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Author Topic: FR2 / PMD 670 users...speak out!  (Read 11111 times)

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Offline Daryan

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Re: FR2 / PMD 670 users...speak out!
« Reply #15 on: September 30, 2004, 01:27:41 PM »
Well, that is certainly fair!

Daryan
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Offline Lil Kim Jong-Il

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Re: FR2 / PMD 670 users...speak out!
« Reply #16 on: September 30, 2004, 01:52:09 PM »
The FR2 has only one AES/EBU input port.  You need two AES/EBU ports to transport at 192/24 in stereo.


The AES/EBU data format allows a data rate of 24/96 on 2 channels over one link.  The spec provides for 192/24 by allowing the channel encoding to specify that the second sample frame is treated as a subsequent sample of the first channel (double rate), not a seperate channel.  So AES/EBU will support only 1 channel at 24/192.  To get stereo 24/192, you need 2 AES/EBU ports with one channel marked double sample frequency left and the other marked double sample frequency right.

At least that is my understanding.
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Offline Daryan

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Re: FR2 / PMD 670 users...speak out!
« Reply #17 on: October 01, 2004, 09:36:36 AM »
Wow, great information, if I posted more I would give you a +T!  I wonder if an adapter could be made to use two aes ports and combine them into one.  You would thing with all of the technology they have these days, this standard would change as well.  What digital format allows for 24/192 over one input at curiosity?

Daryan
Microtech Gefell 200/210->Zaolla Silverlines->Fostex FR-2 (oade modified plus other self mods)

Playback: Bolder modified Squeezebox SB3 (building linear power supply)->Bolder Cable Modified Panasonic XR-45 with bybee's->Bolder Nitro speaker cables->VMPS Audio super modified 626r's, VMPS Larger SUB, 1000w class AB sub amp
Tweaks: isolation and room treatments, silclear, BPT 1.5r Power Conditioner (modified), isoblocks, vibrapods, many others

Offline Lil Kim Jong-Il

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Re: FR2 / PMD 670 users...speak out!
« Reply #18 on: October 01, 2004, 03:13:30 PM »
I wonder if an adapter could be made to use two aes ports and combine them into one.  You would thing with all of the technology they have these days, this standard would change as well.  What digital format allows for 24/192 over one input at curiosity?

A conforming AES/EBU cable will support a certain maximum frame rate - that is the limiting factor.  The link protocol has plenty of room for expansion.  A copy of the spec is here : http://www.ebu.ch/CMSimages/en/tec_doc_t3250-2004_tcm6-12767.pdf.

Yes I suppose that you could take a pair 48k or 96k bit rate MONO AES signals and shift/interleave the subframes to stuff a two channel AES frame.  But you can't do that without actively processing the link protocol, so no passive cable would do this.  And that still won't get you a stereo 24/192 signal.

I don't know what is used to transport multi-channel 24/192 in realtime except for streaming protocols that run over LAN or firewire.
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Offline Daryan

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Re: FR2 / PMD 670 users...speak out!
« Reply #19 on: October 01, 2004, 04:24:36 PM »
Wow, I am very impressed.  I am going to sit down over a beer tonight and read through this pdf so I can learn as well.  Thanks so much for the info! :o

Daryan
Microtech Gefell 200/210->Zaolla Silverlines->Fostex FR-2 (oade modified plus other self mods)

Playback: Bolder modified Squeezebox SB3 (building linear power supply)->Bolder Cable Modified Panasonic XR-45 with bybee's->Bolder Nitro speaker cables->VMPS Audio super modified 626r's, VMPS Larger SUB, 1000w class AB sub amp
Tweaks: isolation and room treatments, silclear, BPT 1.5r Power Conditioner (modified), isoblocks, vibrapods, many others

jpschust

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Re: FR2 / PMD 670 users...speak out!
« Reply #20 on: October 02, 2004, 10:52:40 AM »
so it looks like the 744 has dual AES ins which would make stereo 24/192 possible.

Offline mmedley.

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Re: FR2 / PMD 670 users...speak out!
« Reply #21 on: October 04, 2004, 10:18:02 PM »
I played with a PMD-670 a little bit this weekend. The guys at Sirius use them to do interviews while walking around. I did not get to use it offically for recording purposes, but seemed to be a decent unit. I tested it for playback and to also pull a sample off of it via coax and it worked beautifully. It was fairly lightweight and seemed decently sturdy. I would give it an average rating. Just my opinion though.

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marc0789

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Re: FR2 / PMD 670 users...speak out!
« Reply #22 on: October 05, 2004, 10:45:40 AM »
Hey now folks...

i'm getting ready to plunk down for one of these two units.  I know all the specs and possible modifications that are offered by the Oades.  I've got Carls' W-MOD FR2 at my disposal to play with.

I"m really wanting to hear from the Martantz PMD670 users in here.  What do you think of it?
While i'd rather have 24bit capability....I dont think it justifiies the $1,000 difference in price tag once all is said and done between these two devices.  I think 24/96 is better, no doubt.  But i'm not unhappy listening to 16bit redbook standards either.

The Marantz goes for as little as $650.  I understand that Doug recomends an upgrade that lowers the distortion levels or something, making it perform better as a PA recording device.  Given its 16bit limitations, I'm thinking I can get away with 1-2gb CF cards or just a single 5gb PCMCIA card as storage.  Bringing this up to around $800. 
It seems as though it runs for a long time on 8 AA cells, and i've got tons of 1800mAh NiMH doube As so I would be all set here.    Buying from the Oades w/whatever MOD doug has for it should still keep this in the under $900 ball park I would assume.  Anyone know better?  Anyone have one of these Oade mod PMDs ?

The FR2, modd'd would be in the $1600 range.  Plus another $250 for a pair of 5gb PCMCIA cards to allow 24bit recording...which I would do.  But for this kind of money, i"d honestly rather wait until the 722 becomes a retail reality.  Plus, I find it a little bulky.  And it would require me to carry lead around to power it.  Another big negative to me.  I would guess that it sounds superior after Doug gets his hands on those preamps, but honestly I love the sound of my mics so much that anything that offers little in the way of coloration gets my vote.

So i'm looking for opinions.  Especialy you Marantz users.  what do you think?  Ease of use?  Real life record times on its 8 AAs ?  Size, portability, rugged? 

inquiring minds want to know.


Listening to an FR-2 tape for the first time, mk4>fr-2, neville bros. from telluride blues and brews, and really like the sound. To me, sounds a whole bunch like an m148, warm, but tight overall and dry in the low end. good first impression for sure, even listening to a 16bit cd.

Offline spcyrfc

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Re: FR2 / PMD 670 users...speak out!
« Reply #23 on: October 05, 2004, 06:26:52 PM »
i run pmd670 unmodded. iit is very sensitive, but i have been pleased with the overall quality but it sucks to run @ 3 1/2.
for storage of digitial media, check out Nixvue products.  i have a 40 gig vista that i picked up on ebay, it is pocket size and very portable.  pretty nice for unloading the CF cards, which for a 2gb card costs only a little less than this 40gig vista.
the pmd670 is rugged and lightweight. 
i dig it but if anyone gets one, get it modded.
luke
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Offline Nick's Picks

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Re: FR2 / PMD 670 users...speak out!
« Reply #24 on: October 06, 2004, 07:25:48 AM »
i run pmd670 unmodded. iit is very sensitive, but i have been pleased with the overall quality but it sucks to run @ 3 1/2.
for storage of digitial media, check out Nixvue products.  i have a 40 gig vista that i picked up on ebay, it is pocket size and very portable.  pretty nice for unloading the CF cards, which for a 2gb card costs only a little less than this 40gig vista.
the pmd670 is rugged and lightweight. 
i dig it but if anyone gets one, get it modded.
luke

yea, Doug told me it was not suited for PA recording stock (neither is the FR2).  Brickwall action.

Offline silentmark

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Re: FR2 / PMD 670 users...speak out!
« Reply #25 on: October 06, 2004, 08:22:09 AM »
i run pmd670 unmodded. iit is very sensitive, but i have been pleased with the overall quality but it sucks to run @ 3 1/2.
for storage of digitial media, check out Nixvue products.  i have a 40 gig vista that i picked up on ebay, it is pocket size and very portable.  pretty nice for unloading the CF cards, which for a 2gb card costs only a little less than this 40gig vista.
the pmd670 is rugged and lightweight. 
i dig it but if anyone gets one, get it modded.
luke

yea, Doug told me it was not suited for PA recording stock (neither is the FR2).  Brickwall action.

You don't need the mod if you are going to be running an outboard pre/AD, correct ? This is just for the internal pre I think.

spcyrfc - what do you mean it's sensitive ?
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Offline spcyrfc

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Re: FR2 / PMD 670 users...speak out!
« Reply #26 on: October 11, 2004, 05:51:35 PM »
with an outboard pre it is fine.  the internall though peaks very easily.  for examply i recorded a woodwind quintet the other day un amplified or acoustic and had to keep my levels hovering around 3 1/2 to avoid peaking.
that is why i call it sensitive.
hope that clears it up.
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Offline phrazelle

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Re: FR2 / PMD 670 users...speak out!
« Reply #27 on: January 12, 2005, 11:34:14 AM »
i got a pmd670 for christmas, and took it to colorado for the keller/yonder show.  i skipped my preamp due to not having a battery pack, and it was a mono preamp (still building the rig).  i had my levels at -6 db and still distorted the hell out of the vocals.  i figure its not using a preamp that did that, but im not sure.  i took it to band practice last night and used my mono preamp and the levels peaked out if i turned the main input knob over 2.  sensitive is one word for this deck. 

oh, and if you use the phantom power on the deck, it will eat the hell out of your batteries.  8 AA's are supposed to last 6 hours, but i only got 4 out of it w/ phantom power on.

one more thing, if you use a 4 gb flash card, you can pull 6 hours of 48khz wav no problem.

anyone with one of these that has ideas on how to make the thing tame down a bit give me a shout.
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Offline dnsacks

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Re: FR2 / PMD 670 users...speak out!
« Reply #28 on: January 12, 2005, 12:05:16 PM »
You need to run an external pre (a digimodded ua5 would be ideal since you can feed the unit digitally and skip its analog stage alltogether), run attenuators (pads), or sell your stock one and get a modded one from Doug Oade (doug will only mod units he sells and can mod the analog inputs so that it will be usable for recording amplified music).

Offline phrazelle

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Re: FR2 / PMD 670 users...speak out!
« Reply #29 on: January 12, 2005, 03:17:35 PM »
i used an external mono preamp (behringer mic100) at practice and the levels looked ok, but the distortion is through the roof.  is a better preamp and then also attenuators the next step?  there is a -20db switch on the mics, should i flip the switch?  man, this is bugging the hell out of me. :-\
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