I got was labeled 8/7 (8GB/seventh card bought). That way, fumbling around in the dark at a fest I can easily see what size the card is and keep in my head which cards have been used. I also put the used cards in the case backwards as a clue because keeping things in ~MY~ head is risky. I am getting some bigger cards so that changing them out wont be much of an issue though.

I really want to find a better case. The one I have is unnecessarily thick and if you carry it the wrong way, the cards can slide out of their slots. Good thing I only paid a buck for it. I don't like the ones with the inserts for different types of chips, the ones I've tried just don't seem to work well. What do you use?