Topic: opinions please

[shane]

Okay, so I've done a little more research and have narrowed down my choices.  I think I'm going to go with a two channel system and forget the surround setup (unless someone can convince me otherwise).  While I have found many smaller companies out there that offer great products I've (almost) decided to go with a major brand.  Can anyone out there, preferably someone with any experience with these units, give me any feedback?  These guys are leading the pack:

integrated amplifier   http://www.crutchfield.com/S-lvV91XvyUa4/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?wm=fp&I=033PMA2KIV&g=10450

dvd player   http://www.crutchfield.com/S-lvV91XvyUa4/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=54400&I=033DV2910B

Also, am I really losing that much by going with a simple two speaker setup.  Its my feeling that I can get a better two speaker setup for the same amount of money I could get a multi channel setup for.  Don't know if that came out right but you guys know what I mean right?  Anyway, I will be using this system for pretty much everything, television, movies, & music listening so i want to get kind of an all around workhorse yet still get good sound quality.  Thanks for any and all info.

Shane

[pfife]

I suspect, for that amount of money, people here will be able to suggest better integrated amps for about the same amount... unfortunately that person is not me...  but $1200 will get you a very nice integrated.

[Daryan]

I wouldn't be thinking Denon when I am thinking 2 channel.  I also think you can do much better than 80 watts for that kind of money.  I have suggestions, but what kind of speakers are we driving with the integrated, and what dac do you use?  The denon 2910 is great, and has lots of modding potential should you decide to go that route later on.  Look at the Cambridge Audio stuff though, much more bang for the buck out of the UK.  Perhaps search for an Oppo dvd player as well, the audio performance is supposed to be fantastic.

[shane]

Excuse my ignorance but would I need sometihng else for digital/analog conversion?  In reading about the DVD 2910 it says the unit uses dual 12-bit/216-MHz converters.

Shane

[BobW]

The Denon integrated is very refined and well-tempered. Maybe too much so, perhaps even "dry" ?
I like it as much as I like Rotel. Less than I like Creek.

For $1200 a Portal dual mono integrated with 100wpc @8 ohms and LOTS of impulse power to spare is worth a comparison.
The bass from this thing is just plain sick. The Panache is very articulate, and has nice soundstage for transistors.

The Denon Universal disk player sounds pretty dang good.
The new Jolida CD player is unreal. But it is "just" a CD player.

Please respect my "loudmouth opinion" but I'd have skipped buying all my SACDs, DualDisks, and DVD-As and have stuck to CDs with the JoLida, if I knew then what I know now.
Hi-Res with divergent formats has become a fool's game.   

 

[jpschust]

the denon 2910 universal is probably the best priced universal on the market right now with a quality dac in it as well as a very high quality transport. 

[Evil Taper]

someone find Nick from Nick's Picks, he's the hi-fi guru

[shane]

The Denon integrated is very refined and well-tempered. Maybe too much so, perhaps even "dry" ?
I like it as much as I like Rotel. Less than I like Creek.

For $1200 a Portal dual mono integrated with 100wpc @8 ohms and LOTS of impulse power to spare is worth a comparison.
The bass from this thing is just plain sick. The Panache is very articulate, and has nice soundstage for transistors.

The Denon Universal disk player sounds pretty dang good.
The new Jolida CD player is unreal. But it is "just" a CD player.

Please respect my "loudmouth opinion" but I'd have skipped buying all my SACDs, DualDisks, and DVD-As and have stuck to CDs with the JoLida, if I knew then what I know now.
Hi-Res with divergent formats has become a fool's game.   

 

Bob,

I looked at the Panache and it was morfe like $1800.

Shane

[carlbeck]

Better yet, just purchase used. I would stick with the 2910 or for the same money used I would buy a 3910 used. Also for the same money as that "receiver" I would look at a DK Designs MKII. It does depend what speakers you want to drive but the reality is that (imo) most would consider the Dennon receiver to be what's known as mid-fi. You can get alot nicer products for the same money used. Start out here & search the forums, there are many people in that same situation as you. Then go to Audiogon.com & ask the question there,  you will get tons of answers. We  all started out in the same situation as you but by asking the questions you can eliminate most of the headaches.

Also, do not be afraid to buy used, especially off Agon. Avoiding the big guys that you see at your local electronics store will (usually) be a better investment in the long run yeilding better sound too!

[wboswell]

I have to reiterate what Carl said.  Buying used gives you the opportunity to buy better gear without the large investment.  Everything depreciates, but not nearly as quick when you're the second buyer.. just like cars.  If something doesn't work out used, re-sell and go a different direction. 

Just like taping, playback is highly if not more addictive.  There are WAY more options (and opinions for that matter).  However, being able to discuss things here helps tremendously as you know what types of music (live music will be a significan part) folks are playing when they discuss gear hear.  But like I said, playback gear is addictive, and you'll find yourself talking yourself into things very quickly!  Audiogon=crack

[pfife]

I have to reiterate what Carl said.  Buying used gives you the opportunity to buy better gear without the large investment.  Everything depreciates, but not nearly as quick when you're the second buyer.. just like cars.  If something doesn't work out used, re-sell and go a different direction. 

Just like taping, playback is highly if not more addictive.  There are WAY more options (and opinions for that matter).  However, being able to discuss things here helps tremendously as you know what types of music (live music will be a significan part) folks are playing when they discuss gear hear.  But like I said, playback gear is addictive, and you'll find yourself talking yourself into things very quickly!  Audiogon=crack

The other thing to keep in mind, with buying used at this quality level, people know what they have, and take good care of it (for the most part).

[BobW]

I looked at the Panache and it was morfe like $1800.

If you're seriously interested:
Call the toll free number, ask for Joe.
Tell him Bob the taper said to give you the best price he can do.
He does mail order demos, and will sell returns at substantial discounts after thoroughly testing them.

He's all over AudiogoN as well.

[Lil Kim Jong-Il]

Is the 2910 a lower rated model than the older 2900?  The price of the 2910 new is about half the new price of the 2900.   For the money, the 2900 is an amazing unit and they are available on agon for about $400-$450 now.

[carlbeck]

The 2910 is the newer model & are spposed to be better than the previous models.

[shane]

I looked at the Panache and it was morfe like $1800.

If you're seriously interested:
Call the toll free number, ask for Joe.
Tell him Bob the taper said to give you the best price he can do.
He does mail order demos, and will sell returns at substantial discounts after thoroughly testing them.

He's all over AudiogoN as well.

Is he this Joe here?
http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?intatran&1133535764

Shane

[BobW]

[
Is he this Joe here?
http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?intatran&1133535764

Shane

Yes, Joe is the owner and usually answers the telephone as well.
You may do better than the price quoted, if you bargain a bit.
I was half-joking about mentioning my name. Talk to him, if you're interested, he is a very knowledgeble and pleasant guy.

I must give you a caveat about my recommendation of the Panache.
As much as I like it, I went with a modded JoLida 502B for my system.
It matched my Missions better and I don't have time to speaker shop right now.
I may very well go back to the Panache after I complete my move back to NJ and get a bigger pair of towers.

Good luck and let us know what you land !

[shane]

Hey guys.  I'm still having trouble deciding between two channel or surorund.  A couple more questions and then I'll stop.  If I go with the two channel will I still be able to hook up a sub woofer?  Or will I even need one?  And having only two channels and analog hookups how much am I really going to be missing when watching dvds and will I be able to listen to SACDs, DVD audio, shows recorded in 24/96 etc? 

Shane

[pfife]

Hey guys.  I'm still having trouble deciding between two channel or surorund.  A couple more questions and then I'll stop.  If I go with the two channel will I still be able to hook up a sub woofer? 

Yes.  Some amps will have a sub out.  If it doesn't have a sub out, you can run the speaker lines into the sub, and use its crossover, and out the sub to your speakers. (I think).  I've never done this - just had someone explain it to me once.

Or will I even need one? 

Depends on personal taste, and the freq response of your mains!

And having only two channels and analog hookups how much am I really going to be missing when watching dvds and will I be able to listen to SACDs, DVD audio, shows recorded in 24/96 etc? 

Another personal taste thing - if it were me, I wouldn't give a tiny rats ass about dvds and 5.1, DTS, DD, THX, whatever - its all about the toons for me.

[BobW]

Two full range speakers for me, just like most live performances.
simplicity, more coherence, less room reflections and resonances.
It puts more resource$ into less components, so that you end up having better sounding gear.
just my opinion.....

[MattD]

I agree with Bob on this one. On very good recordings (and movies), I hear surround effects from a two-channel system. Same goes for his statement on the money.

[shane]

Thanks for the input guys.  I thikn I'm going to bite the bullet an dgo two channel.  My feelings have been much like you stated Bob.  For the same amount of money I can get two higher quality channels instead of five.  As far as dvds go I was chatting with a buddy of imne today about it and he staed something painfully obvious to me:
"what the hell do you need surround for on those f*#^$* romantic comedies and indy films you always watch?"  He's pretty much right I rarely watch action movies.  Hell I watch tv dvd more than anything nowadays anyway. 
So that's it.  Now I just have to decide on what amp to get (leaning towards the Portal Panache) and then try and not buy speakers too.

Shane

[BobW]

Thanks for the input guys.  I thikn I'm going to bite the bullet an dgo two channel.  My feelings have been much like you stated Bob.  For the same amount of money I can get two higher quality channels instead of five.  As far as dvds go I was chatting with a buddy of imne today about it and he staed something painfully obvious to me:
"what the hell do you need surround for on those f*#^$* romantic comedies and indy films you always watch?"  He's pretty much right I rarely watch action movies.  Hell I watch tv dvd more than anything nowadays anyway. 
So that's it.  Now I just have to decide on what amp to get (leaning towards the Portal Panache) and then try and not buy speakers too.

Shane

Just to make your life confusing      give a listen to the PS Audio Stereo Control amp in that price class.
Class D, but sounds great !