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Author Topic: Roland R-07, Part 2  (Read 27751 times)

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Offline detroit lightning

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Re: Roland R-07, Part 2
« Reply #120 on: March 04, 2022, 09:02:43 PM »
Probably using this for the first time on Sunday night - very open / taper-friendly artist, so I'm looking to try a number of things. One of the reasons I picked this up was to occasionally run board feeds with it. I have a XLR > Minijack attenuator that I assume I want to use?

Beyond that, it's been forever since I've used a mini-deck like this. Line-in, right?

In this exact case I've never pulled a feed from this board, so not really sure what to expect. Anything else I should look out for in terms of settings.

I can also run into a R44, so I have options...

thx!

Offline checht

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Re: Roland R-07, Part 2
« Reply #121 on: March 05, 2022, 12:13:39 AM »
In my experience, I've had to insert an attenuator between the sbd and r-07, or signal's too hot.


Schoeps MK41s > nbob KCY >
Naiant PFA 60v > Sound Devices MP-6 II  or  Naiant IPA > Roland R-07
Vanguard V1s matched pair
Recordings at LMA

Offline roffels

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Re: Roland R-07, Part 2
« Reply #122 on: March 05, 2022, 04:28:57 AM »
Same here, definitely use attenuators for a soundboard feed.

If you have two r07s, and plan on doing a matrix, the app actually lets you start and stop recording on both units simultaneously - super handy.

Offline guitard

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Re: Roland R-07, Part 2
« Reply #123 on: March 05, 2022, 09:12:52 AM »
I've gotten away with not using an attenuator while recording a soundboard feed of rock music directly to my R-07, but I dialed the input level way down and I had a very friendly and helpful sound guy helping me (it was a small town charity event).  It can work, but as checht recommended, it's probably best to have an attenuator.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2022, 10:36:14 AM by guitard »
Mics: Schoeps MK41s >:D
Pre-amps: BabyNbox & Platinum Nbox
Deck: Sony A10

Video: Sony FDR AX100 (4K), Pany ZS100 (4K)
Photo: Canon EOS 60D w/ Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L is III USM

A/V software: Sony Vegas Pro 13.0 (build 453) 64 bit / DVD Architect Pro 6.0 (build 237)

Offline checht

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Re: Roland R-07, Part 2
« Reply #124 on: March 05, 2022, 10:35:24 AM »
If you have two r07s, and plan on doing a matrix, the app actually lets you start and stop recording on both units simultaneously - super handy.
Hmm, interesting. Sometimes it's a pain to run cable from sbd to ambient mics location.
Do 2 random r07s operate at the exact same clock speed? Have you ever seen drift over a multi-hour recording?
Schoeps MK41s > nbob KCY >
Naiant PFA 60v > Sound Devices MP-6 II  or  Naiant IPA > Roland R-07
Vanguard V1s matched pair
Recordings at LMA

Offline Chanher

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Re: Roland R-07, Part 2
« Reply #125 on: March 05, 2022, 11:41:47 AM »
If you have two r07s, and plan on doing a matrix, the app actually lets you start and stop recording on both units simultaneously - super handy.
Hmm, interesting. Sometimes it's a pain to run cable from sbd to ambient mics location.
Do 2 random r07s operate at the exact same clock speed? Have you ever seen drift over a multi-hour recording?

There will be drift. Even 2 identical recorders with identical ADC's will not be in sync with each other. Whenever you have 2 or more ADC's in a multi track recording, they must be physically connected (not possible on the R-07) with 1 being deemed the "master clock" via settings so all files are recorded off the same clock.

I have mixed many aud + sbd recordings recorded with different recorders/word clocks and while it truly is a PITA, it's also a great way to sharpen your DAW and mastering skills. Plus, if you ever buy one of the many 4+ track recorders out there, you will truly appreciate it!

EDIT: there is a better technique then what i state below, using software to STRETCH one of the sources to fit the other. see posts below
The most helpful tip I learned is visually lining up snare hits. Zoom in AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE on a single snare hit (or wav spike) and literally slide the other track till the same snare hit is perfectly lined up with it. Go forward in the song 3-5 minutes and zoom in again and see how the snare hit peaks are lined up. You will eventually see (usually every 3-10 minutes) the hits begin to drift apart. Then split the 2nd file and re-align again. I usually ended up splitting and re-aligning every 7-10 minutes. YMMV
« Last Edit: March 07, 2022, 08:24:08 PM by Chanher »
"chonner"

Studio Projects C4 (c,o) / AT853Rx (c,h) > AT8533x > SD MP-2 / bm2p+ Edirol UA-5 > Tascam DR-70D / Iriver

Offline guitard

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Re: Roland R-07, Part 2
« Reply #126 on: March 05, 2022, 12:08:23 PM »

The most helpful tip I learned is visually lining up snare hits. Zoom in AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE on a single snare hit (or wav spike) and literally slide the other track till the same snare hit is perfectly lined up with it. Go forward in the song 3-5 minutes and zoom in again and see how the snare hit peaks are lined up. You will eventually see (usually every 3-10 minutes) the hits begin to drift apart. Then split the 2nd file and re-align again. I usually ended up splitting and re-aligning every 7-10 minutes. YMMV

I have found with modern digital recorders, that even between two different recorder brands, the drift is usually very consistent.  So I just find a reference point (snare hit) at the beginning of one of the recordings, line it up with the other recording; and then go to the end of the recordings and stretch or reduce the length of the second recording to match the first recording.  Even for a 90 minute recording, it's rarely off by more than a tiny fraction of a second.  I also go back and spot check in the middle of the recording; but it's uncommon to find spots where it's still out of sync.
Mics: Schoeps MK41s >:D
Pre-amps: BabyNbox & Platinum Nbox
Deck: Sony A10

Video: Sony FDR AX100 (4K), Pany ZS100 (4K)
Photo: Canon EOS 60D w/ Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L is III USM

A/V software: Sony Vegas Pro 13.0 (build 453) 64 bit / DVD Architect Pro 6.0 (build 237)

Offline checht

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Re: Roland R-07, Part 2
« Reply #127 on: March 05, 2022, 12:13:28 PM »

The most helpful tip I learned is visually lining up snare hits. Zoom in AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE on a single snare hit (or wav spike) and literally slide the other track till the same snare hit is perfectly lined up with it. Go forward in the song 3-5 minutes and zoom in again and see how the snare hit peaks are lined up. You will eventually see (usually every 3-10 minutes) the hits begin to drift apart. Then split the 2nd file and re-align again. I usually ended up splitting and re-aligning every 7-10 minutes. YMMV

I have found with modern digital recorders, that even between two different recorder brands, the drift is usually very consistent.  So I just find a reference point (snare hit) at the beginning of one of the recordings, line it up with the other recording; and then go to the end of the recordings and stretch or reduce the length of the second recording to match the first recording.  Even for a 90 minute recording, it's rarely off by more than a tiny fraction of a second.  I also go back and spot check in the middle of the recording; but it's uncommon to find spots where it's still out of sync.

^this
Also, when mixing sbd and ambient from a multitrack recorder, using a transient for alignment is necessary due to wave propagation time. Unless you are trying for a wet, reverb-like sound.
Schoeps MK41s > nbob KCY >
Naiant PFA 60v > Sound Devices MP-6 II  or  Naiant IPA > Roland R-07
Vanguard V1s matched pair
Recordings at LMA

Offline roffels

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Re: Roland R-07, Part 2
« Reply #128 on: March 06, 2022, 12:56:38 PM »
If you have two r07s, and plan on doing a matrix, the app actually lets you start and stop recording on both units simultaneously - super handy.
Hmm, interesting. Sometimes it's a pain to run cable from sbd to ambient mics location.
Do 2 random r07s operate at the exact same clock speed? Have you ever seen drift over a multi-hour recording?

I purchased an r07 in 2019 and one in 2022, I've only run both simultaneously a few times now, but haven't experienced any drift. You'll still want to manually sync the shows up in post to account for distance from the stage and eliminate phasing issues.

Offline Chanher

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Re: Roland R-07, Part 2
« Reply #129 on: March 07, 2022, 12:36:12 PM »

The most helpful tip I learned is visually lining up snare hits. Zoom in AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE on a single snare hit (or wav spike) and literally slide the other track till the same snare hit is perfectly lined up with it. Go forward in the song 3-5 minutes and zoom in again and see how the snare hit peaks are lined up. You will eventually see (usually every 3-10 minutes) the hits begin to drift apart. Then split the 2nd file and re-align again. I usually ended up splitting and re-aligning every 7-10 minutes. YMMV

I have found with modern digital recorders, that even between two different recorder brands, the drift is usually very consistent.  So I just find a reference point (snare hit) at the beginning of one of the recordings, line it up with the other recording; and then go to the end of the recordings and stretch or reduce the length of the second recording to match the first recording.  Even for a 90 minute recording, it's rarely off by more than a tiny fraction of a second.  I also go back and spot check in the middle of the recording; but it's uncommon to find spots where it's still out of sync.

ah yes digital stretching! I am showing my age with my outdated techniques haha. That's why I love this place, always something new to learn. I have a ton of old sbd + aud shows recorded with 2 recorders, I must try digital stretching! Brilliant...
"chonner"

Studio Projects C4 (c,o) / AT853Rx (c,h) > AT8533x > SD MP-2 / bm2p+ Edirol UA-5 > Tascam DR-70D / Iriver

 

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