Topic: DPA 4061 vs. AT853 (831?)RX

[Aaron41]

Hey everyone,

I'm looking to improve my stealth tapes. I'm currently running AT831. While they sound good they are severly lacking in bass. They also have a tendency to get a little overpowered during hard rock shows which I will hit from time to time.

I like the bass on 4061 tapes when they are in the right spot. But of course since they are omnis they can suffer from crowd noise which happens from time to time.

So I've thought about picking up a pair of AT853RX or perhaps getting my current AT831 phantom-modded. I'm just wondering if I'm going to get anywhere near the bass and overall quality as a pair of 4061s. I'd rather have a very good pair of cardoids than a great pair of omnis, personally.

Any help would be great guys. Thanks a lot.

[souper]

try the phantom mod - it will increase the SPL capability of the mics

cards are fine

[fuzn]

Hey everyone,

I'm looking to improve my stealth tapes. I'm currently running AT831. While they sound good they are severely lacking in bass. They also have a tendency to get a little overpowered during hard rock shows which I will hit from time to time.

I like the bass on 4061 tapes when they are in the right spot. But of course since they are omnis they can suffer from crowd noise which happens from time to time.

So I've thought about picking up a pair of AT853RX or perhaps getting my current AT831 phantom-modded. I'm just wondering if I'm going to get anywhere near the bass and overall quality as a pair of 4061s. I'd rather have a very good pair of cardoids than a great pair of omnis, personally.

Any help would be great guys. Thanks a lot.

Do you usually stealth or open tape? Phantom power is really not the best idea if you're stealthing, the extra gear is a total pain. The 4061s are omnis and such, but I was in the exact same boat as you man, I freaking DID NOT want omnis. But when you are in the spot with them around no crowd noise, they really do sound freaking amazing. You gotta hear the tapes I made with them last week in this situation... freaking amazing. Makes the 11/19 one look like trash. If you want clips feel free to pm.

The small as hell setup for the amazing sound and RIGHT ON bass really makes it worth it to just deal with it. This is all assuming you will be stealthing.

[Aaron41]

Hey everyone,

I'm looking to improve my stealth tapes. I'm currently running AT831. While they sound good they are severely lacking in bass. They also have a tendency to get a little overpowered during hard rock shows which I will hit from time to time.

I like the bass on 4061 tapes when they are in the right spot. But of course since they are omnis they can suffer from crowd noise which happens from time to time.

So I've thought about picking up a pair of AT853RX or perhaps getting my current AT831 phantom-modded. I'm just wondering if I'm going to get anywhere near the bass and overall quality as a pair of 4061s. I'd rather have a very good pair of cardoids than a great pair of omnis, personally.

Any help would be great guys. Thanks a lot.

Do you usually stealth or open tape? Phantom power is really not the best idea if you're stealthing, the extra gear is a total pain. The 4061s are omnis and such, but I was in the exact same boat as you man, I freaking DID NOT want omnis. But when you are in the spot with them around no crowd noise, they really do sound freaking amazing. You gotta hear the tapes I made with them last week in this situation... freaking amazing. Makes the 11/19 one look like trash. If you want clips feel free to pm.

The small as hell setup for the amazing sound and RIGHT ON bass really makes it worth it to just deal with it. This is all assuming you will be stealthing.

These mics will be used for stealthing. I've loved your NIN 4061 tapes.

[fuzn]

Hey everyone,

I'm looking to improve my stealth tapes. I'm currently running AT831. While they sound good they are severely lacking in bass. They also have a tendency to get a little overpowered during hard rock shows which I will hit from time to time.

I like the bass on 4061 tapes when they are in the right spot. But of course since they are omnis they can suffer from crowd noise which happens from time to time.

So I've thought about picking up a pair of AT853RX or perhaps getting my current AT831 phantom-modded. I'm just wondering if I'm going to get anywhere near the bass and overall quality as a pair of 4061s. I'd rather have a very good pair of cardoids than a great pair of omnis, personally.

Any help would be great guys. Thanks a lot.

Do you usually stealth or open tape? Phantom power is really not the best idea if you're stealthing, the extra gear is a total pain. The 4061s are omnis and such, but I was in the exact same boat as you man, I freaking DID NOT want omnis. But when you are in the spot with them around no crowd noise, they really do sound freaking amazing. You gotta hear the tapes I made with them last week in this situation... freaking amazing. Makes the 11/19 one look like trash. If you want clips feel free to pm.

The small as hell setup for the amazing sound and RIGHT ON bass really makes it worth it to just deal with it. This is all assuming you will be stealthing.

These mics will be used for stealthing. I've loved your NIN 4061 tapes.

Yeah, I don't know many people that stealth with phantom power. There really isn't a compact solution to do it... Then again, things are different in california compared to the rest of the world. This is exactly the reason why I just said screw it and went with the 4061s. Words can't express how happy I am that I did it.

[Evil Taper]

the AT mics can't touch the imaging or realism of the 4061s.  i wouldn't worry about crowd noise because it's not often that you'll encounter a show where you can't move a few feet to get away from chatty people.  that's also a major advantage of omnis, you can move around whenever you must and it doesn't effect the sound as long as you're not spinning in circles and what not.  once you tape with the 4061s you'll be able to SEE the differance in quality once you open the files on your PC, for real.  your only other option is to upgrade to some really nice cards or try going phantom with the ATs.  There's a few people who really dig how they work phantom, maybe talk to shwilly, but the 4061s are definately easier to stealth with and higher quality.

[nardo]

There's also the option of getting a pair of Sanken COS-11s. Slightly more expensive than DPA406x but some people (including myself) prefer their sound over DPA406x. Historical note (according to my distributor who also has DPA mics): the diaphragm of the DPA406x series was designed after that of the COS-11s, the COS-11s do have slightly lower self-noise, though. I'm extremely happy with them so far (taped around 20 shows within the last month 2 weeks).

http://www.sanken-mic.com/ (no affiliation, just a happy user)

In the cable section is a topic on how to connect them to a miniplug, just in case.

<EDIT> typo </EDIT>

[Evil Taper]

buy what your ears like.

[nardo]

buy what your ears like.

Definitely agree with that. Just thought I'd give another option to consider while at it.

[pfife]

Not sure how much you care about the physical size of the mics, but a while back I posted comparison pics of the capsules in the rig pics section between these two mics - right after I got the DPAs, and still had the AT853Rx.

As far as sound quality, you know where I stand.   

Edited to add:  I found the pic:

[George]

Yep, i heard that nin tape and i'm sold on dpa's, once my concert run finishes (when does it ever?) i'll sell my gear off and take a giant step forward to dpa's and the mt.

[Aaron41]

Not sure how much you care about the physical size of the mics, but a while back I posted comparison pics of the capsules in the rig pics section between these two mics - right after I got the DPAs, and still had the AT853Rx.

As far as sound quality, you know where I stand.   

Edited to add:  I found the pic:

My god those things are small. I'd have to buy a new stealth hat. 

[Unitmonster]

a lot of people are saying that they don't worry about the omni issue, but I'd have to disagree.  NOt so much on the sound issue but for the level of stress in the show.  THe one thing i found when I used omnis was that I was always busy thinking about who was talking and not enjoying the show.  Now that I use sub-cards and cards I feel pretty confident taht chatter isn't going to harm my tapes very much and can relax and enjoy myself.    Just another perspective.

[Aaron41]

a lot of people are saying that they don't worry about the omni issue, but I'd have to disagree.  NOt so much on the sound issue but for the level of stress in the show.  THe one thing i found when I used omnis was that I was always busy thinking about who was talking and not enjoying the show.  Now that I use sub-cards and cards I feel pretty confident taht chatter isn't going to harm my tapes very much and can relax and enjoy myself.    Just another perspective.

I'm always thinking about that even with cards. I'm getting better each time I hear that a chatter didn't make it on the tape. But, of course, there is the bass and quality issue. If the phantom-powered cards can produce very good sound I'd almost perfer them to an omni sound.

I'm hoping to borrow a pair of DPA 4061s for an upcoming NIN show. If it turns out solid, I'd pick up a pair for stealthing. If not, I'll look into phantom powered options.

[olyrc]

I ran AT831s in my first rig, and I've owned/borrowed a few other mics since (Oktavas, Josephsons, AT943) and switched a couple months ago to DPA 4061 > DPA mma6000 > MT2496.  I'm massively paranoid about crowd noise, but basically said screw it because of the tapes I'd heard with the DPA 406x.  I'm glad I switched.

I ran DFC, 20' from stage in the crowd for two Death Cab for Cutie shows in Portland last month and started to get pissed the first night about some of the crowd noise/chatter around me.  (I'm not the best human mic stand - I'm barely 5'8")  Then I listened to the tape.  You can tell it's a live show, but the crowd fades into the music - no chatter to be found.  Even the applause is decent - not overbearing.  I'm completely sold on the DPAs and the MT at 24/48 (still waiting for 24/96).  Now I just need to get off my ass and get a DVD-Audio program.

That said, if you're still not convinced and decide to go with ATs, I'd recommend the AT943/933 over the AT853 both for size & sound.

That is my $0.02.  Go with what your ears like.

Cheers,
Ryan