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Author Topic: Mk22 advice wanted  (Read 6535 times)

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Offline adrianf74

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Re: Mk22 advice wanted
« Reply #15 on: March 15, 2024, 10:06:04 AM »
Thanks for all advice!

I owned these and they were, by far, my favourite Schoeps caps to run and I pulled some AMAZING recordings with them.  Depending on if a show was mixed mono (and in many cases, the ones down on the "beach" in Toronto were), I would simply pick a stack and stand about five or six rows back with my hat tilted towards the speakers.   I generally do PAS when using a hat anyhow... if I could only own one set of caps, these would probably be it.
Decks: Zoom F6, Zoom F3 w/ BTA-1 | Power: Neewer NP-F750 7000mAh | Mics: (under construction) | Camera: DJI Osmo Action 4

Offline morst

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Re: Mk22 advice wanted
« Reply #16 on: March 16, 2024, 12:46:43 AM »
Wide card is mathematically halfway between cardioid and omni.
In a good sounding spot, these should be the semi-directional butter!


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Offline adrianf74

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Re: Mk22 advice wanted
« Reply #17 on: March 16, 2024, 01:53:24 PM »
Wide card is mathematically halfway between cardioid and omni.
In a good sounding spot, these should be the semi-directional butter!


 :headphones: :headphones: :headphones:
Most likely the reason I love my Line Audio CM3's.  Definitely not the same mic but a lot more affordable.
Decks: Zoom F6, Zoom F3 w/ BTA-1 | Power: Neewer NP-F750 7000mAh | Mics: (under construction) | Camera: DJI Osmo Action 4

Offline checht

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Re: Mk22 advice wanted
« Reply #18 on: March 16, 2024, 10:36:52 PM »
The mk22s have become my favorite caps, and I've used 4s, 5s, 21s, and 41s. When deployed properly, their sound is everything I'm looking for: detailed yet expansive, warm but not dark, and capable of great imagining and a rock solid sound stage.

I use them 4' split in an OMT4 config, with 41s in the center, outdoors and in reasonable-sounding rooms. Also, had I Nick modify my actives to put a binder m & f inline on one cable, so I can use a binder extension cable to split them as much as 17'. Most commonly, I split them 6' to 14' onstage, about a foot up from the lip, at 8"-10" off the deck, and they are amazing in that setting, producing a wonderful, clearly separated image. Matrix with a pair of 41s ortf above the drums, and vocals off the monitor mixer. Getting my best recordings of Steely Dead this way, to my ears.

Here's an example, a bit of soundcheck from Kona:
https://archive.org/details/sd2024-02-24.matrix
About 2 minutes in, during the keys solo, is a good example of the sound stage, w keys & guitar on L, drums C-R, and bass R.

After 40+ years of recording, learning so much these days. What a blast!
MK41s, MK22s; Vanguard V1s matched pair; Niaint x8
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Offline robeti

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Re: Mk22 advice wanted
« Reply #19 on: March 17, 2024, 10:34:15 AM »
Thanks much!
I just got home from recording Black Pumas. I was 5th row from the stage.
I used the mk22s in a dina hat mount.
My first impressions: much more omni sound than cardioid sound. Full rich sound without being too bass heavy. The show was very bass heavy but the mk22s capture this beautiful without being boomy. It will require a bit more work in post (screamers, clapping etc.) I think I prefer this sound over cardioid and hyper cardioid.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2024, 10:36:58 AM by robeti »
mics schoeps mk22/mk4/mk41 (matched) | nakamichi cm-300 (JB mod/cp1/cp2/cp3) | nakamichi cm-50 | primo em4052pmi4's | sp-cmc-4u/at-853 4.7k mod (shotguns/h/c/sc/o) | ca-11 c/o | ca-14 c
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Offline adrianf74

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Re: Mk22 advice wanted
« Reply #20 on: March 17, 2024, 05:27:13 PM »
Thanks much!
I just got home from recording Black Pumas. I was 5th row from the stage.
I used the mk22s in a dina hat mount.
My first impressions: much more omni sound than cardioid sound. Full rich sound without being too bass heavy. The show was very bass heavy but the mk22s capture this beautiful without being boomy. It will require a bit more work in post (screamers, clapping etc.) I think I prefer this sound over cardioid and hyper cardioid.

There are times where the 41's are clutch but if you're up close, the 22's are gold as you've just learned.
Decks: Zoom F6, Zoom F3 w/ BTA-1 | Power: Neewer NP-F750 7000mAh | Mics: (under construction) | Camera: DJI Osmo Action 4

Offline goodcooker

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Re: Mk22 advice wanted
« Reply #21 on: March 17, 2024, 08:12:38 PM »
Thanks much!
I just got home from recording Black Pumas. I was 5th row from the stage.
I used the mk22s in a dina hat mount.
My first impressions: much more omni sound than cardioid sound. Full rich sound without being too bass heavy. The show was very bass heavy but the mk22s capture this beautiful without being boomy. It will require a bit more work in post (screamers, clapping etc.) I think I prefer this sound over cardioid and hyper cardioid.

I ran my HO subcards in dina quite often. The high end is very directional but the low end seemed to end up sounding very mono due to the caps being placed close together. I did it this way to minimize my footprint when recording onstage same idea as what you can fit in a hat. Best compromise for the result.
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Offline Gutbucket

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Re: Mk22 advice wanted
« Reply #22 on: March 18, 2024, 12:36:15 PM »
There are times where the 41's are clutch but if you're up close, the 22's are gold as you've just learned.

The mk22s have become my favorite caps, and I've used 4s, 5s, 21s, and 41s. When deployed properly, their sound is everything I'm looking for: detailed yet expansive, warm but not dark, and capable of great imagining and a rock solid sound stage.

I use them 4' split in an OMT4 config, with 41s in the center, outdoors and in reasonable-sounding rooms. [snip]

Don't mean to take this OT, but one of the design intentions of OMT4 is to accommodate a wide range of taper situations via the ability to tweak the balance between the two very different yet complementary stereo pairs by leaning a bit more on one verses the other as needed, sometimes even working cross-balances between the two.  Open patterns like Mk22 and mk21 are particularly attractive for this as I see them as inhabiting something of a sweet spot over on the omni side side of continuum of pickup patterns, with super/hypercardioid inhabiting a similar position on the opposite bi-directional side, and the 50/50 "cardioid-compromise" inhabiting the middle.  The pattern-continuum sweet spots strike me as being not 100% omni nor 100% bi-directional fig-8, nor a straight 50/50 combination of the two like a straight cardioid, but more of a Goldilocks "just right" balance on either side.  Seems to make an especially good combination when both pairs are arranged to work together and support each other as a team without elbowing in too much on what the other does well.

An interesting irony is that OMT4 still works and remains robust when setup the inverse way. That is, setup either in the typical way with the highly directional pair in the center (X/Y supercards, say) with the more open pattern pair spaced out to either side, or in the opposite way with the more open pattern in the coincident center (say as a Mid/Side pair with mk22 Mid, mk8 Side) and the more directional supercard pair spaced out to either side of that in PAS.

Over the past weekend I was going through some SD cards and ended up listening to an OMT4 setup I recorded a few years back similar to that, which used a much more open MG cardioid as Mid in the center M/S pair and MG m21 supercards in the wide pair positions.  Direct PA clarity was primarily contributed by the wider spaced supercard pair while the ambience, depth, sense of space and dimension were primarily contributed by the more open-cardioidish M/S center pair, rather than the other way around.
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