Topic: Sound Devices 722 vs Korg MR 1000

[Sanjay]

I ran a tube pre-> Tascam DSD before I gave up hauling around a golf cart battery now I've switched to the MR-1000+Neve Portico

Here are some Neve+DSD samples, DSD really has a euphonic quality about it that even survives downsapling...even mp3 encoding.  Check em' out. Microphone source for all recordings is a Stephen Paul Audio modified AKG C33e.

peace, chris

Mp3s:
All- Glen Phillips on vox (Various and Sundry Tour)- Exit Music (From a Film)
http://www.comebackdownload.com/Various%20and%20Sundry%20-%20Exit%20Music%20For%20a%20Film.mp3

Sara, Sean Watkins and Luke Bulla (Various and Sundry Tour)- Somebody More Like You.
http://www.comebackdownload.com/Various%20and%20Sundry%20-%20%20Somebody%20More%20Like%20You.mp3

Here is a full show on the archive from the TASCAM recorder:
http://www.archive.org/details/glen2005-08-30.dsd.flac

That's fantastic sounding.

Thanks.

[TNJazz]

Actualy spliters are the way to go. Should we do just AD stages using external pre amps or all in one solution comps?

You should use a single pre and split the lines coming out of it going to the decks.  This is what I was going to do the next opportunity I have.

[JasonSobel]

Actualy spliters are the way to go. Should we do just AD stages using external pre amps or all in one solution comps?

You should use a single pre and split the lines coming out of it going to the decks.  This is what I was going to do the next opportunity I have.

or use a pre with two sets of outputs.  like a V2.
that'd be a great comp.  V2 > 722 and same V2 > MR1000.

[JasonSobel]

or use a pre with two sets of outputs.  like a V2.
that'd be a great comp.  V2 > 722 and same V2 > MR1000.

But which recorder gets stuck with the unbalanced outputs?

you could switch it up at setbreak.
are there any portable pre-amps that are fairly common with two sets of balanced outputs?  offhand, I can't think of any.
also, I am of the opinion that the differences due to unbalanced vs. balanced outputs would be minor, but it is something that should be considered.

[gmm6797]

IMHO, find a pre that has the same outputs to 2 separate decks... so that the only difference in the specs of a comparison are the decks... nothing else

I have access to 2 different MK4>KCY>VMS02ib setups... and a 722, but no MR1000 for an exact comparison

Anyone in the Western NY area with a MR1000?

[Nick's Picks]

between my preamp, Carls preamp and all the various analog input decks we have on hand, a nice splitter cable will be fine.

[BC]

or use a pre with two sets of outputs.  like a V2.
that'd be a great comp.  V2 > 722 and same V2 > MR1000.

But which recorder gets stuck with the unbalanced outputs?

you could switch it up at setbreak.
are there any portable pre-amps that are fairly common with two sets of balanced outputs?  offhand, I can't think of any.
also, I am of the opinion that the differences due to unbalanced vs. balanced outputs would be minor, but it is something that should be considered.

I am pretty sure that the balanced outs run hotter than the unbalanced.

[carlbeck]

The MR will need the unbalanced outs so the inputs won't overload.

[JasonSobel]

or use a pre with two sets of outputs.  like a V2.
that'd be a great comp.  V2 > 722 and same V2 > MR1000.

But which recorder gets stuck with the unbalanced outputs?

you could switch it up at setbreak.
are there any portable pre-amps that are fairly common with two sets of balanced outputs?  offhand, I can't think of any.
also, I am of the opinion that the differences due to unbalanced vs. balanced outputs would be minor, but it is something that should be considered.

I am pretty sure that the balanced outs run hotter than the unbalanced.

yes.  the unbalanced outs on the V2 are 6dB lower than the balanced.  but as Carl is alluding to, the MR1000 likely has a lower overload point compared to the 722.  I don't know what the specific specs are of the MR1000 (i.e. where is overloads, or at what analog level it hits 0dBfs, etc), but all those details should definitely be nailed down before the comp happens.

[carlbeck]

I think without all of us getting into our lab coats if we just use a V2 & I take the unbalanced outs into my MR-1000 it will be close enough for a fair comp. So the balanced outs into the 722, the unbalanced into the MR-1000 (must be a 1/4 TRS jack) the comp will be close enough for most ears. The real trick will be to get the levels exact & that will require post processing which I bet will skew the comp more than balanced vs. unbalanced. Regardless, I am confident the DSD will shine, even dithered down to 24 or 16 or MP3.

[boyacrobat]

this test is insulting to dsd comparing it to a pcm machine, even if its a 722.
do the test and get over it.

by the way to balance insult , mr1 rec in dsd will smoke 722 also.


g.

[carlbeck]

this test is insulting to dsd comparing it to a pcm machine, even if its a 722.
do the test and get over it.

by the way to balance insult , mr1 rec in dsd will smoke 722 also.


g.

Well without sounding so smug I do agree to a certain extent. Honestly the difference in what you hear with DSD vs. PCM on a  high rez system is as noticeable as MP3 to 24 bit IMO. The only problem is no solution to playback the files in DSD at this time, the dithered 24 bits sound sweet though so until there is a reasonable solution I will enjoy dithered 24 bit recordings.

[WiFiJeff]

I'd like to believe these are killer boxes, but there hasn't been much in the way of direct head-to-head tests.  I listened to Simon's comp (MR-1 fed by the preamp of the V3, digital feed from the V3 to a MT2496), and ended up like most preferring the V3 A/D version over DSD.  I've liked the few MR-1 and MR-1000 recordings I've made, but I haven't seen the evidence yet to rate them quite so high.  I've gone line-in to both machines (except for a botched MR-1000 run, where my Josephsons overloaded the mic input of the MR-1000), but hope (if I get the splitter cables I ordered by tomorrow) to a/b the 722 internal preamp/A/D and the MR-1000 preamp/DSD on Friday, then test both fed with an external preamp next week.  The lack of a general means of distributing and listening to DSD recordings is also an issue; if it doesn't sound better on CD or DVD-A (and even DVD-A is only interesting to a few of my friends) I'm not sure when DSD will be useful.

Jeff

[Nick's Picks]

my not very objective thoughts:
its hard not to be biased when its your deck, first off.  That, and I'm a fan of the technology..., to the point where I'm unconcerned w/tests and comps.

In my own little world...where my opinion is the only one w/any weight...
I do hear a difference.
I hear it right away when I'm listening to the DSD masters especially.  I know my gear, I know how things have sounded....and what they now sound like since moving to the Korg MR1.  I really do think there is "something there" that isn't there w/PCM. 

In any case....., Its real nice to not have to worry about an all in one box ,(now that i'm over that lust), and just "have trust" in my little deck meeting all of my needs from open taping w/bomber ass preamps and whatever..., to very low profile recording w/just mics and a battbox.  I know the MR1 will yield results that will be pleasing to me.

[it-goes-to-eleven]

this test is insulting to dsd comparing it to a pcm machine, even if its a 722.
do the test and get over it.

by the way to balance insult , mr1 rec in dsd will smoke 722 also.

Hype aside, the v3 a/d was preferred over the mr1 in a comp here. The r09 a/d was very much preferred over the v3 a/d in the comps I've put up here (2 or 3).  So there is some question whether the more costly mr1 can beat out the r09 in a comp with a good pre in front.