Taperssection.com
Gear / Technical Help => Recording Gear => Topic started by: NOLAfishwater on July 08, 2008, 10:49:23 AM
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continue.
old thread here:
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,88437.0.html
****YOU WILL NEED A SPECIAL CABLE WHEN RUNNING INTO THE TRS INPUTS FROM AN UNBALANCED SOURCE***
FWIW, GuySonic got back to me and said the wiring drawing I posted a few posts ago is the way to wire the TRS plugs for use from an unbalanced source into the MTII.
http://taperssection.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=106690.0;attach=94665
Thanks GuySonic!
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... ;D
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;)
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I'd just like to check in, having bought a MicroTrack II this week. I haven't had much time to check it out yet, but it seems to work when driven via its S/P-DIF input from a Grace Lunatec V3 at 44.1 kHz, either at 16- or 24-bit resolution. That alone makes it more versatile than a DAT or MiniDisc recorder.
It's very nice that it offers a volume-adjustable headphone output while recording from the digital input. If the analog line outputs are also live then, as the instruction book seems to say, that will be very convenient for master class recording, in which I make a digital recording for the instructor's archive and simultaneous cassettes for the students.
Strangely, when I tried (just from curiosity) to verify the 48 Volt phantom powering, all that I could measure at the mike inputs was about 4.2 Volts DC. I'll try that again another time. I may never use the analog inputs, but it would be nice to know what they're actually capable of.
--best regards
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Question for any who have run an analog recording to the MT2.
I was advised to convert my current mini mics from the 1/8" jack to a TR connection (told that the TRS modded will prevent the noise prob) because the 1/4" in is a better connection. From looking over Guy Sonics wav's, it appears the 1/8 input's less noisy than the 1/4 even with a balance signal? Is there any real benny to using 1/4 instead?
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Which is the biggest compact flash you have used with success (details please) ?
Has anybody tried transcend 32 gb 133x Cf card?
How well microtrack II deals with remaining time in big storage cards?
Thanks in advance.
Best.
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Question for any who have run an analog recording to the MT2.
I was advised to convert my current mini mics from the 1/8" jack to a TR connection (told that the TRS modded will prevent the noise prob) because the 1/4" in is a better connection. From looking over Guy Sonics wav's, it appears the 1/8 input's less noisy than the 1/4 even with a balance signal? Is there any real benny to using 1/4 instead?
I've only run 1/8" in, but I thought it sounded pretty good... It's no apogee, but for stealth gear I'm happy with it.
How well microtrack II deals with remaining time in big storage cards?
I would expect based on my experience that all cards, 8GB and over will incorrectly report the time remaining based on a 96khz sampling rate even if you are sending 44.1 or 48. It sucks, but what can you do?
EDIT: the above is only the case for SPDIF... if you're not using SPDIF, then you would never know this problem existed.
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Looking at Guysonic's test results, the difference in noise floor between the 1/8-inch and 1/4-inch balanced inputs is small. Depending on the noise floor of the mics you're using, you would be unlikely to hear any difference between the inputs.
The advantages of the 1/4-inch input are that it's more durable, and less prone to adding electrical noises than the 1/8-inch jack. Put another way, the 1/8-inch jack is consumer grade, while the 1/4-inch jack is closer to pro standards. These days, pro gear use locking connectors with balanced cable, such as XLR.
Of course you can make a good recording with a 1/8-inch jack. I'm just saying that the 1/4-inch jack will last longer and give more reliably good results.
Flintstone
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Looking at Guysonic's test results, the difference in noise floor between the 1/8-inch and 1/4-inch balanced inputs is small. Depending on the noise floor of the mics you're using, you would be unlikely to hear any difference between the inputs.
The advantages of the 1/4-inch input are that it's more durable, and less prone to adding electrical noises than the 1/8-inch jack. Put another way, the 1/8-inch jack is consumer grade, while the 1/4-inch jack is closer to pro standards. These days, pro gear use locking connectors with balanced cable, such as XLR.
Of course you can make a good recording with a 1/8-inch jack. I'm just saying that the 1/4-inch jack will last longer and give more reliably good results.
Flintstone
While true for MT1, MT2 inputs do vary in noise performance with the minijack input far quieter than TRS input. See MT2 noise plot graph below.
(http://www.sonicstudios.com/-35dBu_graph.gif)
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+T Flintstone, Rustoleum, and Guy Sonic...
I love taping. Think it's a pretty common characteristic among tapers to become too much of a perfectionist. Hate working the kinks out of new gear or new chain and having early recordings not come out. This forums priceless and I'm sure has saved me countless headaches. Thanks, thanks, thanks... :happy:
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We're talking about the green and dark blue plots on the graph, right?
Looks like a difference of 2 to 3 dB to me.
However, both mic inputs are noisier than the line input, and by a
substantial amount.
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While true for MT1, MT2 inputs do vary in noise performance with the minijack input far quieter than TRS input. See MT2 noise plot graph below.
Is there a similar curve for the MT1 anywhere to look at?
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Hoo boy. I just finished five days (10 hours/day) live recording, using the MicroTrack II as the bit-bucket for most of it. I have some things to report ... but I need a night's sleep first.
A quick summary, though: In general it worked very well, but because of a few glitches (one of which may have cost me nearly three hours of a valuable recording) I don't quite trust this recorder yet. Still, it seems close to being a rather great little recording device, I think.
And a request: Somewhere on this board there was a discussion in the past month or two of how you can perhaps recover a file that was written to a CF card but not closed. I read that discussion, and now I need to re-read it, since I'm in that situation myself. But I couldn't find it--can someone steer me to it, please?
--best regards
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DSatz -- I'm not sure from your description the current state of your "bad" data. It seems there are two symptoms when people have trouble with the MT: either the file is gone completely, or it's present but shows 0 bytes. There've been discussions around both issues.
Here's the one that stands out in my memory on the 0 byte file issue:
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,53521.0/all.html
And a bunch on recovering files from cards when the data seems completely gone:
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,83947.0.html
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,53521.0/all.html
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,71939.0.html
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,53423.0/all.html
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,83947.0.html
And here's a discussion on WAV header repair, which may or may not be an issue for you depending on your exact problem:
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,72936.0/all.html
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Brian, many many thanks, and a (superfluous in your case, but still heartfelt) +T for your kindness in listing out those threads.
[What I have is a card that shows no files at all.] Wrong! I looked again--the file I need is shown, but appears as a 0-length file. With any luck, most of the cluster chains will be neat and consecutive.
The newest (v.1.0.4) firmware from M Audio claims to resolve the "media lock-up issues during record," but in the absence of any further detail, I have no way to know whether they mean this particular problem or not.
--best regards
P.S.: I got up the nerve to run chkdsk /f on the drive, and it correctly restored the entire 2 hour, 3 minute, 50-second WAV file up to the point where the recorder froze. Whew! (Now, if it only hadn't frozen ... but that turned out to be OK, too, in its own way. This time.)
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P.S.: I got up the nerve to run chkdsk /f on the drive, and it correctly restored the entire 2 hour, 3 minute, 50-second WAV file up to the point where the recorder froze. Whew! (Now, if it only hadn't frozen ... but that turned out to be OK, too, in its own way. This time.)
I, for one, await your in-depth review and comments. I saw someone this past weekend who had an MT1 and grumbled a bit about it, but was generally happy. With that in mind, I see many people who have similar reactions about the MT2. I keep looking at it as the only 24bit digi-in, but I have trouble pulling the trigger on one with the random issues.
On that note, my iriver120 isn't perfect, but I've never had an issue in the field personally but I had one at home testing stuff, so it might be that every recorder has random gremlins, and it's just what percentage of normal operation is affected.
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I see many people who have similar reactions about the MT2. I keep looking at it as the only 24bit digi-in, but I have trouble pulling the trigger on one with the random issues.
On that note, my iriver120 isn't perfect, but I've never had an issue in the field personally but I had one at home testing stuff, so it might be that every recorder has random gremlins, and it's just what percentage of normal operation is affected.
What I would add to that is that to go better you have to spend more, like on a Korg MR1, or a Sony D50 or a Fostex FR2.
Right now I am balancing between the MT 2 or the Edirol R-09HR. But that is because I can't find a review with a line-in noise-spectrum curve for the Zoom H2 or the Tascam DR1. Is there one anywhere?
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So here is the $64,000 question....has anyone got the brass balls to put the MTII firmware on the MT 24/96? I just got the MT 24/96 for the second time to record 24 bit and wanted to go 96k with it, but forgot about the seamless split issue and you can only record 57 minutes at 24/96 which is too short for any main set. On the M-Audio site it specifically says not to use the 24/96 firmware with the MTII but says nothing about using the MTII firmware on a 24/96. I am tempted just for giggles and possibility of getting seamless track splits on the 24/96. Thoughts? Anyone know how the guts are different?
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So here is the $64,000 question....has anyone got the brass balls to put the MTII firmware on the MT 24/96? I just got the MT 24/96 for the second time to record 24 bit and wanted to go 96k with it, but forgot about the seamless split issue and you can only record 57 minutes at 24/96 which is too short for any main set. On the M-Audio site it specifically says not to use the 24/96 firmware with the MTII but says nothing about using the MTII firmware on a 24/96. I am tempted just for giggles and possibility of getting seamless track splits on the 24/96. Thoughts? Anyone know how the guts are different?
I can't imagine anything good would come of it. The MT 2496 firmware is stable and the unit is easy to use. The unit was not built to accomodate the seamless split, which is probably (at least partly) why the new unit was created. I cannot see any way that the firmware would solve this issue.
A better solution is to record at 24/48.
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So here is the $64,000 question....has anyone got the brass balls to put the MTII firmware on the MT 24/96? I just got the MT 24/96 for the second time to record 24 bit and wanted to go 96k with it, but forgot about the seamless split issue and you can only record 57 minutes at 24/96 which is too short for any main set. On the M-Audio site it specifically says not to use the 24/96 firmware with the MTII but says nothing about using the MTII firmware on a 24/96. I am tempted just for giggles and possibility of getting seamless track splits on the 24/96. Thoughts? Anyone know how the guts are different?
I can't imagine anything good would come of it. The MT 2496 firmware is stable and the unit is easy to use. The unit was not built to accomodate the seamless split, which is probably (at least partly) why the new unit was created. I cannot see any way that the firmware would solve this issue.
A better solution is to record at 24/48.
Yeah, that's what I figured I would do. It took quite a while to figure out how to do that with my UA-5. The MT came with an old Beta, 1.04 I think, and it wasn't reading the sample rate automatically so whatever rate I had set under the analog inputs was being carried over when I switched to the digital input. My next plan is to upgrade the regular firmware to 1.4.6 and record 24/48 until I win the lotto and upgrade to something else. I am liking the coax cable better than the optical for digital recording, I don't feel like I have to baby the cable like the optical one with the caps and such.
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So here is the $64,000 question....has anyone got the brass balls to put the MTII firmware on the MT 24/96? I just got the MT 24/96 for the second time to record 24 bit and wanted to go 96k with it, but forgot about the seamless split issue and you can only record 57 minutes at 24/96 which is too short for any main set. On the M-Audio site it specifically says not to use the 24/96 firmware with the MTII but says nothing about using the MTII firmware on a 24/96. I am tempted just for giggles and possibility of getting seamless track splits on the 24/96. Thoughts? Anyone know how the guts are different?
I can't imagine anything good would come of it. The MT 2496 firmware is stable and the unit is easy to use. The unit was not built to accomodate the seamless split, which is probably (at least partly) why the new unit was created. I cannot see any way that the firmware would solve this issue.
A better solution is to record at 24/48.
Yeah, that's what I figured I would do. It took quite a while to figure out how to do that with my UA-5. The MT came with an old Beta, 1.04 I think, and it wasn't reading the sample rate automatically so whatever rate I had set under the analog inputs was being carried over when I switched to the digital input. My next plan is to upgrade the regular firmware to 1.4.6 and record 24/48 until I win the lotto and upgrade to something else. I am liking the coax cable better than the optical for digital recording, I don't feel like I have to baby the cable like the optical one with the caps and such.
I have had the MT 2496 since it came out. Originally it was terrible, but within a few months it got much better and then with the final firmwares it became rock solid. It is not for everyone though, because it is qwirky. I have not lost a recording or had a problem since 2006. I really love the deck and my recordings. I always go at 24/48. I have had a few close calls on the split, but even if I lose a few seconds it is not the end of the world. So far the only time that did happen is when I tried 24/96.
There have been a few times I started a new file between songs, bu pushing record twice. That worked well.
The only thing for me that I try and keep drilled in my head is to remember to put the hold button back on after I do anything. It is really easy to touch the buttons and screw up a recording. I'm pretty religious about remembering that if I make any changes during a recording.
I am afraid that putting firmware from the new MT could make the unit not function.
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I think the same thing goes with the MT2. Initially there were a lot of bugs, but they've been mostly overcome. Seems that by the major decrease in postings about the device and it's problems, most people running them are satisfied. I love my unit. Has been great running digi-in and am also pretty impressed with going 1/8" in with my at933's. Definately worth the purchase imho.
Now if only we could get an Oade mod...
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sorry for the basic questions...
which inputs are digital?
is the s/pdif input and/or output?
I've got some old DAT tapes (has s/pdif optical & coax out) and minidiscs (has 1/8" out) I want to transfer to my PC, but I don't have an audio interface. I'm looking at the MT2 as option... anyone have thoughts on that?
edit:
old DAT recorder is the Sony PCM-M1 & I have a Sony RM-D100K for the digital outputs
old minidisc recorder is the Sony MZ-N1
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sorry for the basic questions...
which inputs are digital?
is the s/pdif input and/or output?
I've got some old DAT tapes (has s/pdif optical & coax out) and minidiscs (has 1/8" out) I want to transfer to my PC, but I don't have an audio interface. I'm looking at the MT2 as option... anyone have thoughts on that?
edit:
old DAT recorder is the Sony PCM-M1 & I have a Sony RM-D100K for the digital outputs
old minidisc recorder is the Sony MZ-N1
If you're only looking to do a digi transfer of old tapes, I would invest in a much cheaper usb audio interface for your computer (under $100). But if you want a new digital recorder, the MT2 isn't a bad investment.
The MT2 has spdif as it's digi in and it's outputs are either digi thru the usb or analog thru rca stereo connectors. You could run your md thru the 1/8th jack, m1 thru the spdif...
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I thought the outputs were analog only, like the original MT ?
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To play audio, no digi outputs, but for transfer, digi thru usb.
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... But if you want a new digital recorder, the MT2 isn't a bad investment.
yeah, actually i am thinking kill two birds with one device... i need a new recorder too. i just bought an edirol R09HR, but think i'll exchange it for the MT2 just to get the digi inputs
excellent news! thank you very much for the quick reply!
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... But if you want a new digital recorder, the MT2 isn't a bad investment.
yeah, actually i am thinking kill two birds with one device... i need a new recorder too. i just bought an edirol R09HR, but think i'll exchange it for the MT2 just to get the digi inputs
excellent news! thank you very much for the quick reply!
Other than the digi inputs on the MT2 I would stick with the edirol R09HR that you just bought.
The 1/4" TRS inputs on the MT2 will produce noise on your recording if you are inputting from an unbalanced source...
:P
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Guysonic's tests show the MT2 works well with
-- balanced mic input to the 1/4-inch jacks
-- line input and
-- unbalanced mic input to the 1/8-inch jack.
There is a lot of noise added when using the 1/4-inch jack and an unbalanced input.
Here is Guysonic's post:
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,88437.msg1286241.html#msg1286241
The upgrade to the MT2 added a seamless rollover when 2 GB file size is reached, and fixed a low voltage problem with phantom power. But the MT2 preamp is generally more noisy than its predecessor, the Microtrack 2496.
This is one of the few times I can think of where the revised model is not as good as the original. (Another example: iRiver replacing the H120 with the H320.) If you can live with a 2 GB file size and don't need the full 48V of phantom power, then buy a used MT 2496.
Flintstone
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In case anyone with the MicroTracK II is interested, I recently sold mine (for personal reasons, not dissatisfaction). I've got a Denecke PS-2 and AD-20 set that I paid $450 for back in April, used 5x at my bands rehearsals, that I'm selling for $200.00. It's really a terrific deal. The AD-20 produces far superior sound to the internals in the MicroTrack. Both going for about $125 less than the cost of the AD-20 alone.
The thread with my contact info is in Recording Gear and Yard Sale forums now.
Thanks,
Dan
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O.K. folks - got a question for you. This may well be a no-brainer but I'm new to recording and simply don't know what to do here.
I have a Microtrack 2, a pair of SP-CMC-8 omnis and a Sound Professionals battery box - not sure the model, it's older and not sold on their site anymore, runs on a 9-volt battery. The mics have 3.5mm plugs and run into a Y connector which I've been running into the MT2 1/8" mic in. The bbox has a 3.5mm jack and plug as well. I want to run mics > bbox > mt2 via the 1/8" mic in but i'm just a little scared to plug it in after reading this:
http://www.m-audio.com/index.php?do=support.faq&ID=9a237a0b77a1865fb5f66e14d146b6c6
http://www.m-audio.com/index.php?do=support.faq&ID=069ce733df6a2782d6212893fc4a431d
http://www.m-audio.com/index.php?do=support.faq&ID=5d99c9ee03fa5f70bac4c743877145a7
Is it necessary to use the 1/4" inputs if I want to run phantom power? Can I fry the MT2 if I run the bbox straight in to the mic in? Any help on this will be greatly appreciated.
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O.K. folks - got a question for you. This may well be a no-brainer but I'm new to recording and simply don't know what to do here.
I have a Microtrack 2, a pair of SP-CMC-8 omnis and a Sound Professionals battery box - not sure the model, it's older and not sold on their site anymore, runs on a 9-volt battery. The mics have 3.5mm plugs and run into a Y connector which I've been running into the MT2 1/8" mic in. The bbox has a 3.5mm jack and plug as well. I want to run mics > bbox > mt2 via the 1/8" mic in but i'm just a little scared to plug it in after reading this:
http://www.m-audio.com/index.php?do=support.faq&ID=9a237a0b77a1865fb5f66e14d146b6c6
http://www.m-audio.com/index.php?do=support.faq&ID=069ce733df6a2782d6212893fc4a431d
http://www.m-audio.com/index.php?do=support.faq&ID=5d99c9ee03fa5f70bac4c743877145a7
Is it necessary to use the 1/4" inputs if I want to run phantom power? Can I fry the MT2 if I run the bbox straight in to the mic in? Any help on this will be greatly appreciated.
From my limited knowledge...
You would use a battery box or use phantom power. I cannot think of any situation where you would use both. The mics you mention would be best used with battery box not phantom power.
As far as I know the phantom power is for the 1/4" TRS jacks, but again even if I used the 1/4 jacks with your set up, I'd use the battery box. If you had an MT1, you would actually be adapting the mics to go into the 1/4 jacks as the 1/8 seems to run too hot, but my understanding from reading various threads here on TS, is that this is not the case on the MT2.
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Wow, that was fast! Thanks for the quick reply...
As to phantom power I think maybe I gave the wrong impression. I'm not trying to use both - someone referred to the battery box as a phantom power adapter and left me thinking they were one and the same. I just want to know if it's safe or for that matter if it's proper to run the battery box into the 1/8" mic jack on the mt2 or do I need something like this:
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/SP-MICROTRACK-MINI-TRS
to safely run the battery box.
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I run sp-cmc-8's to my MT2 going 3.5mm in as well. The 48v phantom power is for the 1/4 inputs. It won't affect your mics at all. Still shouldn't turn it on...will pro'ly drain the batt much faster. Keep running the batt box in the chain. I made 1 recording going sp-cmc-8> mt2... sounds pretty distorted. Needs the extra voltage.
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The only way to go in thru the trs requires a mod to the cabling. I would stick with the 1/8th in. It is actually less noisy anyway.
MY .02
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I run sp-cmc-8's to my MT2 going 3.5mm in as well. The 48v phantom power is for the 1/4 inputs. It won't affect your mics at all. Still shouldn't turn it on...will pro'ly drain the batt much faster. Keep running the batt box in the chain. I made 1 recording going sp-cmc-8> mt2... sounds pretty distorted. Needs the extra voltage.
THANK YOU - That's what I was hoping to hear. I had this picture in my head of plugging in the bbox and sparks shooting out...:really_sucks:
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Wanted to check in and see if there are any fellow MT2 users who have run a CA-9100 pre to 1/8th input on the device. I'm expecting one in the next couple of weeks and would love any input from anyone who has used the combo.
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I don't own a preamp...sorry. Any MT2 users ever use the 'Limiter' (Main Menu>Record Settings>Limiter) function? If so, what were the results? From what I gather it acts as a hard limiter of sorts which could be useful I suppose but I don't want to do anything that might degrade a recording. I've been afraid to use it for fear that it might 'squash' the louder sounds. Any ideas? ???
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I don't own a preamp...sorry. Any MT2 users ever use the 'Limiter' (Main Menu>Record Settings>Limiter) function? If so, what were the results? From what I gather it acts as a hard limiter of sorts which could be useful I suppose but I don't want to do anything that might degrade a recording. I've been afraid to use it for fear that it might 'squash' the louder sounds. Any ideas? ???
I have not used the limiter function on the MTII..........but this has me wondering what the deal is with attenuation
for mic and line sources
All my Cassette/DAT decks and SBM1 had line/mic switches and -20db mic pads for those loud rock concerts we
tend to record
Whats the deal with the MTII?
I dont see any switches/settings to differentiate how it handles a line or mic signal.......does it auto attenuate?
I was considering using a 9100 pre, but not sure how to adjust for line in
I see nothing for mic attenuation, other than that 1/8" ext attenuator on the Maudio site
http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/MicroTrack10dBPad.html
I think the MT1 had a switch on the side to attenuate.......the MTII seems like that switch was replaced to
adjust the brighness of the display.
The manual and FAQ do not address this, so thought I would ask here
thanks
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I don't own a preamp...sorry. Any MT2 users ever use the 'Limiter' (Main Menu>Record Settings>Limiter) function? If so, what were the results? From what I gather it acts as a hard limiter of sorts which could be useful I suppose but I don't want to do anything that might degrade a recording. I've been afraid to use it for fear that it might 'squash' the louder sounds. Any ideas? ???
I have not used the limiter function on the MTII..........but this has me wondering what the deal is with attenuation
for mic and line sources
All my Cassette/DAT decks and SBM1 had line/mic switches and -20db mic pads for those loud rock concerts we
tend to record
Whats the deal with the MTII?
I dont see any switches/settings to differentiate how it handles a line or mic signal.......does it auto attenuate?
I was considering using a 9100 pre, but not sure how to adjust for line in
I see nothing for mic attenuation, other than that 1/8" ext attenuator on the Maudio site
http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/MicroTrack10dBPad.html
I think the MT1 had a switch on the side to attenuate.......the MTII seems like that switch was replaced to
adjust the brighness of the display.
The manual and FAQ do not address this, so thought I would ask here
thanks
To the best of my knowledge there isn't any attenuator function. I've seen the inline M-Audio 10db pad and figure I'll need it. Everything I record seems to run hot if I set my levels above 15% or so. This of course leaves me no other choice (that I know of) than to boost the amplitude in post thereby raising the noise floor. That's what originally got me wondering about the limiter function - if it would be possible to raise my levels without clipping. I don't like the idea of having to add the M-Audio pad into the chain - more than likely it'll wind up unplugging at some really inconvenient time.
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I know that m-audio boasts that the mt2 has "extended input gain range" which I assume is why there is no longer a switch for mic/line-in. Guysonic tested the range and in a previous post indicated that the mt2's mic in has more room than the h2 line-in.
I am supposed to be getting a ca-9100 pretty soon myself and am concerned about how my mics>9100>mt2 will play out. Guess it'll all come out in the wash after some field testing.
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Here was the previous post by Guysonic that I was referring to.
Re: New improved microtrack (MT II)
« Reply #360 on: May 04, 2008, 05:39:34 AM »
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Quote from: taperwheeler on May 02, 2008, 02:34:00 PM
I haven't read anything about how well the unit handles high level spl's when recording through the 1/8" input and am curious if anyone has had any experience with it. I know M-Audio claims that the new unit has more headroom but that's not saying much. Would love to use my sp-cmc-8 mics straight in for stealth recording.
Measured: MT2 TRS inputs ~+4dBu Maximum (with REC adjust level set at minimum), and this ~+0.8dBu more than max on MT1; not much difference.
MT2 minijack mic maximum ~ -2.4dBu (the ZOOM H2 maximum LINE input!) compared to MT1 -13.3dBu, so MT2 has slightly over 10dBu MORE headroom than MT1; this is a significant improvement.
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I'm running SP-CMC-8 omnis>SP-SPSB-6>MT2 and recorded a show this past Friday. Stealthed it. It's up on DIME right now (with mp3 samples) here:
http://www.dimeadozen.org/torrents-details.php?id=218982
It came out pretty nice considering where i was seated. The only issue I really ran into as far as the recorder is concerned is the same thing that I previously posted about low input level/boosted amplitude in post/increased noise. The increased noise floor isn't anything dramatic but it still bugs me.
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I'm running SP-CMC-8 omnis>SP-SPSB-6>MT2 and recorded a show this past Friday. Stealthed it. It's up on DIME right now (with mp3 samples) here:
http://www.dimeadozen.org/torrents-details.php?id=218982
It came out pretty nice considering where i was seated. The only issue I really ran into as far as the recorder is concerned is the same thing that I previously posted about low input level/boosted amplitude in post/increased noise. The increased noise floor isn't anything dramatic but it still bugs me.
So when you increase the MT2 gain you end up with distortion?
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I haven't taken that chance, so far. When the red lights come on it's supposedly overloading - so says the manual. Whenever that happens, I lower the levels a bit until they stay off completely. That may be overcautious on my part but I'd rather boost levels in post than have a clipped recording that I can't do anything with. On the other hand, I haven't used any other mics with the MT2 - could it be that cmc-8's are just particularly sensitive?
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I haven't taken that chance, so far. When the red lights come on it's supposedly overloading - so says the manual. Whenever that happens, I lower the levels a bit until they stay off completely. That may be overcautious on my part but I'd rather boost levels in post than have a clipped recording that I can't do anything with. On the other hand, I haven't used any other mics with the MT2 - could it be that cmc-8's are just particularly sensitive?
I recently read another post re: the sensitivity of the omnis found:
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,111438.0.html
I've noticed the red light coming on on some of my recordings. You definately don't want it coming on often or for more than a brief second.
I record with an older pair of sp-cmc-8 mics (the 933) and have the card caps. After quite a few recordings that I was just not too happy with the overall sound, had the low sensitivity mod performmed. I'm much happier now. You may want to look into it as an option.
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I haven't taken that chance, so far. When the red lights come on it's supposedly overloading - so says the manual. Whenever that happens, I lower the levels a bit until they stay off completely. That may be overcautious on my part but I'd rather boost levels in post than have a clipped recording that I can't do anything with. On the other hand, I haven't used any other mics with the MT2 - could it be that cmc-8's are just particularly sensitive?
I recently read another post re: the sensitivity of the omnis found:
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,111438.0.html
I've noticed the red light coming on on some of my recordings. You definately don't want it coming on often or for more than a brief second.
I record with an older pair of sp-cmc-8 mics (the 933) and have the card caps. After quite a few recordings that I was just not too happy with the overall sound, had the low sensitivity mod performmed. I'm much happier now. You may want to look into it as an option.
May have to look into that - the low sens mod. Is there any way to tell which model of the cmc-8 you have? More specifically, can one visually differentiate between the at933 and the at943? I got mine second hand and all I know is that they were originally purchased from Soundprofessionals sometime in 2005.
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2005, you likely have the 943. From talking with someone at Sound Pro's there really isn't any big diff's between them.
To get back to the discussion on using a pre and line-in...I sent an incident report to M-Audio to inquire about spl handling and using line-in to the device. Here's their reply:
"The 1/8" stereo mic input jack is only for mono or stereo microphone input signal.
To feed line lever signal into the device you will have to go thru the 1/4" TRS inputs.
Regards"
This is a very big bummer especially considering the shortcomings of the TRS inputs.
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2005, you likely have the 943. From talking with someone at Sound Pro's there really isn't any big diff's between them.
To get back to the discussion on using a pre and line-in...I sent an incident report to M-Audio to inquire about spl handling and using line-in to the device. Here's their reply:
"The 1/8" stereo mic input jack is only for mono or stereo microphone input signal.
To feed line lever signal into the device you will have to go thru the 1/4" TRS inputs.
Regards"
This is a very big bummer especially considering the shortcomings of the TRS inputs.
Bummer indeed. I suppose you could use an inline attenuator...sometimes referred to as 'headphone volume control' or the like. I know that Soundpros makes this available as an option on some of their battery boxes; costs about $20 or so to add it. I imagine that one could send a battbox back to them and have it modded...or maybe someone with some electronics skills on the boards could do it.
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It's gonna take some experimenting. Once I get my 9100 in, gonna try running thru the 1/4 trs inputs. I believe the 9100 has a female 1/8" port for it's output connection. Will pick up a 1/8" male to dual trs cable and see how it sounds. My understanding is that some people avoided the "sprinkler sound" by doing all the gain with their pre and keeping the mt2 gain all the way down. Will really suck if I'm not going to be able to run the 9100 with the mt2. Really wanted one recorder for both my open and low pro setups.
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So to further my frustration with this device, came across this info on M-Audio's site regarding use of the trs:
"To record with the MicroTrack II's 1/4” inputs, you must record from a balanced source with TRS balanced cables. If you are recording from an unbalanced line level source or a microphone with an unbalanced (TS) cable, use the 1/8” input instead; connecting unbalanced cables to the 1/4" TRS inputs yields an audible clicking sound that is recorded. You can change your input source from the MicroTrack II’s Main Menu>Record Settings>Input Source.
Guess I'll be doing a lot of testing once my preamp arrives.
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Most times MT2 TRS line level input driven from low (unbalanced type) output of preamplifier avoids the noise issue.
Also, wiring unbalanced as pseudo balanced also avoids noise issues.
This is using special unbalanced to balanced adapter that takes unbalanced preamp common ground wired to TRS (-minus) ring connections, sending EACH channel's +hot signal to TRS tips, and leaves the common TRS sleeve cable ground shield connections UNCONNECTED, preferably near the preamplifier output jacks.
While discouraged by MT2 issues to do a technical review (sent this back for refund), suggest going to top of my tips page finding MT2 thread link to very large TS topic with many pages, and many of my posts discussing technical MT2 details now being asked in this thread.
Suggest trying a search for my posts within this topic saving much reading?
Link at: www.sonicstudios.com/tips.htm (http://www.sonicstudios.com/tips.htm)
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Any idea how this Hosa "stereo breakout 3.5 mm TRS to dual 1/4 in TS" cable would interplay between a CA-9100 > MT2?
http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/CMP153
I'm concerned from reading M-Audio's site that using a TS cable could in some way damage my recorder or preamp.
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Grrr. Thing froze again during a recording last night. Not good.
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Grrr. Thing froze again during a recording last night. Not good.
Sorry to hear about your recording ??? - you may already be aware of this:
1.0.7 Firmware available as of 10-23-2008.
http://www.m-audio.com/index.php?do=support.drivers&f=957
I have no idea if this will help or not but I suppose it's worth a shot if you haven't upgraded.
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Mr. _g, thank you very much--I hadn't known about that firmware upgrade. Also from the notes on the page you referenced, there seems to be a "DMA" setting (that I hadn't known anything about) that can affect lockups. I wonder if that would have prevented last night's mess-up.
Nonetheless, for the rest of this series of opera recordings, I've switched to a TCD-D8. I can't take further chances--how could I explain to the client if there are two failures in the same piece of equipment?
The unit may have other problems as well--when I tried to measure its "48 Volt" phantom power supply, for example, I saw nothing resembling 48 Volts (or even 8 Volts). Perhaps I just got a lemon, which nearly every product has some of.
--best regards
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Mr. _g, thank you very much--I hadn't known about that firmware upgrade. Also from the notes on the page you referenced, there seems to be a "DMA" setting (that I hadn't known anything about) that can affect lockups. I wonder if that would have prevented last night's mess-up.
Nonetheless, for the rest of this series of opera recordings, I've switched to a TCD-D8. I can't take further chances--how could I explain to the client if there are two failures in the same piece of equipment?
The unit may have other problems as well--when I tried to measure its "48 Volt" phantom power supply, for example, I saw nothing resembling 48 Volts (or even 8 Volts). Perhaps I just got a lemon, which nearly every product has some of.
--best regards
I'm not sure about that DMA setting or what it means but I have been having some lock ups in past experiences and I just upgraded the firmware to the version listed above. The problem I was having happened when I would apply an external battery source. Within minutes it would lock the device up. Tried for the first time last night as a secondary rig and no lock up. Ran Church Audio ST-11 mics>Church Audio 9100 preamp>TRS inputs>MTII.
No problems with recording, but have yet to look at results in Cool Edit.
Good luck!
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The unit may have other problems as well--when I tried to measure its "48 Volt" phantom power supply, for example, I saw nothing resembling 48 Volts (or even 8 Volts). Perhaps I just got a lemon, which nearly every product has some of.
--best regards
Hope it helps...were you using the TRS inputs when yours locked up? I noticed that manitouman was. I've exclusively used the mic in and have never had any trouble with lock-ups - used an external battery as well with no problems. I'm running v1.0.4 firmware which was factory installed. I noticed somewhere around the later pages (pp. 23-24 or so) on the previous Microtrack 2 thread, here:
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,88437.0.html
that there was speculation M-Audio was trying to work out many of the kinks that early MT2 users were reporting before fully releasing the MT2. Does anyone know whether this is in fact true? I picked mine up sometime around the beginning of September and it's operated without flaw so far.
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I just updated to the new 1.0.7 firmware and now everything is wacky. I can not get it to power on without being plugged in to an external power source. When I turn it own on it's own battery it shows the initial screen then goes blank. If I plug it into external power it'll power on and it will continue to work fine on it's internal battery if I disconnect the external power. When I do this it shows the MT battery has a full charge. I tried reverting back to 1.0.4 but that didn't help. Any ideas out there?
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Make sure that you still have the recorder plugged in via usb while you are running the update.
As the directions say, download the firmware. Mount the MT2 to your computer. Paste the new firware files onto the cf card in the MT2. Unmount the recorder but keep it connected. Then run the update.
If all else fails, maybe remove the cf card, reformat it completely.
Keep us posted. Will try my MT2 tonight to see if I had any problems. I ran the firmware update but haven't run any tests.
Good luck...
I just updated to the new 1.0.7 firmware and now everything is wacky. I can not get it to power on without being plugged in to an external power source. When I turn it own on it's own battery it shows the initial screen then goes blank. If I plug it into external power it'll power on and it will continue to work fine on it's internal battery if I disconnect the external power. When I do this it shows the MT battery has a full charge. I tried reverting back to 1.0.4 but that didn't help. Any ideas out there?
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Thanks for the reminder on the procedure. I must've done this a dozen times between my MT2 and my original MT and never had a problem, but this past few times I Unplugged the MT2 after loading the files and then ran the update. From your procedure reminder I see I should've just disconnected and then do the update. That appears to have fixed the problem. I guess it always helps to read the update procedure carefully and don't rely on memory of what you've done before.
Thanks again for the reminder!
Make sure that you still have the recorder plugged in via usb while you are running the update.
As the directions say, download the firmware. Mount the MT2 to your computer. Paste the new firware files onto the cf card in the MT2. Unmount the recorder but keep it connected. Then run the update.
If all else fails, maybe remove the cf card, reformat it completely.
Keep us posted. Will try my MT2 tonight to see if I had any problems. I ran the firmware update but haven't run any tests.
Good luck...
I just updated to the new 1.0.7 firmware and now everything is wacky. I can not get it to power on without being plugged in to an external power source. When I turn it own on it's own battery it shows the initial screen then goes blank. If I plug it into external power it'll power on and it will continue to work fine on it's internal battery if I disconnect the external power. When I do this it shows the MT battery has a full charge. I tried reverting back to 1.0.4 but that didn't help. Any ideas out there?
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No problem. Glad it's working and isn't another M-Audio problem.
All's well that ends well... :headphones:
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Just wanted to share that I have now rec'd my CA 9100 preamp and after some living room testing, found that it works fine running between my AT933's and the MT2 via TRS with the levels all the way down on the recorder. Can't wait to try it in the field. My only concern will be amplification in a lower SPL, acoustic environment. Perhaps run via the 1/8" connection to take advantage of the 20 db of 9100 gain plus the recorder gain?
My at933's have the low sensitivity mod so I assume there will be some cases where 20db of gain may not be enough?
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Okay, so I've done the update and ran using the TRS inputs and an external battery source. Recording came out great! At another show I ran the 1/8" input used a little of the MTII's gain with the gain on the 9100 pre and I got a lot of "hiss" in the really quiet parts. So needless to say I won't use the 1/8" plug ever again even though it is stealthier to use.
Last night, recorded a <3 hour show using the TRS inputs, gain all the way down on MTII, used only gain on pre, external battery plugged in and everything turned out fine. At the end of the show I was shutting everything down. MTII finished writing file, returned to the main screen, I unplugged the external battery and pressed the on/off button to shut it down. I held it for a few seconds and then started shutting down the other rig. When I came back to the MTII it was stuck on the "M-AUDIO" screen with the "plug" picture. And it has been stuck there ever since.
Is there a hard reset I can do to get it to "unfreeze"?
Thanks!
EDIT: Oh and about using the 1/8" jack for the extra dB's, I was recording a half acoustic/half electric show. In the low parts is where you'll get the most hiss noticeable. Just an FYI. ;D
EDIT 2.0: Fixed! From M-Audio's knowledge base. Took more than 10 seconds but worked.
Screen frozen, device not responding, won't power off
Text size [-]
Q: My MicroTrack recorder has frozen, it's not responding to any button presses, and I can't power the device off. What should I do?
A: Press and hold both the Power and Del buttons for 10 seconds and then release them; the device should power off.
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Okay, so I've done the update and ran using the TRS inputs and an external battery source. Recording came out great! At another show I ran the 1/8" input used a little of the MTII's gain with the gain on the 9100 pre and I got a lot of "hiss" in the really quiet parts. So needless to say I won't use the 1/8" plug ever again even though it is stealthier to use.
EDIT: Oh and about using the 1/8" jack for the extra dB's, I was recording a half acoustic/half electric show. In the low parts is where you'll get the most hiss noticeable. Just an FYI. ;D
Sucks...guess I'll be better off running the 9100 thru 1/4" in all situations and boosting up levels in post in situations that the 20db's of the pre won't get the levels up high enough. Wish the 9100 offered more than 20db. I assume you tried going in thru the 1/8" because the gain wasn't enough using only the 9100?
Anyway that you could post a sample of the hissing?
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If you have a TTD account you can go here < http://www.thetradersden.org/forums/showthread.php?t=66353 > and download any of those acoustic songs. If not, maybe I can MP3 a song and email it to you?
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If you have a TTD account you can go here < http://www.thetradersden.org/forums/showthread.php?t=66353 > and download any of those acoustic songs. If not, maybe I can MP3 a song and email it to you?
Thanks man! Snagged it and will give it a listen.
Edit: Gave it a listen and you're right...that hiss is crazy loud.
What were your settings on the 9100 and the MT2?
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For what it's worth, I came across this cable at the Sound Pro's site.
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/category.cgi?item=SP-MICROTRACK-MINI-TRS-1
It has a designation option to be used with the MT2. Awhile back Chris at SP emailed me to say that they could wire a cable in theory that should prevent the sprinkler sound, thus allowing use of both an external pre's gain and that of the MT2 thru the 1/4" jack. At that time it hadn't been tested. I've emailed him again in hopes that it has now been proven to work. Here's hoping...
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Can't remember the settings on the MTII because it was a >:D job. I "think" I turned down the gain on the MTII about half way down what the default setting is and adjusted the gain on the 9100 up to a comfortable level. I know that doesn't say much but that was what I did.
That cable only mentions the MTI and not the MTII specifically. I never had the problem with the MTI. This is something new with the MTII. I have stayed with just using the TRS cable when recording with the MTII. Hands down the best option for me anyways.
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Can't remember the settings on the MTII because it was a >:D job. I "think" I turned down the gain on the MTII about half way down what the default setting is and adjusted the gain on the 9100 up to a comfortable level. I know that doesn't say much but that was what I did.
That cable only mentions the MTI and not the MTII specifically. I never had the problem with the MTI. This is something new with the MTII. I have stayed with just using the TRS cable when recording with the MTII. Hands down the best option for me anyways.
The cable has a drop-down tab in the options that differentiates b/w mt1 and mt2. I chatted with Chris via email and they use the tr wiring scheme that avoids the ground which avoids the sprinkler sound. I'm going to order one and give it a go. I'll let you know how it works out.
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I have this for sale in the YS -
Soundprofessionals MT interface. I could not find this on their website, I think they discontinued it. It is a battery box/interface for the MT. It has 1/8" input, headphone monitoring, is a battery box, and uses the TRS inputs on the MT instead of the 1/8" input. I would assume this would work great with the MTII but you should write to SP to confirm. Uses a small 12v battery like a AA, just shorter and sexier. I used it a few times 2 years ago and has sat since I sold my first MT and now needs to go since I am selling my second MT. Besides, I was going all digital with a UA5 in front of it. It works with DPA 406X series and with AT mics like the AT853s. No roll off on the adaptor.Make Offer
(http://home.comcast.net/~simms3/Interface.JPG)
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I have this for sale in the YS -
Soundprofessionals MT interface. I could not find this on their website, I think they discontinued it. It is a battery box/interface for the MT. It has 1/8" input, headphone monitoring, is a battery box, and uses the TRS inputs on the MT instead of the 1/8" input. I would assume this would work great with the MTII but you should write to SP to confirm. Uses a small 12v battery like a AA, just shorter and sexier. I used it a few times 2 years ago and has sat since I sold my first MT and now needs to go since I am selling my second MT. Besides, I was going all digital with a UA5 in front of it. It works with DPA 406X series and with AT mics like the AT853s. No roll off on the adaptor.Make Offer
Unfortunately that device won't work with the mt2 using the trs because the cabling has to be wired specifically for the mt2 (no grounds wired to shield). Looks pretty cool tho'...
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I have this for sale in the YS -
Soundprofessionals MT interface. I could not find this on their website, I think they discontinued it. It is a battery box/interface for the MT. It has 1/8" input, headphone monitoring, is a battery box, and uses the TRS inputs on the MT instead of the 1/8" input. I would assume this would work great with the MTII but you should write to SP to confirm. Uses a small 12v battery like a AA, just shorter and sexier. I used it a few times 2 years ago and has sat since I sold my first MT and now needs to go since I am selling my second MT. Besides, I was going all digital with a UA5 in front of it. It works with DPA 406X series and with AT mics like the AT853s. No roll off on the adaptor.Make Offer
(http://home.comcast.net/~simms3/Interface.JPG)
I have this and use it on my MT1 (2496). It is a must have if you want a low profile. A fantastic battery box for the unit. Too bad it is discontinued. As an MT2496 owner, it was the best accessory for the device. Too bad it does not work on the MT2. Of course the 2 decks have very different issues. On the MT2496, the 1/8 jacks were not too good and ran way too hot. This solution allowed you to use the TRS jacks and the 1/8 jack mics like the modded AT853's or Chris Church's mics (my favorite with the unit), and not to deal with Battery box cables or bulk. I have a Rat Shack 1/8 "L" connector attached so I have some swivel capability (also great for connecting the supplied "T" mic, and also allows some movement so nothing gets yanked out when the situation calls for wires running through clothing.
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I have this for sale in the YS -
Soundprofessionals MT interface. I could not find this on their website, I think they discontinued it. It is a battery box/interface for the MT. It has 1/8" input, headphone monitoring, is a battery box, and uses the TRS inputs on the MT instead of the 1/8" input. I would assume this would work great with the MTII but you should write to SP to confirm. Uses a small 12v battery like a AA, just shorter and sexier. I used it a few times 2 years ago and has sat since I sold my first MT and now needs to go since I am selling my second MT. Besides, I was going all digital with a UA5 in front of it. It works with DPA 406X series and with AT mics like the AT853s. No roll off on the adaptor.Make Offer
Unfortunately that device won't work with the mt2 using the trs because the cabling has to be wired specifically for the mt2 (no grounds wired to shield). Looks pretty cool tho'...
Crap, I am never going to sell this thing.
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Hey y'all. This is my first post. I am BRAND new to taping. In fact, I am not even a taper yet. I am learning and doing research quickly so I can get some equipment before a show at the end of January. I need some stealth gear and I'm very interested in the Microtrack II. As a beginner, I don't want to buy much just to get started. I was wondering if I can do it all with just this one device? How good will a concert sound if I record it using only the MT2 and its mic that comes with it? No extra mics, no extra power, just the MT2. Does anyone have a sample recording of the PURE MT2 live concert experience? Or any input?
I've found it new for $255 (http://www.samedaymusic.com/product--MDOMICROII). Does anyone know a better price? Or perhaps I should check for a used one at the yard sale.
I know this is probably a simple and basic question, but I appreciate any thoughts! Thanks!!
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So I picked up the 1/4 cable specially wired for the mt2 from sound pro's and it works beautifully. No sprinkler sound from the mt2 when adding gain from the mt2. However, did notice that the mt2 is significantly noisy when running too much gain. Think I'll be running my 9100 full-on and using as lil' of the mt2 gain as possible. Considering a naiant or sp pre that offers more gain down the road.
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I just reread all of this thread specifically for reference to the 1/8" input on the MT II. Looks like where this left off was everyone was going for 1/4" line input.
Here is my current set up:
AT853s > CA 9100 with 4.7k mod on, volume at max > IRiver h120, Rockbox, Gain Zero
With that set up I just turn it all on, hit record, and it comes out great. I have to increaes the volume afterward, but I have never clipped and the sound always has sounded good. My question is, can I sub in the MTII for the h120 with the same results? I would be using zero gain on the MTII through the 1/8" input jack. I want to use the MTII for 24bit if the battery will last, I need to test how long mine will record on the interal battery alone due to the recording situation ;). If it won't work out, that's fine, I still love my h120 I was merely hoping to take advantage of the 24bit on the MTII which I generally use as a bit bucket.
Thanks!
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I just reread all of this thread specifically for reference to the 1/8" input on the MT II. Looks like where this left off was everyone was going for 1/4" line input.
Here is my current set up:
AT853s > CA 9100 with 4.7k mod on, volume at max > IRiver h120, Rockbox, Gain Zero
With that set up I just turn it all on, hit record, and it comes out great. I have to increaes the volume afterward, but I have never clipped and the sound always has sounded good. My question is, can I sub in the MTII for the h120 with the same results? I would be using zero gain on the MTII through the 1/8" input jack. I want to use the MTII for 24bit if the battery will last, I need to test how long mine will record on the interal battery alone due to the recording situation ;). If it won't work out, that's fine, I still love my h120 I was merely hoping to take advantage of the 24bit on the MTII which I generally use as a bit bucket.
Thanks!
I've really wanted to run the same setup (modded 853>CA Pre>1/8 input MT2). Adding the 1/4 cabling has added a bit more bulk than I wanted. Only prob is that the 1/8 input is a mic input only. So running a line signal may be coming in too hot. Somewhere in an earlier post, Guysonic stated that the 1/8 input on the mt2 was the same as max line in on the h2, so maybe it wouldn't be a factor. I think some testing is needed. Maybe I will fiddle around at home.
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Coming out of the CA 9100 at full gain with the 4.7k mod I am adding around 10-12db from what I understand of the mod. The full gain is 20db. I have an important show Saturday that isn't worth throwing a good recording away on experimenting. Maybe I will do some experimenting on the home stereo to see what I come up with. Thanks for the feedback.
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Just recieved my MTII yesterday, so I ran a "Livingroom" test last night with my V3 digi out and works perfectly. Thanks to those who gave me "the low down" before I pulled the trigger.
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Glad you're happy Ted. Zero complaints with it as a bit bucket and haven't been let down with it in low-pro analog stuations either. Only wish the 1/8" input was switchable to line input like the mt1.
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I got a question. When I ran digital out of my UA-5 > Iriver H120 the levels were controled by the UA-5. Is that the case with the V-3 > Digital > MTII?
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When I ran digital out of my UA-5 > Iriver H120 the levels were controled by the UA-5. Is that the case with the V-3 > Digital > MTII?
Yup. AFAIK, with any recorder that accepts a digital input, the levels are controlled by the device containing the ADC (in this case the UA-5 / V3). There may be exceptions of which I'm unaware.
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When I ran digital out of my UA-5 > Iriver H120 the levels were controled by the UA-5. Is that the case with the V-3 > Digital > MTII?
Yup. AFAIK, with any recorder that accepts a digital input, the levels are controlled by the device containing the ADC (in this case the UA-5 / V3). There may be exceptions of which I'm unaware.
Thanks Brian. I figured as much and I would also have found out soon enough ;D
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I use the V3 digital in to the MTII combination. Yes, the V3 will control the levels.
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So far so good with the MTII. Ran my AKG 426 > V3 Digital > MTII with fantastic results!
http://www.archive.org/details/delf2009-04-16.c426b.flac
Going to give it a shot tonight with the Guns for the Dead in Woosta.
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So far so good with the MTII. Ran my AKG 426 > V3 Digital > MTII with fantastic results!
http://www.archive.org/details/delf2009-04-16.c426b.flac
Going to give it a shot tonight with the Guns for the Dead in Woosta.
Not my kind of music....but the sound is AMAZING! Very nice!
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after quite a bit of reading I think I'm going to have to pick one of these up soon. My trusty JB3, even though it's been put to light use over the past 2 years or so, is pretty much on it's last legs. Old man served me well, but I think it's time to make the 24 bit jump. For my casual taping needs this looks to be a perfectly suitable bit bucket to throw behind the ua-5.
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Hello forum!
Firstly and foremostedlyest – a big dramatic THANK YOU to everyone who was a part of this EPIC thread. What a resource.
I’ve decided, after a loooong time of research – days solid!, that I will be buying myself a Microtrack II.
I just wanted to try and list all the issues and notes I’ve taken in order to make sure I’ve covered everything[!] and maybe get some advice on a couple of things. (hopefully this will help anyone else looking into the MT II)
Here it goes...
1) I can use balanced mic or line to TRS inputs or unbalanced to 1/8” inputs without problem. To use unbalanced into TRS I need to have a loud preamp and turn MT gain right down, or use a pseudo-balanced cable. Does this cover everything?
2) What kind of problems have people had with battery drainage? I read in a couple of user reviews that people had experienced it draining whilst off. I read elsewhere that this was either caused or exacerbated by using the Hold switch, and also some reports of it clearing up once the battery got ‘worn in’. Any more experiences/definitive story on this? I’m thinking it might be wise to run it off a battery pack whenever it’s remotely practical, so that the external battery wears out rather than the internal battery, the external being much easier to replace than the internal. I’m aware of this method of replacing the internal battery with an iPhone or iPod battery:
http://www.greendog.co.uk/microtrack/howto.php
But this is an MT 1, will this work the exact same with MT II?
3) I should reformat my CF cards at every opportunity to avoid problems. I think that was from Guytronic on these forums…
4) I’ve read here that people are using 16Gb CF cards with no trouble, but I understand that M-Audio still only officially support 8Gb. Anyone tried 32Gb? Anyone tried ‘Kingston 133X ELITE PRO’ cards? They seem to be the cheapest 16Gb cards I can get.
5) Anyone found or made a windshield that works well with the plugin mic?
6) Can you still only change recording level while recording, or has this been changed?
7) I can get this for a fair bit less than I was expecting, so I’m considering buying a new mic. Another stereo omni condenser mic would be good, not necessarily the same T-mic design, but something smallish would be good, which I can either have plugged straight into the unit or on an extension and clipped somewhere inconspicuous. Basically how little can I spend on this to get a noticeable improvement? Something I can get from a UK vendor would be best. There’s 3 options at Sound Professionals for $50, $60 & $70 respectively. Any experience with these? Or I found this Olympus ME-51S mic: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Olympus-145037-ME-51S-Stereo-Microphone/dp/B000BTAH62/ref=dp_cp_ob_ce_title_1
8) [8 )] Battery pack?? Are there any limitations on what specs I’m looking for? The ‘BATTERY SIZING 101’ over at www.sonicstudios.com seems to suggest to me that more voltage/current/wattage = more power supply, is it as simple as this? Anyone got any advice between something that’ll take AA/C/D batteries or some sort of battery unit that’s basically another Microtrack battery in external form, like this: http://www.macally.com/EN/Product/ArticleShow.asp?ArticleID=32
Or this: http://www.amazon.com/Lenmar-Universal-Powerport-Power-Adapter/dp/B0015ZZZLS/
This one is tricky for me, as I’m taking the thing to Nepal in the summer and I don’t think I’ll always be in a city with even semi-reliable mains power. So looking for a reasonably heavy duty solution here.
You know what, by joe, I think that’s it! Hopefully I’ve just created a helpful summary for any prospective Microtrack buyers, or present owners for that matter, and hopefully someone has definitive answers to some of these questions!
Again, many many thanks for this thread.
Keep pebblin’
Simon
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Hello forum!
Firstly and foremostedlyest – a big dramatic THANK YOU to everyone who was a part of this EPIC thread. What a resource.
I’ve decided, after a loooong time of research – days solid!, that I will be buying myself a Microtrack II.
I just wanted to try and list all the issues and notes I’ve taken in order to make sure I’ve covered everything[!] and maybe get some advice on a couple of things. (hopefully this will help anyone else looking into the MT II)
Here it goes...
1) I can use balanced mic or line to TRS inputs or unbalanced to 1/8” inputs without problem. To use unbalanced into TRS I need to have a loud preamp and turn MT gain right down, or use a pseudo-balanced cable. Does this cover everything?
2) What kind of problems have people had with battery drainage? I read in a couple of user reviews that people had experienced it draining whilst off. I read elsewhere that this was either caused or exacerbated by using the Hold switch, and also some reports of it clearing up once the battery got ‘worn in’. Any more experiences/definitive story on this? I’m thinking it might be wise to run it off a battery pack whenever it’s remotely practical, so that the external battery wears out rather than the internal battery, the external being much easier to replace than the internal. I’m aware of this method of replacing the internal battery with an iPhone or iPod battery:
http://www.greendog.co.uk/microtrack/howto.php
But this is an MT 1, will this work the exact same with MT II?
3) I should reformat my CF cards at every opportunity to avoid problems. I think that was from Guytronic on these forums…
4) I’ve read here that people are using 16Gb CF cards with no trouble, but I understand that M-Audio still only officially support 8Gb. Anyone tried 32Gb? Anyone tried ‘Kingston 133X ELITE PRO’ cards? They seem to be the cheapest 16Gb cards I can get.
5) Anyone found or made a windshield that works well with the plugin mic?
6) Can you still only change recording level while recording, or has this been changed?
7) I can get this for a fair bit less than I was expecting, so I’m considering buying a new mic. Another stereo omni condenser mic would be good, not necessarily the same T-mic design, but something smallish would be good, which I can either have plugged straight into the unit or on an extension and clipped somewhere inconspicuous. Basically how little can I spend on this to get a noticeable improvement? Something I can get from a UK vendor would be best. There’s about 3 options at Sound Professionals for $50, $60 & $70 respectively. Any experience with these?
8) [8 )] Battery pack?? Are there any limitations on what specs I’m looking for? The ‘BATTERY SIZING 101’ over at www.sonicstudios.com seems to suggest to me that more voltage/current/wattage = more power supply, is it as simple as this? Anyone got any advice between something that’ll take AA/C/D batteries or some sort of battery unit that’s basically another Microtrack battery in external form, like this: http://www.macally.com/EN/Product/ArticleShow.asp?ArticleID=32
Or this: http://www.amazon.com/Lenmar-Universal-Powerport-Power-Adapter/dp/B0015ZZZLS/
This one is tricky for me, as I’m taking the thing to Nepal in the summer and I don’t think I’ll always be in a city with even semi-reliable mains power. So looking for a reasonably heavy duty solution here.
You know what, by joe, I think that’s it! Hopefully I’ve just created a helpful summary for any prospective Microtrack buyers, or present owners for that matter, and hopefully someone has definitive answers to some of these questions!
Again, many many thanks for this thread.
Keep pebblin’
Simon
1. You can use 1/4 inputs running gain from external and internal pres with a specially made cable. Soundpro's offers one on their site...others here could make you one. From my analog recording experience with the mt2, it's better avoiding using the internal preamp gain as much as possible as it can be noisy if using a lot.
2. I always run an external. So far, no probs with powering.
3. I keep a 16gb card in my mt2. Have never reformatted it, and no probs yet. I'll be interested to know if reformatting is useful.
5. Never used the t-mic, but it has a builtin windscreen.
6. Recordijng levels cn be changed before or during recording.
7. I use sp mics...like them, but everybody has their own preference. You'll need a battery box with most electret mics if you wanna record loud shows.
8. Any mini usb power pack should work. Duracell makes a sled device utilizing 2 aa's.
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Wholesome - thanks for the info.
I think I'll definately need a proper fluffy windscreen at some point, not just foam, so I emailed this guy who's all over ebay selling windscreens specialised for each of the portable recorders. He says they should easily be able to make one for me, though I'm not sure whether he realises it's got the little T-mic and not something built in... Here he is btw http://myworld.ebay.co.uk/hearley/
Depends if I get a new mic for it of course! Need to find some opinions on the quality of the supplied mic...
You say I'd need a battery box to record loud shows - why is this? Seems counter-intuitive to me, in my ignorance, I'd have thought you were more likely to need extra power for quieter stuff? I assume the problem is not enough juice coming from the plugin power? How can I work out/find out if a mic will run ok without a battery box?
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Wholesome - thanks for the info.
I think I'll definately need a proper fluffy windscreen at some point, not just foam, so I emailed this guy who's all over ebay selling windscreens specialised for each of the portable recorders. He says they should easily be able to make one for me, though I'm not sure whether he realises it's got the little T-mic and not something built in... Here he is btw http://myworld.ebay.co.uk/hearley/
Depends if I get a new mic for it of course! Need to find some opinions on the quality of the supplied mic...
You say I'd need a battery box to record loud shows - why is this? Seems counter-intuitive to me, in my ignorance, I'd have thought you were more likely to need extra power for quieter stuff? I assume the problem is not enough juice coming from the plugin power? How can I work out/find out if a mic will run ok without a battery box?
The t-mic with the unit has omni mics...much less susceptible to wind noise...may not be needed with the existing windscreens. I can't say that I've heard anything great about the mic. I imagine it doesn't give very good results.
The louder the music, the higher the sound pressure level and need for more power than plugin power offers. Any standard electret mic is gonna need a batt box or preamp supplying 9v to prevent distortion. I believe that having a 2.7k mod done, you can run fine off plugin.
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MT2 arrived today and is currently charging! Unfortunately, my amazon order with my kingston cf card didn't show up as scheduled, so I'm going to have to wait until tomorrow to do any testing with it. First field test will be Friday for Will Hoge.
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first impressions..awfully light. I can see how some would be put off by it feeling "cheap". menu is responsive enough..I remember reading (maybe about the MT1) that the menu was pretty sluggish but this seems just fine. Updated the firmware to 1.0.7 with ease. Battery life is looking pretty rough. I charged this for about 7 1/2 hours out of the box. Limited with a 512mb cf until tomorrow, but I've recorded about 50 minutes of 16/44 wav with the included mic and updated the firmware...and I'm at half full on the battery meter. Yikes. I was planning on getting external power anyway, but I'm now definitely going to make it a point to get this in time for my first show with it on Friday.
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I have found that the power meter goes down fast and then slows down after 1/2 of the meter is gone.
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hopefully a few cycles will get it in shape. It's down to about 1/4 now with roughly 100 minutes recorded. I suppose any usb powerpack will work? I'm going to have to pick up something locally to have it for friday.
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The t-mic with the unit has omni mics...much less susceptible to wind noise...may not be needed with the existing windscreens.
This is good to know, makes sense!
I can't say that I've heard anything great about the mic. I imagine it doesn't give very good results.
One would assume so, though I definately recall at least one instance of a Microtrack owner on some forum somewhere being surprised at how acceptable it was... The only answer to this clearly is to try it out myself! Did I mention, I ordered mine the other day? So I too shall post my findings once I actually possess one.
The louder the music, the higher the sound pressure level and need for more power than plugin power offers. Any standard electret mic is gonna need a batt box or preamp supplying 9v to prevent distortion. I believe that having a 2.7k mod done, you can run fine off plugin.
Interesting stuff. 2.7k mod, is this a resistor or capacitor? On the PCB or somewhere easier to work on? I'm intrigued.
hopefully a few cycles will get it in shape. It's down to about 1/4 now with roughly 100 minutes recorded. I suppose any usb powerpack will work? I'm going to have to pick up something locally to have it for friday.
Aye, aye, I've heard repeatedly that rechargeable batteries take time to maximise their potential, to wear in, sort of... In fact, let me find that article I was reading...
Here we go! this page: http://www.sonicstudios.com/batsys98.htm is a ridiculously deep discussion of that ever-enthralling topic of: Batteries! It's quite marvellous. I think this is the page of a taperssection user isn't it? Guysonic? If I'm right, well done that man. Very important passage towards the end concerning lithium ion batteries (the kind in the Microtrack, and in many external batteries, like this one I've bought http://www.superetrader.co.uk/u2o-iup-5400-universal-external-battery-black-pda-mp3-p-3684.html):
"Suggestion: For longest service life, store all lithium battery packs and decks with internal lithium batteries with battery at <50% remaining capacity. Recent article states that capacity loss in storage is greatly reduced with NOT storing these at full or near full charge.
Yearly loss of storage capacity with always fully charge cells is as much as 30-40% per year of storage. Batteries stored at <40% charge loose much less capacity (<4-8% per year) while stored.
So best case for Lithium Ion battery is being used down to 30-40% remaining capacity, and stored in this condition until needed, and then fully recharged just before using. Used in this manner, cell life to 80% capacity may extend to as much as 5 years."
Can't say I'm looking forward to constantly worrying about the state both my batteries are in while being stored, and trying to recharge them just BEFORE use. Could be rather frustrating, couldn't it?
oh well ::)
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fwiw, I ended up getting about 3 hr 20 min on my first test with it. Definitely going to be running external usb power for any but the shortest outings. Otherwise, I like what I see. I'm going to do more testing tonight with the full rig and running 24/48 digitally from the ua-5.
edit: picked this up at rat shack. $40 for 2100mah is a bit more than I wanted to spend compared to online prices, but I wanted the piece of mind of having it tomorrow at the show. I don't do festies so this one should more than suit my needs. should come in handy for charging my iphone if i'm out and about away from power too.
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2767656
love the form factor. nearly identical to the MT2 LxW and about 1/4" thick.
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I have just a AA battery enclosure right now, I think I should step up to something like this for the MTII. What kind of tips did yours come with? You could use this to charge your iriver h320 too if you have it Rockboxed, not that you really need to charge the iriver's given their battery life capacity for a single show, but you could.
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first recording went by fine last night, no gremlins. One question I have though..when the usb battery pack is connected..should it show as charging for the entire show? I assumed it would act just like it's plugged into the wall, with the check mark and plug icon over the battery. MT was fully charged before going out.
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What kind of tips did yours come with?
If you're curious about the U20 I-up thing I got, it came with: mains supply for charging the thing itself, USB->thing i don't recognise,but i guess is ipod, USB->female connection which in turn connects all the rest of the tips: all sizes of round tips, including one that looks like it would fit nokia phones, a small flat thing that looks like a wider USB mini, and even a sony ericsson phone connection.
should it show as charging for the entire show? I assumed it would act just like it's plugged into the wall, with the check mark and plug icon over the battery. MT was fully charged before going out.
Weird weird weird, I'm still waiting for my CF card to arrive but I'll have to check this when I get mine set up...
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first recording went by fine last night, no gremlins. One question I have though..when the usb battery pack is connected..should it show as charging for the entire show? I assumed it would act just like it's plugged into the wall, with the check mark and plug icon over the battery. MT was fully charged before going out.
I don't think the MT ever goes to the check box because you are using it at the same time you are charging it, at least that has been my experience. I do recall, I think it was in one of the original MT 24/96 threads, that it is best to have the MT charged fully before going out so that the drain on the external battery is reduced. The MT may get to very close to a full charge, but not quite all the way to switch over to the check box. Congrats on the first run!
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Just had one chance to play with it so far, very briefly. Only one thing comes to mind (using stock mic into 1/8" input):
LOOUUUD NOOOIIISSSES
loud hissing noise that is. hmm. near impossible to know how much is mic and how much preamp, til I can try a different mic... Anyone notice a significant amount of noise from the stock mic itself compared to other mics?
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If I run mine long enough on external battery, it will go to a full charge. Usually during the second set.
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Just had one chance to play with it so far, very briefly. Only one thing comes to mind (using stock mic into 1/8" input):
LOOUUUD NOOOIIISSSES
loud hissing noise that is. hmm. near impossible to know how much is mic and how much preamp, til I can try a different mic... Anyone notice a significant amount of noise from the stock mic itself compared to other mics?
Have never used the t-mic and am assuming that it pro'ly does offer up a lot of self noise. Generally speaking though, the units internal pre is noisy. Best running an external pre and running 1/4" line in.
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Wholesome - thanks for the info.
I think I'll definately need a proper fluffy windscreen at some point, not just foam, so I emailed this guy who's all over ebay selling windscreens specialised for each of the portable recorders. He says they should easily be able to make one for me, though I'm not sure whether he realises it's got the little T-mic and not something built in... Here he is btw http://myworld.ebay.co.uk/hearley/
Depends if I get a new mic for it of course! Need to find some opinions on the quality of the supplied mic...
You say I'd need a battery box to record loud shows - why is this? Seems counter-intuitive to me, in my ignorance, I'd have thought you were more likely to need extra power for quieter stuff? I assume the problem is not enough juice coming from the plugin power? How can I work out/find out if a mic will run ok without a battery box?
The t-mic with the unit has omni mics...much less susceptible to wind noise...may not be needed with the existing windscreens. I can't say that I've heard anything great about the mic. I imagine it doesn't give very good results.
The louder the music, the higher the sound pressure level and need for more power than plugin power offers. Any standard electret mic is gonna need a batt box or preamp supplying 9v to prevent distortion. I believe that having a 2.7k mod done, you can run fine off plugin.
I was surprised by the stock T-mic...obviously it's nowhere close to the quality of most any other similar mics (Church, AT, etc.) but it'll work in a pinch. To my ears it sounds much better than the internals on the R09 series. When I received my MT2 I had a bit of a wait before getting decent mics and stack taped a relatively loud show...turned out very listenable. Much better than I expected.
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Wholesome - thanks for the info.
I think I'll definately need a proper fluffy windscreen at some point, not just foam, so I emailed this guy who's all over ebay selling windscreens specialised for each of the portable recorders. He says they should easily be able to make one for me, though I'm not sure whether he realises it's got the little T-mic and not something built in... Here he is btw http://myworld.ebay.co.uk/hearley/
Depends if I get a new mic for it of course! Need to find some opinions on the quality of the supplied mic...
You say I'd need a battery box to record loud shows - why is this? Seems counter-intuitive to me, in my ignorance, I'd have thought you were more likely to need extra power for quieter stuff? I assume the problem is not enough juice coming from the plugin power? How can I work out/find out if a mic will run ok without a battery box?
The t-mic with the unit has omni mics...much less susceptible to wind noise...may not be needed with the existing windscreens. I can't say that I've heard anything great about the mic. I imagine it doesn't give very good results.
The louder the music, the higher the sound pressure level and need for more power than plugin power offers. Any standard electret mic is gonna need a batt box or preamp supplying 9v to prevent distortion. I believe that having a 2.7k mod done, you can run fine off plugin.
I was surprised by the stock T-mic...obviously it's nowhere close to the quality of most any other similar mics (Church, AT, etc.) but it'll work in a pinch. To my ears it sounds much better than the internals on the R09 series. When I received my MT2 I had a bit of a wait before getting decent mics and stack taped a relatively loud show...turned out very listenable. Much better than I expected.
Good to know. Guess I'll keep mine in the gear bag in case of emergency.
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my T mic makes some crazy noise. hums real bad in the left channel. wouldn't ever use it again.
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After smoking a power cable for the minime and schoeps pre, I put the T mic on a stand and used a -10 attn cable to the MTII
I was amazed how good this sounded, but then again, I was recording a 3 piece in a bar from 7' away......so a tin can and string would sound just as good I suppose
The soundprofessionals appear to make a very similar style mic
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I have a possible issue with the MT2 that I just bought a couple of months back here on TS. I searched the old thread and this one and don't see anything mentioned about the MT2 having this problem. I run akg460 mods/ck63 caps >Wmod UA5>MT2 (SPDIF in) running 16 bit only. My first recording was fine as far as I know, but the 5 recordings since have had the same issue. I hear clearly on the wav file about 4 or 5 times in the first hour of the show about 2-4 consecutive pops/static and even a slight dropout on one occasion. I zoom into the spot and it's not a spike but a big long drop for about 2 or 3 seconds long, after the first hour the rest of the show is fine. It can start at 4 min into the file or a little later but it's always on one channel. The first 3 shows were on the right channel only but then the next taping appeared on the left channel only, so my guess is it's one of the mic caps and after talking to an AKG specialist, I sent the caps off to him for analysis. I haven't tried recording on the ck61 card caps but will soon. Oade Bros was trying to tell me the MT2 is famous for interference when using SPDIF input, but the likely culprit is the caps which are old since I'm the third owner of these mics.
Anyone experience anything like this on their wav files when using the SPDIF input? I thought it might be cell phone interference but I used another pair of cables and same thing occurred and the fact that it has occurred on only one channel each time, it has to be one of those caps unless someone tells me they had a similar issue with their MT2.
Thanks in advance for any help or insight.
Tom
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sounds like dropped samples. is your card fast enough?
I have a possible issue with the MT2 that I just bought a couple of months back here on TS. I searched the old thread and this one and don't see anything mentioned about the MT2 having this problem. I run akg460 mods/ck63 caps >Wmod UA5>MT2 (SPDIF in) running 16 bit only. My first recording was fine as far as I know, but the 5 recordings since have had the same issue. I hear clearly on the wav file about 4 or 5 times in the first hour of the show about 2-4 consecutive pops/static and even a slight dropout on one occasion. I zoom into the spot and it's not a spike but a big long drop for about 2 or 3 seconds long, after the first hour the rest of the show is fine. It can start at 4 min into the file or a little later but it's always on one channel. The first 3 shows were on the right channel only but then the next taping appeared on the left channel only, so my guess is it's one of the mic caps and after talking to an AKG specialist, I sent the caps off to him for analysis. I haven't tried recording on the ck61 card caps but will soon. Oade Bros was trying to tell me the MT2 is famous for interference when using SPDIF input, but the likely culprit is the caps which are old since I'm the third owner of these mics.
Anyone experience anything like this on their wav files when using the SPDIF input? I thought it might be cell phone interference but I used another pair of cables and same thing occurred and the fact that it has occurred on only one channel each time, it has to be one of those caps unless someone tells me they had a similar issue with their MT2.
Thanks in advance for any help or insight.
Tom
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I have a 4gb 45kb card and a 15mb speed 4gb card, but the problem happens on both wav files and I used both of these 4gb cards on consecutive nights. The problem only occurs like 4 times in the first hour of the 3 hour show and not after that which is strange. I'm waiting to hear from AKG on the mic caps, but in the meantime I will try taping with the cardioid caps and see what happens, then I'll know for sure.
thanks
sounds like dropped samples. is your card fast enough?
I have a possible issue with the MT2 that I just bought a couple of months back here on TS. I searched the old thread and this one and don't see anything mentioned about the MT2 having this problem. I run akg460 mods/ck63 caps >Wmod UA5>MT2 (SPDIF in) running 16 bit only. My first recording was fine as far as I know, but the 5 recordings since have had the same issue. I hear clearly on the wav file about 4 or 5 times in the first hour of the show about 2-4 consecutive pops/static and even a slight dropout on one occasion. I zoom into the spot and it's not a spike but a big long drop for about 2 or 3 seconds long, after the first hour the rest of the show is fine. It can start at 4 min into the file or a little later but it's always on one channel. The first 3 shows were on the right channel only but then the next taping appeared on the left channel only, so my guess is it's one of the mic caps and after talking to an AKG specialist, I sent the caps off to him for analysis. I haven't tried recording on the ck61 card caps but will soon. Oade Bros was trying to tell me the MT2 is famous for interference when using SPDIF input, but the likely culprit is the caps which are old since I'm the third owner of these mics.
Anyone experience anything like this on their wav files when using the SPDIF input? I thought it might be cell phone interference but I used another pair of cables and same thing occurred and the fact that it has occurred on only one channel each time, it has to be one of those caps unless someone tells me they had a similar issue with their MT2.
Thanks in advance for any help or insight.
Tom
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I think it is a problem with the UA-5. He tried using a different recorder and he was getting the same errors. Give them the whole story.
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It's definitely not the MT2 or UA5. I sent the hyper caps off to the akg specialist and he said it's one cap and it responded the way I described it on my wav file. I had 2 different type caps so the original owner had already replaced one and the newer cap was the culprit. He had to fix both so they were balanced within 2 db of each and they're good to go now. It's good to know it's not the MT2 because I love this recorder.
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Well, I'm always behind the times. I just purchased an MTII. I haven't recieved it yet. I have a few questions...
As far as wiring. I have attached a drawing of what GuySonic suggested as the low noise way to go from an unbalanced pre-amp output to the balanced 1/4" inputs on the MTII.
Is this correct?
Is this the prefered way to run line level analog into the MTII, or is using the 1/8" jack the prefered input?
For external power, I need a mini-USB cable connected to a 5v battery pack?
Thanks in advance, Chuck
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Well, I'm always behind the times. I just purchased an MTII. I haven't recieved it yet. I have a few questions...
As far as wiring. I have attached a drawing of what GuySonic suggested as the low noise way to go from an unbalanced pre-amp output to the balanced 1/4" inputs on the MTII.
Is this correct?
Is this the prefered way to run line level analog into the MTII, or is using the 1/8" jack the prefered input?
For external power, I need a mini-USB cable connected to a 5v battery pack?
Thanks in advance, Chuck
Chuck,
I used one of these and it worked great, real small and compact. (1000 mAh) . http://www.google.com/products?q=duracell+usb+battery&rls=com.microsoft:en-us:IE-SearchBox&oe=UTF-8&sourceid=ie7&rlz=1I7HPIB_en&um=1&ie=UTF-8&ei=RBtOSoKQLsG0twfsyrSqBA&sa=X&oi=product_result_group&ct=title&resnum=4
I also have some cheapo digital concepts 5v usb charger that take 4 AA batteries. Got it a Walmart in the photo section. Basicly any 5v usb battery booster will work fine.
Ted
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Chuck,
As for external power, I use Energizer's "Energy 2 Go" - $20 from most any retailer. Starting with a fully charged MT2 + charger with fresh batteries (2 AA's - Energizer Ultimate Lithium), I've recorded about 3 hours and still had a full charge when finished. There are a couple of flashing blue led's that light up when in use but a piece of gaff tape covers them nicely. It's small, cheap, durable and effective.
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Thanks guys. Is the input cable wiring diagram correct for going line-in into the 1/4" jacks?
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Thanks guys. Is the input cable wiring diagram correct for going line-in into the 1/4" jacks?
Anyone know about the analog in cables?
Are there any 16GB CF cards I should stay away from? I'm going to buy one this week.
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Not sure about CF cards to not use. My understanding is that Sandisk Ultra II cards are safe but I'm only running an 8gig. You might check the M-Audio user forums for further info, here:
http://forums.m-audio.com/forumdisplay.php?f=7
I've also heard good things about Kingston and Transcend CF cards.
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FWIW, GuySonic got back to me and said the wiring drawing I posted a few posts ago is the way to wire the TRS plugs for use from an unbalanced source into the MTII.
http://taperssection.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=106690.0;attach=94665
Thanks GuySonic!
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So I've got my MTII with me here in Nepal, minus UA5 cos my walmart battery pooped itself just before left, and I still haven't hardly used my MTII cos I've had nothing but problems!! maybe someone recognises symptoms?
First problem seems to be faulty internal battery. Every time I come back to it, it won't turn on, I plug it in to charge and after an hour or so it might turn on, after some silly messing about plugging and unplugging power and pressing buttons in random orders... Shouldn't it be able to power up immediately with an external power source, even if the internal battery's dead?
So then I charge it fully (which takes hooouuuurs) and try to get my files on to my laptop, and that won't work. I go to Connect To PC, and when I press the Nav switch to connect as it asks, it reboots! Every time. Then I put it away (fully charged of course), come back to it later and it won't turn on, again, and again.
Just a thoroughly faulty unit? Or something I'm doing wrong? I bloomin hope it's my fault because I want to record some traditional Nepali musicians but don't want to waste their time with faulty equipment!
*sad*
Cheers peoples!
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So I've got my MTII with me here in Nepal, minus UA5 cos my walmart battery pooped itself just before left, and I still haven't hardly used my MTII cos I've had nothing but problems!! maybe someone recognises symptoms?
First problem seems to be faulty internal battery. Every time I come back to it, it won't turn on, I plug it in to charge and after an hour or so it might turn on, after some silly messing about plugging and unplugging power and pressing buttons in random orders... Shouldn't it be able to power up immediately with an external power source, even if the internal battery's dead?
So then I charge it fully (which takes hooouuuurs) and try to get my files on to my laptop, and that won't work. I go to Connect To PC, and when I press the Nav switch to connect as it asks, it reboots! Every time. Then I put it away (fully charged of course), come back to it later and it won't turn on, again, and again.
Sorry if I dont'know the equipment at all, just interested in getting one. But here go some questions considering basical electronic matters.
1) Could you take the battery out of the MT2? If you do did, then plugging an external source, be it battery or AC, should work immediately. If not then something is wrong with the MT2.
2) Is there a chance something could have gone wrong with the supply when powering abroad, that could have sent higher voltages to MT2?
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It sounds like you have a bad unit to me. Are you in an extreme climate; cold, snow, dust/sand, humidity etc.? I personally haven't had any problems with mine - not since updating to the latest firmware...1.0.7.
As to charging taking an excessively long time, I read somewhere (M-Audio forums maybe?) that there was an issue with the charge indicator (little battery icon in the upper right corner of the screen) not accurately representing the battery level while charging. For instance, plug in MT2 to charge > unit indicates full charge > unplug then immediately re-plug and it will show as charging for the time necessary for a full charge cycle.
Replacing the battery in a MT2 is supposedly a pretty daunting task. The link below has some great info on battery replacement for the original MT. I'd think the process would be about the same for the MT2...it does not look fun.
http://www.greendog.co.uk/microtrack/index.htm
If it's still under warranty I would contact M-Audio and shoot for a replacement unit.
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Hey,
New here and to taping as well.
Today I have ordered my start kit for taping and I need to ask you people here if I did buy the right things.
The things I have ordered is: a Microtrack II, a 8GB card, a SP-SPSB-11 battery box w. bass roll off and a cable to use the batterybox Line-in.
I already got a Sony ECM-719 mic laying around unused for two years.
My main goal is to tape is Death- & heavy metal, but maybe something other as well.
Is this going to work well for my primary goal, or have I missed something?
Cheers
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Hey,
New here and to taping as well.
Today I have ordered my start kit for taping and I need to ask you people here if I did buy the right things.
The things I have ordered is: a Microtrack II, a 8GB card, a SP-SPSB-11 battery box w. bass roll off and a cable to use the batterybox Line-in.
I already got a Sony ECM-719 mic laying around unused for two years.
My main goal is to tape is Death- & heavy metal, but maybe something other as well.
Is this going to work well for my primary goal, or have I missed something?
Cheers
Will it work? Sure. Will it work well? That's debateable. The weak link is definitely the mic. You may want to investigate other options in that area at some point, but as a starting point you're probably going to be OK. Record a show or two and see what the results yield.
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I'd definitely get new mics. If you're looking to go cheap, the links below are about as cheap as you can get a decent set for. There are plenty of other options as well - they just cost more. I'd think any of these would be better suited for your purposes than the Sony.
cards:
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/SP-CMC-20
omnis:
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/SP-BMC-1
or
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/SP-BMC-2
or
http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/SP-BMC-9
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The mic problem isn't something I can do anything about right now. All this was expensive enough for this month.
But I have been thinking about buying Church Audio CA-11, if you guys don't know anything better in the same price-range(~$100-200)?
But anyway, you don't see any problem with my set-up? I don't want to toast anything the first thing I do when I get the stuff home.
I'm a total novice when it comes to these kind of things.
Is there anything more I should have for a better result, except experience? :P
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Nothing will fry. The CA-11's are nice...I had a set and was completely pleased with them. Be sure the phantom power switch on the Microtrack is turned OFF. I don't know if that would fry anything or not but I imagine it would at the least drain your battery faster.
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Okay. Thanks a lot for the help nathan_g!
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You bet :)
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Does anyone happen to know the mAh capacity of the Microtrack II battery?
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Microtrack II for $129.99 at Comp-U-Plus:
http://www.compuplus.com/insidepage.php3?sid=p3b6f8f004n594h&id=1011225&utm_medium=refer
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I got mine the first week of July for $180... I thought THAT was a good deal...
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I bought mine for $230 a few months ago and then a week later the same seller had them for $189 :'( Now I wish I held out longer.
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MTII Question for you guys...
Used it for the first time on Friday night...U89i > V3 (analog) > MTII. Rather than even messing with the 1/4 inch inputs on first use, I went for the 1/8 input. My levels were pretty good on the MTII, but the problem is that I had to set the trim on the V3 all the way to the lowest setting in order to get reasonable peaks. I was recording Toubab Krewe outside, and they really aren't a very high volume band, so I'm concerned that I'm not gonna have enough headroom on the MTII for louder bands/venues. Anyone else have this experience?
A couple of comments/thoughts to go with the above question...
I like running the V3 as an analog device...so while I suspect that a logical solution would be to run the V3 digital out into the SPDIF connector on the MTII, I didn't really want to do that if possible because I like the V3 sound better in analog mode.
Unless there's a logical solution to the above experience that I'm not considering, I may just keep the MT2496 and pass the MTII on to my son-in-law. (I had been figuring on keeping the new MTII and giving him the older MT2496.)
TIA for any help anyone can provide.
Steve
I was recording Toubab Krewe fairly close in, but the sound levels were really very low. I'm
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MTII Question for you guys...
Used it for the first time on Friday night...U89i > V3 (analog) > MTII. Rather than even messing with the 1/4 inch inputs out of the box, I went for the 1/8 input. My levels were pretty good on the MTII, but the problem is that I had to set the trim on the V3 all the way to the lowest setting. I was recording Toubab Krewe outside, and they really aren't a very high volume band, so I'm concerned that I might not have enough headroom on the MTII for louder bands/venues. Anyone else have this experience?
This will probably help reconcile the difference in gain on the V3 vs what you saw on the MT2:
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,113926.msg1524480.html#msg1524480
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^^ Thanks Page, but that's not really getting at the root of the issue.
A better explanation would help...so the V3 is on the lowest trim setting and I'm getting one green light on each channel of the V3. Rarely was I even bouncing up to two lights during the Toubab show. At that V3 setting, the MTII levels are bouncing up pretty close to peak. Actually at the Toubab show, the levels on the MTII were perfect, but as I said it was a low volume show.
So what that means is that any show where the V3 levels go above one or two green lights, I'll be clipping the MTII...and since my V3 was at the lowest setting, I can't back off anymore on the V3 level. :-\
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^^ Thanks Page, but that's not really getting at the root of the issue.
A better explanation would help...so the V3 is on the lowest trim setting and I'm getting one green light on each channel of the V3. Rarely was I even bouncing up to two lights during the Toubab show. At that V3 setting, the MTII levels are bouncing up pretty close to peak. Actually at the Toubab show, the levels on the MTII were perfect, but as I said it was a low volume show.
So what that means is that any show where the V3 levels go above one or two green lights, I'll be clipping the MTII...and since my V3 was at the lowest setting, I can't back off anymore on the V3 level. :-\
Well, the issue is that the lights on the V3 are calibrated to what they would end up with after the AD stage which takes a blazing hot signal. So to get a -2db signal out of the AD stage (and thus show up as such on the V3's meters), it takes around a +20db equivilent signal going to the AD stage. So if your not seeing bright lights on the V3, that doesn't mean your not pumping out juice, just the lights are calibrated to the analog out signal. Compound this with I suspect the max line in the MT2 will take being around +4 (I'm guessing based on my own gear), you've gotta run the V3 with almost no gain.
In short; the lights on the V3 are useless if your running analog out to a recorder which doesn't handle a hot pro signal (+20db range) like the SD boxes. You can use the diagram that Jason posted as a guideline to how that maps based on the cabling you have out of the V3.
edit: and an even abbreviated explanation is that the V3 analog outs aren't designed to be used with non-hot receiving boxes.
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Page provided a quick explanation. I was just about to post my slightly more detailed explanation, so I'll go ahead anyway.
Tonedeaf -- I'm surprised you prefer the MT ADC to the V3. I far prefer the V3 ADC, personally. No matter...just goes to show we all have different ears and there's no single solution that satisfies all ears. :)
If I'm understanding you correctly, you're trying to run the V3 purely as a preamp. So you have mics > V3 > V3 analog out > MT or MTII 1/8" (unbalanced) analog-in. At the TK show, you had both the variable trim and the stepped gain as low as they can go, i.e. 0 and 10, respectively. And your levels were still quite high, even for a quiet show, so you're concerned louder shows will result in levels from the V3 that are too high for the MTII to handle. Do I understand correctly?
If I understand correctly, it seems your concerns are warranted. The MTII's unbalanced 1/8" input takes a maximum input of -3.6 dBV, or approx. -1.4 dBu (per M-Audio specs (http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/MicroTrackII.html) and dBV > dBu calculator (http://www.sengpielaudio.com/calculator-db-volt.htm). So, if the MTII's 1/8" input receives a signal stronger than -1.4 dBu, it will overload.
Jason's chart to which Page linked shows that the V3's analog, unbalanced output is -8 dBu when the lowest level meter (-27 dBFS) lights up. The V3's analog, unbalanced output is -2 dBu when the second lowest level meter (-21 dBFS) lights up. So if the V3's second lowest level meter lights up (as they did occasionally for you), you're basically maxing out the MTII's 1/8" input: the V3 is outputting -2 dBu and your MTII only accepts -1.4 dBu. So...no more headroom, and hence your problem.
You might try the balanced 1/4" inputs, but I think you'll run into the same problem. The MTII's balanced 1/4" inputs take a max signal of +4.3 dBu. As you can see from Jason's chart, the V3's balanced output provides -2 dBu when the lowest level meter (-27 dBFS) lights up, and +4 dBu when the second lowest level meter (-21 dBFS) lights up. Even if you switched to the 1/4" inputs, you'd basically have the same problem: with the second lowest level meter lit up on the V3, the V3 outputs +4 dBu and the MTII's balanced 1/4" inputs accepts a max signal of +4.3 dBu. So...again, no more headroom.
So, four options to consider. Basically, you need to reduce the signal level before it hits the V3, within the V3, or after the V3 but before it hits the MTII.
- Set the V3's input attenuators to -20 dB (if they're not already set). These are internal jumpers, L = J3/J4, R = J14/J15. Se the V3 manual for more details.
- Set the pad (attenuator) on your mics. I'm not familiar with your mics, whether they even have a pad, or how they sound with the pad engaged, but...it's an option to consider.
- You might try the M-Audio -10 dB attenuator (http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/MicroTrack10dBPad.html) (or another in-line attenuator device).
- Learn to love the V3 ADC and run V3 digital out > MT/MTII! :P
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i know some people arent a fan of the V3's A>D, but the reality is its gonna kill the MT A>D on just about every level. the only time people skip the V3's A>D is if they have an HQ DAC like an AD2K or 722 to go to.
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Page provided a quick explanation. I was just about to post my slightly more detailed explanation, so I'll go ahead anyway.
Tonedeaf -- I'm surprised you prefer the MT ADC to the V3. I far prefer the V3 ADC, personally. No matter...just goes to show we all have different ears and there's no single solution that satisfies all ears. :)
[rest of response deleted for brevity]
Bingo. Thanks alot Brian and Page. Brian, your answer gives me exactly the info that I was asking for...and then some. I really appreciate the effort you put into providing that answer!!! :cheers: Page I also appreciate your responses too. Thanks.
Brian, to answer the question about preferring the MTII ADC against the V3, I have no preference because honestly I haven't tried running the V3 in all the possible configs. (I'm confident that the V3 ADC is MUCH better than the MTII's) Additionally, I only got the V3 awhile ago and then I messed it up (see the preamp forum where I explained what I'd done to mess my V3 up). So I haven't actually had access to it all that much.
Regarding using the MTII, I just received the MTII last week so this was the first time I'd used it. I had been running my R-09HR with the V3 outputting an analog signal to the Line In jack and honestly, I really liked the sound I was getting initially so, for the limited shows that I've run the V3 with, I figured why mess with it.
That leads me to Friday night. When I arrived at the venue to record Toubab, I discovered that I'd accidently left the R-09HR at home, so I was left with using the MTII the first time out. So, since I hadn't given any thought to how best to run the MTII and since I had the necessary cables for connecting the R-09HR via the 1/8 input jack, I just set it up the same as I normally set up the R-09HR.
Of course, before the music started I had the V3 levels set where I normally have had them set for the start of a show (I don't know the settings yet...approximately in the 9pm position). When the music started, my levels on the MTII pegged hard. So I backed off the MTII levels all the way back and then backed the V3 levels all the way back down as far as it will go. Fortunately, the MTII was no longer peaking, but the MTII levels were pretty much dead on. That was great for the TK show, but of course that got me to thinking about what about future loud shows...so that's why I asked the question.
Anyway, based on the feedback that you gave me, I'll have to think some more about how best to go forward. I picked the MTII up as a backup to the R-09HR, but also so that I could run a second rig with my Church Audio setup.
I also have an MT2496, but I bought the MTII so I could give the MT2496 to my son-in-law...my daughter asked me to get him a starter rig for his birthday, so I'm giving him the MT2496 for his birthday, and I've picked up some CA-14's and 9100 preamp for her to give him.
Anyway, that's a little background about this situation. I think probably what I'll do is use the MTII only in conjunction with the CA gear and use the R-09HR with the V3.
Thanks again for the detailed responses guys!!!
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i know some people arent a fan of the V3's A>D, but the reality is its gonna kill the MT A>D on just about every level. the only time people skip the V3's A>D is if they have an HQ DAC like an AD2K or 722 to go to.
But there are plenty of great sounding V2 > (insert $300 recording device here) rigs out there. How is that any different than a V3 analog out to...say an R-09HR? In my listening, the V2/V3 analog just has a warmer sound to it that I generally have preferred in my listening comparisons over the digital V3 sound.
Personally, I've never really understood why the general TS.com membership tends to insist on bit perfection. I know I'm in the significant minority here, but if it sounds good to me, then it _IS_ good and I don't really care if it's the absolute highest quality digitally perfect stream. That's why I've stuck with my V3 analog > R-09HR...cause I like it.
Course, I'm sure the difference between me and most is that I don't playback on audiophile quality end devices either, so there's probably a big difference between my needs and many that read TS.com.
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I have a situation with a recent pair of recordings and just wonder something about the MTII. Is it possible that I really didn't record in 24/48 even though the MTII was set to 24 bit and my UA5 was definitely set to 48kHz? I recorded 2 shows that were 2.5 hours each. I wound up with 2 wav files each night, one was 1.86gb in file size and the 2nd file 669mb, total of 2.52gb. That seems awfully small for a 24 bit recording. It should be double that size. I see clearly in Soundforge 8 and cd wav editor that the wav file is 24 bit, 48000 sample rate, so how could the compressed flacs result in only .99gb total file size? That's the file size for the 16 bit version. I was def working with the 24 bit files and already resampled/dithered to 16 bit and save that wav as 16 bit. I viewed the wav file's properties and it does say it's a 24/48 file but the audio format says "PCM" (not sure what that means). After splitting the tracks in cd wav I did save it as Direct Wav and checked the box "use alternate 24 bit format", then encoded to Flac using Flac Frontend (level 8) and that went ok, but then I see the total file size of the flacs = .99gb. It makes no sense. Did I really record in 24/48 even though the evidence shows I did.
Any help would be appreciated. I'm quite new to doing 24 bit. I did follow the resample/dither instructions and my 16 bit came out just fine, just don't what the heck is going on with the file size, mainly WHY is the wav file only a total of 2.52?
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^^ Can't help you other than to say that, at 24/48, a good rule of thumb is one gig an hour. So, based on your explanation, it seems the second file which is smaller would be the one that is wierd.
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Thanks for the input. I think since the show was 2 1/2 hours that 2.52 gb total is about right, but why did the total file size of all the flacs come out to only .99gb which is really what the 16 bit version should be? I would think the file size would be double that. the bottom line is the wav's show up as 24/48 in 2 programs plus if right click and check Properties of the wav file.
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Thanks for the input. I think since the show was 2 1/2 hours that 2.52 gb total is about right, but why did the total file size of all the flacs come out to only .99gb which is really what the 16 bit version should be? I would think the file size would be double that. the bottom line is the wav's show up as 24/48 in 2 programs plus if right click and check Properties of the wav file.
The compressed, FLAC file size will depend on the bit depth and sample rate of the original file, the compression level used, and the content of the recording. Don't worry about the compressed FLAC file size.
BTW...are you running current MTII firmware? Reason I ask: UA5 + MTII were not compatible at 24-bit, initially. More info here: http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,95964.msg1671629.html#msg1671629
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Thanks for the input. I think since the show was 2 1/2 hours that 2.52 gb total is about right, but why did the total file size of all the flacs come out to only .99gb which is really what the 16 bit version should be? I would think the file size would be double that. the bottom line is the wav's show up as 24/48 in 2 programs plus if right click and check Properties of the wav file.
The compressed, FLAC file size will depend on the bit depth and sample rate of the original file, the compression level used, and the content of the recording. Don't worry about the compressed FLAC file size.
BTW...are you running current MTII firmware? Reason I ask: UA5 + MTII were not compatible at 24-bit, initially. More info here: http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,95964.msg1671629.html#msg1671629
Thanks Brian for the info. I DID check on the firmware and even called M-Audio and then checked my MTII and I def am current with the firmware. I have a Wmod UA5 and I made sure I had it set to 48 kHz and the MTII to 24 bit. It seems the 2.52 gb total wav file size is correct for a 2.5 hour show, but the compression at level 8 in Flac Frontend must be what had it end up as .99gb. The reason I was concerned is that the 16 bit version I did (after resample & dither to 16 bit) had the total flac size as .99gb also. Could it be that the UA5 is really not sending a 24/48 signal to the MTII? Should one unit be turned on before the other to ensure the signal gets received? It's weird because the wav file shows up clearly as 24/48 in Soundforge and by right clicking and looking at Properties of the wav file.
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Thanks for the input. I think since the show was 2 1/2 hours that 2.52 gb total is about right, but why did the total file size of all the flacs come out to only .99gb which is really what the 16 bit version should be? I would think the file size would be double that. the bottom line is the wav's show up as 24/48 in 2 programs plus if right click and check Properties of the wav file.
Just for kicks...does SF have a "bit meter" function? It's possible the WAV properties say 24-bit even though the actual data is 16-bit. The "bit meter" function would confirm it, one way or the other.
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Thanks for the input. I think since the show was 2 1/2 hours that 2.52 gb total is about right, but why did the total file size of all the flacs come out to only .99gb which is really what the 16 bit version should be? I would think the file size would be double that. the bottom line is the wav's show up as 24/48 in 2 programs plus if right click and check Properties of the wav file.
Just for kicks...does SF have a "bit meter" function? It's possible the WAV properties say 24-bit even though the actual data is 16-bit. The "bit meter" function would confirm it, one way or the other.
I'm not sure what SF calls it but I'll check it out. I do see in SF when I open a wav file at the bottom it shows the bit depth and sample rate and it changes based on the type of wav file. I guess the "bit meter" is on the toolbar so I'll check it. I will also try decoding a flac back to wav and see if it still shows it as 24/48 or did it change to 16/48 or 16/44, then I'll know if something is wrong.
Thanks again for the help.
Tom
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I will also try decoding a flac back to wav and see if it still shows it as 24/48 or did it change to 16/48 or 16/44, then I'll know if something is wrong.
No need, this won't reveal anything. The decoded file will precisely match the file before it was encoded to FLAC. It won't change the WAV properties, or reveal the actual bit depth of the data stream, or anything like that.
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I will also try decoding a flac back to wav and see if it still shows it as 24/48 or did it change to 16/48 or 16/44, then I'll know if something is wrong.
No need, this won't reveal anything. The decoded file will precisely match the file before it was encoded to FLAC. It won't change the WAV properties, or reveal the actual bit depth of the data stream, or anything like that.
Thanks for that info. SF has a bit depth and sample rate window at the bottom when you open a wav file (that could be it's bit meter) and my wav's do show 24 bit and 48000 sample rate, that's why it's so strange that the compressed flacs equal the size of the 16 bit files I already did.
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SF has a bit depth and sample rate window at the bottom when you open a wav file (that could be it's bit meter) and my wav's do show 24 bit and 48000 sample rate, that's why it's so strange that the compressed flacs equal the size of the 16 bit files I already did.
The FLAC / 16-bit file size thing is just a coincidence. I'm not familiar with Soundforge, so I don't know the answer, but the question is: does the 24-bit / 48000 sample rate window at the bottom show the actual bit depth of the data itself, or the bit depth as documented in the WAV header (which is what you see when you view Properties of the file in Windows Explorer, for example). What you want is a tool in SF that shows you the bit depth of the actual data, not just what's the bit depth as recorded in the WAV header.
Someone posted a free bit depth plugin a while back, I think...let me see if I can find it. (Or perhaps someone will chime in with their knowledge of SF.)
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I use to use SF and the number in the lower panel is just the info from the wav header. I don't know if it has a bit rate meter as part of the program.
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Thanks guys for the help here. I could open a 24 bit wav file in SF and go to Process>Bit Depth Converter and it would show the current bit depth and sample rate of the wav file, wouldn't it? That might be the closest thing to a bit meter other than the panels at the bottom. I made the mistake on my first attempt at recording at 24/48, didn't switch the UA5 to 48 kHz and the wav file opened in SF as 24 bit, 44,1000 sample rate so I know it tells you the bit depth and sample rate of the wav file you opened, but as far as the bit depth of the data itself I'm not sure. I guess I just don't understand the difference.
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I could open a 24 bit wav file in SF and go to Process>Bit Depth Converter and it would show the current bit depth and sample rate of the wav file, wouldn't it?
Maybe. I'm not sure how SF captures that information. It might simply show the bit depth and sample rate in the WAV header, and not the actual bit depth and sample rate of the data itself. More on that in a minute.
FWIW, Jason provided a couple plugin bit-meter options here: http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,123142.msg1640080.html#msg1640080
I know it tells you the bit depth and sample rate of the wav file you opened, but as far as the bit depth of the data itself I'm not sure. I guess I just don't understand the difference.
Very basically, a WAV file is made up of two different parts: the header and the data.* The header stores merely descriptive information about the data within the file: stereo or mono, bit depth, sample rate, etc. The data itself is, well...the data itself, and is encoded however the ADC outputs it. Here's the thing: the header and the data don't have to match...and they don't always.
Usually, when there's a mismatch, it's because the header sample rate doesn't match the data sample rate. For example, the header says the file is 48k, but the data is actually 44.1k. But most software simply checks the header to find out the file format information, like bit depth, sample rate, etc.: if the header says the file is 24-bit, then the software assumes it's correct. The result: the software plays the file at 48k, even though the data's actually 44.1k...and the recording sounds too fast, like chipmunks singing -- it's very easy to identify when mismatches in sample rate occur
But there can also be a mismatch between the header's bit depth and the data's bit depth. For example, the header can say the file is 24-bit, but the data itself might only be 16-bit. When the bit depth is mismatched, though, you probably can't hear the difference...hence the need for a bit meter that actually reads the data itself, rather than relying on the header information. And that's why you need a "bit meter"...to read the format of the data itself, not the header. Some software has this feature built-in, others require plugins, like the ones linked above. Clear as mud? :P
* Lots more detailed info here: WAV PCM soundfile format (http://ccrma.stanford.edu/courses/422/projects/WaveFormat/)
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thanks i had similar issues with the MTI, and despite the fact that many here have said the MTII is 100% relable, i still am wary of using one as a primary recorder
Hoo boy. I just finished five days (10 hours/day) live recording, using the MicroTrack II as the bit-bucket for most of it. I have some things to report ... but I need a night's sleep first.
A quick summary, though: In general it worked very well, but because of a few glitches (one of which may have cost me nearly three hours of a valuable recording) I don't quite trust this recorder yet. Still, it seems close to being a rather great little recording device, I think.
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Thanks for all this info Brian. It's a bit overwhelming since I'm new at this 24 bit thing. I did play a 24 bit file decoded back to wav from a flac and it's normal speed (no chipmunks lol).
I was able to create flac files with cd wav editor and came out with 1.48 gb which I'm told is normal for level 8 compression. I just don't know why Flac Frontend is compressing it to under 1 gb total file size.
I've uploaded the source and have a few tapers who are grabbing it and they'll tell me if I screwed up or it doesn't sound like 24 bit.
I agree I'm not 100% comfortable with the Microtrack II recording 24 bit even though SF shows it as 24/48 and cd wav editor does too. I'll try 24/96 the next time with my UA5 and see what happens!
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My last recording (mics>v3spdif>mt2) attempt had a strange result. Had my v3 set at 48khz...recorded in 24 bit. The saved files showed up as 24bit 44.1 khz. I assumed that I must've mistakenly left the v3 at 44.1. When I went to edit, the files loaded as 44.1, but on playback, were slow and dragging. I changed them, not converted to 48khz and they sounded fine. First time something like that's happened to me and found it a bit weird that the mt2 gave them a 44.1 header.
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no it wouldnt. if you guys are talking about what i think you are (16bit files masquerading as 24-bit), it is actually a 24-bit data file, but the last 8bits are all zeros.
2 ways to do it:
use the bit depth meter link, or wavelab has that as well as a standard feature
record something into it peaking at really low levels, like -50 or below, then normalize it to zero. you'll know right away if you were working with 24 bits of data
Thanks guys for the help here. I could open a 24 bit wav file in SF and go to Process>Bit Depth Converter and it would show the current bit depth and sample rate of the wav file, wouldn't it? That might be the closest thing to a bit meter other than the panels at the bottom. I made the mistake on my first attempt at recording at 24/48, didn't switch the UA5 to 48 kHz and the wav file opened in SF as 24 bit, 44,1000 sample rate so I know it tells you the bit depth and sample rate of the wav file you opened, but as far as the bit depth of the data itself I'm not sure. I guess I just don't understand the difference.
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Stupid question maybe...
Just bought a battery box(SP-SPSB-11) for my microtrack 2.
I also bought a 1/4 to 1/8 adapter, but I picked the wrong one, the not ballanaced one.
My question is if I can use the ordinary mic input with this bb(its 12v) without frying my mic(sony ecm-719, I have ca-14 ordered).
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I just got a Hydra 1/8 to 2 TRS's to use with my MTII, but it isn't balanced. Am I going to have problems using this cable? If so what are you guys using that will work? Someone please steer me in the right direction. I have read the thread, but doesn't seem to confirm any cable that will for sure work. Thanks
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Hopping on the MT II thread to learn about my recently purchase...
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Hopping on the MT II thread to learn about my recently purchase...
2nd this - just purchased one myself and have been reading up on things.
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I just got a Hydra 1/8 to 2 TRS's to use with my MTII, but it isn't balanced. Am I going to have problems using this cable? If so what are you guys using that will work? Someone please steer me in the right direction. I have read the thread, but doesn't seem to confirm any cable that will for sure work. Thanks
You'll be fine with the cable you purchased as long as you keep the gain on the mt2 all the way down. If you don't have an external preamp and will need to use the gain on the recorder, you'll need a specially wired cable. Sound pro's or several cable makers here at ts can build you one. For what it's worth, I would look at running an external pre with the mt2. It's internal pre is a tad noisy, even running at low levels of gain. Do some living room testing with a quiet background. Record and increase your gain. On playback you'll heAR and get a feel for where your limits are on the pre. I think mine got a bit noisy around 1/3 of the way up on gain increase.
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Tapewheeler I have a ST9100! I need to turn the gain all the way down on the MTII? Then just use the pre gains? I have CA-14 and 9100 that I run open! Thanks for the help!!
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Tapewheeler I have a ST9100! I need to turn the gain all the way down on the MTII? Then just use the pre gains? I have CA-14 and 9100 that I run open! Thanks for the help!!
Great! Yes, you'll have to keep the mt2 gain all the way down with the cable you have and run the 9100 for any gain. I bought a specially wired cable for my mt2 and still just use the cleaner gain from my 9100. You should be fine running that way with any moderately loud show. Do some testing at home, but I think you'll find that you'll have plenty of gain that way for most anything you record, especially running 24 bit and keeping peaks around -12 or so. I've been happy running my mics>9100>mt2 that way.
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Tapewheeler, thanks man I was getting concerned I wasted money on a cable! I will do some home testing. Thanks for the help.
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mine arrived yesterday - man that thing is quite small and very light! now awaiting my SP cables so i can run the CA preamp into the TRS inputs. thanks to all of you who provided so much info (even though i am sorry for the lost recordings for some) over the past few years concerning this recorder - it has been most helpful!
peace,
ts
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How much time do you typically get on a full charge for recording through digi-in and for playback on the MT II ?
Recording the other night, I seemed to get really low after just 2 hours.
Playback is a little more.
I have a battery pack in transit, but it would be good to know in general.
TIA
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I would never run mine without the external battery FWIW.
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I would never run mine without the external battery FWIW.
I won't either. Had a single-AA battery USB adaptor that worked fine, and I was using the MT II as a backup recorder / test.
Just wondering if I should contact M-Audio and complain since the unit is new.
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I would never run mine without the external battery FWIW.
I won't either. Had a single-AA battery USB adaptor that worked fine, and I was using the MT II as a backup recorder / test.
Just wondering if I should contact M-Audio and complain since the unit is new.
When I first received mine, gave it a full charge then ran a test at home. Got somewhere around 5-6 hours. I suggest doing the same test. I know that my battery meter display on my mt2 tends to drop quickly so maybe thats the case.
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i have a mt1 but i never got over 2hrs on a full charge
i always use a 4aa sled with it and i have used the same 4aa for many shows and the mt on a full charge they are just starting to drop down 1 level on the meter
adata 16gb cards work in the mt1 and 2
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i have a mt1 but i never got over 2hrs on a full charge
That is how the MT I was rated. The MT II is supposed to last much longer. Should last as long as taperwheeler reports.
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I've had my MT2 for about a year and it gets about 4.5 hours going mic in.