Author Topic: Rechargeable high voltage 1.6V 2500mWh AA nickel-zinc technology (Read 11678 times)

Falconidave · « **on:** March 18, 2009, 11:04:59 PM »

I just received my charger and set of 4 AA's. They charged up in about an hour(supposed to have affinity for rapid charging). I tried them in my Canon A630 first, powered up and worked fine. I've now got them in my Sony PCM-D50 and on a recording test using internals with light and LEDs on. Will post back with results. There is only one review on the RitzCamera site and it's negative. I don't let that shit scare me...much

Has anyone else given these a closer look?

http://www.ritzcamera.com/product/141660936.htm

Falconidave · « **Reply #1 on:** March 19, 2009, 06:53:27 PM »

Just got home from work and checked the D50. 18.63 hours recorded at 16/44.1 on 16Gb card and battery meter still showing full. Display light on and all LEDs turned on for the test. Don't have time to let it continue. Gotta get ready for a show after work tomorrow, so gonna recharge them and get packed...

I love them so far...

cybergaloot · « **Reply #2 on:** March 19, 2009, 07:05:19 PM »

I don't know about the D50 but some devices with battery meters need to know what type of battery is in the unit, all the ones I've seen its alkaline vs. NiMh. The main reason it wants to know which type is to know how to measure it. I know the manuals for some devices say to not use anything but alkaline or Ni-Cd (no lithium for example). What I don't know is how important all that is but your meter could be inaccurate. Still, 18 plus hours! Wow! Lets us know how they work out in the long run.

Falconidave · « **Reply #3 on:** March 19, 2009, 07:30:53 PM »

Before I put them back in the charger I checked each one in a DigiCam EC-741 Universal Battery Tester and 2 of the four registered between 80-100% charge, and 2 of them showed 60-80% charge remaining. So, you're probably right about the D50's meters being inaccurate. But 18+ hours with the lights on is great. I'll keep this thread updated on how they do in the field.

Gutbucket · « **Reply #4 on:** March 19, 2009, 07:51:37 PM »

Great runtime.

The meters will not be accurate unless there is a setting for this battery type on the recorder. But with that much time you may never need to rely on the battery indicator anyway.

Alkaline batteries are 1.5v nominal, NiMH are 1.2v, these are 1.6v. In addition, each battery chemistry has different voltage discharge curves. Generally, standard cells taper off more evenly and more advanced types keep the voltage up for longer, but then voltage drops off rapidly.

Not sure how the Sony's batteries are wired, but either 2 or all 4 cells are in series, multiplying the voltage of each cell. That means when using NiMH batteries the recorder 'sees' either 2.4 or 4.8v, with alkaline cells it 'sees' 3 or 6v, and with these batteries the recorder 'sees' either 3.2 or 6.4v.

Falconidave · « **Reply #5 on:** May 03, 2009, 08:58:50 PM »

Update: Just had a random "replace battery" message, and shutdown in the D50 after recording for 5 minutes. Fortunately it was just a speaker in a meeting. The batteries were freshly charged and even showed full before starting, and even when I turned the deck off and back on again. The 5 minute file was intact, but obviously missed what I was there for. Not sure I can trust them for a live concert from now on. Anybody else got these and having any issues? Gonna test them in my 09HR for awhile and see how that goes.

gmm6797 · « **Reply #6 on:** May 03, 2009, 10:40:48 PM »

I have been running nmh rechargeables in my portable gear for some 5-6 years now with no worries, I did have one random show where the re-charge from the night before was not 100%, and that sucked, but it was a "1 off" opps

Falconidave · « **Reply #7 on:** May 03, 2009, 11:50:09 PM »

Quote from: gmm6797 on May 03, 2009, 10:40:48 PM

I have been running nmh rechargeables in my portable gear for some 5-6 years now with no worries, I did have one random show where the re-charge from the night before was not 100%, and that sucked, but it was a "1 off" opps

This thread was started to discuss the new rechargeable Nickel-Zinc batteries. Different animal than the NiMH rechargeable battery. I too have use NiMH for years w/o any issues...

gmm6797 · « **Reply #8 on:** May 03, 2009, 11:57:50 PM »

woops, sorry for the mis-read

Falconidave · « **Reply #9 on:** May 04, 2009, 12:44:12 AM »

No problema...

spcyrfc · « **Reply #10 on:** May 09, 2009, 09:30:31 PM »

Quote from: Falconidave on May 03, 2009, 08:58:50 PM

Update: Just had a random "replace battery" message, and shutdown in the D50 after recording for 5 minutes. Fortunately it was just a speaker in a meeting. The batteries were freshly charged and even showed full before starting, and even when I turned the deck off and back on again. The 5 minute file was intact, but obviously missed what I was there for. Not sure I can trust them for a live concert from now on. Anybody else got these and having any issues? Gonna test them in my 09HR for awhile and see how that goes.

bizarre. these batteries sounded promising at first, but with the above... let use know how it goes.

what sort of charger are you using? and how did you charge them?

if i could get 18+ hrs on a single charge, that would be great. i mean 12 aint bad, but 18, maybe 24 - wow.

Falconidave · « **Reply #11 on:** May 18, 2009, 08:34:34 PM »

Quote from: spcyrfc on May 09, 2009, 09:30:31 PM

Quote from: Falconidave on May 03, 2009, 08:58:50 PM
Update: Just had a random "replace battery" message, and shutdown in the D50 after recording for 5 minutes. Fortunately it was just a speaker in a meeting. The batteries were freshly charged and even showed full before starting, and even when I turned the deck off and back on again. The 5 minute file was intact, but obviously missed what I was there for. Not sure I can trust them for a live concert from now on. Anybody else got these and having any issues? Gonna test them in my 09HR for awhile and see how that goes.

bizarre. these batteries sounded promising at first, but with the above... let use know how it goes.

what sort of charger are you using? and how did you charge them?

if i could get 18+ hrs on a single charge, that would be great. i mean 12 aint bad, but 18, maybe 24 - wow.

I used the charger that they sell with it that supposedly is the only one capable of giving them the proper, and full charge. It charges them in less than an hour. Which is supposedly what they prefer. I think it may just be more of a compatibility issue with the Sony PCM D50. I'm going to do some testing in my R-09HR and see if they work better.

Falconidave · « **Reply #12 on:** November 03, 2009, 12:37:58 PM »

For what it's worth, I'm testing out these batteries in my new Sony PCM-M10, right along side of the Edirol R09HR. I started the test last night and when I left for work this morning, they were both still going strong(10+ hours), with batt setting in both set to "alkaline". Will report back when test finished.

Edit:

Got 17 hours 43 minutes with the Sony PCM-M10 and these batteries in "alkaline" setting. Will do more tests and post results. Additionally, file saved perfectly even with low battery shut-down.

gmm6797 · « **Reply #13 on:** November 03, 2009, 11:56:15 PM »

nice work... all of the reviews of the M10 state exceptional battery run times!

Falconidave · « **Reply #14 on:** November 04, 2009, 07:32:49 AM »

My Edirol R09HR does NOT seem to like these batteries. It consistently shuts down after about 4 hours w/o losing the file. Doesn't matter if the battery setting is "alkaline" or "NiMh". Definitely a strange occurrence.

su6oxone · « **Reply #15 on:** November 09, 2009, 05:33:17 PM »

Wonder if the issue might lie with the companies making these NiZn batteries rather than the technology itself. If reputable battery makers, like Energizer, Duracell, Sanyo, and perhaps Maha, made these types of batteries perhaps they would be more reliable? I found this article from Engadget of NiZn batteries made by another manufacturer that they have tested extensively:

http://www.engadget.com/2009/11/09/powergenix-nizn-rechargeable-aa-batteries-finally-some-cells-w/

Very intrigued by this new battery tech.

gmm6797 · « **Reply #16 on:** November 10, 2009, 12:26:27 AM »

if anyone actually tries these, I would be curious what the results are

Gutbucket · « **Reply #17 on:** July 12, 2010, 07:32:57 PM »

Quote from: Falconidave on March 18, 2009, 11:04:59 PM

I just received my charger and set of 4 AA's...

Dave, have you continued using these? Have they worked well over time?

Thinking of trying them in the Tascam DR2d which doesn't seem like the lower voltage of the NiMH at all.

twatts (pants are so over-rated...) · « **Reply #18 on:** July 13, 2010, 12:28:47 AM »

I'm thinking of picking some of these up for my HD-P2...

http://www.amazon.com/PowerGenix-ZR-PGX1HRAA-4B-Charger-Rechargeable-Batteries/dp/B0029NZVZ0
http://www.amazon.com/PowerGenix-ZRPGX-AA8-High-Voltage-Rechargeable-Batteries/dp/B002NJUJ16/ref=pd_cp_e_1

Terry

Gutbucket · « **Reply #19 on:** July 13, 2010, 09:26:48 AM »

Those are the ones I'm considering as well.

twatts (pants are so over-rated...) · « **Reply #20 on:** July 13, 2010, 09:00:54 PM »

Hmmm.... Misleading... 2500mWh = 1550mAh...

These do have a quicker recharge, though...

YMMV...

Terry

tim in jersey · « **Reply #21 on:** July 13, 2010, 10:25:42 PM »

Quote from: twatts and not wearing pants on July 13, 2010, 09:00:54 PM

Hmmm.... Misleading... 2500mWh = 1550mAh...

These do have a quicker recharge, though...

YMMV...

Terry

Out of curiousity, what is the math for calculating mWh>mAh?

twatts (pants are so over-rated...) · « **Reply #22 on:** July 13, 2010, 10:42:52 PM »

Quote from: tim in jersey on July 13, 2010, 10:25:42 PM

Quote from: twatts and not wearing pants on July 13, 2010, 09:00:54 PM
Hmmm.... Misleading... 2500mWh = 1550mAh...

These do have a quicker recharge, though...

YMMV...

Terry

Out of curiousity, what is the math for calculating mWh>mAh?

W/V = A

2500mW/1.6v = 1550mA (+/-)

So if you have 8x of these for 12.8v, and your device has a draw of 500mA at 12v, these batteries will run the device for 3 hours (1550mAh/500mA = 3h).

I run a Tascam HD-P2, that has a Power Consumption of 6W @ 12V, or 0.5A (500mA). These batteries would run me about 3 hours. This makes sense, I currently use a set of Duracell NiMH that are 2650mAh and I get about 4.5 hours out of them.

http://www.tascam.com/details;9,11,52,19.html

Terry

ArchivalAudio · « **Reply #23 on:** August 26, 2010, 03:22:58 AM »

any one try these out yet?

here is their website statement
http://www.powergenix.com/environment.php
http://www.powergenix.com/techhistory.php
http://www.powergenix.com/applications.php

sounds promising

thanx
--Ian

Johnny Thunder · « **Reply #24 on:** August 26, 2010, 08:41:10 AM »

I'm waiting with baited breath to see what develops here. I'm currently investing pretty heavily in MaHa chargers and AA's, as well as Sanyo Eneloop AA's and AAA's. Where those are concerned, I think everyone can agree that they're well tested now and very stable. This N-Z tech seems promising, but I'm not biting until I see some results, especialy how long the batteries last as far as discharge - recharge cycles. Might the loose peak voltage over time? Might the peak start to fall off rapidly as they see more recharge - discharge cycles? Questions abount, and I thank the OP for making the purchace and starting to put these things through the paces. I'd sure like to participate in testing as well, but money's non-existant for additional expendatures at present. Let's hope these batts prove to be everything they claim!

-JT

Gutbucket · « **Reply #25 on:** August 26, 2010, 12:33:25 PM »

Picked up 8 Powergenix AAs and the quick charger. My several year old low self-discharge NiMH AAs (Maha Imedion) still run my R-09s for ~5+ hours, but will not run the DR2d for more than a few minutes. Figuring that deck may not like the lower voltage of NiMH, I'm trying these.

The nickel-zincs charge very, very fast. Initial tests in the DR2d battery hog ran it for about 2.5 hrs, recording in dual channel mode (2 stereo tracks) which is the only way I use that recorder. I ran it a bit on vacation and think they may have started getting more time after some cycling, but I'll have to test that. BTW, if looking at the Powergenix, the quick charger (white) is the better choice, primarily becasue it has independent circuits for each battery as well as charging faster without penalty. It's only a few dollars more than the 3-5 hr rapid charger (black) which only has 2 circuits instead of 4, charging the batteries in pairs.

Johnny Thunder · « **Reply #26 on:** August 26, 2010, 01:38:34 PM »

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nickel-zinc_battery

ArchivalAudio · « **Reply #27 on:** August 30, 2010, 02:54:14 AM »

does anyone know if the fact they run 1.6 v would over volt any thing that needs 3v ie 2x 1.5v (AA) like the Sony M-10?
I think these would be perfect for it but wouldn't want to damage the unit.
since 2 X 1.6 would = 3.2v instead of 3v

just wondering if anyone has any insight?
thanx
--Ian

Gutbucket · « **Reply #28 on:** August 30, 2010, 09:23:30 AM »

Shouldn't be a problem. Any gear that could not handle a nominal 0.2V supply over-voltage would be very poorly designed indeed. That's probably within the tolerance range of standard 1.5V AA alkaline cells anyway.

ArchivalAudio · « **Reply #29 on:** August 30, 2010, 01:53:33 PM »

Quote from: Gutbucket on August 30, 2010, 09:23:30 AM

Shouldn't be a problem. Any gear that could not handle a nominal 0.2V supply over-voltage would be very poorly designed indeed. That's probably within the tolerance range of standard 1.5V AA alkaline cells anyway.

thanx that's what I kinda figured