Topic: With or without windscreens?

[vansmack]

I just received my sound professionals SP-CMC-2 mics I use with a sharp md480.  I'm testing them with just a blaring stero.  (my 1st show recording is the following weekend) It seems they sound better without the windscreens on. Would this change when recording a live concert?  It would be hard rock indoors. Also do people prefer the mic or line input?  Any suggestions on the level meter?   My level meter goes from 1 to 30. It seems it records alot louder with the mic in. Thanks --Bill

[seethreepo]

line in is best if you can get good levels.
windscreens also protect the mic elements  from moisture, smoke , etc.  

as to actual levels   hard to say but you can allways increase the volume after wards much harder to eliminate distortion  so that said I'd err on the side of caution.

mic in is much more sensitive in general terms.  line in  on most decks adds a "pad" of 10- 20 db  basically increasing your decks ability to handle a high decibal level  and spl  sound pressure level.  

also if you get there early enough  tape the opening act  and check the results in the bathroom and adjust accordingly.  

lastly a blarring stereo doesnt come close to approximating even the most modest  PA system    so dont base your levels in any way on those results.  

[greenone]

Welcome to the taping world! To answer your questions in order...

- Windscreens. Generally, you don't need them indoors. Some folks run light windscreens indoors if they have to set up near a vent or fan, or if the place is particularly smoky and they're worried about stuff getting inside their mics. At the levels of a hard rock concert, there will be little to no difference in your recording - for the Sound Pro mics, any windscreen you get will be too small to make much of a difference.

- Mic or line input. If you only have the microphones, you have to use the mic input because otherwise your microphones won't be powered. However, doing it this way it's very easy to overload your MD and end up recording nothing but staticky crap. It's possible to avoid this but only at very quiet concerts, which you're not recording. I would recommend buying one of the SP's battery box modules, which will power your mics and enable you to go line in.

- Level meter. You usually want to push it as high as you can go without going over, or else you lose dynamic range (the loud parts won't seem so loud and the quiet parts will be REALLY quiet). I'm not familiar with the Sharp deck you're using but I know that levels can be manually set on some Sharps and not on others, so it may be a moot point. Check your manual and see if you can turn off what's typically called automatic gain control, or AGC. If you can't, then the good news is that you don't have to worry about your levels...but the bad news is you have no choice.

Hope this helps and good luck!

--Dave

[Chanher]

I don't believe any Sharp MD models possess a AGC, but even if you did it is better to set your own levels.  A general rule of thumb is to have the peaks (the loudest part, or the highest point on the level meter) around 3db below the 0db mark, just to make sure nothing is clipping.  seethreepo made a good point about taping the opening act and trying to sneak a listen, especially if it's your first time taping.  the first time you tape you are at a high percentage of making some kind of mistake (I definitely made more than one) and it is better to make mistakes on a opening act then fix them for the real deal.  good luck and if you have more questions ask away.

[greenone]

I stand...er, sit corrected - thanks for the clarification...I must be thinking of the Sonys.

Then again, this is coming from a lunkhead who's never run an MD...but AGC is, in general, a Bad Thing (tm). Anything that claims to think for you is a Bad Thing (tm).

[Chanher]

yes it is Sony's that are common to posess AGC.  

[jpschust]

greenone im gonna take you to task on this one.

ALWAYS use windscreens.  ALWAYS.  Here's why- a well made windscreen will not alter your recording.  Here's why you use them especially in the live scene- lets just say some drunken a-hole knocks over your mics, if they fall on a windscreen then you get that much more protection.  Also smoke protection and fan/ac protection in your recordings.  I can't see why anyone would not use them in a live situation.

[John R]

use them.  little dpa's inside for smoke/ac
big shures outside for wind, sun, liqiud.  they're pretty much impervious to anything

jr

[John Kelly]

Well in the same vain, I just ordered a pair of the big DPA's for my Octavas.  Should I get something smaller for indoors?  Or will these be fine for indoors as well?

I had planned on using them at every show, both in and outdoors.

[greenone]

Jonny - good point! Can't say I've seen too many folks using them indoors but I guess it's not a bad idea.

I still stand by my mic in vs. line in point though. (insert "grasping at straws" smiley here)

[Brian Skalinder]

ALWAYS use windscreens.  ALWAYS.  Here's why- a well made windscreen will not alter your recording.  Here's why you use them especially in the live scene- lets just say some drunken a-hole knocks over your mics, if they fall on a windscreen then you get that much more protection.  Also smoke protection and fan/ac protection in your recordings.  I can't see why anyone would not use them in a live situation.

FWIW, I agree with Jonny on this one.  The only time I don't run windscreens is for non-smoking, sit-down shows (like Jorma) in venues I already know I won't have ventilation system problems.  I use the DPA 0896 indoors and the Shure A81WS outdoors.  (I also have a pair of very small windscreens I picked up along the way - they don't work very well, more like pop-screens, but they might work indoors.  Dunno as I always use the DPAs indoors.)

John - the DPAs are great for indoors.  A lot of people use 'em outdoors, too.  If I had a single pair of windscreens, it'd be the DPAs.  But as it is, I love my Shure's outdoors.

[nic]

I find the DPA 0896 windscreens actually attenuate the signal and make the bass a "little" muddy compared to without.
that said, I still use them outdoors but not indoors.

[jpschust]

thats interesting... are you talking brand new screens?  if not they may need to be cleaned (little dishwashing detergent will clean the gunk right out of them).  i would find it very hard to believe that in the live arena you would be able to tell a difference unless the screens were dirty.

[nic]

they were new...the difference is *slight* but noticeable.
I only noticed it when I ran the screens for 1 set but not another of a 2 set show

[jpschust]

seems very very strange to me.  ive never ever had something happen like that in the studio environment unless the screen was dirty or damaged.