Topic: Where does sound "come out" of an upright piano

[BayTaynt3d]

The sound on these puppies comes out from everywhere, lol...

You've got a lot of choices, but I'd classify them into four groups: (1) out the top, (2) from the back, (3) under the front, and (4) more ambient from farther back.

As discussed already, a lot of this is personal preference, and another big part is how the thing is positioned (against wall or not, etc.). Also, if you are dealing with other instruments at the same time, bleed from them on the piano mics will play a role. Another thing to consider is the piano itself -- for example, if the piano is bright, you might not want to go out the top. Personally, I often go with split omnis near the top and I haven't had too much trouble with mechanical noise. A dynamic under the front can be good for bleed issues (if not inside with the lid down), except possibly clugy foot pedals can cause mech noise. Moving back and going more ambient can work, but I've found that doesn't work nearly as well as it does with a grand.

Bottom line, is there is no real right/wrong way with an upright. I t depends a lot on preference, the piano itself, the config in the room, bleed issues, what kind of mics you have, etc. If you can, experiment. If not, go with your gut. That's my two cents at least.

[run_run_run]

The university had one in a lounge area outside a dinning area and got pissed people where playing it. They put a sign on it last week, for display only and then took the Piano away. WTF

[carpa]

For what is my experience (I'm a pianist, but very very little acknowledge in taping) the big differences between upright and grands must be taken into account in order to choose a good miking. Let me explain some points (probably many of you already know).

I think that positioning the instrument far from the wall doesn't solve all problems, as miking the instrument directly on the rear (towards the soundboard) could be a little like miking a grand from below (not the same, of course).
Problems-differences in uprights may be indicated as:

1) a low tone in an upright has exactly the same pitch as a concert grand, but a much shorter and larger string. The result is a much muddier tone, less deep and with less harmonics; this is mainly responsible for a less detailed sound in the whole range.

2) In a grand the strings, going forward from the point in which they are screwed on the somière, pass individually through a hole inside a brass  piece called agraffe (in italian/french), while in an upright there is une metal bar for all the strings called compressor which keeps them tight;  the result is a less precise sound depending on "unwanted" vibrations.

3) a lot of time the mechanic of an upright is noisier than a grand and less precise in touch response, so it's difficult to play with the same control of a grand; this seems not having a lot to deal with recording, but in real world an upright performance tends to be less accurate.

4) the left pedal only brings the hammers closer to the strings (more difficult to control the action, also) and doesn't move the whole mechanic in order to strike strins from a different position; the sound is only a little bit softer, but doesn't affect the timbre, like in a grand.

Many of you are experts, so you don't need my advice, but I would say that for all these reasons a wise balance between close miking (mechanical noises, unpredictable lack of precision by the performer, poor harmonics) and too far (everything confused and lack of bass)shoud be found.
Just according to my istinct I would suggest not to move the piano too much from the wall (maybe 50-60 cm), open the upper lid and take off the front cover beside the key cover(in a way in which the pianist sees the hammers); I would not take off the other cover below the keyboard (in front of the pianists legs) and probably I would place mics higher than the piano a couple of meters far.
It's just an idea from a newbie. If someone tries let me know, and don't send me to hell
c

[rowjimmy]

That's good information, carpa, thanks.

Same for the rest of you guys, I've pondered recording the piano in my home and you've given me much to think about.

Oh, and those Coles ribbons.... are those running in blumlein?
Nice.

[Frequincy]

Just wanted to say this is a great thread and I've enjoyed reading it. Thanks for the insights.

[Gutbucket]

So I go visit an exhibition of sonic sculpture works yesterday and one of the pieces was an upright piano that in the performance of a previous piece had all of it's keys nailed down.  There was a video with headphones of it out on the street the year before with the curator in a tux asking passers-by to take turns nailing.  Hilarious when an old woman is doing as instructed but is just lightly taping the nail along with the resulting timid 'plink', 'plink'.. he finally shows her how, driving the nail in with a few strong blows and she cries out, "No!, No!, What are you Doing!?"

The current piece features the same piano with fully nailed keys, now with the addition of a bulls-eye painted on the back, a contact mic on the stings with near-by amplifier and a museum employee offering darts. A solid throw to the soundboard echoes though the typically highly reverberant museum like a John Cage riff.