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Gear / Technical Help => Ask The Tapers => Topic started by: kuba on April 22, 2005, 01:08:59 PM
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You all know that annoying noise appearing when a message or a call is received near loudspeakers. My question is, whether it is safe to tape with cell phone switched on near to the recording device. You know what I mean??
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if you get in coming call and your cell phone is RIGHT next to the recorder i'm thinking you might get some interference. One of the firsts shows I ever taped I had my phone next to my dat. I could hear that noise on my tape when somebody called my phone during the set. I just try to keep it in my pocket. Sometimes i turn it off completely during the show depending upon a few variables.
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Nextels in particular raise hell. I have a regular phone, but I always turn it off during the show. It's not like I'm going to hear anyone who calls, anyway.
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This thread reminded me of a conversation I had not to long ago with an old taper friend of mine about cell phones at concerts. We use to see people get busted taping stealth all the time by exposing backlights or meters on their decks and how the common use of cell phones have now made it easier for stealth tapers to get away with peaking at their decks and not worry too much about exposing a "mystery light" in a dark venue...
dB-
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yes they do interfere with your recording. I was stealthing Morrissey back in October and I called my dad becasue he is a big morrissey fan. I got some of the clickdy click sound on the tape for about 1 sec. it just depends on how close you are to the recorder. Now I turn my phone off at concerts.
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It seems that the problem is worse in Europe. I have gotten noise at shows from other people (when I didn't even bring my phone). Also, for some reason I never had any problems going SBM1>D100. But using mics>D100, I often got weird sounds, so apparenly it also depends on the equipment.
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I've had a hard time nailing the problems down to one particular piece of gear, one set of mics, one set of cables, or even one phone or service type.... I've observed the cell phone interference problem for quite a few years though across a myriad of gear types. I think it is generally just good policy to, at the VERY least, just turn your ringer off....
I think active cables though are more prone to interference than other types of cables, gear etc.... though ymmv.....
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This thread reminded me of a conversation I had not to long ago with an old taper friend of mine about cell phones at concerts. We use to see people get busted taping stealth all the time by exposing backlights or meters on their decks and how the common use of cell phones have now made it easier for stealth tapers to get away with peaking at their decks and not worry too much about exposing a "mystery light" in a dark venue...
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Hadn't thought about it before but it makes perfect sense.
-Kevin
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This thread reminded me of a conversation I had not to long ago with an old taper friend of mine about cell phones at concerts. We use to see people get busted taping stealth all the time by exposing backlights or meters on their decks and how the common use of cell phones have now made it easier for stealth tapers to get away with peaking at their decks and not worry too much about exposing a "mystery light" in a dark venue...
dB-
Hadn't thought about it before but it makes perfect sense.
-Kevin
Totally! It actually saved my ass once at a Ben Harper show. I was upfront and this security woman saw the light of my D100 when I was setting the levels. She walked up to me and asked what that was. Luckily my phone was in my pocket right under the fanny pack, so I pulled it out and told her I had just turned it off. She believed it and left me alone. Never touched the D100 again that night...
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I already taped some shows that were ruined in most parts by cell phones users having a conversation during the songs!!!
I just think cell phones should be forbidden at shows.
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I'm really surprised that I don't ge the cell phone interferance more often. I think maybe only one I have recorded the clicky noise during a show. Seems like it should happen more often. Thank god it doesn't. Just another thing to add to the list of things concert goers have no idea that thier doing to ruin a recording. Of course at least one person has to migrate toward your rig whether they know it or not. It could be 100 feet from anything and someone will want to stand 2 feet from it and almost step on it or something.
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I'm really surprised that I don't ge the cell phone interferance more often. I think maybe only one I have recorded the clicky noise during a show. Seems like it should happen more often. Thank god it doesn't. Just another thing to add to the list of things concert goers have no idea that thier doing to ruin a recording. Of course at least one person has to migrate toward your rig whether they know it or not. It could be 100 feet from anything and someone will want to stand 2 feet from it and almost step on it or something.
I think it depends on the phone and the carrier.
This one guy's phone messes with my friends tv all the time. I never seen mine
or his do that. I bring my phone to the show because I use the clock on it.
that's all it is there for..
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I bring my phone to the show because I use the clock on it.
that's all it is there for..
Buy a watch :)
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one thing i like about cell phones is that when i check my levels now, i pull out my cell phone right afterwards. now whenever i check levels, security thinks i'm checking my phone.
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I already taped some shows that were ruined in most parts by cell phones users having a conversation during the songs!!!
"hmmmmmm... I need to make a phone call. If I go back to those tall stands with antennae, that will increase my cell phone reception. Plus, no one is talking there so I can have a better, louder conversation" :P :-X
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I've had a hard time nailing the problems down to one particular piece of gear, one set of mics, one set of cables, or even one phone or service type.... I've observed the cell phone interference problem for quite a few years though across a myriad of gear types. I think it is generally just good policy to, at the VERY least, just turn your ringer off....
I think active cables though are more prone to interference than other types of cables, gear etc.... though ymmv.....
Cell phone interference is a b*tch... I recently upgraded from MD to JB3, and I noticed that the JB3 is much more sensitive.
Now, just switching on the phone (Ericsson T65) gives me 5 seconds of loud beeps recorded. I had it on my MD too, but it wasn't as earpiercing.
It's not safe to keep it on, even without ringtone. I believe it's the phone scanning the frequencies to connect with the nearest base station that JB3 records.
The only thing that helps is keep the phone off for the entire gig.
Jan
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The only thing that helps is keep the phone off for the entire gig.
Seems like a great idea to me.
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The only thing that helps is keep the phone off for the entire gig.
Seems like a great idea to me.
that's what i do...
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Nextels are awful with sound gear, in my experience.
I concur about cell phones and stealthing. In fact, I'll use the light from my cell phone to look at the levels on the NJB3, rather than turning on the light from the NJB3 - saves NJB3 batteries.
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i use my nokia as a flashlight too when i can't use the d8's backlight... works like a charm. ;)
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i have a stylus that has a flashligt as a tip...
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Sorry to bump this, but is there some kind of protection for this, pouch of some sort? I remember someone mentioned covering the recorder in duct tape should work, but I don't know..
MoFo2
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I just think cell phones should be forbidden at shows.
When I saw A Perfect Circle back in April of 2004, they were not allowing people to take camera phones in. Of course, they were still relatively new and most people didn't have one then. A friend just got back from seeing Porcupine Tree in Atlanta, GA and said that their security were grabbing people out of the crowd for using their camera phones as they apparently had a similar policy. It seems like commonplace now a days to go to shows and see a sea of blue light from camera phones as everyone pulls them out to take crappy pictures with.
When allowed, I completely agree that they facilitate in checking levels on a recorder and provide a nice scapegoat if someone were to spot you. A lot better than using a lighter anyways. I keep my phone on vibrate at all times anyways, opposite side that I usually clip the NJB3 to, can't say that I've ever noticed any problems from it, even if I do get/miss a call/txt msg.
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I just think cell phones should be forbidden at shows.
When I saw A Perfect Circle back in April of 2004, they were not allowing people to take camera phones in. Of course, they were still relatively new and most people didn't have one then. A friend just got back from seeing Porcupine Tree in Atlanta, GA and said that their security were grabbing people out of the crowd for using their camera phones as they apparently had a similar policy. It seems like commonplace now a days to go to shows and see a sea of blue light from camera phones as everyone pulls them out to take crappy pictures with.
When allowed, I completely agree that they facilitate in checking levels on a recorder and provide a nice scapegoat if someone were to spot you. A lot better than using a lighter anyways. I keep my phone on vibrate at all times anyways, opposite side that I usually clip the NJB3 to, can't say that I've ever noticed any problems from it, even if I do get/miss a call/txt msg.
To paraphrase Chris Robinson earlier this month:
"concerts used to be about sneaking in weed, getting high, and enjoying the music...now it's all people staring at their cell phones taking shitty pictures"
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I've just been listening over a lecture a friend recorded for me with my MD gear and there's phone click noises all over it. This is weird, because I (surprisingly) have never suffered noise on any of my recordings. Obviously I wasn't at this lecture, so I don't know how close any phones were to my stuff, but I can't remember ever seeing any of the people I sit with keeping a phone on the desk. When I tape, I always have my phone in the other pocket to my MD, but it's often held closer than that while I'm sending a text or writing down bits of a setlist. The only immediate difference I can think of is that the lecture tape was done with mic in rather than line in. I might try some experiments sometime to investigate further.
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I do a lot of video shoots, and the cell phone problem has been getting worse year by year. Cell phones definately can cause interference in any audio setup, even completely balanced setups because the mic itself can be effected even before the signal starts going down the balanced pipes. Although unbalanced systems (like more stealth systems) are even more prone to it because the interference can be picked up anywhere in the chain, whereas a good balanced system will have some ability to cancel it if it tries to enter anywhere downstream from the mics themselves. Not 100% sure I've got that correct, but that has been my personal experience with audio capped during video shoots.
One thing I don't think I saw mentioned above is that the TYPE of cell phone really makes a HUGE difference. GSM phones are really, really bad because they "talk" to the system even when not making or receiving a call (or text message). If you have a GSM phone and leave it next to your speakers at work, it'll cause iterference even when absolutely NOTHING is happening re messages or calls. With my old-system TDMA phone, I only got that type of interference when actually getting a call or message. The REALLY BAD news is that everything in the states is moving towards GSM and away from TDMA, so when combined with the proliferation of cell phones in general, the use of GSM phones is growing even more than that. This is also part of the reason why this has been a much bigger problem in other countries who were using non-TDMA systems longer than us.
Note: I might have confused TDMA with CDMA, but the point is that cell phones definately cause interference, and some types of cell service are worse than others. It is a well-known fact in the video industry that plenty of recorded dialog for video and movies have been completely fucked up by this causing numberous hours of re-recording or touch-ups in post.
I would definately turn off your phone while taping as you are the most likely person to be the closest to your rig more than anyone else. Just my two cents...
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I have had trouble with cell interference several times in the past. A couple of months ago I was screwing around with my gear and decided to see where the phone would interfere with things. I found that the biggest introduction of interference was when the phone was close to my mic cables. Now mind you it would probably be rare in the field to have your phone on you mic cables but..... I'm running a pair of Bumblebee's and the cell sounds only happened when the phone was resting on the wires and even then it was very sporadiac and didn't happen much. When I put them next to some StarQuads I had on my playback system the noise was very noticable and happened quite often.
My guess is it depends mostly on how well your cable is shielded among other things. I also picked up some tones on my D8. Faint but there from time to time. My D10 was not so lucky. Lots of interference.
My solution now is just to keep my phone in my pocket (I don't stealth anymore). The ohone does not get mixed in with my gear ever anymore.
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never had one problem with cell phone interference. Guess i should cross my fingers
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I do a lot of video shoots, and the cell phone problem has been getting worse year by year. Cell phones definately can cause interference in any audio setup, even completely balanced setups because the mic itself can be effected even before the signal starts going down the balanced pipes. Although unbalanced systems (like more stealth systems) are even more prone to it because the interference can be picked up anywhere in the chain, whereas a good balanced system will have some ability to cancel it if it tries to enter anywhere downstream from the mics themselves. Not 100% sure I've got that correct, but that has been my personal experience with audio capped during video shoots.
One thing I don't think I saw mentioned above is that the TYPE of cell phone really makes a HUGE difference. GSM phones are really, really bad because they "talk" to the system even when not making or receiving a call (or text message). If you have a GSM phone and leave it next to your speakers at work, it'll cause iterference even when absolutely NOTHING is happening re messages or calls. With my old-system TDMA phone, I only got that type of interference when actually getting a call or message. The REALLY BAD news is that everything in the states is moving towards GSM and away from TDMA, so when combined with the proliferation of cell phones in general, the use of GSM phones is growing even more than that. This is also part of the reason why this has been a much bigger problem in other countries who were using non-TDMA systems longer than us.
Note: I might have confused TDMA with CDMA, but the point is that cell phones definately cause interference, and some types of cell service are worse than others. It is a well-known fact in the video industry that plenty of recorded dialog for video and movies have been completely fucked up by this causing numberous hours of re-recording or touch-ups in post.
I would definately turn off your phone while taping as you are the most likely person to be the closest to your rig more than anyone else. Just my two cents...
I cannot be within 10 feet of a pair of speaker without my GSM phone (Motorola V3) causing noise. So, in response, I NEVER go near a recorder with it on whether I need a clock or not. Odd thing is that my wife has the same identical phone with the same carrier and says she never notices it. I think that it may happen and she is just less sensitive to audio anomolies.
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that's it! no more letting strangers stash their jacket etc. in the taper area for convenience >:D
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does anyone have a airplane mode on theirs? Mine does and it's nothing real fancy (kyocera 3250) so I imagine some of you do.
I have been turning mine on airplane mode which means it can't send or receive calls
yet the phone functions at whatever else it may do, ie: games.
Now I have not ever noticed anything with my phone before so I don't know if airplane mode makes a difference or not.
Could someone try it out if they have that feature and get back with us? I think you would notice a difference between the two modes.
Like I mentioned before I use my phone as a watch since I don't own a watch.