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Gear / Technical Help => Recording Gear => Topic started by: jerryfreak on April 09, 2014, 04:31:36 AM
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its 2014 and we still dont have a reliable, cheap simple bit bucket.
time to take the bull by the horns
http://www.element14.com/community/community/raspberry-pi/raspberry-pi-accessories/wolfson_pi/blog/2014/03/14/can-you-hear-the-wolfson-calling-setting-up-and-using-the-wolfson-audio-card
im just starting to look at this but seems the community has already mastered the tech we need.
im thinking super simple interface with auto-boot scripts to select sample rate
im a total raspberry pi newb so i have no idea how ti works. hardware support seems solid we just need someone good with linux who can dial in a kernel for our purposes, and potentially down the road an optional ui to make it more user-friendly
i say we keep it simple and go for spdif in/out only and maybe headphone monitoring. we dont need another pcm-m10
I started a thread about it over there:
http://www.element14.com/community/thread/32886/l/simple-spdif-recorder
the alsa/ecasound experience i referenced was using a PDaudioCF card with a sony U3 way back when we didnt have 24/96k soundcards for laptop recording:
https://archive.org/details/sci2003-10-31.flac24
at the time the vx pocket was the standard but of course only did 48K and the only way to get 24/96 was using that card with a PDA. (702T didnt exist yet). that particular soundcard was more reliable with the linux laptop than with the live24-96 pda software. there are already alsa drivers for this wolfson card and thats 99% of the battle
from what i read so far this should be easy, well need to pull together on case design, power options, etc. im thinking trying to maybe get an order together of like 20 cases or something.
hopefully jon will help us out with his infinite wisdom on cases and power solutions ;)
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manual:
http://cpc.farnell.com/images/en_CC/WolfsonRPiSoundcardManual.pdf
future:
http://lifehacker.com/the-adafruit-pitft-makes-adding-a-touchscreen-to-a-rasp-1532669256
(though it appears the screen may use the same pins as the soundcard : http://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=72320)
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and as far as playback... the options are limitless....
http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?100724-SqueezePlug-Version-7-available&s=9c5cc30f9da773cf7d69d0c693e5061c
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an example of how simple it would be to remotely control this device with a smartphone:
http://www.instructables.com/id/Simple-and-intuitive-web-interface-for-your-Raspbe/?ALLSTEPS
PiUi interface:
http://www.raspberrypi.org/piui-control-your-pi-with-your-phone/
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id rather use native 24 bit with no signal processing than anything 16bit at this point
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build it we will come...
I am more interested in extreme portability and convenience--a digital out preamp, raspberry pi, and smartphone seems too fussy for me. I'd use an all-in-one recorder instead. But I am working on USB and wireless microphone solutions that would work direct to smartphone or tablet.
Most sources don't exceed 12 bit anyway. The entire analog era, even the top-grade reel machines, operated within no better than 13 bit (before NR schemes, which can be equally applied to digital recording).
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USB Audio Class 2.0
Hey TI! Hey AD! Do you all realize it's 2014?
Maybe some smaller chip makers will see an opportunity here.
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What I would like is just a simple system that has two usb ports.
One has a USB 1 compliant device.
The second is a USB flash drive.
And one LED on the system: green = on
Plug in flash card, red=recording, flashing red= full or other error.
That's it.
Maybe I'll hack such a system on a raspberry Pi or an x86 low power box.
Richard
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This sounds like a fun project. Keep us up to date on your progress.
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If you can stand a touchscreen interface rather than a single LED, just about any Android tablet or smartphone could do that.
if there is something that can take bit perfect 24-bit spdif im game
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I've got a song, I ain't got no melody
I'ma gonna sing it to my friends
Will it go round in circles?
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You could just pick up a used Tascam HD-P2 for about $250-350 and call it a night (seem to be easily had for under $300 on ebay right now)
It accepts 24bit up to 192Khz on it's SPDIF
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You could just pick up a used Tascam HD-P2 for about $250-350 and call it a night (seem to be easily had for under $300 on ebay right now)
It accepts 24bit up to 192Khz on it's SPDIF
QFT... The P2 is a great machine, often overlooked in favor of multi-channel or pocket-sized decks...
Terry
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What I would like is just a simple system that has two usb ports.
One has a USB 1 compliant device.
The second is a USB flash drive.
And one LED on the system: green = on
Plug in flash card, red=recording, flashing red= full or other error.
That's it.
Maybe I'll hack such a system on a raspberry Pi or an x86 low power box.
Richard
If you can stand a touchscreen interface rather than a single LED, just about any Android tablet or smartphone could do that.
Is there an APP out there?
Note that the Android device has to act as a USB host for an audio device. (I think that is the terminology.)
My current solution is an Intel atom "net box" running Linux. Whenever I apply power, it records to an internal drive.
The logical step would be a web based interface to this box, but I haven't got around to it.
Richard
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You could just pick up a used Tascam HD-P2 for about $250-350 and call it a night (seem to be easily had for under $300 on ebay right now)
It accepts 24bit up to 192Khz on it's SPDIF
this would be less than 1/4 of the size and 1/4 of the cost
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You could just pick up a used Tascam HD-P2 for about $250-350 and call it a night (seem to be easily had for under $300 on ebay right now)
It accepts 24bit up to 192Khz on it's SPDIF
this would be less than 1/4 of the size and 1/4 of the cost
It may be smaller - but after all the additional components, caseing, screen, etc I doubt it will be much less then $150 - this doesn't include all the additional time
It would be a neat project but it's not going to be 1/4 the cost
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You could just pick up a used Tascam HD-P2 for about $250-350 and call it a night (seem to be easily had for under $300 on ebay right now)
It accepts 24bit up to 192Khz on it's SPDIF
this would be less than 1/4 of the size and 1/4 of the cost
It may be smaller - but after all the additional components, caseing, screen, etc I doubt it will be much less then $150 - this doesn't include all the additional time
It would be a neat project but it's not going to be 1/4 the cost
ok, less than half the cost and well under 1/4 of the size. and the time... well thats the fun part
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Some of you are missing the point of the Pi...FUN!
I've made dozens of things out of mine. For me it's not actually using it for whatever I get it to do...it's figuring out how to get it to do shit. Once I get it working it's almost a certainty that I will soon lose interest in what it does and move on to something else.
My next project is to make a old school video game emulator (mainly for old Nintendo games).
I'd really like to try to make a remotely accessible recorder that I could leave at a club and log into from home to record shows. Doubtful I'd ever get around to that, but would be really cool if I could find a club willing to let me leave it there.
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amen brother
ill get a pi and soundcard board and report back
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Some of you are missing the point of the Pi...FUN!
I've made dozens of things out of mine. For me it's not actually using it for whatever I get it to do...it's figuring out how to get it to do shit. Once I get it working it's almost a certainty that I will soon lose interest in what it does and move on to something else.
My next project is to make a old school video game emulator (mainly for old Nintendo games).
I'd really like to try to make a remotely accessible recorder that I could leave at a club and log into from home to record shows. Doubtful I'd ever get around to that, but would be really cool if I could find a club willing to let me leave it there.
If you manage to do any of this, it would be great.
I would pay for an application that does this that runs as an extremely basic Windows application.
The best USB card I could find is, Digigram CanCUN, two and four channel USB, mic preamp, p48.
I've got the four input card now. It has a popup mixer under Win7. Top tier sound. (TI PGA2500 preamps).
My main interest is that I can use measurement mics with this rig.
Wind Turbines...
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Caution : Noob here !
I understand that you want to go out of a DAC (or any kind of digital signal) to a box that just does storage of the bits generated by the DAC in the audio file format of your choice.
You chose the S/Pdif route but this makes it necessary to use a card such as the Wolfson on the Raspberry PI.
The Usb route would feed into a Raspberry Pi direct (I looked into it a few weeks ago) and you could send the Usb feed to a file through a program such as arecord for example (I tried it on a linux desktop machine fed from a MixPre-D through the Usb connection). One might consider this route with perhaps an extension card on the raspberry to have a minimal screen and 4 push buttons to select options.
Some one (JonStoppable ?) suggested using a smart phone as a bit bucket : the Usb way probably allows this through a program such as USB Audio Recorder PRO (it seems to work at least with Android machines).
I have not been using the Usb connection a lot but it should allow 24/96 two channels without special drivers (just as an Usb audio class device). I doubt that higher rates would be sensible on such processors anyhow.
Well, there was a word of caution at the beginning ...
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Caution : Noob here !
I understand that you want to go out of a DAC (or any kind of digital signal) to a box that just does storage of the bits generated by the DAC in the audio file format of your choice.
You chose the S/Pdif route but this makes it necessary to use a card such as the Wolfson on the Raspberry PI.
The Usb route would feed into a Raspberry Pi direct (I looked into it a few weeks ago) and you could send the Usb feed to a file through a program such as arecord for example (I tried it on a linux desktop machine fed from a MixPre-D through the Usb connection). One might consider this route with perhaps an extension card on the raspberry to have a minimal screen and 4 push buttons to select options.
Some one (JonStoppable ?) suggested using a smart phone as a bit bucket : the Usb way probably allows this through a program such as USB Audio Recorder PRO (it seems to work at least with Android machines).
I have not been using the Usb connection a lot but it should allow 24/96 two channels without special drivers (just as an Usb audio class device). I doubt that higher rates would be sensible on such processors anyhow.
Well, there was a word of caution at the beginning ...
Welcome to the wild world of audio recording on the go!
This app: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.extreamsd.usbaudiorecorderpro
I've been tempted to try this app out but I have only two android devices and both are not high end devices. they work for MY needs but I don't know about audio recording.
What android devices are you using? do you have any recordings from it? what bit recording are you using?
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^ That's awesome!
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Yeah, he has a trial version too. So it won't cost anything to see how it works.
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I used an earlier version of that developer's multitrack software with a Nook Color running Android on an N2Acard. At that time (two years ago I think), it didn't support stereo recording from USB Audio Class devices, but it seems from their site they have that sorted now. I bought wifey a Nook HD and N2Acard for Christmas, so when I get time to build my latest USB mic incarnation I'll give their latest software a go.
It shouldn't be very resource intensive to record 16/48 stereo audio. I imagine the $130 Samsung tablet I saw at Staples would do the job just fine. One thing to check with tablets is if they provide any power from their USB port, most USB microphones and other basic USB audio devices will be low-power (100mA), whereas a USB OTG host is only required to supply 8mA. The Nook Color worked fine.
I have the nook color HD 16 GB something or other. android 4.0.4 but I guess that's recent enough!
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Yeah, he has a trial version too. So it won't cost anything to see how it works.
Thanks for the link. Will try this out as soon as i can.
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I'm ready for JazzFest!!
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element14/Wolfson did a good job on this card. The jacks have through-hole reinforcement though the digis are pretty close together. Thanks to the huge Pi community, it comes with a kernel compiled with PREEMPT. So I haven't gotten a single buffer overrun in the 40+ hours of testing I've done with it (got it a week and a half ago), including straight ten and fourteen hour long pulls. Only uses about three watts while recording and with wifi going!
My code features remote control with any phone/tablet/desktob with wifi and a recent browser, direct to FLAC recording with no file size limit, really good meters inspired by AD2K+, detects peaks and holds until you reset it even if you don't have your phone out and aren't looking at it, long preroll buffer (I'm using two minutes), stop then start without losing any samples, and a bunch more stuff...
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boom!!!!
so you wrote that android interface? can you put a parts list together for the project? what are you using for power? is that acrylic case an off the shelf item?
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Is there is Pi there, or does that card run standalone ???
yes the pi is the board in the back with the SD slot, usb jack, red LED. the wolfson card is in the front and fits into a pinout on the pi card
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Pretty cool shit. Going to have to add this to the list of stuff I want to try with my Pi. Might even have to buy a second Pi.
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Pretty cool shit. Going to have to add this to the list of stuff I want to try with my Pi. Might even have to buy a second Pi.
Make sure you have a V2 Pi. I have two V1's, and was kind of let down when I learned I would have to buy a third just for this. They have the Wolfson card on the shelf in my local Microcenter...so, if you have one of those stores close by you may be able to get instant gratification....
--Michael
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I have no idea what you guys are talking about, but this looks totally bad-ass...
Terry
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Pretty cool shit. Going to have to add this to the list of stuff I want to try with my Pi. Might even have to buy a second Pi.
Make sure you have a V2 Pi. I have two V1's, and was kind of let down when I learned I would have to buy a third just for this. They have the Wolfson card on the shelf in my local Microcenter...so, if you have one of those stores close by you may be able to get instant gratification....
--Michael
is the V2 the 'model B' on microcenter's website?
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If I remember correctly, there is a V2 of Model B. It has an additional "pad" or connection point for widgets of some sort. The Wolfson card uses it. Check the Wikipedia page, I think that is where I saw a table of model differences. Sorry, on phone or I would look it up.
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For those interested, I asked some guys in a forum who are are really knowledgeable about RPi's and Wolfson Cards about the possibility of adding an LED touchscreen. The problem is that the Wolfson card uses a heck of a lot of pins on the RPi that are typically needed for adding screens. Of course, this project doesn't make one bit of fiscal sense that I can think of, but I'm beginning to get the itch to build my own bit bucket with screen just because I think I can. It sounds like fun (and headaches that make you smarter when you solve them). Anyway, post here with a lot of options:
http://www.element14.com/community/message/111174/l/re-pi-wolfson-touchscreen-lcd#111174
Hope this helps if you happen to be interested in this stuff,
--Michael
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Saw this posted today on another board:
Saw a super sick, home brew bit bucket and recording rig in NOLA.
A software developer from San Fran built a bit bucket using a RaspberryPi, soundcard and a USB wireless card. Wrote custom software in Linux and an Android app to run the thing. The wireless card created a secure network which he used to monitor the levels. About $100 in parts and about the size of 2 packs of cigarettes on top of each other.
In front of that was a set of DPA's and V3. The mics were mounted on a stand with an additional extension on top. The whole thing (stand included) packed into a vest with custom pockets built in.
Seriously the coolest, stealthiest full rig I've ever seen. It was super sick.
I spoke with the guy. Might be able to get him to build one for me. He said he was thinking about posting the specs and instructions so people could do it themselves.
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Saw this posted today on another board:
Saw a super sick, home brew bit bucket and recording rig in NOLA.
A software developer from San Fran built a bit bucket using a RaspberryPi, soundcard and a USB wireless card. Wrote custom software in Linux and an Android app to run the thing. The wireless card created a secure network which he used to monitor the levels. About $100 in parts and about the size of 2 packs of cigarettes on top of each other.
In front of that was a set of DPA's and V3. The mics were mounted on a stand with an additional extension on top. The whole thing (stand included) packed into a vest with custom pockets built in.
Seriously the coolest, stealthiest full rig I've ever seen. It was super sick.
I spoke with the guy. Might be able to get him to build one for me. He said he was thinking about posting the specs and instructions so people could do it themselves.
Yeah. That was Burris's rig. Super sick!
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I want to build one of these. This is too cool.
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Google wrote the Android interface. The UI is all HTML/CSS/JS so you don't need a special app.
I'm powering it with an LFP battery and a little switcher to output 5V, both I already had sitting around, but you can use any of those phone chargers or other USB power devices. It has a micro-USB-B connector and takes 5V.
I'm probably going to offer these preassembled and tested with all the software installed. Most people don't want to have to chase down the right parts and put it together and support is more realistic if all of the hardware is known. The software is custom and you need a custom Linux build if you want it to boot fast. My dot.com entrepreneur friends are encouraging me to do a Kickstarter. Price will be comparable to other handheld recorders, under $250.
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nice!
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Google wrote the Android interface. The UI is all HTML/CSS/JS so you don't need a special app.
I'm powering it with an LFP battery and a little switcher to output 5V, both I already had sitting around, but you can use any of those phone chargers or other USB power devices. It has a micro-USB-B connector and takes 5V.
I'm probably going to offer these preassembled and tested with all the software installed. Most people don't want to have to chase down the right parts and put it together and support is more realistic if all of the hardware is known. The software is custom and you need a custom Linux build if you want it to boot fast. My dot.com entrepreneur friends are encouraging me to do a Kickstarter. Price will be comparable to other handheld recorders, under $250.
What's the current draw without WiFi enabled?
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id like one in kit form so i could have something thats gonna work, but also learn a bit in the process
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You could just pick up a used Tascam HD-P2 for about $250-350 and call it a night (seem to be easily had for under $300 on ebay right now)
It accepts 24bit up to 192Khz on it's SPDIF
Where are these $250 P2s? The cheapest on ebay right now is $350 + shipping, with NO CF card. I'd buy 1 in a second for $250....
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I would too. It looks like there have been a couple sold between 250-350 in recent times...just a few. But, I'm off topic. Is there a USB sound card with S/PDIF in that might work in place of the Wolfson? I ask, because I have two Pi's that aren't compatible with the Wolfson card. I've spent some time looking, but everything seems to be USB DAC, and doesn't have coax S/PDIF in. Anyone every seen one?
--Michael
You could just pick up a used Tascam HD-P2 for about $250-350 and call it a night (seem to be easily had for under $300 on ebay right now)
It accepts 24bit up to 192Khz on it's SPDIF
Where are these $250 P2s? The cheapest on ebay right now is $350 + shipping, with NO CF card. I'd buy 1 in a second for $250....
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the only usb i know of with a digi in is the cancun series from digigram ($500+)
I would too. It looks like there have been a couple sold between 250-350 in recent times...just a few. But, I'm off topic. Is there a USB sound card with S/PDIF in that might work in place of the Wolfson? I ask, because I have two Pi's that aren't compatible with the Wolfson card. I've spent some time looking, but everything seems to be USB DAC, and doesn't have coax S/PDIF in. Anyone every seen one?
--Michael
You could just pick up a used Tascam HD-P2 for about $250-350 and call it a night (seem to be easily had for under $300 on ebay right now)
It accepts 24bit up to 192Khz on it's SPDIF
Where are these $250 P2s? The cheapest on ebay right now is $350 + shipping, with NO CF card. I'd buy 1 in a second for $250....
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I have a raspberry pi running open elec Linux xbmc on it,It's a solid lil media center!
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Any progress on this bare-bones S/PDIF bit bucket?
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This is awesome. The metering on the AD2k was one of the reasons I kept it for so long. Peak hold is an awesome feature. I'd love to see this offered in a DIY kit as Jamie said. Does anyone know what came of this?
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Any progress on this bare-bones S/PDIF bit bucket?
Seems to me that the RPi is a viable option. I've got an M-Audio Transit USB and with a little tweaking to the madfuload app (http://'http://sourceforge.net/projects/usb-midi-fw/files/madfu-firmware/'), it works with the RPi and will accept a S/PDIF in and write it to an SD chip. Mainly though, I use the Transit with my Android phone which seems to be somewhat more stable than the RPi.
(http://hoxnet.com/drop/IMG_20140731_072814.png)
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years ago i tested teh maudio transit for DAT transfer purposes, and IIRC, it dropped samples. may vary depending on host hardware. i would test it extensively if using it for mission critical field work