Topic: Microtrack internal battery replacement... update ... help still needed

[KLowe]

Hey yall,
After having the MT shut down for YET ANOTHER SHOW  even with a external battery box in place.  I've decided that the MT is basically a POS.  Surprise!!!
 
Since I can't in good concience sell this thing in the yard sale here I've decidided to take it apart and replace the internal battery my damn self.  I'll probably blow it up b/c i know nothing about voltage etc.... but who cares.  Its all in the name of science.

From what I've gathered from other threads.  The internal MT battery is 3.7 li on battery right?  In theory could I replace this battery with any 3.7v li on battery that I find?  I know that the size of the battery matters but I'm thinking about making the replacement battery totally external anyway by drilling a hole in the back of the MT and running the black and red wires outside and basically ghetto rigging a battery to the outside of the box with tape.



Thanks,

Kevin

[Church-Audio]

Hey yall,
After having the MT shut down for YET ANOTHER SHOW  even with a external battery box in place.  I've decided that the MT is basically a POS.  Surprise!!!
 
Since I can't in good concience sell this thing in the yard sale here I've decidided to take it apart and replace the internal battery my damn self.  I'll probably blow it up b/c i know nothing about voltage etc.... but who cares.  Its all in the name of science.

From what I've gathered from other threads.  The internal MT battery is 3.7 li on battery right?  In theory could I replace this battery with any 3.7v li on battery that I find?  I know that the size of the battery matters but I'm thinking about making the replacement battery totally external anyway by drilling a hole in the back of the MT and running the black and red wires outside and basically ghetto rigging a battery to the outside of the box with tape.



Thanks,

Kevin

The only problem with that idea is the shitty little wires will break off the back of the circuit trace, if you want this mod to work use a low profile connector of some sort in the back of the MT. So you can simply plug in your external battery pack, make sure to protect the input with a in4001 diode. so that you are protected against polarity inversion. Put in two one for negative one for positive so that both sides with block dc going in the wrong direction. I would look at connectors by hirose, check out www.digikey.com they have all the hirose connectors you could ever want. The other problem with your mod is the battery meter is based on a battery with a known mA rating, if you go below it, the battery will drain to fast. If you go above it you will increase your run time but your battery gage will not be as accurate. I could be wrong but I am pretty sure the microcrapper's battery gage is based on firmware. Anyone know for sure please correct me.

Chris Church

[Brian Skalinder]

After having the MT shut down for YET ANOTHER SHOW  even with a external battery box in place.

Have you considered trying to track down the cause of your shutdown problems?  How long does the internal battery last?  Under what conditions (i.e. analog-in, how much gain, phantom power on/off, digital-in, etc.)?  What external battery pack?  Did you test to ensure it worked properly before using it in the field and having problems?  Etc.

[Church-Audio]

After having the MT shut down for YET ANOTHER SHOW  even with a external battery box in place.

Have you considered trying to track down the cause of your shutdown problems?  How long does the internal battery last?  Under what conditions (i.e. analog-in, how much gain, phantom power on/off, digital-in, etc.)?  What external battery pack?  Did you test to ensure it worked properly before using it in the field and having problems?  Etc.

Good advice maybe if its a brand new machine and the battery life is much less then expected you could return it under warranty? Before you hack it

[KLowe]

I have tested this thing.  Works great if plugged into a wall....will record an entire show at 24/48 into a microdrive.  But.... battery and external battery pack will not push this microdrive once the internal battery runs out.  I have tested the external battery pack and all is fine.  5 volts is there.  I'm sure I should just run a CF card and not a microdrive and see what happens. 

What I don't get is why does this thing work great when plugged into a wall but NOT work with the external battery pack (that I know is good).

Thanks for all of the help so far.  I hope I can get this figured out.

Oh yeah.. I only use this as a bit bucket SPDIF in from a UA-5 and all the phantom stuff..etc is OFF.

[KLowe]

Good advice maybe if its a brand new machine and the battery life is much less then expected you could return it under warranty? Before you hack it

Nope.  Bought it in the yard sale here and from what I read M-audio's customer service sucks a huge one.  So.  Just gonna try to see what I can do with it.  Ebay doesn't really seem like an option either since there are so many used ones for sale in much better shape.

[Brian Skalinder]

I have tested this thing.  Works great if plugged into a wall....will record an entire show at 24/48 into a microdrive.  But.... battery and external battery pack will not push this microdrive once the internal battery runs out.

Instead of plugging in the external pack once the internal battery gets low, try using the external power supply right off the bat, then switching to internal when the external runs out.  If you run down the internal, and then plug in the external, the external power source may be doing double duty:  charging the internal battery -and- providing the juice to operate the MT.  That may be drawing more current than the battery pack can provide, or may be enough current to draw the battery pack down more swiftly.

What external battery pack?  Maybe the problem is the battery pack and not the MT.

[willndmb]

my internal sucks ass too
fully charged with a microdrive i am lucky to get 1.5 hrs
however with a 4aa battery pack plugged in from the go i can get well over 3 hrs

i used the same aa for 3 shows only charging the internal between

[KLowe]

What external battery pack?  Maybe the problem is the battery pack and not the MT.

energizer 7.2v from oade into a segue interprise juice box.  I think you are on to something when you say that the external is pulling double duty.  That makes sense.
sad thing is that for Umphrey's on Friday I had the external plugged in to the MT at the start of the show...bc i new that the internal was going to die.

Really think if I replace the internal than all should be happy.  I just wish there was a way to completely bypass the internal and run strictly from an external source.  Charging up the internal from the battery pack has got to be what is causing all of the problems.

[Brian Skalinder]

energizer 7.2v from oade into a segue interprise juice box.

What's the capacity of the battery?  Is it a li-ion battery?  Or if you don't know either of those questions...what's the Energizer model number?  Should be on the battery somewhere.

Problem could be due to any number of problems:  pulling double duty, battery may have gone bad, the JuiceBox or a cable may have a short, the battery may not provide sufficient voltage for the voltage regulator in the JuiceBox, etc.

[cmoorevt]

Also, are you using a compact flash card or a microdrive?  Microdrives will drain the internal REAL fast.  Compared to willndmb's experiences, I use a compact flash card and even with phantom power on(when running the AT853s) still get three hours out of the internal battery.  Not sure how long it would go w/o phantom. 

I'd also echo Brian's comments about plugging in the external supply from the beginning, even if the MT's internal is charged.  I forgot to charge the MT internal battery before taping one night, ran using the external supply and the MT turned off after a few hours, lending credence to the double duty theory.

I've been using one of the bixnet 4xAA external supplies which seem to be impossible to find these days, but you may want to try one of the 4xAA Energizer energi to go devices if you determine something is wrong with the juicebox and/or want a smaller external battery source.

http://www.redherring.com/Article.aspx?a=17258&hed=Energizer+to+Sell+Energi+To+Go

[KLowe]

https://www.all-battery.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=1561


I think this is the exact replacement battery.  Looks just like the one I pulled out of the MT.

Will try it and see what happens.

[Brian Skalinder]

I think this is the exact replacement battery.  Looks just like the one I pulled out of the MT.

Will try it and see what happens.

If it were me, I'd do some more testing to nail down whether the problem lies with the MT batt, the external batt, cables, JuiceBox, etc., before replacing any of those components.  But if you think the above will do the trick - good luck!  Let us know how it turns out.

[KLowe]

sound advice.  Gonna test everything tonight.
If we have to go down the battery changing road.. I'll let you know the results

thanks for all the help

Kevin

[KLowe]

the update.  All items measured with volt meter (sperry dm-5300).

voltage from battery - 10.32 (which is weird b/c it says only 7.2v on lable)

voltage from post juice box 4.96v

voltage from stock MT 2496 battery 4.12 v (about 1/3 charged)

++voltage required from 6gb hitachi microdrive++
Requirement    
+3.3VDC / +5VDC (±5%)
Current (write)    
230mA / 280mA
Current (standby)    
13mA / 15mA

++voltage for CF II card++  (chose sandisk for example)
Read     50 mA(3.3V) 55 mA (5V)     50 mA(3.3V) 55 mA (5V)
Write    65 mA(3.3V) 70 mA (5V)             65 mA(3.3V) 70 mA (5V)


So....there is the proof that the Microtrack's battery hates microdrives as far as mA usage.

But what I still dont get is that the external battery pack should supply a shit-ton of mA hours for this device and a microdrive.  I guess it comes backk to the double duty theory.  The microtrack keeps shutting off to charge mode b/c the charge required to charge the battery and run the microdrive is more than the 5v juicebox can push to it.

What do ya think about pushing 6v to it?  Think it would cause any damage?

anyway to figure out how much voltage is required to charge the MT's battery?

Still dont get why the damn MT will run just fine when plugged into an AC wall socket when the wall-wart AD/DC converter is rated as 5v   Time to stick the volt meter in the wal-wart thing to see if it really is 5v?

Any opinions or advice?

thanks in advance.

KEvin