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Gear / Technical Help => Cables => Topic started by: ghoststash on April 06, 2012, 12:40:59 PM
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Looking to purchase some new XRL cables...mainly 20ft. Can anyone recommend some that I can find online? Price range up to $50 each?
Thanks in advance
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The best way to go is tgakidis here in TS. He makes 'em custom. For stock cables, Mogami gold is hard to beat.
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A couple of the members here make custom cables, in virtually any configuration you might want. Try tgakidis (http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=133186.0 (http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=133186.0)) or darktrain (http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=110932.0 (http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=110932.0)).
I have several cables from tgakidis and am extremely pleased with the quality (several more on the way, actually). I don't have any personal experience with darktrain's stuff, but I know a number of people that use them and think they're great...
[EDIT: I was posting at the same time as Waistlib62...Sorry for the duplicate info!]
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I just switched from Canare Star Quad to Gotham low capacitance Star Quad and made my own but you can buy...
GAC-4/1 Low Capacitance Quad Mic Cable.
Black 25 Foot Assemblies with Top Quality Black Shell, Gold Pin XLR Connectors.
for $40.00 each direct from Gotham Audio USA or buy it as bulk/cut length cable & your preference of connectors to make your own.
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The best way to go is tgakidis here in TS. He makes 'em custom. For stock cables, Mogami gold is hard to beat.
X2, plus he's a great guy, easy to deal with. Likewise for darktrain. Support TS cable builders!!
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The best way to go is tgakidis here in TS. He makes 'em custom. For stock cables, Mogami gold is hard to beat.
X2, plus he's a great guy, easy to deal with. Likewise for darktrain. Support TS cable builders!!
I absolutely agree. Both make fantastic cables. I thought I'd add looking into Canare Mini Star Quad and also silver clad copper cables. Either cable builder can make these.
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The best way to go is tgakidis here in TS. He makes 'em custom. For stock cables, Mogami gold is hard to beat.
X2, plus he's a great guy, easy to deal with. Likewise for darktrain. Support TS cable builders!!
I absolutely agree. Both make fantastic cables. I thought I'd add looking into Canare Mini Star Quad and also silver clad copper cables. Either cable builder can make these.
There are 2 versions of Canare mini star quad, one is better suited for field microphone use [L-4E5C] and the other is more for permanent installation usage [L-4E5AT]. I used Canare's regular size star quad for years and loved it offering excellent noise rejection (still have the cables for backup) but recently switched to Gotham because Canare/Belden/Mogami/Clark/Gepco star quad is higher capacitance cable.
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PM sent
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The best way to go is tgakidis here in TS. He makes 'em custom. For stock cables, Mogami gold is hard to beat.
X2, plus he's a great guy, easy to deal with. Likewise for darktrain. Support TS cable builders!!
I absolutely agree. Both make fantastic cables. I thought I'd add looking into Canare Mini Star Quad and also silver clad copper cables. Either cable builder can make these.
There are 2 versions of Canare mini star quad, one is better suited for field microphone use [L-4E5C] and the other is more for permanent installation usage [L-4E5AT]. I used Canare's regular size star quad for years and loved it offering excellent noise rejection (still have the cables for backup) but recently switched brands because Canare/Belden/Mogami/Clark/Gepco star quad is higher capacitance cable.
I was unaware of the L-4E5AT. I'll make sure I'm getting the L-4E5C next time I order bulk cable. Thanks for pointing that out. :coolguy:
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zaollas!
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Anyone happen to have a link to that hilarious Amazon comment section about cables improving sound?
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I like musilux for xlr-3 cables - wirelux.com
My house is wired with their speaker cable too - I love it
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I use Mogami Mini Quad for tube microphone cables:
http://www.mogamicable.com/category/bulk/microphone/quad/ (http://www.mogamicable.com/category/bulk/microphone/quad/)
But it looks like the Gotham cable has better specs for quad
Migrating to Gotham >:D
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I use Mogami Mini Quad for tube microphone cables:
http://www.mogamicable.com/category/bulk/microphone/quad/ (http://www.mogamicable.com/category/bulk/microphone/quad/)
But it looks like the Gotham cable has better specs for quad
Migrating to Gotham >:D
That's exactly why I switched after years of using Canare Star Quad. I do believe Gotham also makes tube mic cable.
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But it looks like the Gotham cable has better specs for quad
Migrating to Gotham >:D
That's exactly why I switched after years of using Canare Star Quad.
Can you share a direct link of the cable you speak of quad
thanx
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But it looks like the Gotham cable has better specs for quad
Migrating to Gotham >:D
That's exactly why I switched after years of using Canare Star Quad.
Can you share a direct link of the cable you speak of quad
thanx
Not sure if this is the one (http://www.gotham.ch/en/index.php?section=docsys&cmd=22_details&id=15) DigiGal was referring to. For more info, use the contact info on Gotham Audio USA's homepage (http://www.gothamaudiousa.com/).
I wasn't familiar with GA's products. Looks like something else for me to try. Thanks for the recommendation DigiGal.
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Maybe we should start a great big cable drama thread. We haven't had one in a while! ;)
In my many years here at TS, I've never heard a published cable comp that documented a sonic difference due to cables.
I'm not saying cables don't make a difference - far from it. Just that a Lot of assumptions are made. We seem to take a lot of things for granted in cables. Such as the preference for star quad over two or three conductor.
And, oh, btw. Some people use the wrong flux. Or they don't take the time to clean the flux off after soldering. So their solder connections corrode. I'm not saying that about anyone specifically, or even implying it. Just that cleaning flux from connections is a PIA and it tends to expose us to harmful chemicals. It is the part of cable making that I dislike the most. Good solder joints are also important. How hard can it be to solder a wire to a terminal? Well.....
So on the Gotham cable..... Has anyone confirmed that there is a sound improvement? Or is this chasing specs? Has anyone actually verified the specs by measuring the cable? What aspect of the mechanical construction results in a lower capacitance? Are your runs so long that capacitance is a major consideration?
Does it justify the higher price (2X - 3X?)? The shield is a double layer twist, which has great coverage. One concern with that approach vs. a braid is whether the shield opens up due to wear or a situation beyond your control. Ideally, our cables get less wear than most on stage cables. Though many of us do record on stage. Of the cables commonly in use, 1804a has the least shield coverage. Some of the silver-teflon MIL cables may also suffer from poor shield coverage.
The Gotham specs seem to obfuscate things a bit. They made some odd choices in units. Like how they specify the size of the conductor.
So what is our priority in cables? For me, it is audio quality and some amount of durability (I don't want to worry that hidden damage is compromising my recordings). Another major consideration is ease of setup and tear down. I want to minimize my setup time, especially on a ladder up in the rafters, and especially up on stage. The teflon jacketed cables can either be extremely difficult to handle, or they can be wonderful - I've worked with both. A friend had an early pair that were terrible - they had a tremendous memory and wanted to coil like a spring. My primary pair are wonderful, and every time I coil them I think of how much I love them compared to my canare and mogami cables.
At this time, I have some great test equipment that would be useful for comparing some cable behaviors. Mainly frequency response and RF noise. While I tend to emphasis subjective listening performance above all else, there is a lot to be said for eliminating cables that have poor frequency response, etc. Though doing these tests balanced is much more tricky. Ultimately, I don't really have any time for this now - my active mic products are the priority (though I am really curious).
Beware of counterfeit cable and counterfeit connectors.
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But it looks like the Gotham cable has better specs for quad
Migrating to Gotham >:D
That's exactly why I switched after years of using Canare Star Quad.
Can you share a direct link of the cable you speak of quad
thanx
Not sure if this is the one (http://www.gotham.ch/en/index.php?section=docsys&cmd=22_details&id=15) DigiGal was referring to. For more info, use the contact info on Gotham Audio USA's homepage (http://www.gothamaudiousa.com/).
I wasn't familiar with GA's products. Looks like something else for me to try. Thanks for the recommendation DigiGal.
Yes, GAC 4/1 is Gotham's low capacitance star quad cable and it's the one I was referring to, I used Neutrik EMC XLR connectors on the GAC 4/1 cables.
I also just picked up some Gotham three conductor "double Reussen shielded" GAC-3 mic cable to try. Haven't built the GAC-3 cables yet but will put standard XLR's on these. GAC3 recommended by Neil Muncy to overcome "pin 1 problems".
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But it looks like the Gotham cable has better specs for quad
Migrating to Gotham >:D
That's exactly why I switched after years of using Canare Star Quad.
Can you share a direct link of the cable you speak of quad
thanx
Not sure if this is the one (http://www.gotham.ch/en/index.php?section=docsys&cmd=22_details&id=15) DigiGal was referring to. For more info, use the contact info on Gotham Audio USA's homepage (http://www.gothamaudiousa.com/).
I wasn't familiar with GA's products. Looks like something else for me to try. Thanks for the recommendation DigiGal.
Yes, GAC 4/1 is Gotham's low capacitance star quad cable and it's the one I was referring to, I used Neutrik EMC XLR connectors on the GAC 4/1 cables.
I also just picked up some Gotham three conductor "double Reussen shielded" GAC-3 mic cable to try. Haven't built the GAC-3 cables yet but will put standard XLR's on these. GAC3 recommended by Neil Muncy to overcome "pin 1 problems".
I've wanted to try the Neutrik EMC XLR . Do they require a tool to fasten the boot to the shell? Wonder how effective they are against cell phone interference.
(We could start a discussion about how much better these sound ::)
http://www.neutrik.us/en-us/xlr/crystalcon/nc3fxx-b-crystal
. . . especially with "miracle pebbles" taped around the cable ;D
Just kidding; not trying to start anything
Dave
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I've wanted to try the Neutrik EMC XLR . Do they require a tool to fasten the boot to the shell? Wonder how effective they are against cell phone interference.
(We could start a discussion about how much better these sound ::)
http://www.neutrik.us/en-us/xlr/crystalcon/nc3fxx-b-crystal
. . . especially with "miracle pebbles" taped around the cable ;D
Just kidding; not trying to start anything
Dave
Although they sell one, a special tool is not at all necessary to install the boots, it could probably help speed up assembly if you're making lots of cables.
I used EMC connectors with the GAC4/1 quad cable but by design it seems the GAC 3 cable will be better suited with standard XLR connectors.
The Neutrik EMC connectors integrate an LC-filter to avoid RF-interference and LF-noise from their EMC XX series of connectors. The Neutrik EMC XX incorporates circular capacitors that act as high-pass filters with a cut-off frequency around 10 MHz and also an EMI suppression ferrite bead with 24 ohm at 1 MHz btw. pin 1 and the cable screen providing a low-pass filter for improved RF rejection.
They were developed to reduce RF interference and pin 1 problems, more details here for anyone following along. http://www.neutrik.us/en-us/xlr/emc-series/nc3fxx-emc
No "miracle pebbles" or "magic legumes" involved with the EMC connectors, but you could add them yourself if so inclined. ;)
The crystalCON with CRYSTALLIZED TM Swarovski Elements on standard NC connectors are most likely marketed toward stage performers who are looking for bling. :crazy:
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PM sent
Darktrain is the MAN :) Ted does nice work as well 8)
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Have been a mogami/canare star quad guy for years, but have begun the shift to Ted's cables exclusively. Echo everything said about product and customer service ;)
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As far as commercially made cables, I have been a ProCo Ameriquad user for almost 20 years. Around 2005, had a 2 sets that were 9 years old where the female Neutrix connectors were starting to have a tough time locking. I called them about getting them serviced, and instead they offered me a full replacement at no charge, all I had to do was send them the old ones. Great cable maker, IMO.
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I've been very happy with everything Darktrain has made for me, from RCA>RCA, RCA>mini, and an awesome 30' kcy extension cable.
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I am a fan of cables made by ted gakidis, they are the best and hes a great guy!
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I would like to point out that both Ted( a cnble maker himself) and Digi Gal pointed out you can make your own. Is it for everyone? Well no. But, it is one of the first steps you will learn if you are going to try and solder anything. The plus is that you spend a little less and can make exactly what you want. Worst case is that you don't do a good job and have to do it over. All part of the learning curve, IMHO. Or you just have no interest or dont feel it is a skill set that you can/have mastered then our local cable makers are there for you. As an aside, I can get Zaolla cables at just over cost, if you wanted. http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=126561.0 BUT....even just over cost they are expensive cables being solid silver not the silver plated. They are alos the opposite of light with cable being about 10mm. I have looked and have not found an easy ready source for bulk purchase of this type of cable. Fwiw' the only cable I don't own yet is the gotham, I have, and use, the canare & Mogami star quad, Gepco bittree 110 ohm starquad, Belden 1804a starquad. This type of cable is better at rejecting interference, and your best interference protection os to do what Digi Gal does. It does help on your basic connectors if you do tie in the shells in order to have the coverage be continuous especially when you might be using two cables connected to each other. Now let's start up that "BEST" cable argument, as noted, we have not had that downward spiral in a while >:D
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Buy a soldering iron and learn how to make you own cables...
Terry
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I'm looking for new cables and would like to try the gac 4/1. Since I'm solder challenged......do you know anyone that makes the GAC with Neutrick EMC connectors? Mentioned before, but it seems that could be a good combination.
Also like the look and feel of the musilux, but not sure if it would hold up with me. I would probably break it first time out.
-haf
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PM darktrain. He makes all of my cables exclusively and I've been extremely happy with all of them. They're all HQ cables with good neutral connectors ;) if its a cable and a connector you need, darktrain can do it if its possible.
I have never bought or used Teds cables, but I've seen them and they look like they're super HQ as well. You really can't go wrong with either cable maker. I just have experience with darktrain, so that's why I'm recommending him ;)
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I'm sure cable design and build can make differences in sound and clarity, but I would also like a set of cables that are easy to handle.
Read a good paper that explains how the 4 conductor works. I also learned a lot about cable technology and issues. Now I just need to read another 10 times and maybe it will begin to sink in :)
http://www.procosound.com/download/whitepapers/Understanding%20Microphone%20Cables.pdf (http://www.procosound.com/download/whitepapers/Understanding%20Microphone%20Cables.pdf)
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The best way to go is tgakidis here in TS. He makes 'em custom. For stock cables, Mogami gold is hard to beat.
Agreed
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The best cables are made by ted gak. He is fairly priced and extremely well made. As well as a nice guy.
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Where do the monster brand cables fall as far as quality and reliability? It doesn't sound like any of you guys use them. I have used their instrument cables for years without issue. How do they work for live recording gear?
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Where do the monster brand cables fall as far as quality and reliability? It doesn't sound like any of you guys use them. I have used their instrument cables for years without issue. How do they work for live recording gear?
the cables are quite good quality, but i find them to be very expensive and i think there is better value such as cables make by ted. but i think some of us if not a lot like to support inside the community and buy stuff from other tapers like ted, and darktrain, ect. but i don't have anything against them, other than the price. but of course, only MY opinion
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Shady company, who makes sub-par goods. They also threaten legal action at the drop of the hat, going after monster.com, Monster energy drink, and Blue Jeans Cable. Blue Jeans uses high quality Belden cables, Neutrik and Canare connectors, and has a few of their own lines. Check out this email exchange.
http://www.bluejeanscable.com/legal/mcp/
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Where do the monster brand cables fall as far as quality and reliability? It doesn't sound like any of you guys use them. I have used their instrument cables for years without issue. How do they work for live recording gear?
Overpriced and nothing special, despite their marketing. The cables made by Ted and Darktrain, among others, are far superior and fairly priced.
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That is pretty shady.
I am more concerned with quality. Don't get me wrong, that kind of business is a turn off to the point that I probably would not buy another monster cable, but considering the lifetime warranty and the fact that I already own two long instrument cable made by monster, and I have bought two 15' xlr cables to start with my recording rig with that are made by monster, I will continue to use them unless there is an affordable cable out there that is hands down better as far as quality is concerned. I really like being able to walk into a store with a broken cable( only had to do it once) and leave with a brand new cable for free.
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Then buy anything other than Monster from your local store
Canare
Belkin
Mogami
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Ted & Robb ( darktrain) make excellent products with fast delivery. I like that they can make custom ends i.e right angles and offsets to custom fit
how you have gear set up in bag. Support your fellow tapers!
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Anyone happen to have a link to that hilarious Amazon comment section about cables improving sound?
I know I'm grave-digging here, but I think you're referring to:
A caution to people buying these: if you do not follow the "directional markings" on the cables, your music will play backwards. Please check that before mentioning it in your reviews.
I was disappointed. I consider myself an audiophile - I regularly spend over $1000 on cables to get the ultimate sound. I keep my music-listening room in a Faraday cage to prevent any interference that could alter my music-listening experience. Sending any signal down ordinary copper can degrade the signal considerably. While ordinary listeners might not notice, to somebody with even a rudimentary knowledge of sound, the artifacts are glaring. Denon should have used silver wiring (hermetically sealed inside the rubber sheath to prevent any tarnishing, of course), which has a significantly higher conductivity than copper. Furthermore, Denon needs to treat the wires they use in the cable with a polarity inductor to ensure minimal phase variance.
Needless to say, I returned the cable and wrote an angry letter to the so-called engineers at Denon.
Or the whole page here: http://www.amazon.com/Denon-AKDL1-Dedicated-Cable-Version/dp/B000I1X6PM/
Or this one: http://www.amazon.com/AudioQuest-K2-Terminated-Speaker-Cable/dp/B000J36XR2/
Pretty hilarious stuff. Thanks for reminding me. Cracked up the first time I read that shiz.