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Gear / Technical Help => Recording Gear => Topic started by: Charlie Miller on October 04, 2018, 11:43:00 AM

Title: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: Charlie Miller on October 04, 2018, 11:43:00 AM
It looks like KORG is no longer making portable DSD recorders. I love my Tascam DA-3000 so much that I bought a second one. They’re linked as a 4-track. I rather not fly with a 4U rack so I need s portable DSD recorder. Any recommendations?
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: darby on October 04, 2018, 12:01:48 PM
Sony PCM-D100 (https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1008089-REG/sony_pcm_d100_portable_stereo_field.html)
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: heathen on October 04, 2018, 12:47:01 PM
https://us.astellnkern.com/blogs/news/product-information-ak-recorder
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: Nick's Picks on October 04, 2018, 01:25:08 PM
Ouch!   really cool, but expensive w/the $1700+ "music player" needed to go w/the recording sled.
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: capnhook on October 04, 2018, 01:57:17 PM
Dinosaurs are getting expensive.
 :P
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: Charlie Miller on October 05, 2018, 04:18:10 PM
https://us.astellnkern.com/blogs/news/product-information-ak-recorder

damn, that is cool
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: Charlie Miller on October 05, 2018, 04:19:45 PM
Sony PCM-D100 (https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1008089-REG/sony_pcm_d100_portable_stereo_field.html)

I was looking at that but it only does 2.8MHz and I was hoping to get 5.6MHz, but it's a possibility, thanks.
I contacted sound devices last year asking if they had any DSD recorders coming in the future and they sound they can't comment on that.
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: Nick's Picks on October 06, 2018, 12:42:29 PM
what about the "big korg" deck ?  that did 5.6MHz.   Prob. hard to locate one though.
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: Nick's Picks on October 06, 2018, 12:43:29 PM
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Korg-Mr-1000-DSD-1-Bit-Professional-Mobile-Recorder/323420231960?hash=item4b4d591918:g:qoQAAOSwBFVbhvKt
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: weroflu on October 06, 2018, 12:58:32 PM
I picked up an MR2 last year. Very happy with it as an entrance into DSD.  I looked into that AK gizmo but it was just too much $ to justify.
If I do another electronics project it will be a miniature DSD recorder.
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: jb63 on October 09, 2018, 08:02:28 PM
If you can pick up a Korg MR-1000 for $500 or under I can recommend it.
Its lighter than I thought it would be and had very clean preamps. I never take mine out any more, but use it strictly for playback and renaming files.

They come up on eBay in flocks sometimes.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Korg-Mr-1000-DSD-1-Bit-Professional-Mobile-Recorder/163296053466?hash=item26053408da:g:MN8AAOSw61FbtpBg:rk:8:pf:0

Here's another but hold out for one that has the bag, because its a nice bag.
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: Charlie Miller on October 09, 2018, 09:27:39 PM
If you can pick up a Korg MR-1000 for $500 or under I can recommend it.
Its lighter than I thought it would be and had very clean preamps. I never take mine out any more, but use it strictly for playback and renaming files.

They come up on eBay in flocks sometimes.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Korg-Mr-1000-DSD-1-Bit-Professional-Mobile-Recorder/163296053466?hash=item26053408da:g:MN8AAOSw61FbtpBg:rk:8:pf:0

Here's another but hold out for one that has the bag, because its a nice bag.

Thanks. I have a V2 so preamps not an issue. I'm gonna own one of these very soon.
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: sunshinedavedream on October 11, 2018, 03:52:03 PM
Beware the MR1000's ability to suck dry cell batteries dry quickly. I don't own a portable p/s for mine as I use it infrequently in the field but when I have used it, it ran through 2 complete sets of batteries for 2 70 minute sets. Sounds great though! If you're always getting your power from the wall wart, no problems.
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: Charlie Miller on October 14, 2018, 09:30:05 PM
Beware the MR1000's ability to suck dry cell batteries dry quickly. I don't own a portable p/s for mine as I use it infrequently in the field but when I have used it, it ran through 2 complete sets of batteries for 2 70 minute sets. Sounds great though! If you're always getting your power from the wall wart, no problems.

I’ll have AC so that shouldn’t be a problem but still good to know. Thanks
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: beatkilla on October 14, 2018, 10:00:50 PM
Beware the MR1000's ability to suck dry cell batteries dry quickly. I don't own a portable p/s for mine as I use it infrequently in the field but when I have used it, it ran through 2 complete sets of batteries for 2 70 minute sets. Sounds great though! If you're always getting your power from the wall wart, no problems.

I’ll have AC so that shouldn’t be a problem but still good to know. Thanks

The MR-1000 is the best sounding deck i've ever used IMO in DSD without any doubt.

However i am not a fan of Hardrive recorders so i use the Korg MR-2 without any regrets.
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: rippleish20 on January 02, 2019, 02:25:39 PM

I got a MR-1000 off  ebay for $500 and successfully recorded the Oteil & Friends New Years show. It sound s awesome but now I am wondering what people do to share the recordings. I am planning on DSD > WAV @ 24/48 but do people share the dff files themselves? Is there a way to combine the files the Korg creates? Can you track DFF files?

ps I used a 12v battery and powering the device was not a problem.
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: beatkilla on January 02, 2019, 07:54:43 PM

I got a MR-1000 off  ebay for $500 and successfully recorded the Oteil & Friends New Years show. It sound s awesome but now I am wondering what people do to share the recordings. I am planning on DSD > WAV @ 24/48 but do people share the dff files themselves? Is there a way to combine the files the Korg creates? Can you track DFF files?

ps I used a 12v battery and powering the device was not a problem.

You need to use Korg AUDIOGATE

https://www.korg.com/us/products/audio/audiogate4/download.php

In that download is also ds-dac setup which you do NOT need to install  unless you have a Korg DAC.

You can combine,split,(i guess you could split all the tracks)but i only split off the excess beginning and ending and than EXPORT a new DSF MASTER file for archive and listening on my Korg DSD DAC.

You can also EXPORT to WAV.

I export to 24bit 176.4 khz and than use my normal audio editor to make further changes(EQ,etc.)



Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: DSatz on January 02, 2019, 08:39:55 PM
Do you feel that your DSD recordings lose any of the qualities that you like when they're exported to PCM (WAV, etc.)?
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: rippleish20 on January 03, 2019, 07:25:55 AM

I got a MR-1000 off  ebay for $500 and successfully recorded the Oteil & Friends New Years show. It sound s awesome but now I am wondering what people do to share the recordings. I am planning on DSD > WAV @ 24/48 but do people share the dff files themselves? Is there a way to combine the files the Korg creates? Can you track DFF files?

ps I used a 12v battery and powering the device was not a problem.

You need to use Korg AUDIOGATE

https://www.korg.com/us/products/audio/audiogate4/download.php

In that download is also ds-dac setup which you do NOT need to install  unless you have a Korg DAC.

You can combine,split,(i guess you could split all the tracks)but i only split off the excess beginning and ending and than EXPORT a new DSF MASTER file for archive and listening on my Korg DSD DAC.

You can also EXPORT to WAV.

I export to 24bit 176.4 khz and than use my normal audio editor to make further changes(EQ,etc.)

Thank you very much!
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: morst on January 03, 2019, 04:28:20 PM
Do you feel that your DSD recordings lose any of the qualities that you like when they're exported to PCM (WAV, etc.)?
And if not, then why record DSD?
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: Charlie Miller on January 04, 2019, 09:15:00 PM

I got a MR-1000 off  ebay for $500 and successfully recorded the Oteil & Friends New Years show. It sound s awesome but now I am wondering what people do to share the recordings. I am planning on DSD > WAV @ 24/48 but do people share the dff files themselves? Is there a way to combine the files the Korg creates? Can you track DFF files?

ps I used a 12v battery and powering the device was not a problem.

You need to use Korg AUDIOGATE

https://www.korg.com/us/products/audio/audiogate4/download.php

In that download is also ds-dac setup which you do NOT need to install  unless you have a Korg DAC.

You can combine,split,(i guess you could split all the tracks)but i only split off the excess beginning and ending and than EXPORT a new DSF MASTER file for archive and listening on my Korg DSD DAC.

You can also EXPORT to WAV.

I export to 24bit 176.4 khz and than use my normal audio editor to make further changes(EQ,etc.)





Try dbpoweramp. It's faster than the korg software.
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: noahbickart on February 26, 2019, 04:40:22 AM
Do you feel that your DSD recordings lose any of the qualities that you like when they're exported to PCM (WAV, etc.)?

Bumping an old thread.

Does anyone want to comment on this?

I'm experiencing the other way around, as sometimes I "upsample" to DSD in audirvana+ to my mytek DSD DAC, as with most things in audio, when listening sighted, I feel I hear a difference. But I don't trust myself....
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: voltronic on February 26, 2019, 06:14:54 AM
Do you feel that your DSD recordings lose any of the qualities that you like when they're exported to PCM (WAV, etc.)?

Bumping an old thread.

Does anyone want to comment on this?

I'm experiencing the other way around, as sometimes I "upsample" to DSD in audirvana+ to my mytek DSD DAC, as with most things in audio, when listening sighted, I feel I hear a difference. But I don't trust myself....

There is a real possibility that you are presenting your DAC with a data stream it processes more accurately than others.  Not all DACs do equally well with everything that is thrown their way.  In other words, your Mytek may do a better job converting a DSD stream than it does PCM, or it may just sound "different" which you perceive as "better".

There are all kinds of things written about how upsampling PCM to higher rates/depths may or may not have benefits.  I haven't ever heard of someone saying that converting PCM to DSD giving an audible benefit, but it may be upsampling a lower-rate PCM to a higher one first before the DSD conversion.

As far as recording directly to DSD, I think it doesn't make much sense unless you (a) are not going to edit or process the files at all (which would cause them to be converted to PCM anyway), and (b) send them straight to a DAC that natively decodes DSD.
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: noahbickart on February 26, 2019, 08:29:45 AM

There is a real possibility that you are presenting your DAC with a data stream it processes more accurately than others.  Not all DACs do equally well with everything that is thrown their way.  In other words, your Mytek may do a better job converting a DSD stream than it does PCM, or it may just sound "different" which you perceive as "better”

Yes. This is why I set it up this way. But pretty lights and a bright “hdsd” lcd readout tends to create some expectation bias.

I’d love to hear some DSD masters from people who have recorded this way.
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: rippleish20 on February 26, 2019, 09:13:04 AM
I recorded a whole John Kadlecik Band run last month as well as Oteil & Friends on New years (SBD and in some cases SBD + microphones on stage) .  Aside from the fact that the music might not interested you, I have no idea how to "distribute" them other than resampling using PCM.
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: noahbickart on February 26, 2019, 03:37:26 PM
I recorded a whole John Kadlecik Band run last month as well as Oteil & Friends on New years (SBD and in some cases SBD + microphones on stage) .  Aside from the fact that the music might not interested you, I have no idea how to "distribute" them other than resampling using PCM.

why can't you upload the DSF or DFF files?
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: beatkilla on February 26, 2019, 04:04:52 PM

There is a real possibility that you are presenting your DAC with a data stream it processes more accurately than others.  Not all DACs do equally well with everything that is thrown their way.  In other words, your Mytek may do a better job converting a DSD stream than it does PCM, or it may just sound "different" which you perceive as "better”

Yes. This is why I set it up this way. But pretty lights and a bright “hdsd” lcd readout tends to create some expectation bias.

I’d love to hear some DSD masters from people who have recorded this way.

I sent you a wetransfer link with some samples.
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: rippleish20 on February 26, 2019, 05:31:19 PM
I recorded a whole John Kadlecik Band run last month as well as Oteil & Friends on New years (SBD and in some cases SBD + microphones on stage) .  Aside from the fact that the music might not interested you, I have no idea how to "distribute" them other than resampling using PCM.

why can't you upload the DSF or DFF files?

They are DFF files. I could upload them, but each set is a Proj directory with lots of DFF files.   I havent had time to research if there is a more standardized way to distribute them.
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: Nick's Picks on March 02, 2019, 12:45:34 PM
back in my DSD days, I really did like the sound of DSD > PCM 16/44.1 .    Was it better than any other straight to PCM recording?   probably not.  But I liked it.  I perceived a smoothness ...
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: jb63 on March 02, 2019, 01:35:43 PM
back in my DSD days, I really did like the sound of DSD > PCM 16/44.1 .    Was it better than any other straight to PCM recording?   probably not.  But I liked it.  I perceived a smoothness ...

I agree 100%!
The files are a pain in the ass, but you can re-lable them right in the deck and archive them and spit them out at any bit rate later, and I still sit on my MR1 as the best mini recorder for 2-channel recording.
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: rippleish20 on March 02, 2019, 02:30:13 PM
My perception is also that the recordings are "smoother"
Title: Re: Portable DSD Recorders
Post by: jb63 on March 03, 2019, 11:24:06 PM
"smoother" is a good description, but I can't tell you why, exactly.