Topic: Next step up in omnis from 4061's?

[yates7592]

Perfectly (very) happy with my 4061's. Just dreaming, what would be my options if and when I decide to move up a gear or three in omni mics? They would be  hat-mounted, so mic capsules say 2-3 inch max, XLR input expected, high SPL, low sens. I would be looking for a very noticeable further improvement in sound from my already excellent 4061's. Say up to $2K (new or used)??

[JD]

My vote would be for Nevaton MCE400's. In every comp I did against my DPA 4060's I preferred the Nevatons

http://bigpurpledog.com/category/shop/microphones/nevaton/mce-400

Looks like they are still not making/importing them at this point, They do pop up on the yard sale once in a while...

[yates7592]

^ Thanks but I ran the Nevs and they're not an option again. Also I'm not looking for any more miniatures (I think I tried nearly all of those). Looking at omni's with xlr's and larger caps (but still hattable) that would be a significant step up in sound from 4061's or any of the miniatures.

[Ultfris101]

So you're thinking Schoeps MK2's or something like that? Sounds like you're looking at Nbob actives and some caps type setup or you're set on XLRs? Maybe KCYs and PFA?

4061's are pretty nice. I'm anxiously awaiting responses on this query.

was it you who spurred a long discussion on  'ing with MK41's not long ago? This seems like a familiar topic.

[aaronji]

DPA 4006 caps, with either the compact bodies (4006C) or the MMP-E active cables...

[blg]

I like no longer worrying about the people behind me, so would never only run omnis, but if i wanted the option, i'd get mk5's. 

[Gutbucket]

My unsolicited advice for maximum return on investment, in regards to the sound quality of the resulting recordings?

Keep the 4061's and consider recording four channels.   The improvement in moving to larger, higher quality DC polarized omnis (Schoeps, DPA, whatever) is real but relatively subtle unless in optimal recording situations with optimal mic'ing setups.  In most somewhat compromised headworn situations, those differences will be more subtle.  The improvement you can get by going to 4 channels with the intent of mixing to 2 is not subtle and can directly address problems inherent to the headworn recording technique.
 
Do that either by:
1) Adding a pair of forward facing miniature directional mics, placed coincident with the omnis.  This allows you to either choose between either the forward facing directionals or the head baffled omnis outright, or to mix the two in various interesting ways.  Mix them full range at various ratios and you gain mic pattern control varying between omni (baffled, outward facing) and cardioid or supercardioid forward facing.  Not simply one pattern or the other but fine-tunable to any combination pattern in between, after the fact, by ear to whatever sounds best. You can gain even more control by EQing each differently before mixing them to gain control over pattern by frequency. 

That gives you not only the ability to reduce some of the annoyance of people behind without completely sacrificing the naturalness of omnis, but also the capability of improving on the omnis alone even in an otherwise perfect situation, and more so than switching to higher quality omnis. 

2) Adding a second pair of non-coincident baffled omnis facing forward and backwards PM me for details.

Which is more appropriate depends on the music and venues in which you record.  Either approach offers very real, practical, non-subtle potential quality improvements, but requires increased complication of both the recording setup and the resulting mixdown work.  IME, that is a larger barrier to going this route than cost (either to do this 4 channel thing or to move to a top-shelf omni pair), yet the potential reward is far greater as well, especially in a practical real-world sense.

[jbell]

You might want to check these out!!

http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=143514.msg1865454#msg1865454

[yates7592]

was it you who spurred a long discussion on  'ing with MK41's not long ago? This seems like a familiar topic.

Not me.

[yates7592]

4037's (or 4033/4035/4036) look interesting. Not much info out there. Does anybody have any sound samples? Can't find any on Dime or Etree...and TS search function does not seem to be working as it used to, for me at least.

[adrianf74]

You're gonna be hard-pressed, as Gutbucket mentioned, to find a better omni out there than what you have.  I know some people like the Nev MCE400's but, like you, they're not for me, either.   I know I've had this conversation behind closed doors with a bunch of people around these parts because I was looking at CK62's for a while to run with my active setup.  I've since picked up a pair of PFA Actives, as well, but didn't see the value in buying the CK62's over the 4061's (or pretty much all small DECENT omnis -- 853's, CA-11 Series II, CA-14, etc.).   Some of my best pulls with omnis were with the CA-14's, so I wouldn't really move from where you are -- but that's just me and a few other people. 

[Len Moskowitz (Core Sound)]

...what would be my options if and when I decide to move up a gear or three in omni mics?

It's hard to beat the 4060s in flat & extended frequency response and high SPL capacity. So the next step up would be a mic with all the same features plus lower self noise. In a compact (but not miniature) omni microphone I'd recommend the DPA 4006e (with active cable) or 4006C (without).

Either would be hard to beat.

(Disclaimer: We're full line DPA dealers, and big DPA fans too.)

[dogmusic]

I've read some good things about the DPA 2006c.

What about the Line Audio CM3 or OM1? I've been on the fence about buying a pair of those myself.

[aaronji]

I've read some good things about the DPA 2006c.

I have gotten really good results with them.  An excellent "poor" man's substitute for the 4006 (that is DPA poor, though, so still pretty pricey)...Not as good as the 4006, but not that far off either, and quite similar in terms of the "DPA house sound".

[yates7592]

Drooling over the compact/modular 4006's, anybody using these, and have some samples? Are they worth the money?