Topic: Etymotic Research questions

[Teen Wolf Blitzer]

I noticed there are different versions.  Looking at the Er4 but notice there are different versions of those.  er4s?  er4p?    Their website doesn't talk about it though.  Can someone break it down for me?  And thoughts on the Er6?  They are cheaper.  But I like the er4.  Also noticed some are all black and some are red and blue?  Thanks folks.

[bhtoque]

The ER-6 are great. I use them in the field all the time. Can hear my rig over the crowd/band no problem.

The 4p is a powered version for use with weaker headphone outs if I remember correctly.

JAson

[Nick's Picks]

that is correct.  the 4p is just the 4 that is easier to drive w/POS consumer headphone jacks.
I've read that it sacrifices a little bit of quality over the straight up er4, but you wouldn't notice.

I've used the 4, the 4p, the 6, the sure e2...
any BY FAR....the most "user freiendly', feature packed, AWESOME sounding, ass kicking isolation was w/the cheapest model M-Audio.  I think its the E-10.  $99.
smokes the er6.  rivals the 4 easily.  has excellent isolation...super comfy...and the fisrt 6 inches of wire coming out of the ear piece is able to be molded around your ear so that they stay on even if not in your ear.

[MattD]

Never would have guessed that. When my 6s kick the bucket, I'll look at the M-Audio earphones. Detachable cable = good idea. I'm always afraid I'm going to yank out the Etymotic's cable because I can't always get a grip on the body.

[Teen Wolf Blitzer]

Thanks for the replies.  I was looking at those M-audios.  So if I was to get the Er's I'd probably want the powered version since the R-4's (as with all Edirol products) headphone out is so week?  And then I've read reviews how some think they are uncomfortable or take some getting used to?  Some said you really need to cram them down your ear canals.  I'm just a little worried forking over the cash if my head can't take it.  I've had  inner ear issues since I was a kid.  Had tubes 4 times.     Did you all get used to them pretty quick?

[joekar]

I have a set of ER-4 P's.....They sound and fit great...... I too have ear issues...Purchased a set of the E5C Shure in ear monitors.....The shure's would not fit my ears and the stiff wire that is suppose to loop around your ears were annoying and very uncomfortable...... Gave  them to my son and he loves them....The ER-4's fit great with the foam isolators....The silicone pieces just never seemed to fit right.....
I've had these for a few years so I'm sure there are new and different models available now....I've heard some good things about the Ultimate Ears EU 10 pro but they are a bit pricey...
The Etymotic site does have a page to help you select which model is right for you:
http://www.etymotic.com/ephp/er4-wrfy.aspx
Hope this helps...

Hey Nick...thanks for the heads up on the M-Audio headphones...I'll check them out next time I'm in the market for new phones.......but my HD 650's, Sony 7509's and ER-4P are holding up just fine...

[jlykos]

To add to this, I have a pair of the Westone UM-1 in-ear monitors and I love them.  Very flat response and detailed.  Also comfortable; I have had them in my ears for like five hours straight without any problems.  Only issue is the somewhat thin bass response; the UM-2 are supposed to have a much better bass response, but at three times the price.  The UM-1 cost $100 and are a great value for the money.

[Brian Skalinder]

In my book, the ER-6s win hands down for one big reason:  they're the only model that mate with my custom-molded earplugs (see pics).  Talk about comfortable to wear!  And they sound pretty good, too.  Wouldn't surprise me if others sound better, but the others won't even come close to comparing comfort-wise, and for my portable listening I'm only interested in Good Enough sound.  There're so many other obstacles to HQ sound during my portable listening (lossy compression on my player to fit more songs, mediocre DAC and headphone output, external noise and vibrations, mental distractions, etc.), I just don't see the value in slightly better sounding earphones at the expense of comfort (and in some cases my pocketbook).

[Nick's Picks]

the 6s are awesome.  but for $20 more, the Maudios sound better and have more features.
they are thin and have the same tip options as the Etys' too.

[Brian Skalinder]

they are thin and have the same tip options as the Etys' too.

Not if they don't fit custom molded earplugs, they don't! 

[Nick's Picks]

well, the little plastic "barrel" that the tips slide over is the same size as the Ety's, and comes w/the same tips.
so...if your customs fit on the ety's, I bet they fit these as well B.

[Jammin72]

SR-4S and P are essentially the same earphone with a different impedance load, and because of that bass response.


Here's the Differences in a nutshell.

Which ER•4 is Right for You?

ER•4B (Binaural) earphones are for the binaural recording enthusiast. The ER•4B is an ideal earphone for use with material that has not been equalized for loudspeaker playback. It was developed from the ER-1 earphone that is referenced to a flat diffuse field and used primarily for speech reception research, where the goal is to produce the same frequency response at the eardrum as would be produced in the live situation.

ER•4S (Stereo) earphones were designed to compensate for the high frequency emphasis in all CD recordings, in order to provide accurate sound reproduction. Performing musicians often use them as in-ear monitors because the response of the ER•4S matches the response of most typical monitor loudspeakers. The high accuracy and exceptional sound isolation of the ER•4S have made these earphones popular with musicians, recording engineers and audiophiles. ER•4S earphones can be used with a headphone amplifier when using low power portable devices.

ER•4P (Portable) earphones can be used with portable CD, MP3, DVD and other players without requiring an additional amplifier. As compared to the ER•4S, the ER•4P has 10 dB greater output at high frequencies and 13 dB greater output at low frequencies. The higher sensitivity and enhanced bass of the ER•4P have made it the most popular earphone for most uses.

You can actually get a small adapter cable that converts the P to an S.

http://www.etymotic.com/ephp/er4-acc.aspx

I would go with the P and get the cable later if you want to use it with higher powered sources.

[Brian Skalinder]

well, the little plastic "barrel" that the tips slide over is the same size as the Ety's, and comes w/the same tips.
so...if your customs fit on the ety's, I bet they fit these as well B.

Ah, I didn't realize you meant the very same tips - I thought you meant just the same tip options:  a foam type, a rubber flanged type, etc.  Very cool if the M-Audio's also fit custom plugs.  I hate wearing earphones without my custom molds, now.

[mmmatt]

I have er4p's and when I owned my r4 it was plenty loud to monitor effectively.  I would highly recommend these for live monitoring but for playback they are not so well suited IMO.  The isolation is fantastic and the vocals really pop.

Matt

[Nick's Picks]

you get that same isolation from any of the Ety line.
and if your using them solely for live work, then paying $250 vs $90 is something to ponder.

btw..
Mmmmatt, nice aussie!

[mmmatt]

you get that same isolation from any of the Ety line.
and if your using them solely for live work, then paying $250 vs $90 is something to ponder.

btw..
Mmmmatt, nice aussie!

thank you sir!

I bought my ety's for 180 new btw

Matt

[Nick's Picks]

whoa..
thats a sweet deal.  mine were ridiculous when i bought them from headroom

[RebelRebel]

Have ER-4(no p) and find them to excel at live monitoring and playback at home, isolation is phenomenal , all the detail is there, and with the custom molded earpieces, I can wear them for hours with no discomfort. they are a constant companion when recording.

[Gutbucket]

Cool trick- I'll sometimes wear the ER4S's like earplugs for overly loud shows while recording and supplement the high end with just enough volume from the headphone amp to match whatever bass attenuation I get from the earplugs.  It's like an earplug EQ control.  I get some weird looks with them on rocking out to the live music sometimes though.

I'd really like to get some of those custom molded plugs like Brian has.  I didn't care for any of the standard flanges or the barrel shaped foam plugs that came with them and instead use the highest isolation rated foam earplugs I could find (blue skinned foam, round on one end and flanged on the other) that I punch a hole through using a leather punch and then push over the miniature drivers.  These fit and seal much better for me giving greater isolation and bass response.  The deeper I get them into my ear canal the better they sound, and the better the isolation is.

I've got a pair of ER4S's and a pair of ER4P's.  I got the second set so both myself and girlfriend could wear them on long roadtrips in an old convertible - even with the top up they make for a much better listening environment by cutting out all that noise.  I used a small headphone volume adapter cable to even the volume and impedance load and drive them from the same headphone amp.

I do notice a difference in sound between the P and the S model.  The S's have a smoother, more extended treble range but are harder to drive.  The headphone amp in the R-09 is not strong enough to get the S's loud enough, but the little Total Airhead amp from HeadRoom drives them fine.  I usually use that little amp with them all the time because it sounds so much better, and works well.

The only time the AirHead>ER4S is not quite loud enough is when monitoring loud music in the field.  Just not enough level to really hear over the really loud stuff, but fine for acoustic music.  I plan on trying the ER4P's next time out for a little extra level. 

[mmmatt]

Cool trick- I'll sometimes wear the ER4S's like earplugs for overly loud shows while recording and supplement the high end with just enough volume from the headphone amp to match whatever bass attenuation I get from the earplugs.  It's like an earplug EQ control.  I get some weird looks with them on rocking out to the live music sometimes though.

I do this too when monitoring in the field.  I let my ears get used to the ambient noise w/o volume on the ety's and then gradually pull the ety's up to a comfortable level.  Saves on ear fatigue for sure.

Matt

[KenH]

I originally bought the ER6's, and ended up returning them for the ER4p's, and was happy that I did.  Built way better and sturdier, besides sounding better imo.

ER4p's can still be had for about $179.  ER6's, about $79.

/Ken

[bugg100]

The M-Audio IEM's are oem'd from Ultimate Ears as the U.E super.fi 3 according to a thread at head-fi.  The upshot is that they are locally stocked at Radio Shack in North America. as the super.fi 3 live ($99)

This long thread details swapping the left and right wires and running reversed (left in right ear...) and getting better seal with a more low profile appearance. Thread is specifically about super.fi 5 but goes on to talk about the 3 live deeper in the thread.

I really want a good monitor setup.  I'm tired of getting brickwalling and only discovering later.........

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=191204&highlight=flip+flop

[newscane]

I picked up a pair of the super.fi 3s on headphone.com for $79.  Added in an airplane adapter for $10, and $10 for shipping.  They arrived today.  In a quick test with my ipod, they sound great.  Block out plenty of external noise, and they're VERY efficient -- had the volume at 25% or so.  My only quibble is that if I try to sing along  it sounds like crap, because I'm hearing myself.  But I suppose that's just the nature of the ear-canal earphones, because of the seal they make...

[mmmatt]

  My only quibble is that if I try to sing along  it sounds like crap, because I'm hearing myself.  But I suppose that's just the nature of the ear-canal earphones, because of the seal they make...

No... you just sing like crap.

Matt

[newscane]

  My only quibble is that if I try to sing along  it sounds like crap, because I'm hearing myself.  But I suppose that's just the nature of the ear-canal earphones, because of the seal they make...

No... you just sing like crap.

Matt

funny...

[boojum]

Odd man out here: I have the ER4B's.  I got them because I was doing a lot of binaural at the time and that they have a flat response curve and do not try to imitate speaker sound.  I bought them shortly after I read a review in AUDIO saying that the only better earphones at the time were the Stax Lambda Pro 4's, which cost thousands even if they do go down to 8Hz.  I have been pleased with them as long as I have had them and that must be close to ten years now.  I just keep buying the green plugs which protect the drivers from ear wax and listen in pleasure. 

L8R     

[Gutbucket]

Odd man out here: I have the ER4B's.  I got them because I was doing a lot of binaural at the time and that they have a flat response curve and do not try to imitate speaker sound. ...

I was curious about those. Have you ever had a chance to compare those to the ER4S/P's? Are the response curves published anywhere?  All I could find a few years back were statements that the ER4B's were EQ'd for binaural applications, but no specifics other than that.

[newscane]

Odd man out here: I have the ER4B's.  I got them because I was doing a lot of binaural at the time and that they have a flat response curve and do not try to imitate speaker sound. ...

I was curious about those. Have you ever had a chance to compare those to the ER4S/P's? Are the response curves published anywhere?  All I could find a few years back were statements that the ER4B's were EQ'd for binaural applications, but no specifics other than that.

http://www.etymotic.com/ephp/er4-wrfy.aspx

[boojum]

Odd man out here: I have the ER4B's.  I got them because I was doing a lot of binaural at the time and that they have a flat response curve and do not try to imitate speaker sound. ...

I was curious about those. Have you ever had a chance to compare those to the ER4S/P's? Are the response curves published anywhere?  All I could find a few years back were statements that the ER4B's were EQ'd for binaural applications, but no specifics other than that.

You got the answer from the previous post.  This is the line which swayed me: " . . . the goal is to produce the same frequency response at the eardrum as would be produced in the live situation."

[Gutbucket]

Thx.

From the Etymotic site liked above:
"ER•4 MicroPro Earphones have special filters that shape the frequency response and prevent earwax from entering the earphones."
I've never changed mine in 8 years or so.. they still appear nice and green and at least look and sound un-clogged.  Maybe it's time to do so anyway.  I wonder if the filters are different for the ER4B's to 'shape the frequency response' differently as the cuve shows in the link above.  It would be cool to just change filters to switch between 4S & 4B response.  I know the difference between the 4S and 4P is the impedance in the cable.

[boojum]

Thx.

From the Etymotic site liked above:
"ER•4 MicroPro Earphones have special filters that shape the frequency response and prevent earwax from entering the earphones."
  I wonder if the filters are different for the ER4B's to 'shape the frequency response' differently as the cuve shows in the link above. 

Yeah, it would be cool, but they sell only one style of "green filters" so all they are filtering is ear wax.  I sometimes clean out the white flanges with a toothpick and now soak them in soapy water now and again or in rubbing alcohol.  They are good.  I paid about US$140 when I got mine; maybe even US$125.  It was a long, long time ago.

Cheers

[Chuck]

So, I just got the ER-6's and had another set of custom molds made for my ears. My first, impression, using them with the Westone molds, is they are thin sounding. I will have more time over the weekend to test them. But, just doing an A/B with my HD600's, out of a GoVibe headphone amp, the Sennheisers offer much fuller sound.

I'm very excited about the new molded ear plugs, as I also bought the Etymotic ES-15 filters for them, too. My old plugs were very muffled sounding.

I'm wondering if the ER-6's need a break-in period to sound better?

[boojum]

I cannot vouch for the sound of the ER6's.  But in considering their sound are you sure the old ones were correct or the new ones?  The old ones could have pumped the sound and the new ones are more accurate, but less exciting.  You will have to determine this yourself.  Good luck.

[Jammin72]

So, I just got the ER-6's and had another set of custom molds made for my ears. My first, impression, using them with the Westone molds, is they are thin sounding. I will have more time over the weekend to test them. But, just doing an A/B with my HD600's, out of a GoVibe headphone amp, the Sennheisers offer much fuller sound.

I'm very excited about the new molded ear plugs, as I also bought the Etymotic ES-15 filters for them, too. My old plugs were very muffled sounding.

I'm wondering if the ER-6's need a break-in period to sound better?

They're not going to have the low end of your 600's.  Break in helps but don't expect the same presentation or bass response.  They're a completely different animal.

[jerryfreak]

Ive rocked the 4p's since i got my first nomad jukebox back in 01/02ish.

I bought mine used, at the time, they were well over $300. The cable eventually went bad, and they gave me a whole new set for $150 (at that time they were still over $250).

The $180 pairs on ebay are the deals of the century, imo. You'd be hardpressed to tell a difference between the s and p series sonically, and youd almost certianly need a headphone amp to get the most out of the s's

So, I just got the ER-6's and had another set of custom molds made for my ears. My first, impression, using them with the Westone molds, is they are thin sounding. I will have more time over the weekend to test them. But, just doing an A/B with my HD600's, out of a GoVibe headphone amp, the Sennheisers offer much fuller sound.

I'm very excited about the new molded ear plugs, as I also bought the Etymotic ES-15 filters for them, too. My old plugs were very muffled sounding.

I'm wondering if the ER-6's need a break-in period to sound better?

They're not going to have the low end of your 600's.  Break in helps but don't expect the same presentation or bass response.  They're a completely different animal.

[jerryfreak]

homebrew adapter for 4p to 4s:

http://www.fixup.net/tips/ety/ety.htm

i actually just bought one already made off ebay for $20:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=290200583700