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Author Topic: Building a full 007 taping rig from scratch in 2022  (Read 6923 times)

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Offline yug du nord

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Re: Building a full 007 taping rig from scratch in 2022
« Reply #75 on: June 29, 2022, 05:42:51 PM »
Off topic:

Let’s keep in mind playback systems.
My playback system is the weakest link of my rig listening experience.
It does what I want it to, but definitely could upgrade it.

Playback matters when it comes to rig sources also.
.....got a blank space where my mind should be.....

Online Scooter123

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Re: Building a full 007 taping rig from scratch in 2022
« Reply #76 on: June 29, 2022, 05:53:50 PM »
Agreed, and therein lies another conundrum

Does one start with a cartridge (for vinyl), because if the cartridge doesn't pick it up, the speakers won't play it?

The D-A module for those listening to digital sources?

Preampliers? Tube or Solid State?

Amplifiers?  Again, Tube or Solid State? 

Speakers?  Conventional ported speakers or ribbon type?

Again, its your money and your ears, and if one can't tell the difference between Magnaplanars and Polk Audio speakers, then in a certain way, I envy you.  Enjoy the Polk Audio speakers with your Tasters Choice. 
Regards,
Scooter123

mk41 > N Box  > Sony M-10
mk4 > N Box > Sony M-10

Offline unidentified

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Re: Building a full 007 taping rig from scratch in 2022
« Reply #77 on: June 29, 2022, 06:36:44 PM »
You know, for some people

Freeze Dried Tasters Choice works for them, rather than Starbucks

Cell phone camera shots are just as good as a Nikon SLR

Church Microphones work for them

And for those people, if they don't notice the difference, then more power to them



Reminds of the shot in Pulp Fiction where Vincent tells Jimmy how good his coffee is...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1-1dUbBjgE

Ultimately, its your money and your ears, and if you are happy with the rig, then that's great.  Trying to justify better microphones to someone who drinks freeze dried coffee because Starbucks doesn't taste 10x better to them, is a fool's errand.

That's not at all the point and vastly exaggerates the quality range being discussed,  but whatever.  It's your opinion and I will respect it and your experience, although Starbucks is surely not the Schoeps of coffee.   

Here's my last word on this thread.  This site works best when folks are respectful, kind, and helpful.  I see that at work everyday here when some novice wanders in here looking for basic help and people jump in to offer guidance in a respectful manner (https://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=199646.0;topicseen).  Insinuating that long time tapers with vast experience (literally 50 years worth in my case) should stay home rather than record shows with their allegedly "crappy" mics is not useful and destroys everyone's chances to learn more about this great and odd hobby of ours.  I know that I have learned a lot here from kind and generous souls and continue to do so everyday.   Respectful communication, please.  Just saying.  Deep breaths and peace to all.  I will not be responding to this thread further. 
« Last Edit: June 29, 2022, 07:49:50 PM by unidentified »

Offline MakersMarc

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Re: Building a full 007 taping rig from scratch in 2022
« Reply #78 on: June 30, 2022, 10:21:51 AM »
I think of it this way; the span between say C11/14 to 4Vs, we're talking maybe about a 15-20% difference, if even. For example: I taped Mule fob last week, the sound was pristine at 25'. A Church tape would have sounded good. I wish I could live with 85%, it is waaay cheaper.

yeah, but 15-20% difference in what? That's my point. What are you measuring? Goodness?

I trust my ears.
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Offline opsopcopolis

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Re: Building a full 007 taping rig from scratch in 2022
« Reply #79 on: June 30, 2022, 12:09:56 PM »
I think of it this way; the span between say C11/14 to 4Vs, we're talking maybe about a 15-20% difference, if even. For example: I taped Mule fob last week, the sound was pristine at 25'. A Church tape would have sounded good. I wish I could live with 85%, it is waaay cheaper.

yeah, but 15-20% difference in what? That's my point. What are you measuring? Goodness?

I trust my ears.

 ::) ya ok
« Last Edit: June 30, 2022, 12:13:15 PM by opsopcopolis »

Offline MakersMarc

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Re: Building a full 007 taping rig from scratch in 2022
« Reply #80 on: June 30, 2022, 12:58:48 PM »
You know, for some people

Freeze Dried Tasters Choice works for them, rather than Starbucks

Cell phone camera shots are just as good as a Nikon SLR

Church Microphones work for them

And for those people, if they don't notice the difference, then more power to them

Reminds of the shot in Pulp Fiction where Vincent tells Jimmy how good his coffee is...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1-1dUbBjgE

Ultimately, its your money and your ears, and if you are happy with the rig, then that's great.  Trying to justify better microphones to someone who drinks freeze dried coffee because Starbucks doesn't taste 10x better to them, is a fool's errand.

...and we have a winner!
😈 Mk4v/41v>nbob actives>Baby nbox>Oade warm mod Marantz 620.

Open: 4v/41v>nbobs>Nicky mod Naiant PFA>Oade warm mod 661.

Home: the Stereo Hospital budget refurb rig: Lappie>DragonFly Cobalt/Red with Jitterbug>Nikko NR520/Sansui 221>B&W V202 speakers.

Offline jcable77

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Re: Building a full 007 taping rig from scratch in 2022
« Reply #81 on: June 30, 2022, 05:16:53 PM »
Its threads like this that make me say when people ask if Im "a taper" I respond with "no, I just record music".
« Last Edit: June 30, 2022, 05:23:35 PM by jcable77 »

Offline tjj5036

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Re: Building a full 007 taping rig from scratch in 2022
« Reply #82 on: June 30, 2022, 06:32:51 PM »
Damn this thread is getting spicy! To answer the original question I think SP-CMC-4Us w/ the 4.7K sensitivity mod > SP Battery box (SP-SPSB-10/SP-SPSB-11) > compact recorder (PCM-A10 / Edirol, etc) is the right way to go. Those mics + battery boxes rarely set off metal detectors since its mostly plastic and they're super small as well. Should run you like 400-500$ depending on the recorder you want to go with. I ran a similar setup and was very, very happy with how the results turned out at the types of shows you're describing.

I eventually went the Schoeps + Babynbox route and absolutely love the upgrade but I wouldn't start off with something like that. Start small, see if the hobby is for you, practice with the gear and get the hang of everything down first before deciding to go big. It's always worth having a backup rig anyway; whenever I travel for a show now I leave my AT853Us + SP-SPSB-10 in the car in case something goes wrong or I get busted with the beefier equipment.

There was a comment about downloading recordings to find the type of sound you like. Also recommend doing that but I think there is a bit of bias there in that the people running Schoeps/Neumanns typically know where to go in a venue to get a great sounding recording so the odds are in their favor to begin with. If you have a crappy spot in the venue the beefier mics aren't really going to help you out.

Good luck!
Bay Area taper that runs http://ratm.live . Please get in touch if you have any Rage recordings or know anyone that taped Rage! Always happy to tape a Bay Area show, get in touch if you want someone taped!

Mics: MK4s, AT853s, CA-14s/CA-11s
Battery/Pre: NBox+, Babynbox, SP-SPSB-10, CA-9200, Naiant Littlebox
Recorder: PCM-A10, Marantz PMD 661
Video: Panasonic ZS100

Online Scooter123

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Re: Building a full 007 taping rig from scratch in 2022
« Reply #83 on: July 01, 2022, 01:51:41 PM »
Damn this thread is getting spicy! To answer the original question I think SP-CMC-4Us w/ the 4.7K sensitivity mod > SP Battery box (SP-SPSB-10/SP-SPSB-11) > compact recorder (PCM-A10 / Edirol, etc) is the right way to go. Those mics + battery boxes rarely set off metal detectors since its mostly plastic and they're super small as well. Should run you like 400-500$ depending on the recorder you want to go with. I ran a similar setup and was very, very happy with how the results turned out at the types of shows you're describing.

I eventually went the Schoeps + Babynbox route and absolutely love the upgrade but I wouldn't start off with something like that. Start small, see if the hobby is for you, practice with the gear and get the hang of everything down first before deciding to go big. It's always worth having a backup rig anyway; whenever I travel for a show now I leave my AT853Us + SP-SPSB-10 in the car in case something goes wrong or I get busted with the beefier equipment.

There was a comment about downloading recordings to find the type of sound you like. Also recommend doing that but I think there is a bit of bias there in that the people running Schoeps/Neumanns typically know where to go in a venue to get a great sounding recording so the odds are in their favor to begin with. If you have a crappy spot in the venue the beefier mics aren't really going to help you out.

Good luck!

+1  I had the AT8 mikes after Church mikes and before DPAs and before Schoeps.  I disagree that better mikes in a crappy location will not make a difference.  MK41s for example are perfect for a bad location with talkers around you.  I don't run them much, but that is what they were made for.  I wish I kept my DPA Omnis. 
Regards,
Scooter123

mk41 > N Box  > Sony M-10
mk4 > N Box > Sony M-10

Offline grawk

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Re: Building a full 007 taping rig from scratch in 2022
« Reply #84 on: July 01, 2022, 01:59:59 PM »
4061s are pretty awesome for pulling tapes when nothing else will get in, and you have to try pretty hard to make them sound bad.

Offline daspyknows

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Re: Building a full 007 taping rig from scratch in 2022
« Reply #85 on: July 01, 2022, 02:19:01 PM »
I know I'm an asshole, but i hate when someone posts Zoomie audio of, say, Dead Company. And the ticket was like $250. For fucks sake, if you can buy that ticket you can buy mics. Even cheap ones is better than a Zoomie. Pissing in the gene pool.

Been out running my 4's and 41s out in the field so missed all of this but  :cheers:

Scooter's point with priorities is spot on IMHO.  If I am paying up for tickets in the prime spot and I have the cash to fund it why not.  I am going in with the best possible rig, going in with backups of every component in case of  a failure.  If spending $500 on the ticket is worth it to me compared to the $100 ticket then spending  $3K each on 2 rigs is also worth it for me.    Would  I be as into this hobby if I wasn't as invested?  Doubtful.

In the whole scheme of things this isn't a crazy expensive hobby.  I know people with other hobbies  like cars, boats, skiing, biking etc etc who spend vast sums because they can.  I also know others without the resources who also have those hobbies and spend what they can and enjoy it.  Relatively speaking, aside from tickets its less expensive than it used to be as well.
« Last Edit: July 01, 2022, 02:23:44 PM by daspyknows »

Offline tjj5036

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Re: Building a full 007 taping rig from scratch in 2022
« Reply #86 on: July 01, 2022, 09:13:37 PM »
Damn this thread is getting spicy! To answer the original question I think SP-CMC-4Us w/ the 4.7K sensitivity mod > SP Battery box (SP-SPSB-10/SP-SPSB-11) > compact recorder (PCM-A10 / Edirol, etc) is the right way to go. Those mics + battery boxes rarely set off metal detectors since its mostly plastic and they're super small as well. Should run you like 400-500$ depending on the recorder you want to go with. I ran a similar setup and was very, very happy with how the results turned out at the types of shows you're describing.

I eventually went the Schoeps + Babynbox route and absolutely love the upgrade but I wouldn't start off with something like that. Start small, see if the hobby is for you, practice with the gear and get the hang of everything down first before deciding to go big. It's always worth having a backup rig anyway; whenever I travel for a show now I leave my AT853Us + SP-SPSB-10 in the car in case something goes wrong or I get busted with the beefier equipment.

There was a comment about downloading recordings to find the type of sound you like. Also recommend doing that but I think there is a bit of bias there in that the people running Schoeps/Neumanns typically know where to go in a venue to get a great sounding recording so the odds are in their favor to begin with. If you have a crappy spot in the venue the beefier mics aren't really going to help you out.

Good luck!

+1  I had the AT8 mikes after Church mikes and before DPAs and before Schoeps.  I disagree that better mikes in a crappy location will not make a difference.  MK41s for example are perfect for a bad location with talkers around you.  I don't run them much, but that is what they were made for.  I wish I kept my DPA Omnis.

To clarify, having the better mics in a bad location will definitely help, but whenever I've done shootouts the difference is maybe like 10%. It's hard to recover from a bad location :)
Bay Area taper that runs http://ratm.live . Please get in touch if you have any Rage recordings or know anyone that taped Rage! Always happy to tape a Bay Area show, get in touch if you want someone taped!

Mics: MK4s, AT853s, CA-14s/CA-11s
Battery/Pre: NBox+, Babynbox, SP-SPSB-10, CA-9200, Naiant Littlebox
Recorder: PCM-A10, Marantz PMD 661
Video: Panasonic ZS100

Offline daspyknows

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Re: Building a full 007 taping rig from scratch in 2022
« Reply #87 on: July 02, 2022, 02:12:09 AM »
Damn this thread is getting spicy! To answer the original question I think SP-CMC-4Us w/ the 4.7K sensitivity mod > SP Battery box (SP-SPSB-10/SP-SPSB-11) > compact recorder (PCM-A10 / Edirol, etc) is the right way to go. Those mics + battery boxes rarely set off metal detectors since its mostly plastic and they're super small as well. Should run you like 400-500$ depending on the recorder you want to go with. I ran a similar setup and was very, very happy with how the results turned out at the types of shows you're describing.

I eventually went the Schoeps + Babynbox route and absolutely love the upgrade but I wouldn't start off with something like that. Start small, see if the hobby is for you, practice with the gear and get the hang of everything down first before deciding to go big. It's always worth having a backup rig anyway; whenever I travel for a show now I leave my AT853Us + SP-SPSB-10 in the car in case something goes wrong or I get busted with the beefier equipment.

There was a comment about downloading recordings to find the type of sound you like. Also recommend doing that but I think there is a bit of bias there in that the people running Schoeps/Neumanns typically know where to go in a venue to get a great sounding recording so the odds are in their favor to begin with. If you have a crappy spot in the venue the beefier mics aren't really going to help you out.

Good luck!

+1  I had the AT8 mikes after Church mikes and before DPAs and before Schoeps.  I disagree that better mikes in a crappy location will not make a difference.  MK41s for example are perfect for a bad location with talkers around you.  I don't run them much, but that is what they were made for.  I wish I kept my DPA Omnis.

To clarify, having the better mics in a bad location will definitely help, but whenever I've done shootouts the difference is maybe like 10%. It's hard to recover from a bad location :)

Sometimes you got to do what we did for Bright Eyes to deal with location issues.

Offline bonghitwillie

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Re: Building a full 007 taping rig from scratch in 2022
« Reply #88 on: July 03, 2022, 04:50:46 PM »
you can always eq your recording in post and make it sound like a schoeps

Offline grawk

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Re: Building a full 007 taping rig from scratch in 2022
« Reply #89 on: July 03, 2022, 05:38:17 PM »
you can always eq your recording in post and make it sound like a schoeps

no, you can’t improve off axis response or resolution with eq

 

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