Topic: Should I stick with 16bit??? Or should I go 24bit???

[twatts (pants are so over-rated...)]

Should I stick with 16bit???  Or should I go 24bit???

Reasons to stay 16bit:  Everything I have is geared towards 16bit playback - my PC, my burner, my recorder, and my home-stereo.
Reasons to go 24bit:  Higher standard...

I'm concerned about PC noise playing back my 24bits via the sound card (I've had this problem in the past)...  So I'm thinking I have to get a DVDA player.

I'm also wondering how DVDA players handle the 24bit signal - do they they output 24bit via LPCM SPDIF???  Or is it that they D>A the 24bit to analog only and no SPDIF out on 24bit???  If 24bit SPDIF, don't I need a 24bit home-stereo preamp???

Basically, I'm wondering if the switch to 24bit is worth buying a new home stereo preamp, a new recorder, and new PC burner (or set-up music server), or a new transport???  Or should I stick with 16bit (like with an ACM660) knowing that technology will always get better and you can't always keep up???

Currently, I'm leaning towards staying 16bit...  But if 24bit becomes a standard for tapers, well, I want to be "standard"...

Thanks, all constructive opions are welcome...

Terry

[jeromejello]

i'm just an idiot newb, but i will be doing 16 for a while...although when i get my r4 (hopefully by years end) i will jump to 24 bit for certain projects.

[Nick Graham]

Some DVDA players output 24/96 via S/PDIF, but only on DVD-R burned discs. Most released DVD-As and SACDs will only route through the analog outputs.

You can pickup a DVDA capable player for less than $200, a PC based DVD burner for $75, and an amp/receiver that will accept a 24 bit S/PDIF signal for less than $300....not too expensive to step up to hi res audio.

[pfife]

I replied w/ my thoughts on the other thread, so I'll copy/paste here as well:


My Toshitba 4960 sends the signal out the analog outputs, so its nbd - no other updating required.

However, my thought about your dilema:  don't necessarily take the playback system into account in making this decision.   IMO, its most important to get the highest quality recordings as possible - those are the things you can't get a second opportunity to record at a higher resolution.  If you have to dither down to listen to it, then so be it... but for approximately $100, you could get yourself one of a few dvd players that will play your dvd-a's, and that's all you should need.

[twatts (pants are so over-rated...)]

I actually posted this first in the "Skalinger thread", here is PFife's repsonse:

http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=68091.msg913780#msg913780

[pfife]

summary of my position:  I highly recommend jumping to 24bit, cost allowing.  just my $.02

[BC]

Go 24 bit, cheapest way to make higher quality recordings.

To be honest I don't have a DVD-a player and just burn everything on CD for playback and archive the 24 bit masters. But at least they are there for me to go back to.

Plus, like Pfife and Nick said, all you really need to playback 24 bit on optical media is a player, and a burner, shouldn't set you back too much $$.

[pfife]

Plus, like Pfife and Nick said, all you really need to playback 24 bit on optical media is a player, and a burner, shouldn't set you back too much $$.

I think I paid about $60 for my Toshiba... sounds great, but has a lot of faults.  But, it was only $60.

Also, if you already have a dvd player, and get something that will record at 24/48, then you can use that Audio DVD Creator program, which will burn your shows on a regular DVD, so they can be played on a regular dvd player.   I think that prog will automatically upsample from 24/44.1 too.

[twatts (pants are so over-rated...)]

I've been thinking it over and I will continue my quest to go 24bit...  It'll take some time to save up for a nice recorder, hopefully something better than the MAudio MicroCrapper will appear soon...

Maybe a Warm Mod ACM671???  Hmmm...  I'd have to sell my UA5...  Though I think I'll invest in a DVD burner and maybe an upgraded transport later...  I can 16/48 now, so I might as well take advantage of it...

Can my dinosaur P2-300 handle a DVD burner??? 

Terry

[nihilistic0]

You may as well start upgrading

I dont see digital audio really going beyond 24/96.  Some people may argue for 192kHz but whatev.  Also, there is 32 bit and 32 bit floating point, but they're pretty pointless for home users.

Also, you can start buying DVD-A discs and jamming out in actual 5.1 music :]

[Lil Kim Jong-Il]

I'm with the others who recommend 24-bit.  I really love the sound and even if you have a 16-bit playback today, later you'll be glad you can return to the full resolution master files, like BC posted.

But there is a down side - there is more post processing.   With DAT I could get a CD transfer through the CDRW700 in an evening.  With 24-bit, I had to get software and a new machine to run windows.  Also, it took a while to get a workflow I could deal with.   Including tracking, compressing, authoring the 24-bit version, writing multiple backups to different DVD media, processing down to 16-bit, it takes me about 4 hours to get a show ready for the car.   I'm way way behind in tracking shows.  I have stacks of discs and HDs with masters that have never been tracked or played back except through the cassette adapter on the ride home from the show.  If you have time for the post processing, you can make CDs for now and when you upgrade your playback you'll have the 24-bit goodness waiting on you.  I don't know how some people get stuff out so quickly.

[Brian Skalinder]

I'm concerned about PC noise playing back my 24bits via the sound card (I've had this problem in the past)...  So I'm thinking I have to get a DVDA player.

Aside from burning DVDs, another way around this:  send the digital signal out of your PC and do the DAC outside the computer.  That's effectively what you're doing with DVD-A, putting the digital signal onto an optical medium so you may perform the DAC outside the PC.  FWIW, I use a Squeezebox* for wireless transmission from my PC to my living room playback.  When I went 24-bit, I had to make the decision about whether to deal with optical media.  I decided my money was better spent on multiple HDs for redundancy and a Squeezebox than DVD media and player.

* Note, however, that the Squeezebox is limited currently to 24/48.  As best I can gather, the hardware's capable of 24/96, but the firmware / software doesn't currently support it.

[stirinthesauce]

I'm way way behind in tracking shows.  I have stacks of discs and HDs with masters that have never been tracked or played back except through the cassette adapter on the ride home from the show. 

This is my #1 issue with recording in 24bit.  I am WAAAAAAAAY behind as is with my 16bit masters.  Hard enough to find the time to track/flac/burn these.  If I record in 24 bit, it is just that many more that will never see the light of day which I don't want because 50% of what I tape I am the only taper and alot of that is bands that aren't regularly taped.  I just can't deal with the additional workflow seeing as how I'm currently taping 2-3 shows a week.  Maybe I just need to tape less and drag my lappy along more often and start recording in 24 bit.  Oh well, I'm sure I'll move along with the times soon enough, guess I'll enjoy my ease of transfer, track and burn for the time being. 

[nickgregory]

I'm with the others who recommend 24-bit.  I really love the sound and even if you have a 16-bit playback today, later you'll be glad you can return to the full resolution master files, like BC posted.

But there is a down side - there is more post processing.   With DAT I could get a CD transfer through the CDRW700 in an evening.  With 24-bit, I had to get software and a new machine to run windows.  Also, it took a while to get a workflow I could deal with.   Including tracking, compressing, authoring the 24-bit version, writing multiple backups to different DVD media, processing down to 16-bit, it takes me about 4 hours to get a show ready for the car.   I'm way way behind in tracking shows.  I have stacks of discs and HDs with masters that have never been tracked or played back except through the cassette adapter on the ride home from the show.  If you have time for the post processing, you can make CDs for now and when you upgrade your playback you'll have the 24-bit goodness waiting on you.  I don't know how some people get stuff out so quickly.

agree with everything Michael said...I think it was Boswell who said with 24 bit it was like he had just gotten his first dat...having to learn all the workflow and quirks...but imo, you can get pretty quick on the workflow. 

to me 24 bit is worth the hype...I really have been converted on what great 24 bit can sound like...

[pfife]

Can my dinosaur P2-300 handle a DVD burner??? 

twatts, one thing to consider is that 24-bit files are HUGE!  Does the dinosaur have enough HD space to handle this stuff?  Also, on an older machine, I'd imagine dithering/resampling is going to take quite a while.