Taperssection.com
Gear / Technical Help => Microphones & Setup => Topic started by: ilduclo on December 22, 2005, 09:56:54 PM
-
so, will the bat box 9v with the switch for bass filter on and off that I bought for my
"corpsesound binaurals" work with DPA 4061's to increase the spl handling?
you guys are a great resource, thanks for all the help in the past, you rule!
-
so, will the bat box 9v with the switch for bass filter on and off that I bought for my
"corpsesound binaurals" work with DPA 4061's to increase the spl handling?
Why are you currently brickwalling the DPA's, whats the setup?
As for the question I don't know for sure but I don't think you use a standard Core Sound Battery Box >:(
DPA 4061's are what they use in their High End Binaurals and from the CS website:-
"Due to different voltage requirements, the HEB battery box is not compatible with the battery box used with the Core Sound Binaural or Core Sound Stealthy Cardioid microphones."
I think this is due to the modification CS does to powering the capsule (?Linkwitz)
But you can use a standard Sound Professionals battery box provided you have a 1/8" jack on the DPA's.
As to wether this increases spl handing of the mics it depends on what you're using as powering at the moment. DPA spec sheets quote a power requirement of between 5-50V (NB USING their adaptors DONT try phantom power without an adaptor and say I told you it was okay ::) ) so thats not particularly helpful but I've certainly read anecdotal reports that they sound better with the 9volts that they get from SP battery box.
However a number of people seem to be using them with the microtrack 1/4" TRS taking power (?5V) from the 1/8" socket and getting good records so maybe you'd have to try a 9V battery box and see if it's better than your current setup.
-
Hey, thanks for the response.
I think I need to clarify. I don’t have the Coresound modified 4061’s. I have the stock ones from DPA, actually a used set offfa EBay. I need to get them modified so they can handle Isis and Khanate type levels, I understand they can handle 144 db when powered with 9v. I already have a Coresound battery box for the old std “binaurals”, so I was hoping to be able to just get the DPA’s modified to plug into that box and then I won’t have to buy a new one.
Any thoughts on this greatly appreciated.
By the way, I usually go “mic in” to a unmodified Sony D100 dat with the -20db setting on the DAT.
thanks again
M
-
By the way, I usually go “mic in” to a unmodified Sony D100 dat with the -20db setting on the DAT.
Okay I think I understand now the mics are probably fine at this sound level it's probably the D100 preamp that's brickwalling, so your thoughts are correct you need to go line in with a battery box.
...I don't know for sure but I don't think you use a standard Core Sound Battery Box >:(
DPA 4061's are what they use in their High End Binaurals and from the CS website:-
"Due to different voltage requirements, the HEB battery box is not compatible with the battery box used with the Core Sound Binaural or Core Sound Stealthy Cardioid microphones."
I still think the above is true regardless if the mics are ebay DPA4061 or CSHEB's (all i think Len does is match these and terminate them in a 5 pin mini xlr- no actual mic modification).
As to what you should do next:-
1/ you could probably modify the CS battery box but having not seen the schematics can't help there.
2/ buy a SP battery box
3/ Start from scratch and build your own this thread seems appropriate http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=4244.0
?4/ I don't know the D100 does it have separate line in and mic in jack sockets? If so you could make a dongle to use the power from mic but going line in ala Freelunch and the Microtrack http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=51031.0 . Might be a fun project (After reading ilduclo's reply about single jack comment struckout as pointless)
-
so, the SP battery box should work ok to get the high spl's?
there is no seperate mic/line in, but there is a switch to modify the in from mic to line. I only used the line in once, and was unhappy with the low volume recording level. I had to amp it up a bunch and it ended up hissy
-
so, the SP battery box should work ok to get the high spl's?
there is no seperate mic/line in, but there is a switch to modify the in from mic to line. I only used the line in once, and was unhappy with the low volume recording level. I had to amp it up a bunch and it ended up hissy
the sp box doesn't have a switch, you plug it in and bam its now a line signal (at least thats how mine is--the only switches are for bass roll)
what exactly are you using, if you post that you will prob have more people who can help you out
-
By the way, I usually go “mic in” to a unmodified Sony D100 dat with the -20db setting on the DAT. I just bought the DPA's used and have not used them yet
-
imo you should go mics > batt box > dat
LINE level, no -20 and i think you will like it much better
-
OK, but I still need to know about the battery box. I gotta buy one so my local electronic guy can set up my mics for me. I don't really want to pay 90 for Len's box, but I will if I gotta.
-
imo you should go mics > batt box > dat
LINE level, no -20 and i think you will like it much better
I agree entirely but he's now back to needing the battery box, hence
As to what you should do next:-
1/ you could probably modify the CS battery box but having not seen the schematics can't help there.
2/ buy a SP battery box
3/ Start from scratch and build your own this thread seems appropriate http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=4244.0
If you know nothing about electonics and don't want hassle with making something then this has will work http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/SP-SPSB-6 at $49 cheaper than CS but you may want the bass roll off at an extra $20.
However if you've got a friend doing the mics whose competent I'm sure he'd have no trouble knocking up a battery box from the above schematics or canibalising the CS box you already have (of course you may not wish to do this if you intend to use the CS mics again).
-
If you're getting the dpa's
OK, but I still need to know about the battery box. I gotta buy one so my local electronic guy can set up my mics for me. I don't really want to pay 90 for Len's box, but I will if I gotta.
Just curious reading this again what are you having your local guy do?? If you've already got a 1/8" jack on the DPA's and you're buying a battery box all you need to do is plug them in! No electronic skill needed!
Of note see http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=56339.0 dylandenver doesn't seem to happy with his levels going line in on a D8 but I'm sure as was willndmb line in is the way to go, so of course the next can of worms is a pre-amp. >:D
BUT seriously I've never heard of the bands you've mentioned but if they're seriously loud you should be fine with a battery box and line in.
-
They each have a "lemo" connection to them right now, so I need him to cut them off and go with a single 1/8", I guess.....then I can get a BB with an 1/8" in and out, (again, I guess) to go to the 1/8" in on the D100. I guess all I need to know is which BB will work to give me the 120+ db handling.
-
thanks, all, for all the help, this is a great resource!
To finalize the topic, I'm getting the SP battery box since the old Corpse-sound one will not work, sounds like a great deal. It is also cheaper by $10 or so from the Corpse-sound one for the DPA's, and that includes the 2 year warranty, a extended 24" cord, and a multi-position bass rolloff filter. So, sounds like a real good deal.
thanks to all again, especially Cyberman
ilduc
-
imo you should go mics > batt box > dat
LINE level, no -20 and i think you will like it much better
I agree entirely but he's now back to needing the battery box, hence
As to what you should do next:-
1/ you could probably modify the CS battery box but having not seen the schematics can't help there.
2/ buy a SP battery box
3/ Start from scratch and build your own this thread seems appropriate http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=4244.0
If you know nothing about electonics and don't want hassle with making something then this has will work http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/SP-SPSB-6 at $49 cheaper than CS but you may want the bass roll off at an extra $20.
However if you've got a friend doing the mics whose competent I'm sure he'd have no trouble knocking up a battery box from the above schematics or canibalising the CS box you already have (of course you may not wish to do this if you intend to use the CS mics again).
correct me if i'm wrong, but the bass roll off function doesn't work in a line level situation, right? At least, this is what i've read in the past and in my own experiences it didn't seem like the bass roll off worked when going line in.
-
correct me if i'm wrong, but the bass roll off function doesn't work in a line level situation, right? At least, this is what i've read in the past and in my own experiences it didn't seem like the bass roll off worked when going line in.
Mmm.. well. that depends on the impedance of the line-in of your recorder. Most battery boxes are designed for impedances of 10Kohm, and, for example, dats have got an input impedance of 47 Kohm line in and 4,7 Kohm mic-in.
But i guess you're right, you're not getting the real bass roll off because the bboxes were designed for input impedances different than the most used all along the board (dats, microtracks and NJB3's)
-
aha, sooooo, the rolloff will not work on line in, but the box will still help handle big spl's. So, for std level concerts
I'll still go mic in with the box and whatever roll off I think is necessary.
But for LOUD shows, it would seem to be best to go line in, using the box, but ignoring the roll off functions.
correct?
-
aha, sooooo, the rolloff will not work on line in, but the box will still help handle big spl's. So, for std level concerts
I'll still go mic in with the box and whatever roll off I think is necessary.
But for LOUD shows, it would seem to be best to go line in, using the box, but ignoring the roll off functions.
correct?
Honestly, i would also go line in with a battery box. Mic ins tend to be noisy and are often frowned upon as being inferior compared to running line in with a bbox. All imho.
-
aha, sooooo, the rolloff will not work on line in, but the box will still help handle big spl's. So, for std level concerts
I'll still go mic in with the box and whatever roll off I think is necessary.
But for LOUD shows, it would seem to be best to go line in, using the box, but ignoring the roll off functions.
correct?
Not Quite As per lordbelial's posting
Mmm.. well. that depends on the impedance of the line-in of your recorder. Most battery boxes are designed for impedances of 10Kohm, and, for example, dats have got an input impedance of 47 Kohm line in and 4,7 Kohm mic-in.
The actual roll off in Hz of the battery box is only as quoted by the manufacters (Sound Professionals + Core Sounds) when the input impedance is 10k (I'm afraid I don't know the impedance of the D8)
But there will still be bass roll-off at ?47k if thats the impedance of the line in on the D8
This thread is very helpful on this subject
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=40920.0
Read the posting from DKlein especially
;D
-
then, seems line in will be Ok for ALL shows, including quiet acoustic ones?
and I'll experiment with the Bass roll off, see what I think, maybe a really bassy show...?
-
then, seems line in will be Ok for ALL shows, including quiet acoustic ones?
Your extrapolating too much here, this wasn't the situation you wanted a solution for!
I think I need to clarify. I don’t have the Coresound modified 4061’s. I have the stock ones from DPA, actually a used set offfa EBay. I need to get them modified so they can handle Isis and Khanate type levels, I understand they can handle 144 db when powered with 9v. I already have a Coresound battery box for the old std “binaurals”, so I was hoping to be able to just get the DPA’s modified to plug into that box and then I won’t have to buy a new one.
If you're taping quiet acoustics shows you may need to use mic in and amplify using the D8's preamp OR buy an external preamp and go line in.
-
then, seems line in will be Ok for ALL shows, including quiet acoustic ones?
and I'll experiment with the Bass roll off, see what I think, maybe a really bassy show...?
Well... that's not right at all.
In my experience. My last show was acoustic from a local band. I taped them with permission (and they have a copy of the show, of course), and I was running.
AT853 CMC-4 (cards) --> Battery Box from SP --> Line in NJB3 (wav 44Khz)
The problem was the levels. I knew that I was going to have very low levels, because of the moderate SPL's of the show, and I haven't got a pre yet (i'm waiting for a UA-5 to come from Belgium, just bought it from ebay without the mod, but I can handle myself a digimod.). So I had to add +12db of digital preamp in the NJB3 and the levels were fine. I was afraid of diginoises and that stuff, but the recording came out great (until a dumbass hit my stand and the mics fell until hit into a wall, but only for a brief half second you can hear a BUMP from the mics hit...)
A preamp is higly recommended when running line in @ moderate SPL sittuations. IMO.
-
I think I'll use the mic in for low SPL shows, it sure has worked OK for now, using the "CrappySoundingBinauarls"
and their switchable battery box. I haven't noticed any lack of clarity or other bad sound using it so far. Note that I am using a D100, same essentially as a M1 DAT, not a JB. Again, I was looking for BBox info for using my new (used, actually, but new to me) DPA 4061's with the D100.
So, I got the SP BBox with the switchable filters. I think I will use the filters on the mic in shows that I use, but probably not for the line in, loud SPL ones. Really, the mic in is pretty nice for the majority of the shows I attend, but there are a few that will overload even with the BB.
thanks again!
ilduc
-
ok so i am a little confused, the bass roll MUST work going line in otherwise there is no point to even making the box with bass roll
because once you plug into the box its giving you a line signal out.
you wouldn't want to plug your line signal into a mic in right
at any rate i set mine at 98 or whatever it is around there and most of the time it works fine, but a few times when i was really colse i was i had it higher
-
ok so i am a little confused, the bass roll MUST work going line in otherwise there is no point to even making the box with bass roll
because once you plug into the box its giving you a line signal out.
you wouldn't want to plug your line signal into a mic in right
at any rate i set mine at 98 or whatever it is around there and most of the time it works fine, but a few times when i was really colse i was i had it higher
Bass roll off depends on the impedance of the line/mic input.
The signal level depends on the mic and the environment (rock concert...).
That combo decides what input you want to use and what capacitance you need for roll off if any.
Get decent cardioids and you won't need roll off. (at least, that is my experience; my box was made for 47K impedance and filters (-3 db) 22 Hz and below)