Topic: Small Stealth Preamp?

[TideBleach]

I was wondering if anyone could help point me in the right direction to find a Small Stealthable Preamp that would also power my mics with 9volts.

[corsair]

Consider the Reactive sounds spa-2 or boost box...
I own one and am particularly happy with it.
However, they're under some kinda reconstruction now.
Another one would be the one by SP. But I chose
the Reactive Sounds, because their clipping LED is real
useful.

[M]

Chris Church hooked me up with a custom preamp.  It is a similar idea to the reactive sounds one except mine has 3-wire power.

[pfife]

Chris Church hooked me up with a custom preamp.  It is a similar idea to the reactive sounds one except mine has 3-wire power.

I'd try this too. 

[bdasilva]

Chris makes a small, easy to power, quiet pre for a damn reasonable price.




Chris Church hooked me up with a custom preamp.  It is a similar idea to the reactive sounds one except mine has 3-wire power.

[cpatch]

Here's Chris' web site (also currently undergoing reconstruction but follow the link to his eBay store):

http://church-audio.ca

Craig

[SkttrWave]

Would using such a church audio preamp instead of my battery box, significantly improve my current rig (see signature)?

[Krispy D]

I just saw a deneke ad20 on ebay...

[M]

Would using such a church audio preamp instead of my battery box, significantly improve my current rig (see signature)?

It should.  Here is what mine has.

-It provides 3-wire power that has lower distortion than 2-wire that the common batt box uses. 

-It provides 0db to (not either or) 20db of gain selectable by a knob.  I saw that the 3-wire boxes had a lower volume output than the 2-wire ones so the pre will come in handy.   He said he used a better opamp than in his oth

-I also have a selectable hpf at 80hz. 

-A led to let you know that it is on.


I would provide a rewiew/samples but this is a fairly new piece of gear for me.  I was supposed to have my first test in the field on Friday but the concert got cancelled.  From all the testing I did at home it worked great.  My next concert is in 2 weeks I will provide a review then.


If you have any questions you should pm Chris.  He can give you better details and the full specs.

[divamum]

-It provides 0db to (not either or) 20db of gain selectable by a knob.  

Just for the sake of accuracy, so does the Reactive Boostbox (it's 0-35 I believe). The SP pre is the one with fixed gain settings, which is actually why it didn't work out for me and I had to look elsewhere and thus wound up with the REactive. 

Minidisco used to stock the REactive; don't know if it's still in production or not, but it's worked out well for me. That said, nice to know there's another option in the Church product! I searched high and low this time last year and the Reactive was the only one I could find in my price range, so good to know there's some other choices too.

[corsair]

-It provides 0db to (not either or) 20db of gain selectable by a knob.   

Just for the sake of accuracy, so does the Reactive Boostbox (it's 0-35 I believe). The SP pre is the one with fixed gain settings, which is actually why it didn't work out for me and I had to look elsewhere and thus wound up with the REactive. 

Minidisco used to stock the REactive; don't know if it's still in production or not, but it's worked out well for me. That said, nice to know there's another option in the Church product! I searched high and low this time last year and the Reactive was the only one I could find in my price range, so good to know there's some other choices too.

Just to add on, I think Reactive's beauty is also in the clipping led.... Not sure if the
Church Audio has  one.... but that led is invaluable in a stealth situation.

[CHURCH-AUDIO]

We do not use clip lights insted we make a preamp that you would have to run over with a truck before it clip's. Our Sennhieser model (3 wire) has a gain control from 00- db or off to +20 db with a distortion of 0.05% we don't think the clip light on a external preamp tells you anything, because number one the bullistics of the clip light or the way it works, should have a delayed off, so that you can see that it was on in the first place. If your preamp puts out 30 db of gain and you are at clipping I am pretty dam sure your input on your md or hd based recorder that is expecting -20 to -10 db is very much deep into overload. I have measured the  product you mentioned and found that the clip light comes on way to early to be of any use. But hey it's a good gimick.  I think that real preamps that have phantom power and 70 db of gain should have a VU meter with a clip light, but thats not going to fit into your pocket. We could put a lame clip light in our product but to be honest we would rather make it a sell for a little less $$$$ then bullshit people into thinking that this little clip light will be the answer to all your distortion problems.
We only put in what you need to get the job done and insted of wasting money on extra doodad's that do nothing except add to what I call the "KNOB" factor we give you a clean wide band low self noise very low distortion preamp at a price pretty much anyone can pay for with out selling one of the kids. And we do it with the best parts you can buy. We use switchcraft jacks we use 1% metal film resistors and we hand match all of our film caps so they are with in .05% of each other with our advanced LCR meter. Then when we are done all that I have a program called WINAUDIOMLS every preamp is now tested with this program for noise floor, distortion, frequencey response, and then all of these measurements are compaired with a known good sample to make sure they are with in 1% of each other the levels from left to right are with in 0.1db of each other. All this for $220.00 for a 3 wire preamp that is unmatched in its price range.
 

Chris Church

-It provides 0db to (not either or) 20db of gain selectable by a knob.   

Just for the sake of accuracy, so does the Reactive Boostbox (it's 0-35 I believe). The SP pre is the one with fixed gain settings, which is actually why it didn't work out for me and I had to look elsewhere and thus wound up with the REactive. 

Minidisco used to stock the REactive; don't know if it's still in production or not, but it's worked out well for me. That said, nice to know there's another option in the Church product! I searched high and low this time last year and the Reactive was the only one I could find in my price range, so good to know there's some other choices too.

Just to add on, I think Reactive's beauty is also in the clipping led.... Not sure if the
Church Audio has  one.... but that led is invaluable in a stealth situation.

[corsair]

Dude, before U blow off other people's products as lame or gimmicky... I can tell you from practical experience while
taping stealth, that clip led is useful. People who have run SBM-1 into the portable DATs can tell you
how invaluable it is as well...when U can just peer into ur pocket and adjust the gain and not have to look
at the levels on ur recorder..

Yes, when it flashes, it does not clip yet. But the idea to use the clip led is such that it flashes occassionally..
I've taped with it, and I've got good levels using this feature. Also, instead of typing tons of technical
mumbo jumbo into one block of text, consider using paragraphs.

We do not use clip lights insted we make a preamp that you would have to run over with a truck before it clip's. Our Sennhieser model (3 wire) has a gain control from 00- db or off to +20 db with a distortion of 0.05% we don't think the clip light on a external preamp tells you anything, because number one the bullistics of the clip light or the way it works, should have a delayed off, so that you can see that it was on in the first place. If your preamp puts out 30 db of gain and you are at clipping I am pretty dam sure your input on your md or hd based recorder that is expecting -20 to -10 db is very much deep into overload. I have measured the  product you mentioned and found that the clip light comes on way to early to be of any use. But hey it's a good gimick.  I think that real preamps that have phantom power and 70 db of gain should have a VU meter with a clip light, but thats not going to fit into your pocket. We could put a lame clip light in our product but to be honest we would rather make it a sell for a little less $$$$ then bullshit people into thinking that this little clip light will be the answer to all your distortion problems.
We only put in what you need to get the job done and insted of wasting money on extra doodad's that do nothing except add to what I call the "KNOB" factor we give you a clean wide band low self noise very low distortion preamp at a price pretty much anyone can pay for with out selling one of the kids. And we do it with the best parts you can buy. We use switchcraft jacks we use 1% metal film resistors and we hand match all of our film caps so they are with in .05% of each other with our advanced LCR meter. Then when we are done all that I have a program called WINAUDIOMLS every preamp is now tested with this program for noise floor, distortion, frequencey response, and then all of these measurements are compaired with a known good sample to make sure they are with in 1% of each other the levels from left to right are with in 0.1db of each other. All this for $220.00 for a 3 wire preamp that is unmatched in its price range.
 

Chris Church

-It provides 0db to (not either or) 20db of gain selectable by a knob.   

Just for the sake of accuracy, so does the Reactive Boostbox (it's 0-35 I believe). The SP pre is the one with fixed gain settings, which is actually why it didn't work out for me and I had to look elsewhere and thus wound up with the REactive. 

Minidisco used to stock the REactive; don't know if it's still in production or not, but it's worked out well for me. That said, nice to know there's another option in the Church product! I searched high and low this time last year and the Reactive was the only one I could find in my price range, so good to know there's some other choices too.

Just to add on, I think Reactive's beauty is also in the clipping led.... Not sure if the
Church Audio has  one.... but that led is invaluable in a stealth situation.

[pmonk66]

Agreed - I love how you can check your PMD660 that's tucked in your bag in a dark concert hall and see the recording volumes!

[CHURCH-AUDIO]

Think of this ok music is dynamic I am a live front of house sound engineer. I mix some songs at 85 db some rockin tunes I may mix as loud as 115db in the right venue, with the right artist. You have to look at your recorders level control and set it so there is atleast 10 db of head room. A clip light that lights up 2 to 3 db and stays on for one second is not going to help. You need a VU METER NOT A CLIP LIGHT. end of argument it amazes me how some people talk to me like I dont know how to set a %$#@ level, it's what I do for a living, when I am not selling my little mics and preamps. I know what the hell I am talking about. It's one thing to record a show its just a tad bit more complicated to mix it. In the end who do you trust the guy that tapes a few shows or the guy that mixes them for a living?
I don't mean to be offensive but for christ sakes listen to your argument what does a clip light tell you? when the mix is always changing you need to watch a vu meter because by the time the stupid clip light comes on you already have distortion. And chances are your already overloading the recorders input? so why not just watch the $@@@@@ level on the recorder? that is the best way to maximiize the signal to noise ratio with my preamps. Because I take all the stupid shit you dont need and give you what you do need. I have used everything from Neve to Midas to API the best preamps in the world and at the end, I use my ears and a VU meter to tell me where my levels are at not a clip light that comes on way to early in most cases to be usefull. And if you use the argument that you can some how calibrate the clip light so it corrisponds with your vu on your recorder its not true. Yes when the clip light comes on you may be close to clipping but are you really? or is this just an idiot light? I love good gear and good design. But if the clip light is not accurate AND MOST OF THEM ARE NOT. then hey whats the point lets just take a peek at the recorder if you are in doubt, about levels. And my rule of thumb for your recorders input also applies to the mic input of the preamp to avoid distortion you need atleast 10db of headroom for most concerts and I would argue thats not enough some times. So if a clip light is anywhere from 2 db to 10 db before real distortion what does it tell you?


Chris Church
ps i am not having a good day so I am just a tad bit bitchy sorry.



Chris Church

I agree that clip lights rule.

Nothing posted in that sea of text has refuted the usefulness of clip lights while stealthing.  If I am recording into a jb3, I am not pulling that huge thing out of my pocket/shirt/wherever during most stealth shows to try and read those tiny meters.. On the other hand, I can have a pre (or microtrack) in my shirt pocket with the clip LED facing my chest and all I need to do is push the pocket open a bit and glance out of the corner of my eye for the flashing..

It was suggested that the MD or hard disc recorder will overload if the clip light is lit. That may be but it is trivial to work around.  You advance the gain until the light indicates clipping and then back off the gain whatever amount is necessary (from previous testing) to get to the point that is safe with your gear and provides the appropriate safety margin for the circumstances.